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MATT DUFFER: We're from
Durham, North Carolina.

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Growing up we were
just nerdy kids

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playing Dungeons and
Dragons with our friends.

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ROSS DUFFER: We
always loved films

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and we wanted to do
that for a living,

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but we had no idea how
to make that possible.

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How do you get from the
suburbs of North Carolina

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to where we are now
in Hollywood, making

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a show for Netflix?

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MATT DUFFER: So
around third grade,

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our parents for Christmas
gave us a Hi8 video camera.

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We were really
excited about this.

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Starting in the summer
of the fourth grade,

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that's kind of when
everything changed.

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We made our first
full length movie.

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We will fight honorably.

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And one more thing,
onward to battle!

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ROSS DUFFER: Then when we
moved in to high school,

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we said, is there a way to
make these movies even better?

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So what we would
do is every summer

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we would actually start
to write some scripts down

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and this was our first
instance of us writing scripts.

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I made it.

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MATT DUFFER: And that continued
all the way into college.

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We went to Film School
at Chapman University.

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We were still mostly
focused on directing.

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We realized at a certain
point that no one

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was going to let us
direct anything if we

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didn't have a script that we
could attach ourselves to.

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Forget about it.

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MATT DUFFER: So we took
some screenwriting classes,

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we learned the basics
of screenwriting.

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Structure, inciting incident.

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We started to learn
some big ideas about how

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to write a screenplay.

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But father, you're
a man of science.

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And a man of reason.

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MATT DUFFER: So there was
a big turning point for us

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and that was after
we had struggled

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for a while in a
couple of scripts,

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we weren't getting
anywhere with them.

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And a lot of this was because
we were focused on what

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we thought the industry wanted.

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What was selling in the moment,
what people were excited about.

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We just cut out all
the noise and we just

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wrote something that was
really personal to us.

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The story was called
"Hidden," and it

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was about a family that was
hiding in a bomb shelter

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from some mysterious
threat above the surface.

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And we did something
which we hadn't really

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been doing, which because
of the time crunch,

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because of the financial
pressures, we just sat down

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and we're like, we better
figure out this story before we

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go into writing it.

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And we outlined it.

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And when we outlined it,
the outline worked and then

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we wrote the script
incredibly fast.

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It just fell into place
and "Hidden," was born.

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It sold in a bidding
war to Warner Brothers

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and we were suddenly
back on our feet

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and feeling confident again.

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ROSS DUFFER: There are many
ups and downs over that,

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but that was a huge hurdle.

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We didn't even know how to write
a screenplay to suddenly we

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had sold a screenplay
and we had made money

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with just words that we
have written on paper.

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That night we went
to get a meal and I

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remember it was such
a big moment for us

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that we were able to
order soda with our meals,

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because prior to that we
could only afford really

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water with any of our meals.

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To me it was Thai iced tea
at the local Thai restaurant,

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that we were able to do that.

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Like, Thai iced tea, please.

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Also I felt a little bit
like sheepish about it,

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but it was like, oh man, this
is a really good Thai iced tea.

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It was a huge moment,
we're like OK, this is it.

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We've made it.

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But the big take away from
us was write something

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that you're passionate about.

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Write something that you
truly love, not something

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that you think other
people are going to love.

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And outline, outline, outline,
outline, plan, plan, plan.

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But there was a shift in
the industry around the time

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and there were a
lot of producers

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that kept going, hey, well,
that's an OK movie idea,

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but do you have a TV idea?

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And so there was really
a move towards television

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becoming more cinematic and
that started to get us excited.

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And so we started to
go, well, you know what?

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Maybe this is a
type of storytelling

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that we could get
into and that's

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what led us to eventually
develop "Montauk," which

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is the pilot script
that would eventually

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become "Stranger Things."

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MATT DUFFER: It ended
up selling to Netflix,

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and that moment, receiving
that call that Netflix was not

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only buying our script, but
was greenlighting it to series,

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and that they were comfortable
with Ross and I directing it,

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was probably the best
moment of my life.

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This class is really for anyone
who dreams of telling stories

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for a living.

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It's for the person who has 20
scripts in their drawer, none

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of which have sold.

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It's for the person who has only
written 20 pages of a script

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and hasn't been able to
get past the 20 pages.

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Or is just staring
at a blank screen

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and they can't
write a single word.

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You've got the idea, but you
don't know what to do with it.

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It's also for people
who, like us, don't

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know a single soul
in Hollywood and want

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to see how this works and
see if this is something

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that maybe you could actually
do and you can make a reality.

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MATT DUFFER: This class
is also for people

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who just love "Stranger
Things," and want

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to see how we created the show,
how we built it from an idea

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all the way through the script.

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To show you how
it works, we're

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going to go into documents
and things we wrote.

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Netflix has never seen it.

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Our actors have never seen it.

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So we're going to be showing
you those top secret "Stranger

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Things" documents
for the first time.

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ROSS DUFFER: We'll use examples
from "Stranger Things,"

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from the pilot all the way
through stuff from season 4.

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Bitching, right?

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Yeah, yeah, bitching.

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MATT DUFFER: So
something else we're

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going to do to show you
how this process works is

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we're going to create our own
fake Dustin and Steve "Stranger

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Things" spin-off series.

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This is imaginary, it's
just for this class,

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but we're going to generate
the idea in real time

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for you and we're going
to write the opening hook

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and under extreme
time constraints,

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and hopefully it's
going to be some fun.

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This is not a real
thing, Netflix.

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ROSS DUFFER: We love
writing, it is a fun process.

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Yes, it is frustrating at
times, it gets scary at times,

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you get stuck.

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It doesn't feel like you're ever
going to get unstuck sometimes,

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but what we try to do with
this class is show you

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our process because
this is what we found

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has made writing as smooth
as possible and as fun as

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possible.

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I'm going to be a
little dramatic here.

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Right here we cut to black.

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Hey, I'm Ross.

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I'm Matt.

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Together, we're the
Duffer brothers.

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And this is "MasterClass."

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The first stage of development
is coming up with your idea,

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or what we like to call
just sort of the big idea.

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And this is, honestly, one
of the most crucial things

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you're going to do in the
whole process, if not the most

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crucial.

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Because assuming this
goes well, you're

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going to be working with this
idea for potentially years,

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or in our case, we've been
doing it now seven years

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with "Stranger Things."

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So you're going to want an idea
that really gets you excited

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and really inspires you.

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I think it is a
mistake a lot of people

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make in that they sort of--

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they're so excited
to write a script

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and have a script that
they kind of go, well,

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that idea sounds good.

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Let me just start to write it.

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I mean, we've certainly
made that mistake,

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where we've started
writing an idea--

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there's something good
just conceptually wrong

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with the idea, or the idea
itself is not exciting enough,

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and there's nothing you can do.

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You know you could waste
a year or two years

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working on something that is
actually just the problem is

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that the very first stage.

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So it's important that this
first stage you get right,

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and you're working on an idea
that you're really, really

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excited about you.

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Have to have a ton of passion
for it, because best case

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scenario, you know, like in
the case of "Stranger Things,"

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it works, and people
like it, and then you

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could be working
on it for a decade.

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So make sure you love this idea.

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This is a difficult part
of the process to talk about,

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but the way we work, in terms
of coming up with that big idea,

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is we just start throwing
a ton of ideas at the wall,

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and we're just
seeing what sticks.

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And I think sometimes, people
make the mistake of going,

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well, they're looking around
at the shows or the movies that

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are popular right now.

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The classic, back when
we were growing up,

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was this is going to
be like "Die Hard,"

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but I'm going to put it
in a different location--

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"Die Hard" on a bus.

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But that worked.

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"Die Hard" on a bus worked, but
don't let that throw you off.

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So really, I think
what you want to do

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is just think about
what excites you.

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A lot of it should be
more personal than that.

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I think the problem with
looking around at what's popular

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and riffing on that
is that may not have

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any personal meaning to you.

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It's just what's popular,
what's in the zeitgeist now,

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but that is changing so rapidly.

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I remember when we were
coming up in college,

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we wanted to sell a script.

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The big thing was found footage.

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Right?

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So I found footage is not
much of a thing anymore,

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and we were never huge
fans of found footage.

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But we suddenly found ourselves
trying to write a found footage

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movie, and we didn't really
care about found footage.

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Because we didn't have
a lot of passion for it,

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the lack of passion
translated to bad scripts.

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So I think an epiphany
that we had was--

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and it seems so obvious now, but
it wasn't to us at the time--

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was just kind of cut
out all the noise.

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Stop reading "Variety" and
Deadline and all the Hollywood

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trades and obsessing
over what's selling,

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and just focus on what you
love, what you grew up loving,

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what you love now.

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Maybe it's something
personal as a family,

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a story from your family.

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Or in our case, like
our first movie script

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that sold was called
"Hidden," and it

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was set in a bomb shelter.

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We had a friend growing
up in North Carolina,

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and he had a bomb
shelter in his backyard.

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And we made a little short
film set in this bomb shelter.

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So we always thought,
hey, you know,

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wouldn't it be cool
to set an entire movie

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Inside of a bomb shelter?

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Like that would be
challenging but fun,

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and it was based
on this experience

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we had as kids in
this bomb shelter

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that scared the
living hell out of us.

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So it's a sort of
combination where

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you're pulling from your
life, but part of your life--

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it certainly was
for Matt and I--

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is we grew up loving movies.

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And so we're looking
at those movies,

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and we're looking at what
inspired us about that,

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and then you're combining that
with your experiences growing

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up.

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Or in the case of "Stranger
Things," a lot of it

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is based around our
friendships we had

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and the amazing times we had
when we were kids, growing up

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and our summers hanging
out with our friends.

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[INTERPOSING VOICES]

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We certainly didn't
encounter any monsters

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or other dimensions,
but that friendship

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became such a core of that idea.

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So I think it's a mix of those
two things, or it's something

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that you're very
obsessive about.

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For instance, Matt and I love
a good conspiracy theory.

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I remember in high school,
we made a short film

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about the Philadelphia project,
and we love the JFK conspiracy.

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So we're sort of a little
bit of conspiracy nuts,

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and we like looking at all
that stuff, which led us--

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we'll get into it
later-- but it led us

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to the "Montauk" project,
which led directly

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to "Stranger Things."

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So it could be just
something in your life.

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There's another
advantage to choosing

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something that's a little bit
more personal, which is that

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it--

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especially if this is an early
screenplay that you're writing.

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Maybe it's your
first screenplay.

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Maybe it's your second or
third, or whatever it is,

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but certainly, we
found it easier

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if it's something that
we're familiar with, if it's

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populated with characters
or a location or setting

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that we're somewhat
familiar with.

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It's just easier to
write, so you don't

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have to do a year of research.

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That is a way to go, and
there's nothing wrong with that.

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If you want to do like say
a historical screenplay,

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go for it.

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I just would discourage
you from doing that maybe

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on your first screenplay.

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I mean, knock yourself out.

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It's just you're
going to require

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a lot of additional work
and a lot of additional--

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and as you're learning sort
of the fundamentals of writing

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and the fundamentals of
how to write dialogue,

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it's just so much
easier if you can

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tap into voices that you are
more intimately familiar with.

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Even on season one
of "Stranger Things,"

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we felt so much more comfortable
writing the voices of the kids.

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Just those scenes wrote
themselves very quickly for us.

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A shadow grows in
the wall behind you,

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swallowing you in darkness.

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It is almost here.

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What is it?

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What if it's the demogorgon?

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Oh, Jesus, we're so screwed
if it's the demogorgon.

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It's not the demogorgon.

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An army of troglodytes
charge into the chamber.

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Troglodytes?

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Told you.

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00:06:31,785 --> 00:06:34,165
ROSS DUFFER: It was harder
for us to write the scientist.

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So you'll notice on season one,
Dr. Brenner doesn't talk a lot,

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and that's OK.

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I think leaning
into your strengths

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and what you're good at,
and like Matt's saying,

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particularly for this first
script, is a great idea.

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I think the goal
really needs to be

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telling a simple story which
is much more difficult than it

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seems.

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It should seem easy when someone
ultimately reads your script,

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like this just came out of you.

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But it's a process even to
tell a simple, clean story that

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moves from A to B to C to D.

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One fun thing about pulling
from things you love

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is it gives you an excuse
to watch TV shows and movies

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and even rewatch things
that maybe you've

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seen a dozen times, just
to look at how it's done,

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and also try to find some
inspiration in there.

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It's like the best
homework ever.

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It's true, and I don't
think you even have

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to limit yourself to movies.

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I mean, if you're
really into video games,

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some board games now
have amazing narratives.

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I mean, just continue
to consume that stuff.

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And do big movies,
small movies, whatever.

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You know, the big shows
everyone's watching,

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the small shows, even stuff
that doesn't work is helpful.

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And for us, it may just be
like a kernel of an idea.

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I remember for the
first script that we

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wrote that actually
really worked

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and that sold, the one
that Matt had referred

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to that was set
in a bomb shelter

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called "Hidden," the
movie that sparked

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that was a very small
independent film

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called "Monsters," which is
directed by Gareth Edwards who

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00:08:03,320 --> 00:08:07,070
would go on to direct
"Godzilla" and "Rogue One."

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00:08:07,070 --> 00:08:09,140
But what really inspired
us about "Monsters"

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is he went out, and he
made a very small movie

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for not a lot of
money, and it did

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have this supernatural
stuff that we loved.

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And it had giant monsters,
because we're children

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at heart, so we love that.

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But at the heart of that movie
really was a relationship.

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Gareth was able to tell a
story with a huge scope,

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but tell it very
intimately, and we

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00:08:29,450 --> 00:08:33,710
decided we wanted to try to
do something in that vein.

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And then two other movies
that really inspired us

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that were also in that vein were
David Fincher's "Panic Room"

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00:08:39,799 --> 00:08:42,169
and M. Night
Shyamalan's "Signs,"

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00:08:42,169 --> 00:08:45,389
and these are all films
that really spoke to us.

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And when we started to rewatch
them and break it down,

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what we realized is
that what was really

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the connective tissue here
was they were big ideas.

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But at the heart of them,
just like in "Monsters,"

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it was really just
about these families.

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00:08:57,140 --> 00:08:59,420
"Panic Room" was about
a mom and her daughter,

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00:08:59,420 --> 00:09:02,810
and "Signs" was about a
family, and specifically man

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00:09:02,810 --> 00:09:06,050
who's who was sort of broken
in that family healing

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00:09:06,050 --> 00:09:07,590
over the course of that movie.

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00:09:07,590 --> 00:09:10,430
And so we go, even though
there are these huge ideas--

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00:09:10,430 --> 00:09:15,170
you know, aliens,
robbers, giant monsters--

216
00:09:15,167 --> 00:09:17,247
the heart of those movies
isn't really about that.

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00:09:17,250 --> 00:09:18,500
It's about something else.

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00:09:18,500 --> 00:09:20,930
That is the kind of story
that we wanted to tell--

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00:09:20,930 --> 00:09:22,520
ordinary meets extraordinary.

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00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:25,180
So you can look at it like
that, and you can break it down.

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00:09:25,180 --> 00:09:27,230
And I mean, it's
very broad, ordinary

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00:09:27,230 --> 00:09:29,840
meets the extraordinary,
but it was the type of film

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that we hadn't seen
a lot of out there.

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00:09:31,850 --> 00:09:35,450
And that's ultimately what led
to "Hidden," the bomb shelter

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00:09:35,450 --> 00:09:38,750
movie, as we're calling it
and then and then, ultimately,

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00:09:38,750 --> 00:09:39,530
"Stranger Things."

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So I think it's
important, as you're

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00:09:41,113 --> 00:09:43,733
watching these movies
that love and inspire you

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00:09:43,730 --> 00:09:46,400
to try to break
down, maybe there

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00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:49,100
is something that's connecting
all of these things you love.

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Maybe there's sort of a thread
that runs through all of them,

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and I think
identifying what that

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00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:58,610
is could help you identify what
kind of story you want to tell.

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00:09:58,610 --> 00:10:03,500
It's normal and good, in
fact, to take inspiration

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00:10:03,500 --> 00:10:05,060
from these people
who have mastered

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00:10:05,060 --> 00:10:07,460
the art of storytelling,
who have come before you.

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00:10:07,460 --> 00:10:08,180
Right?

238
00:10:08,180 --> 00:10:10,830
And look at what they did,
look at what is successful,

239
00:10:10,830 --> 00:10:13,220
and then take your own
personal experience

240
00:10:13,220 --> 00:10:15,680
and sort of overlay that on top.

241
00:10:15,680 --> 00:10:17,930
And hopefully, you're bringing
your own point of view.

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00:10:17,930 --> 00:10:20,440
You're not trying to
emulate, but you're

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00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:22,190
trying to take the
spirit of what they did

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00:10:22,190 --> 00:10:25,010
and infuse it with
something that's

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00:10:25,010 --> 00:10:27,590
very unique to you, which
is your own personality

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00:10:27,590 --> 00:10:29,150
and your own personal history.

247
00:10:29,145 --> 00:10:30,025
And your own voice.

248
00:10:30,020 --> 00:10:31,640
And your own,
yeah, your own voice.

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250
00:10:37,380 --> 00:10:39,630
As you're searching
for this big idea,

251
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one thing that's really
important to keep in mind

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00:10:41,670 --> 00:10:42,990
is drive.

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00:10:42,990 --> 00:10:46,200
I think every story needs
sort of a core drive,

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00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:47,970
and if you've read
any screenwriting

255
00:10:47,970 --> 00:10:50,430
book or heard any
screenwriter talk,

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00:10:50,428 --> 00:10:51,968
you're probably sick
of hearing this,

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00:10:51,970 --> 00:10:57,160
but the idea of a core
drive, the idea that there's

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00:10:57,157 --> 00:10:59,487
a character who wants something
and is having difficulty

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00:10:59,490 --> 00:11:02,430
getting it, it's true.

260
00:11:02,430 --> 00:11:05,490
I mean, you really do need that
in order to propel your story,

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00:11:05,490 --> 00:11:08,120
in order for the story to work.

262
00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:10,620
You know, listen, you can have
the most beautiful characters

263
00:11:10,620 --> 00:11:12,570
in the world, but what
is getting the reader

264
00:11:12,570 --> 00:11:15,300
to just continue
to turn the pages.

265
00:11:15,300 --> 00:11:17,190
And by drive we don't
mean-- it doesn't

266
00:11:17,190 --> 00:11:19,020
have to be save the planet.

267
00:11:19,020 --> 00:11:22,530
I mean, it doesn't have to
be a Marvel-level drive.

268
00:11:22,530 --> 00:11:24,420
It can be a very small drive.

269
00:11:24,420 --> 00:11:26,480
Like in the sense of
a romantic comedy,

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00:11:26,483 --> 00:11:27,903
it's winning over
the boy, winning

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over the girl, whatever it is.

272
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If you don't have
a drive, it'd be

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00:11:30,557 --> 00:11:32,217
like building a car
without an engine.

274
00:11:32,220 --> 00:11:32,720
Right?

275
00:11:32,720 --> 00:11:34,930
It's just not going
to run very well.

276
00:11:34,930 --> 00:11:37,150
People are not going to
get past page three, four,

277
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or five, whatever it is.

278
00:11:38,460 --> 00:11:40,740
If you look at "Hidden,"
it's a very simple drive.

279
00:11:40,740 --> 00:11:40,890
Right?

280
00:11:40,890 --> 00:11:43,170
It's actually kind of built
into the title of the piece.

281
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It's called hidden.

282
00:11:44,010 --> 00:11:47,890
The goal of the film, the
drive is, to remain hidden.

283
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So we have characters
in a bomb shelter.

284
00:11:49,650 --> 00:11:50,910
They're trying to stay hidden.

285
00:11:50,910 --> 00:11:54,780
Something alerts the outside
presence, these bad guys above,

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00:11:54,780 --> 00:11:57,630
that perhaps they're
in the vicinity.

287
00:11:57,630 --> 00:11:59,490
And the goal for
them is to remain

288
00:11:59,490 --> 00:12:00,670
hidden throughout the film.

289
00:12:00,670 --> 00:12:02,700
So it's a very, very
basic, simple drive.

290
00:12:02,700 --> 00:12:05,490
But our very first script
that got us an agent--

291
00:12:05,490 --> 00:12:06,960
and we'll go into
that more later--

292
00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:08,280
was something called "Origin."

293
00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:10,740
Our main character
woke up, and this

294
00:12:10,740 --> 00:12:13,380
was in the midst of a pandemic.

295
00:12:13,380 --> 00:12:16,440
And he realized he was infected.

296
00:12:16,440 --> 00:12:19,710
He was sick, and he had two
hours to try to cure himself.

297
00:12:19,710 --> 00:12:22,200
Very simple goal--
he is going to die

298
00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:25,560
at the end of this script, if
he's not able to find a cure.

299
00:12:25,560 --> 00:12:28,200
It's a very simple drive,
and your characters

300
00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:30,150
are trying to achieve that goal.

301
00:12:30,150 --> 00:12:31,740
Like Matt saying,
they want something.

302
00:12:31,740 --> 00:12:33,280
They're having
difficulty getting it.

303
00:12:33,282 --> 00:12:34,502
They want to stay hidden.

304
00:12:34,500 --> 00:12:36,450
They're having difficulty
staying hidden.

305
00:12:36,450 --> 00:12:38,580
Why are they having
difficulty staying hidden?

306
00:12:38,580 --> 00:12:41,010
Because we, as the
writers, are going

307
00:12:41,010 --> 00:12:45,510
to continue to throw obstacles
in their way to staying hidden.

308
00:12:45,510 --> 00:12:48,930
So every time they're going to
solve one obstacle that they're

309
00:12:48,930 --> 00:12:50,850
like, phew, maybe
we're hidden now,

310
00:12:50,850 --> 00:12:53,230
there's going to be
something else that happens,

311
00:12:53,230 --> 00:12:55,820
that's going to actually make
their situation even worse.

312
00:12:55,823 --> 00:12:57,993
They're going to solve that,
but then something else

313
00:12:57,990 --> 00:12:59,160
is going to happen
that's going to make

314
00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:00,600
it even harder to stay hidden.

315
00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:03,780
And it's just going to continue
to sort of build and snowball

316
00:13:03,780 --> 00:13:06,810
and escalate, in this way,
you have the audiences

317
00:13:06,810 --> 00:13:07,990
keep turning the pages.

318
00:13:07,992 --> 00:13:09,452
In the course of
"Stranger Things,"

319
00:13:09,450 --> 00:13:10,870
everyone's learning
more and more,

320
00:13:10,867 --> 00:13:13,667
but it keeps getting more
and more complicated.

321
00:13:13,668 --> 00:13:15,208
Finally, they have
the puzzle pieces,

322
00:13:15,210 --> 00:13:17,400
and you lead to the
climax, but you've

323
00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:19,600
got to keep throwing these
obstacles in the way.

324
00:13:19,603 --> 00:13:21,273
But the obstacles
aren't going to exist,

325
00:13:21,270 --> 00:13:25,200
if we don't understand what your
main characters are actually

326
00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:27,750
trying to get, what their
goal is, what their drive is.

327
00:13:27,750 --> 00:13:29,910
But like it's not
just about plot.

328
00:13:29,910 --> 00:13:32,070
I think that's a mistake.

329
00:13:32,070 --> 00:13:33,780
If you're thinking,
OK, well, this just

330
00:13:33,780 --> 00:13:36,720
sounds very plot-driven,
but it actually

331
00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:39,630
involves character and
character building.

332
00:13:39,630 --> 00:13:42,420
The way that your characters
resolve or overcome

333
00:13:42,420 --> 00:13:44,250
these obstacles
is going to reveal

334
00:13:44,250 --> 00:13:46,020
a lot about who they are.

335
00:13:46,020 --> 00:13:49,350
The methods they use to
resolve those obstacles

336
00:13:49,350 --> 00:13:50,310
reveals who they are.

337
00:13:50,310 --> 00:13:51,930
If you think about
"Stranger Things,"

338
00:13:51,930 --> 00:13:54,390
that's how you learn who
these characters are.

339
00:13:54,390 --> 00:13:58,240
Obviously, "Stranger Things,"
there's a lot going on in it.

340
00:13:58,240 --> 00:13:58,740
Right?

341
00:13:58,740 --> 00:14:01,720
But when you really boil
it down, Will is missing,

342
00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:03,180
and we want to find Will again.

343
00:14:03,180 --> 00:14:04,710
It's a very simple drive.

344
00:14:04,710 --> 00:14:07,350
Finding a story
and finding a drive

345
00:14:07,350 --> 00:14:10,380
is really the most
basic, fundamental aspect

346
00:14:10,380 --> 00:14:11,670
of storytelling.

347
00:14:11,670 --> 00:14:15,020


348
00:14:17,410 --> 00:14:19,110
Let's talk a little
bit about how do you

349
00:14:19,110 --> 00:14:20,200
brainstorm your idea?

350
00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:22,160
So we talked about you
can pull from your life.

351
00:14:22,158 --> 00:14:25,738
It's more of an art than a
science, brainstorming is.

352
00:14:25,740 --> 00:14:29,470
I think it's good to let your
mind wander a little bit.

353
00:14:29,470 --> 00:14:31,350
This is not something
that you can force.

354
00:14:31,350 --> 00:14:33,330
So one thing that Ross
and I like to do a lot

355
00:14:33,330 --> 00:14:34,290
is listen to music.

356
00:14:34,290 --> 00:14:36,270
We don't like listening
to music with lyrics.

357
00:14:36,270 --> 00:14:37,470
We like listening
to movie music.

358
00:14:37,470 --> 00:14:38,730
I've always loved movie music.

359
00:14:38,730 --> 00:14:40,230
The lyrics get my
head, whatever.

360
00:14:40,230 --> 00:14:42,000
I mean, this is going to
be very personal to you,

361
00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:43,790
but the good thing
about listening to music

362
00:14:43,792 --> 00:14:47,052
is you can kind of let your
mind wander a little bit.

363
00:14:47,050 --> 00:14:49,450
You don't want to
force it too much.

364
00:14:49,450 --> 00:14:50,940
There's other techniques.

365
00:14:50,940 --> 00:14:53,340
A lot of the good
ideas that we've had

366
00:14:53,340 --> 00:14:57,420
have come when we're not trying
to think too hard about them.

367
00:14:57,420 --> 00:15:00,180
They'll come when
you're driving to work.

368
00:15:00,180 --> 00:15:02,260
They'll come when
you're taking a shower.

369
00:15:02,257 --> 00:15:04,587
I mean, all of those are good
ways of coming up with it.

370
00:15:04,590 --> 00:15:07,770
Ross and I, it helps
that there's two of us.

371
00:15:07,770 --> 00:15:10,590
It works with just one person
as well, but we like to walk.

372
00:15:10,590 --> 00:15:13,890
There's something about walking
that gets the juices flowing

373
00:15:13,890 --> 00:15:14,610
in your brain.

374
00:15:14,610 --> 00:15:16,650
I think it's very difficult,
if you just sit down

375
00:15:16,652 --> 00:15:18,532
in front of your computer,
and you're looking

376
00:15:18,527 --> 00:15:19,767
at a blank computer page.

377
00:15:19,770 --> 00:15:21,580
And you're like, OK,
what is my movie idea?

378
00:15:21,575 --> 00:15:22,955
That's going to
be really tricky.

379
00:15:22,950 --> 00:15:24,030
That's going to
be more helpful,

380
00:15:24,030 --> 00:15:26,410
once you have the idea, and
you're developing it further.

381
00:15:26,405 --> 00:15:29,795
But for this initial big
idea, it is, like Matt saying,

382
00:15:29,790 --> 00:15:31,990
it's a tricky thing to teach.

383
00:15:31,990 --> 00:15:33,450
There's no right or wrong way.

384
00:15:33,450 --> 00:15:35,080
You're going to have
your own process.

385
00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:36,960
But again, I think
if you just try

386
00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:38,970
to sit down in front of
a computer and force it,

387
00:15:38,970 --> 00:15:40,850
you're probably just
going to get frustrated.

388
00:15:40,845 --> 00:15:42,515
We've certainly done
that many times.

389
00:15:42,510 --> 00:15:44,160
We've gotten
frustrated many times.

390
00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:46,410
But I think it is
important to give yourself

391
00:15:46,410 --> 00:15:49,470
some time and space to
come up with the idea.

392
00:15:49,470 --> 00:15:53,520
Even though it is potentially
one, two, three sentences,

393
00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:54,940
that can take a lot of time.

394
00:15:54,940 --> 00:15:57,330
So it seems very easy,
but the idea is not.

395
00:15:57,330 --> 00:15:59,260
I mean, the idea is everything.

396
00:15:59,260 --> 00:16:02,200
So it's going to take
some time, and when

397
00:16:02,198 --> 00:16:04,738
we step through kind of exactly
how we came up with "Stranger

398
00:16:04,740 --> 00:16:06,820
Things," you'll see that
it was kind of developed,

399
00:16:06,823 --> 00:16:08,493
this idea over the course of--

400
00:16:08,490 --> 00:16:09,270
how many years?

401
00:16:09,270 --> 00:16:10,010
Five?

402
00:16:10,010 --> 00:16:11,040
Five years.

403
00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:12,060
Five years.

404
00:16:12,060 --> 00:16:13,140
Something like that.

405
00:16:13,140 --> 00:16:15,030
In terms of the whole
process of writing,

406
00:16:15,030 --> 00:16:19,260
arguably coming up with a big
idea is the most important.

407
00:16:19,260 --> 00:16:21,090
Again, take your time with this.

408
00:16:21,090 --> 00:16:22,920
Be patient with it.

409
00:16:22,920 --> 00:16:24,480
Think back on your
life, the things

410
00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:28,050
that you love, your memories
growing up as children,

411
00:16:28,050 --> 00:16:31,380
your friends, maybe this
story your neighbor told you,

412
00:16:31,380 --> 00:16:32,370
pull from these things.

413
00:16:32,370 --> 00:16:34,150
Pull from works of art you love.

414
00:16:34,150 --> 00:16:35,320
Take your time.

415
00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:36,840
Come up with a bunch of ideas.

416
00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:38,430
A lot of them are
going to be bad.

417
00:16:38,430 --> 00:16:40,230
We write down so many bad ideas.

418
00:16:40,227 --> 00:16:41,307
You'll see some of them.

419
00:16:41,310 --> 00:16:42,390
You'll see some of them.

420
00:16:42,393 --> 00:16:45,213
We throw so many things at
the wall, and so many of them

421
00:16:45,210 --> 00:16:47,250
don't stick, and that's OK.

422
00:16:47,250 --> 00:16:50,760
You're going to feel it, when
you have that idea that just

423
00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:54,180
gets you excited and like you
want to sit down and write it

424
00:16:54,180 --> 00:16:54,680
right now.

425
00:16:54,680 --> 00:16:56,010
I think you're going to feel it.

426
00:16:56,013 --> 00:16:56,823
We certainly have.

427
00:16:56,820 --> 00:16:59,790
When we haven't felt it,
and we've tried to force it,

428
00:16:59,790 --> 00:17:01,320
or maybe it's a
half-formed idea,

429
00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:04,380
it's missing some
important element

430
00:17:04,380 --> 00:17:06,270
and we've tried to
write it and force it,

431
00:17:06,270 --> 00:17:08,790
that ends up just
wasting a lot of time.

432
00:17:08,790 --> 00:17:11,770
Because you're just-- there's
something conceptually wrong.

433
00:17:11,770 --> 00:17:13,650
So you want to try to wait.

434
00:17:13,650 --> 00:17:15,720
It's not a science.

435
00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:18,820
It's going to be
different every time.

436
00:17:18,823 --> 00:17:22,283


437
00:17:24,700 --> 00:17:26,700
So I think the first
assignment for this class

438
00:17:26,700 --> 00:17:29,080
is probably the best assignment,
the most fun assignment.

439
00:17:29,075 --> 00:17:29,985
Definitely.

440
00:17:29,980 --> 00:17:32,770
Which is just watch some
of your favorite stuff.

441
00:17:32,772 --> 00:17:34,232
Watch some of your
favorite movies.

442
00:17:34,230 --> 00:17:36,180
Watch some of your favorite
shows, whatever it is you want.

443
00:17:36,180 --> 00:17:38,550
Read some of your favorite
comic books, whatever it is.

444
00:17:38,550 --> 00:17:39,810
Or your favorite
books, I mean,

445
00:17:39,810 --> 00:17:41,550
that'll take a little bit
longer than watching stuff,

446
00:17:41,550 --> 00:17:42,640
but whatever it is.

447
00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:46,640
And then try to identify
what is the connective tissue

448
00:17:46,637 --> 00:17:47,967
between the stuff that you love?

449
00:17:47,970 --> 00:17:49,560
Is there a connective tissue?

450
00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:52,990
Is there something
unique about your taste?

451
00:17:52,992 --> 00:17:54,452
Is there a reason
that you're drawn

452
00:17:54,450 --> 00:17:55,770
to those particular stories?

453
00:17:55,765 --> 00:17:57,395
See if you can figure
out what that is.

454
00:17:57,390 --> 00:18:00,090
And again, for us, it was
ordinary meets extraordinary.

455
00:18:00,090 --> 00:18:02,620
It doesn't have-- it can
be something very simple.

456
00:18:02,620 --> 00:18:05,280
It can be just one
simple thing that

457
00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:09,030
is connective tissue between all
of these things that you love,

458
00:18:09,030 --> 00:18:12,750
and maybe that will help give
you your inspiration for what

459
00:18:12,750 --> 00:18:14,500
you're going to write.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,990


2
00:00:08,490 --> 00:00:11,930
Something is coming,
something hungry for blood.

3
00:00:11,926 --> 00:00:14,906
[DOG BARKING]

4
00:00:16,390 --> 00:00:17,380
Oh.

5
00:00:17,382 --> 00:00:19,862
[LIGHT BULB ZAPPING]

6
00:00:21,350 --> 00:00:24,440
[STATIC BLIPPING]

7
00:00:24,440 --> 00:00:26,940
The idea for "Stranger Things"
actually traces all the way

8
00:00:26,940 --> 00:00:28,260
back to 2010.

9
00:00:28,260 --> 00:00:30,840
At that point, we were in
the middle of writing movies.

10
00:00:30,837 --> 00:00:31,917
We wanted to write movies.

11
00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,620
We actually sat down
and just wrote out--

12
00:00:34,620 --> 00:00:36,570
I think we spent a
week or two weeks

13
00:00:36,570 --> 00:00:39,260
just spitballing a
lot of movie ideas,

14
00:00:39,258 --> 00:00:40,798
as we were trying
to figure out, what

15
00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:41,980
are we going to write next?

16
00:00:41,980 --> 00:00:44,280
And we actually still
have this document.

17
00:00:44,280 --> 00:00:45,870
You'll see all the
ideas we wrote out.

18
00:00:45,870 --> 00:00:47,550
And we've talked about
this a little bit before,

19
00:00:47,550 --> 00:00:49,430
but you're going to
throw out a lot of ideas.

20
00:00:49,425 --> 00:00:51,245
A lot of them are
not going to be good.

21
00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:53,070
And even the idea that
is "Stranger Things"

22
00:00:53,070 --> 00:00:55,980
or would turn out to become
"Stranger Things" was not

23
00:00:55,980 --> 00:00:58,280
good in the 2010 iteration.

24
00:00:58,275 --> 00:00:59,405
There was a kernel there.

25
00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:01,470
But even then in 2010,
we didn't realize

26
00:01:01,470 --> 00:01:03,130
that that kernel was there.

27
00:01:03,130 --> 00:01:04,350
It just sort of sat there.

28
00:01:04,349 --> 00:01:09,429
We put it away in a drawer, and
we didn't look at it for years.

29
00:01:09,430 --> 00:01:11,970
And, again, this is why even
ideas that you might not think

30
00:01:11,970 --> 00:01:14,790
are good or whatever,
keep a record of them,

31
00:01:14,790 --> 00:01:15,790
don't lose them.

32
00:01:15,790 --> 00:01:16,870
Email them to yourself.

33
00:01:16,870 --> 00:01:19,620
Keep them on Google
Docs or whatever program

34
00:01:19,620 --> 00:01:22,230
you're using, because you
never know, years from now,

35
00:01:22,230 --> 00:01:24,450
it may come back
and actually prove

36
00:01:24,450 --> 00:01:27,950
to be an important part
of an idea, a puzzle

37
00:01:27,953 --> 00:01:29,623
piece of an idea that
you're working on,

38
00:01:29,620 --> 00:01:31,540
which is what happened
with "Stranger Things."

39
00:01:31,537 --> 00:01:34,257
So we're going to show
you now this 2010 document

40
00:01:34,260 --> 00:01:37,590
where we came up with a bunch
of different movie ideas.

41
00:01:37,590 --> 00:01:39,510
I don't think we've
shown this to anyone

42
00:01:39,510 --> 00:01:44,520
outside of our parents and a
few close friends back in 2010.

43
00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:46,380
Some of these ideas,
like Matt said,

44
00:01:46,380 --> 00:01:47,950
are not the best in the world.

45
00:01:47,950 --> 00:01:49,960
But, again, that's
part of the process.

46
00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:52,090
So let's take a look
at this document.

47
00:01:52,090 --> 00:01:54,050
MATT DUFFER: Yeah,
screenplay ideas from-- this

48
00:01:54,048 --> 00:01:56,098
is-- it looks like
November 22 from 2010.

49
00:01:56,102 --> 00:01:57,812
We have a movie idea
for something called

50
00:01:57,810 --> 00:01:58,560
Make-A-Monster.

51
00:01:58,560 --> 00:01:59,970
That's not a good title.

52
00:01:59,970 --> 00:02:01,350
ROSS DUFFER: "In
the near future,

53
00:02:01,345 --> 00:02:02,855
advancements in
genetic engineering

54
00:02:02,850 --> 00:02:05,940
allow for the designing of
unique domesticated pets.

55
00:02:05,940 --> 00:02:08,250
For example, a website
called Design-A-Dog

56
00:02:08,250 --> 00:02:09,720
allows you to mix
breeds to create

57
00:02:09,720 --> 00:02:11,310
your own personalized puppy."

58
00:02:11,310 --> 00:02:14,550
And then this young boy
named Liam finds a company

59
00:02:14,550 --> 00:02:17,460
to actually make a monster,
which is you combine DNA

60
00:02:17,460 --> 00:02:21,900
from different animals, and
he creates his own monster,

61
00:02:21,900 --> 00:02:23,760
which, of course,
then ends up turning

62
00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:25,430
into a bit of a nightmare.

63
00:02:25,434 --> 00:02:25,934
Uh.

64
00:02:25,934 --> 00:02:26,374
Uh.

65
00:02:26,376 --> 00:02:26,816
You know, whatever.

66
00:02:26,820 --> 00:02:27,570
I don't know.

67
00:02:27,570 --> 00:02:28,170
There's a reason that was--

68
00:02:28,170 --> 00:02:28,590
I give it--

69
00:02:28,590 --> 00:02:29,630
--shoved into a drawer.

70
00:02:29,632 --> 00:02:32,652
But if one of you want to run
with that idea, go for it.

71
00:02:32,652 --> 00:02:33,982
I give it-- but you know what?

72
00:02:33,985 --> 00:02:35,175
Here's what is
interesting, though,

73
00:02:35,170 --> 00:02:36,030
about this Make-A-Monster idea.

74
00:02:36,030 --> 00:02:38,280
So we love the idea of a kid
raising a monster, right?

75
00:02:38,280 --> 00:02:41,160
So it-- or we liked some
aspects of it, right?

76
00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:42,810
It feels a little
like "Gremlins"-y.

77
00:02:42,810 --> 00:02:45,570
And the spirit of that kind of
wound up in "Stranger Things"

78
00:02:45,570 --> 00:02:47,300
Season 2, when we
had Dustin have--

79
00:02:47,300 --> 00:02:47,610
ROSS DUFFER: That's true.

80
00:02:47,610 --> 00:02:48,940
MATT DUFFER: --raising Dart.

81
00:02:48,937 --> 00:02:50,307
[GROWLING]

82
00:02:50,310 --> 00:02:53,610
Mediocre idea, mediocre title,
but there were elements of it

83
00:02:53,610 --> 00:02:56,640
that we ended up using, like,
however many years later, eight

84
00:02:56,640 --> 00:02:57,220
years later.

85
00:02:57,220 --> 00:02:57,720
So--

86
00:02:57,720 --> 00:02:58,410
Then the second idea--

87
00:02:58,410 --> 00:02:59,200
--you never know.

88
00:02:59,202 --> 00:03:01,352
--we've got is Frame 285.

89
00:03:01,347 --> 00:03:02,427
MATT DUFFER: Better title.

90
00:03:02,430 --> 00:03:03,510
ROSS DUFFER: Better title.

91
00:03:03,513 --> 00:03:04,423
I think better idea.

92
00:03:04,420 --> 00:03:06,930
There's some logical
issues with this one.

93
00:03:06,930 --> 00:03:10,860
We-- like we said earlier,
we love conspiracy theories.

94
00:03:10,860 --> 00:03:14,410
We're particularly obsessed
with the JFK conspiracy theory.

95
00:03:14,410 --> 00:03:16,890
So-- or conspiracy
theories, I should say.

96
00:03:16,890 --> 00:03:21,210
So this is really about there's
a missing frame in the Zapruder

97
00:03:21,210 --> 00:03:23,670
film, which is Frame 285.

98
00:03:23,670 --> 00:03:26,160
And so the idea is that this
missing frame is actually

99
00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:28,860
the key to solving JFK's murder.

100
00:03:28,860 --> 00:03:30,990
So the idea is that
this is, again--

101
00:03:30,990 --> 00:03:32,490
I think we mentioned
this earlier.

102
00:03:32,490 --> 00:03:34,530
We were trying to write
some found footage stuff,

103
00:03:34,532 --> 00:03:38,282
because that was in back then,
which was a mistake, because we

104
00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:40,470
don't even like found footage.

105
00:03:40,470 --> 00:03:42,450
So the idea is that
it's the babushka lady.

106
00:03:42,450 --> 00:03:44,580
She's filming the assassination.

107
00:03:44,580 --> 00:03:47,310
And people basically want to
come after and get this footage

108
00:03:47,310 --> 00:03:49,900
from her, because it shows who
the real, true perpetrators

109
00:03:49,900 --> 00:03:50,400
are.

110
00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:53,040
And so it's found footage
with these assassins

111
00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:54,450
coming after this family.

112
00:03:54,445 --> 00:03:56,825
It's not a terrible idea,
but the problem with the idea

113
00:03:56,820 --> 00:03:59,760
is how do you do a found
footage movie when it was--

114
00:03:59,760 --> 00:04:02,610
with 19-- I think
that was set in 1963.

115
00:04:02,605 --> 00:04:03,485
You know what I mean?

116
00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:05,130
That was where--
we ran into some,

117
00:04:05,130 --> 00:04:07,170
like, real conceptual problems.

118
00:04:07,170 --> 00:04:07,950
It's not terrible.

119
00:04:07,950 --> 00:04:09,740
It's definitely better
than Make-A-Monster.

120
00:04:09,742 --> 00:04:13,352
Amidst these, like, whatever
sea level ideas, mediocre ideas,

121
00:04:13,350 --> 00:04:16,140
we have something called
The Montauk Experiment.

122
00:04:16,140 --> 00:04:19,420
Again, just like Frame 285,
it was a found footage idea.

123
00:04:19,422 --> 00:04:21,842
Found footage was all the rage,
so we were like, we better

124
00:04:21,839 --> 00:04:23,189
write a found footage idea.

125
00:04:23,190 --> 00:04:24,690
And this was based on--

126
00:04:24,690 --> 00:04:26,790
The Montauk Project, this
is based on a true life

127
00:04:26,790 --> 00:04:27,300
conspiracy.

128
00:04:27,300 --> 00:04:29,360
It's set in Montauk, Long
Island, Air Force base.

129
00:04:29,362 --> 00:04:31,322
This is something we read
about in high school,

130
00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:33,360
and I think we stumbled
across it when we were--

131
00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:34,140
Doing that--

132
00:04:34,140 --> 00:04:36,150
We were doing, like,
a small documentary

133
00:04:36,150 --> 00:04:38,040
for school about the
Philadelphia Experiment.

134
00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:39,460
We read about the
Montauk Project.

135
00:04:39,457 --> 00:04:40,927
We became obsessed with it.

136
00:04:40,930 --> 00:04:43,200
And the idea was
the US government

137
00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:47,580
was conducting these sort of top
secret experiments in this lab,

138
00:04:47,580 --> 00:04:49,770
and some weird
stuff had gone down.

139
00:04:49,770 --> 00:04:51,390
What we liked about
this conspiracy,

140
00:04:51,390 --> 00:04:53,940
that there was a lot
of flexibility in terms

141
00:04:53,940 --> 00:04:55,960
of what could happen there.

142
00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:57,790
I mean, there were
talks about time travel.

143
00:04:57,790 --> 00:05:00,330
There were talk about-- there
was a discussion about monsters

144
00:05:00,332 --> 00:05:05,522
being unleashed, experimenting
on civilians who developed

145
00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:07,320
psionic or psychic abilities.

146
00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:08,310
So there was a lot--

147
00:05:08,310 --> 00:05:09,480
the sandbox was really cool.

148
00:05:09,477 --> 00:05:10,057
But that's--

149
00:05:10,060 --> 00:05:12,720
We were always excited by
the sandbox of what The Montauk

150
00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:13,730
Project could offer us.

151
00:05:13,732 --> 00:05:15,692
And, really, when you
boil it down, what it--

152
00:05:15,690 --> 00:05:18,540
it is from the scientist's point
of view because it's-- this is

153
00:05:18,540 --> 00:05:20,370
a found footage
version of this story.

154
00:05:20,370 --> 00:05:22,920
But there's a protagonist
who they're studying,

155
00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:26,590
who's basically the only known
test subject who survived.

156
00:05:26,590 --> 00:05:29,920
And this really became
the prototype for Eleven,

157
00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:32,710
because this is a test
subject who survived,

158
00:05:32,710 --> 00:05:34,930
who was one of
many test subjects

159
00:05:34,930 --> 00:05:40,070
who developed psychic abilities
due to tests by the government.

160
00:05:40,070 --> 00:05:41,710
So if that sounds
familiar to you,

161
00:05:41,710 --> 00:05:44,860
then you've clearly
watched "Stranger Things."

162
00:05:44,860 --> 00:05:47,110
And so it's like, I think
the question is, like, why

163
00:05:47,110 --> 00:05:48,030
didn't we write it in?

164
00:05:48,027 --> 00:05:49,687
We didn't write it
in because, again, I

165
00:05:49,690 --> 00:05:51,650
think it was the found
footage aspect of it.

166
00:05:51,650 --> 00:05:54,010
We didn't know really how
to write found footage.

167
00:05:54,010 --> 00:05:58,440
We always struggled whenever
we tried to go to page

168
00:05:58,435 --> 00:06:00,855
and write a found footage story.

169
00:06:00,850 --> 00:06:02,360
So we could just never crack it.

170
00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:03,740
We didn't know--
we didn't really

171
00:06:03,735 --> 00:06:06,465
understand how storytelling
worked as a found footage.

172
00:06:06,460 --> 00:06:08,800
And also, it was so
much about the scientists

173
00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:10,930
and the way they did
it, which, again, we do

174
00:06:10,930 --> 00:06:14,210
see flashbacks in Season
1 to the testing and stuff

175
00:06:14,208 --> 00:06:15,248
they've done with Eleven.

176
00:06:15,250 --> 00:06:17,860
But we just couldn't get
that excited about telling

177
00:06:17,860 --> 00:06:20,780
the entire story set
within a lab like that.

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00:06:20,783 --> 00:06:22,453
MATT DUFFER: So we
put these ideas away.

179
00:06:22,450 --> 00:06:23,500
We put them in a drawer.

180
00:06:23,500 --> 00:06:25,330
We were not actively
thinking about them.

181
00:06:25,330 --> 00:06:27,660
But, again, they're simmering
in the back of our brains.

182
00:06:27,663 --> 00:06:29,773
Something might spark for you.

183
00:06:29,770 --> 00:06:32,270
The spark for us was--

184
00:06:32,270 --> 00:06:35,410
occurred three years later,
when we saw the Denis Villeneuve

185
00:06:35,410 --> 00:06:37,460
film starring Hugh
Jackman, Jake Gyllenhaal,

186
00:06:37,455 --> 00:06:38,835
called "Prisoners,"
which doesn't

187
00:06:38,830 --> 00:06:40,210
seem to bear a
lot of resemblance

188
00:06:40,210 --> 00:06:40,870
to "Stranger Things."

189
00:06:40,870 --> 00:06:42,610
But this is the thing-- this
is the movie that sparked it.

190
00:06:42,610 --> 00:06:44,740
So Ross and I were
walking out of that movie.

191
00:06:44,740 --> 00:06:46,090
We loved the movie.

192
00:06:46,090 --> 00:06:47,440
We were talking about it.

193
00:06:47,440 --> 00:06:49,480
At the same time, we
had seen ads for, like,

194
00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:50,200
"True Detective."

195
00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:52,630
So we were into the idea of,
like, a cinematic television

196
00:06:52,630 --> 00:06:53,320
show.

197
00:06:53,320 --> 00:06:55,840
And we started to
talk about what

198
00:06:55,840 --> 00:06:57,490
"Prisoners" would
have felt like had it

199
00:06:57,490 --> 00:06:59,020
been like "True Detective."

200
00:06:59,020 --> 00:07:00,610
I think one thing
when we came out

201
00:07:00,610 --> 00:07:01,910
of it, when we were
talking about it,

202
00:07:01,910 --> 00:07:03,220
we just loved these characters.

203
00:07:03,220 --> 00:07:05,680
We loved the Jake
Gyllenhaal character.

204
00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:06,610
And we just wanted--

205
00:07:06,610 --> 00:07:08,320
and we loved the Hugh
Jackman character.

206
00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:11,680
And we went, well, we had seen
these ads for "True Detective,"

207
00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:15,390
and we knew television was
starting to become cinematic.

208
00:07:15,388 --> 00:07:16,928
And they felt like
these long movies.

209
00:07:16,930 --> 00:07:18,580
And we went, well,
I would have loved

210
00:07:18,580 --> 00:07:22,180
to stick around with these
characters for another five

211
00:07:22,180 --> 00:07:24,010
or six hours.

212
00:07:24,010 --> 00:07:26,590
Like, that would be
cool to tell a long--

213
00:07:26,590 --> 00:07:28,280
this story as a long narrative.

214
00:07:28,280 --> 00:07:29,980
And so that started to--

215
00:07:29,980 --> 00:07:32,830
we started discussing
it and said, OK, well,

216
00:07:32,830 --> 00:07:38,500
what if we told a kidnapping
story that spanned over, say,

217
00:07:38,500 --> 00:07:40,430
eight hours of time?

218
00:07:40,430 --> 00:07:43,400
Which doesn't seem like-- it's
not the most amazing idea ever.

219
00:07:43,398 --> 00:07:44,438
Not groundbreaking, no.

220
00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:47,360
Not groundbreaking, but
then we thought, of course,

221
00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:50,230
we still have the
nerdy qualities to us,

222
00:07:50,230 --> 00:07:53,070
where we want to go, what if
there was an actual monster

223
00:07:53,065 --> 00:07:54,945
in it, not just a serial
killer-type monster,

224
00:07:54,940 --> 00:07:55,980
but a real monster in it?

225
00:07:55,982 --> 00:07:57,402
ROSS DUFFER: What
if we put a spin

226
00:07:57,398 --> 00:07:58,588
on it, a supernatural spin?

227
00:07:58,585 --> 00:07:59,775
[CLANGING]

228
00:07:59,775 --> 00:08:01,905
We started thinking about
poltergeists and all this

229
00:08:01,900 --> 00:08:04,180
and go, well, what if we
told this kidnapping story

230
00:08:04,180 --> 00:08:06,130
we were talking about,
but what if instead

231
00:08:06,130 --> 00:08:09,550
of a traditional kidnapping,
it's a supernatural kidnapping?

232
00:08:09,550 --> 00:08:12,820
So it's really we had those two
words that were like, OK, well,

233
00:08:12,820 --> 00:08:14,450
that's starting
to get us excited.

234
00:08:14,450 --> 00:08:15,740
It started to be a little
bit more interesting.

235
00:08:15,740 --> 00:08:17,630
It was like, OK, we
haven't seen that before.

236
00:08:17,630 --> 00:08:19,260
And then what would
this supernatural--

237
00:08:19,255 --> 00:08:20,255
ROSS DUFFER: Kidnapping.

238
00:08:20,255 --> 00:08:22,515
What would kick off the
supernatural kidnapping?

239
00:08:22,510 --> 00:08:25,830
And that's what led us back
to thinking about The Montauk

240
00:08:25,830 --> 00:08:26,330
Project.

241
00:08:26,330 --> 00:08:27,700
In this 2010 document.

242
00:08:27,700 --> 00:08:29,330
In this document from 2010.

243
00:08:29,327 --> 00:08:30,907
What really got us
excited then was we

244
00:08:30,910 --> 00:08:33,910
started to think about
the time period of that.

245
00:08:33,909 --> 00:08:38,229
The Montauk Project occurred
late '70s, early '80s.

246
00:08:38,230 --> 00:08:39,940
And we go, OK,
well, this would now

247
00:08:39,940 --> 00:08:42,040
be-- that would
dictate the story being

248
00:08:42,039 --> 00:08:43,359
set in the early '80s.

249
00:08:43,358 --> 00:08:45,398
And we were like, OK,
that's really interesting--

250
00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:45,900
Yes.

251
00:08:45,900 --> 00:08:49,630
--because then we can kind of
pay homage to these films that

252
00:08:49,630 --> 00:08:52,890
we grew up loving, a lot
of the sort of films from

253
00:08:52,890 --> 00:08:54,460
the Spielberg era, right?

254
00:08:54,460 --> 00:08:57,160
So that's when you
think about "ET,"

255
00:08:57,160 --> 00:08:59,470
you think about "Poltergeist,"
you think about "Jaws."

256
00:08:59,470 --> 00:09:01,560
And then we got--
then we're like, OK,

257
00:09:01,560 --> 00:09:03,310
now we're actually
really on to something.

258
00:09:03,310 --> 00:09:05,590
And that was-- immediately,
we go, that's it.

259
00:09:05,592 --> 00:09:07,302
That's the next thing
that we're writing.

260
00:09:07,300 --> 00:09:09,520
And I think the beauty,
as Matt mentioned earlier,

261
00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:11,680
about the Montauk
Project conspiracy is not

262
00:09:11,680 --> 00:09:14,560
a lot is known, so it gives
you a lot of flexibility.

263
00:09:14,560 --> 00:09:17,800
There were rumors of
kids with psychic powers.

264
00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:20,590
And there were also rumors
about monsters coming

265
00:09:20,590 --> 00:09:22,180
through another dimension.

266
00:09:22,180 --> 00:09:25,630
So suddenly, we have these
two big ideas floating around,

267
00:09:25,630 --> 00:09:27,040
which is we had psychic powers--

268
00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:29,400
[SCREAMS]

269
00:09:30,587 --> 00:09:31,917
ROSS DUFFER: --we had monsters--

270
00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:33,220
[CRUNCHING]

271
00:09:33,216 --> 00:09:34,106
[ROARING]

272
00:09:34,106 --> 00:09:35,146
[HIGH-PITCHED SCREECHING]

273
00:09:35,148 --> 00:09:36,118
[SHOUTING]

274
00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:39,810
--and we had what "Prisoners"
gave us, which is this--

275
00:09:39,810 --> 00:09:42,990
a drive, which you always
need, which is a kidnapping.

276
00:09:42,990 --> 00:09:45,510
And this is-- once
that all sort of hit,

277
00:09:45,510 --> 00:09:47,940
as we walked out of "Prisoners"
and the following morning

278
00:09:47,940 --> 00:09:51,190
when we talked about it,
we knew we had an idea.

279
00:09:51,190 --> 00:09:52,320
We had that spark.

280
00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:53,880
We had what we felt--

281
00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:56,280
and, again, it's a
little bare bones now,

282
00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:59,490
but we felt we had
that big idea that we

283
00:09:59,490 --> 00:10:01,170
had been looking for so long.

284
00:10:01,170 --> 00:10:04,470
And what those two words,
supernatural kidnapping,

285
00:10:04,470 --> 00:10:07,500
gave us on top of all
of these other ideas

286
00:10:07,500 --> 00:10:11,160
is it gave us a drive, which is
what we talked about earlier.

287
00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:13,980
It gives us that glue
to hold it together,

288
00:10:13,980 --> 00:10:17,250
because if you really start to
break down "Stranger Things,"

289
00:10:17,250 --> 00:10:18,790
there's a lot going on.

290
00:10:18,790 --> 00:10:20,040
It's-- you've got the monster.

291
00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:21,370
You've got the psychic powers.

292
00:10:21,370 --> 00:10:22,660
You've got this broken sheriff.

293
00:10:22,662 --> 00:10:25,112
You've got-- there's a
lot of stuff going on.

294
00:10:25,110 --> 00:10:27,540
But what we knew-- and we
didn't have all those ideas yet,

295
00:10:27,540 --> 00:10:28,670
but we did have a--

296
00:10:28,665 --> 00:10:31,295
we were starting to come up
with some of these ideas.

297
00:10:31,290 --> 00:10:34,170
And we knew that no matter
what ideas we came up with,

298
00:10:34,170 --> 00:10:36,210
we had this drive.

299
00:10:36,210 --> 00:10:39,030
We had a missing kid
that we had to find.

300
00:10:39,030 --> 00:10:41,940
And we knew no matter what
we-- what crazy ideas we

301
00:10:41,940 --> 00:10:45,360
threw at it, we have this glue
that would hold it together.

302
00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:48,540
Hopefully, you have something
like that in your big idea.

303
00:10:48,540 --> 00:10:50,610
It will certainly make
your life a lot easier

304
00:10:50,610 --> 00:10:51,630
as you move forward.

305
00:10:51,630 --> 00:10:55,310


306
00:10:56,883 --> 00:10:58,553
So one thing I think
that is important

307
00:10:58,550 --> 00:11:03,620
is to write down your ideas like
we did in that 2010 document.

308
00:11:03,620 --> 00:11:05,790
It's good to keep a record
of all your old ideas.

309
00:11:05,787 --> 00:11:06,617
You may forget them.

310
00:11:06,620 --> 00:11:07,910
It's fun to come back to them.

311
00:11:07,910 --> 00:11:09,570
Maybe you'll come back
to them years later,

312
00:11:09,570 --> 00:11:10,940
something else
will spark, right?

313
00:11:10,940 --> 00:11:12,770
These ideas are going
to be simmering there.

314
00:11:12,773 --> 00:11:14,753
Maybe you have the
next "Jurassic Park."

315
00:11:14,750 --> 00:11:15,560
I don't know.

316
00:11:15,560 --> 00:11:16,490
I think a lot of
people think you

317
00:11:16,490 --> 00:11:18,710
have to send it into the
WGA or anything like that.

318
00:11:18,710 --> 00:11:19,280
You don't.

319
00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:20,630
Just email it to yourself.

320
00:11:20,630 --> 00:11:22,070
You're covered.

321
00:11:22,070 --> 00:11:23,180
But it's important.

322
00:11:23,180 --> 00:11:23,810
Write it down.

323
00:11:23,810 --> 00:11:26,570
I think also writing down
illuminates some things.

324
00:11:26,570 --> 00:11:27,920
Can you write it down in a way?

325
00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:30,560
Does it come across in a
written form very clearly?

326
00:11:30,560 --> 00:11:31,280
It should.

327
00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:34,100
If it doesn't, maybe your idea's
too complicated or too muddled.

328
00:11:34,100 --> 00:11:35,750
So anyway, take the time.

329
00:11:35,750 --> 00:11:36,330
Write it down.

330
00:11:36,333 --> 00:11:38,043
These don't have to
be long descriptions.

331
00:11:38,042 --> 00:11:39,712
If you're reading
screenwriting books,

332
00:11:39,710 --> 00:11:42,230
you're going to hear
a lot about a logline.

333
00:11:42,230 --> 00:11:45,890
And a logline is usually
one to three sentences

334
00:11:45,890 --> 00:11:47,490
which summarize your idea.

335
00:11:47,490 --> 00:11:51,320
Now, what Matt and I do is we
write a little bit more just

336
00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:53,120
to see how that story's flowing.

337
00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:55,530
Now, it's still missing
a lot of the big details.

338
00:11:55,530 --> 00:11:57,890
But as you saw in
that 2010 document,

339
00:11:57,890 --> 00:12:00,350
we like to write sort of
a short paragraph, maybe

340
00:12:00,350 --> 00:12:01,610
six to eight sentences.

341
00:12:01,610 --> 00:12:05,000
Just give it a little more
just to see how it's feeling.

342
00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:09,470
And that's exactly what we
did with "Stranger Things"

343
00:12:09,470 --> 00:12:11,710
before we even sat
down to outline it.

344
00:12:11,710 --> 00:12:13,130
We wrote it out
in paragraph form.

345
00:12:13,130 --> 00:12:14,150
We sent it to our agent.

346
00:12:14,150 --> 00:12:16,370
And we said, hey,
here's our new idea.

347
00:12:16,370 --> 00:12:17,760
What do you think about it?

348
00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:20,810
So this is what we wrote
back in 2014 to our agent.

349
00:12:20,810 --> 00:12:22,730
We said, "We're
calling it Montauk,

350
00:12:22,730 --> 00:12:26,570
and it's a limited series set
in 1980s Montauk, New York."

351
00:12:26,568 --> 00:12:27,858
And we made a little note here.

352
00:12:27,860 --> 00:12:31,520
"Note, Montauk back then
was akin to Amity in "Jaws,"

353
00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:33,770
not upscale like today.

354
00:12:33,770 --> 00:12:36,410
The small suburban
community is shaken

355
00:12:36,410 --> 00:12:39,230
when a 10-year-old boy vanishes
into thin air one night

356
00:12:39,230 --> 00:12:40,370
while biking home.

357
00:12:40,370 --> 00:12:43,010
We follow the boy's friends,
family, and teachers

358
00:12:43,010 --> 00:12:45,350
as they try to uncover
what happened to him.

359
00:12:45,350 --> 00:12:47,750
We soon realized that the
disappearance is somehow

360
00:12:47,750 --> 00:12:51,770
linked to strange happenings in
Montauk Air Force Station, home

361
00:12:51,770 --> 00:12:54,740
of the Montauk Project, where
a series of secret government

362
00:12:54,740 --> 00:12:59,120
experiments allegedly took place
in the late '70s, early '80s.

363
00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:02,030
But the boy's disappearance
is just the start,

364
00:13:02,030 --> 00:13:06,260
as stranger, more horrifying,
seemingly unexplainable

365
00:13:06,260 --> 00:13:08,630
happenings take
place all over town.

366
00:13:08,630 --> 00:13:10,850
And evil has been
unleashed here.

367
00:13:10,850 --> 00:13:16,340
Think "Super 8"/'80s Spielberg
crossed with vintage Stephen

368
00:13:16,340 --> 00:13:18,200
King, and you'll get the idea."

369
00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:20,000
I do remember
specifically you, like,

370
00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:24,470
writing that down in email and
going, this sounds really cool.

371
00:13:24,470 --> 00:13:26,060
Like, we were really
excited about it.

372
00:13:26,063 --> 00:13:27,733
We were excited to
share it with people.

373
00:13:27,730 --> 00:13:30,140
And I think the previous
document, the 2010,

374
00:13:30,140 --> 00:13:32,330
we were sort of like, should
we send this to people?

375
00:13:32,330 --> 00:13:32,750
I don't know.

376
00:13:32,750 --> 00:13:35,130
We were a little bit embarrassed
about some of the ideas.

377
00:13:35,125 --> 00:13:37,495
This one, we were
like, man, I really

378
00:13:37,490 --> 00:13:39,840
want to send this right away,
and how could someone not

379
00:13:39,835 --> 00:13:40,465
find this cool?

380
00:13:40,460 --> 00:13:41,570
Because we-- it
was just-- to us,

381
00:13:41,570 --> 00:13:43,530
it was all the coolest
stuff in the world.

382
00:13:43,530 --> 00:13:45,440
And even though this is a
little more than a logline,

383
00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:47,360
this is a little more
than a couple sentences,

384
00:13:47,357 --> 00:13:49,097
it is very vague at this point.

385
00:13:49,100 --> 00:13:52,490
We say "friends,
family, teachers."

386
00:13:52,490 --> 00:13:56,810
There's no mention of anyone
remotely resembling Eleven.

387
00:13:56,810 --> 00:13:59,870
There's no mention of a sheriff.

388
00:13:59,870 --> 00:14:02,720
There's no mention
of the boy's mom.

389
00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:04,280
This is a really--

390
00:14:04,280 --> 00:14:05,900
again, don't stress out.

391
00:14:05,897 --> 00:14:08,477
You're going to be missing a lot
of the big details right now.

392
00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:09,660
That's going to be--

393
00:14:09,660 --> 00:14:11,660
we're going to get into
that a little bit later.

394
00:14:11,660 --> 00:14:12,740
It's OK to be vague.

395
00:14:12,740 --> 00:14:16,850
This is really just about that
big idea, that big concept.

396
00:14:16,850 --> 00:14:18,290
It's OK to be vague.

397
00:14:18,290 --> 00:14:20,580
You don't even have to
have your characters yet.

398
00:14:20,580 --> 00:14:21,620
We certainly didn't.

399
00:14:21,620 --> 00:14:23,310
It's not going to
be fully formed now.

400
00:14:23,310 --> 00:14:24,730
But as you can
see, that does kind

401
00:14:24,727 --> 00:14:26,717
of capture the essence
and spirit of the show,

402
00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:28,760
despite having very few details.

403
00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:30,800
So good to start broad.

404
00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:31,460
Very simple.

405
00:14:31,460 --> 00:14:32,090
Baby steps.

406
00:14:32,090 --> 00:14:35,140

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,900


2
00:00:07,245 --> 00:00:09,455
So now we've got
our laptops out.

3
00:00:09,450 --> 00:00:11,790
We're going to show you
how to take that big idea

4
00:00:11,790 --> 00:00:16,350
and write it into a
digestible short paragraph

5
00:00:16,353 --> 00:00:17,773
that you can send
to your friends.

6
00:00:17,770 --> 00:00:19,950
You can send to your
agent, whatever you want.

7
00:00:19,950 --> 00:00:24,240
In order to do this, we're
going to use a made up idea.

8
00:00:24,240 --> 00:00:26,880
We talked about doing a
fake Dustin Steve spinoff.

9
00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:29,210
This is not a real
thing, Netflix.

10
00:00:29,210 --> 00:00:30,000
This is a fake--

11
00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:31,230
this is a fake idea.

12
00:00:31,230 --> 00:00:32,250
It's super undercooked.

13
00:00:32,250 --> 00:00:33,180
It's underdeveloped.

14
00:00:33,180 --> 00:00:35,220
Dustin and Steve,
of course, are two

15
00:00:35,220 --> 00:00:39,400
of the characters from "Stranger
Things" who you may know.

16
00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:41,730
They work really great
as kind of buddies.

17
00:00:41,730 --> 00:00:43,360
They're always often
paired together,

18
00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:44,360
so they're fun to write.

19
00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:46,620
So we thought, hey, if
we're gonna write a spin off

20
00:00:46,615 --> 00:00:48,245
involving "Stranger
Things" characters,

21
00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:50,400
why not write it involving
Steve and Dustin?

22
00:00:50,395 --> 00:00:50,895
So--

23
00:00:50,895 --> 00:00:51,575
Here we go.

24
00:00:51,570 --> 00:00:52,490
I guess we'll do it.

25
00:00:52,487 --> 00:00:52,997
All right.

26
00:00:52,995 --> 00:00:55,065
And we-- I guess we've
cheated a little bit.

27
00:00:55,060 --> 00:00:56,600
We don't have a ton
of time, so we've

28
00:00:56,602 --> 00:00:59,252
kind of pre come up with
a little bit-- a few ideas

29
00:00:59,250 --> 00:01:01,800
as it relates to Steve and
Dustin, the deepfake Steve

30
00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:02,760
and Dustin spinoff.

31
00:01:02,760 --> 00:01:05,200


32
00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:07,290
ROSS DUFFER: So we
do everything in--

33
00:01:07,290 --> 00:01:08,520
MATT DUFFER: In Google Docs.

34
00:01:08,517 --> 00:01:10,097
ROSS DUFFER: For us,
writing together,

35
00:01:10,100 --> 00:01:12,860
it's a great way for us
to collaborate and just be

36
00:01:12,860 --> 00:01:14,420
both writing at the same time.

37
00:01:14,420 --> 00:01:17,280
Again, this is gonna completely
depend on your process.

38
00:01:17,280 --> 00:01:17,780
So--

39
00:01:17,780 --> 00:01:19,040
When I'd normally
be doing this,

40
00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:20,540
I would probably
have headphones on.

41
00:01:20,540 --> 00:01:23,450
I would be listening to music,
but it feels, like, pretty

42
00:01:23,450 --> 00:01:24,830
antisocial and uncinematic.

43
00:01:24,830 --> 00:01:25,460
So I'm gonna--

44
00:01:25,460 --> 00:01:27,710
I'm not gonna have headphones
on while I'm doing this.

45
00:01:27,710 --> 00:01:29,900
So what we were
thinking about with Steve

46
00:01:29,900 --> 00:01:32,510
and Dustin is when we
were talking about what

47
00:01:32,510 --> 00:01:35,150
that spinoff could be, one
thing that we haven't really

48
00:01:35,150 --> 00:01:39,260
had time to explore in the
show is where is Dustin's dad,

49
00:01:39,260 --> 00:01:41,210
and that was sort
of the question

50
00:01:41,210 --> 00:01:43,250
that we're talking about
a couple of days ago.

51
00:01:43,250 --> 00:01:45,950
They go, well, that could be
interesting as a starting off

52
00:01:45,950 --> 00:01:48,590
point to explore in terms
of putting-- getting them

53
00:01:48,590 --> 00:01:49,400
on an adventure.

54
00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:53,570
So, you know, our initial
thought is, okay, what if--

55
00:01:53,568 --> 00:01:55,608
and this is about as far
as it's been developed--

56
00:01:55,610 --> 00:01:58,220
what if Dustin--

57
00:01:58,220 --> 00:02:00,770
Dustin, after the
events of season three,

58
00:02:00,770 --> 00:02:04,100
say, what if he's feeling
emotional about what happened

59
00:02:04,100 --> 00:02:09,890
and he wants to go and visit his
dad before high school starts.

60
00:02:09,889 --> 00:02:13,789
So visit his dad who doesn't
live in Hawkins, so--

61
00:02:13,790 --> 00:02:17,300
and, of course, Steve
has just lost his job

62
00:02:17,300 --> 00:02:21,000
because the mall and
Scoops Ahoy burned down,

63
00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:23,360
and so he convinces
Steve to go with them.

64
00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:25,530
That's sort of the starting
off point for the idea.

65
00:02:25,530 --> 00:02:27,160
And Dustin doesn't have--

66
00:02:27,158 --> 00:02:27,948
doesn't have a car.

67
00:02:27,950 --> 00:02:29,030
He doesn't have a
car, right, right.

68
00:02:29,030 --> 00:02:30,240
Who else is he gonna go to?

69
00:02:30,238 --> 00:02:33,488
Well, he's gonna go to Steve,
so, you know, it works.

70
00:02:33,490 --> 00:02:36,890
And I think what we also
like about the dad in terms

71
00:02:36,890 --> 00:02:41,510
of this made up idea is that
the dad can give us sort

72
00:02:41,510 --> 00:02:43,190
of an emotional core to this.

73
00:02:43,190 --> 00:02:44,720
I think it's
something emotional,

74
00:02:44,720 --> 00:02:48,200
Dustin dealing with his
issues with his dad,

75
00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:51,600
and, of course, Steve
also while his dad

76
00:02:51,597 --> 00:02:53,177
isn't a character
in the show, he also

77
00:02:53,180 --> 00:02:54,380
has issues with his dad.

78
00:02:54,380 --> 00:02:59,210
So I think it's something that
we could use this storyline

79
00:02:59,210 --> 00:03:01,250
to sort explore those
issues and give it

80
00:03:01,250 --> 00:03:04,370
in an emotional core, which
I think could be, you know,

81
00:03:04,370 --> 00:03:05,420
interesting.

82
00:03:05,420 --> 00:03:07,730
But, again, you know,
this is very basic.

83
00:03:07,730 --> 00:03:10,820
What Ross said there is almost
all you need in terms of--

84
00:03:10,815 --> 00:03:11,695
Yeah, I don't know.

85
00:03:11,690 --> 00:03:12,830
The emotion of the idea.

86
00:03:12,830 --> 00:03:15,080
I don't know what
their arc is or anything,

87
00:03:15,080 --> 00:03:17,420
but I know that there
are something there

88
00:03:17,420 --> 00:03:18,710
that could certainly be--

89
00:03:18,710 --> 00:03:21,800
But you'll see as
Ross is kind of talking,

90
00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:24,740
I'm just sort of jotting down
what he's talking about--

91
00:03:24,740 --> 00:03:26,830
just-- it's fine.

92
00:03:26,828 --> 00:03:28,368
It's gonna be really
sketchy, there's

93
00:03:28,370 --> 00:03:30,980
going to be typos, dashes,
whatever, so this is

94
00:03:30,980 --> 00:03:32,480
Dustin Steve spinoff.

95
00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:34,630
Dustin's dad, where is he?

96
00:03:34,625 --> 00:03:36,895
It's Dustin's goal.

97
00:03:36,890 --> 00:03:38,510
Dustin's goal is
to find his dad.

98
00:03:38,510 --> 00:03:39,470
ROSS DUFFER: Well,
that's his initial--

99
00:03:39,470 --> 00:03:40,560
MATT DUFFER: Initial goal.

100
00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:40,680
Yeah.

101
00:03:40,675 --> 00:03:41,755
ROSS DUFFER: Initial goal.

102
00:03:41,758 --> 00:03:44,598
That's obviously-- we're not
going to just write a road trip

103
00:03:44,600 --> 00:03:46,610
movie with Dustin
and Steve although I

104
00:03:46,610 --> 00:03:49,130
suppose that could be fun in
a "Little Miss Sunshine" way.

105
00:03:49,130 --> 00:03:51,410
But this is in the world
of "Stranger Things"--

106
00:03:51,410 --> 00:03:52,910
MATT DUFFER: This
is not the drive--

107
00:03:52,910 --> 00:03:55,610
ROSS DUFFER: So this
is not the drive.

108
00:03:55,610 --> 00:03:57,620
That's just sort of what
kicks off the journey,

109
00:03:57,620 --> 00:03:58,970
but it's not the drive.

110
00:03:58,970 --> 00:04:01,940
The drive would
really kick in when

111
00:04:01,940 --> 00:04:05,670
they get to the dad's house.

112
00:04:05,670 --> 00:04:08,460
Now it-- would be
not-- the story would

113
00:04:08,460 --> 00:04:11,160
kind of end if the dad
was just there, right.

114
00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:16,810
So let's say where's-- where
do we say the dad lives?

115
00:04:16,808 --> 00:04:18,848
Does he live in Arizona,
or is it somewhere else?

116
00:04:18,850 --> 00:04:21,070
Yeah, let's see he--
is it-- yeah, he should--

117
00:04:21,069 --> 00:04:24,489
Let's say he's Arizona.

118
00:04:24,490 --> 00:04:27,420
Now dad isn't there, right.

119
00:04:27,417 --> 00:04:28,247
He can't be there.

120
00:04:28,250 --> 00:04:28,960
He can't be there.

121
00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:29,830
The story would end.

122
00:04:29,830 --> 00:04:31,940
Dad is not in Arizona.

123
00:04:31,940 --> 00:04:35,440
So the goal right here, this
initial thing is still--

124
00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:37,720
it's still-- they're
still in-- there's

125
00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:39,010
an obstacle here instantly.

126
00:04:39,010 --> 00:04:39,850
Where is the dad?

127
00:04:39,850 --> 00:04:41,560
Where is the dad?

128
00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:42,310
Where is the dad?

129
00:04:42,310 --> 00:04:44,680
Well, maybe what we
were talking about

130
00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:47,260
is that the dad is like Dustin.

131
00:04:47,260 --> 00:04:49,630
He's quirky.

132
00:04:49,630 --> 00:04:52,330
He goes off on his adventures
unknown because why

133
00:04:52,330 --> 00:04:53,200
is the dad not here.

134
00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:55,360
Why is the dad not with his son?

135
00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:58,270
Well, maybe the dad
has his own issues,

136
00:04:58,270 --> 00:05:02,380
and he's more interested in
going off on his own adventures

137
00:05:02,380 --> 00:05:04,390
than he is in raising his son.

138
00:05:04,390 --> 00:05:06,490
And maybe that's why
he left his family.

139
00:05:06,490 --> 00:05:07,060
So there.

140
00:05:07,060 --> 00:05:07,900
Now we've got--

141
00:05:07,900 --> 00:05:10,070
Well, it's-- we can think
about a little bit like,

142
00:05:10,067 --> 00:05:11,127
you know, "Last Crusade."

143
00:05:11,125 --> 00:05:11,825
Sure.

144
00:05:11,828 --> 00:05:12,368
Indy's dad.

145
00:05:12,370 --> 00:05:12,950
How I get inspirations, yes.

146
00:05:12,950 --> 00:05:13,460
Right, yes.

147
00:05:13,460 --> 00:05:13,960
Yeah.

148
00:05:13,960 --> 00:05:17,650
So, yes, Indy's dad is a sort
of a good inspiration that he

149
00:05:17,650 --> 00:05:18,520
wasn't--

150
00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:22,430
Sean Connery was not there
for Harrison Ford growing up.

151
00:05:22,430 --> 00:05:24,040
So what we were
thinking about is

152
00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:26,680
when we were talking about
this, it felt a little

153
00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:29,410
like we wanted to get
away from Hawkins, which

154
00:05:29,410 --> 00:05:32,800
means it probably
shouldn't involve anything

155
00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:34,660
with the upside down,
and we certainly

156
00:05:34,660 --> 00:05:35,970
don't want to get 11 involved.

157
00:05:35,970 --> 00:05:39,370
This really what we wanted this
spinoff to be for this class

158
00:05:39,370 --> 00:05:42,430
is really just focused
on Steve and Dustin.

159
00:05:42,430 --> 00:05:45,310
So we were talking
about what kind of story

160
00:05:45,310 --> 00:05:47,260
would be fun to see
these two characters

161
00:05:47,260 --> 00:05:48,670
that we love so much on.

162
00:05:48,670 --> 00:05:51,880
Of course, thinking
back on the movie--

163
00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:53,110
the movies we love.

164
00:05:53,110 --> 00:05:54,640
One of them is--

165
00:05:54,640 --> 00:05:57,100
and you've seen the inspiration
in "Stranger Things"

166
00:05:57,100 --> 00:06:00,100
if you've watched the show
which is "The Goonies."

167
00:06:00,100 --> 00:06:03,470
So "Goonies" is a big
inspiration that was as a kid,

168
00:06:03,470 --> 00:06:06,100
we would just watch it over
and over and over again.

169
00:06:06,100 --> 00:06:08,830
It's one of our favorite
movies growing up.

170
00:06:08,830 --> 00:06:12,040
So we thought it would
be fun to do something

171
00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:16,270
in that vein in the vein
of basically treasure.

172
00:06:16,270 --> 00:06:17,140
What if-- what if--

173
00:06:17,140 --> 00:06:19,210
what if-- what if that's
what the dad is looking

174
00:06:19,205 --> 00:06:21,585
at, just in the same way that
Indy's dad is going looking

175
00:06:21,580 --> 00:06:26,600
for some artifact that is of
great importance, in that case,

176
00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:27,280
the Holy Grail.

177
00:06:27,280 --> 00:06:29,770
What if in this case,
the dad is looking

178
00:06:29,770 --> 00:06:32,590
for some sort of treasure,
something he's been obsessed

179
00:06:32,590 --> 00:06:34,550
about his whole life.

180
00:06:34,550 --> 00:06:37,810
So I did a quick little
Google, and this came up

181
00:06:37,810 --> 00:06:42,010
which is Superstition
Mountains, which is in Arizona.

182
00:06:42,010 --> 00:06:45,490
There's something called
Lost Dutchman State Park,

183
00:06:45,490 --> 00:06:47,890
and apparently that
there is something

184
00:06:47,890 --> 00:06:49,870
called Lost Dutchman's mine.

185
00:06:49,870 --> 00:06:51,730
These are all great
names by the way.

186
00:06:51,730 --> 00:06:54,370
So there's this lost
Dutchman's mine,

187
00:06:54,370 --> 00:06:57,790
and there's a guy
named Adolf Ruth who's

188
00:06:57,790 --> 00:07:01,000
an amateur explorer and
treasure hunter in the '30s.

189
00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:05,410
And he went off looking for
this mine, and in this mine

190
00:07:05,410 --> 00:07:07,430
apparently is a lot of treasure.

191
00:07:07,428 --> 00:07:08,468
Everyone's looked for it.

192
00:07:08,470 --> 00:07:09,470
They can't find it.

193
00:07:09,470 --> 00:07:14,080
But what if, you know,
what if Dustin's dad thinks

194
00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:14,950
he found this mine.

195
00:07:14,950 --> 00:07:15,460
What if--

196
00:07:15,460 --> 00:07:18,090
MATT DUFFER: Or Dustin's dad
followed in Adolf's footsteps.

197
00:07:18,085 --> 00:07:20,415
ROSS DUFFER: Yeah, exactly,
in search of this mine.

198
00:07:20,413 --> 00:07:21,203
MATT DUFFER: Right.

199
00:07:21,205 --> 00:07:26,145
ROSS DUFFER: So that's
where Steve and Dustin, who

200
00:07:26,140 --> 00:07:27,550
knows how they
find out that this

201
00:07:27,553 --> 00:07:28,723
is maybe where the dad went.

202
00:07:28,720 --> 00:07:29,970
We don't need to
know that right now.

203
00:07:29,965 --> 00:07:31,665
MATT DUFFER: They
find a treasure map.

204
00:07:31,660 --> 00:07:33,220
ROSS DUFFER: Maybe they
don't have the map yet.

205
00:07:33,220 --> 00:07:34,930
Maybe they just
heard from a neighbor

206
00:07:34,930 --> 00:07:36,610
that he's obsessed
with this, whatever.

207
00:07:36,610 --> 00:07:37,290
It gives them--

208
00:07:37,285 --> 00:07:38,675
Yeah, a treasure map's
probably too obvious.

209
00:07:38,670 --> 00:07:39,550
It's too obvious.

210
00:07:39,553 --> 00:07:40,723
We're writing a series here.

211
00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:41,920
We're writing a
series, not a movie.

212
00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:43,450
So you'd probably
be something that

213
00:07:43,450 --> 00:07:45,950
would lead to something that
would lead to the treasure map.

214
00:07:45,950 --> 00:07:47,900
Again, we don't have
to figure that out.

215
00:07:47,900 --> 00:07:52,700
So I think Dustin's
goal is to find the dad.

216
00:07:52,695 --> 00:07:54,075
I think maybe this
is the drive--

217
00:07:54,070 --> 00:07:55,150
I think it is the drive.

218
00:07:55,153 --> 00:07:56,893
Is to find the dad,
not the treasure.

219
00:07:56,888 --> 00:07:57,428
[INAUDIBLE]

220
00:07:57,430 --> 00:08:01,640
Steve's goal is to find
the dad and the treasure

221
00:08:01,635 --> 00:08:02,265
because Steve--

222
00:08:02,260 --> 00:08:04,170
ROSS DUFFER: Well, he lost
his job at Scoops Ahoy.

223
00:08:04,170 --> 00:08:04,600
No, but he--

224
00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:06,100
I mean, Steve's gonna
be into the treasure.

225
00:08:06,100 --> 00:08:07,750
Like, Steve's gonna
want the treasure.

226
00:08:07,750 --> 00:08:10,780
Like, that's why he's going
to be motivated to stay here

227
00:08:10,780 --> 00:08:13,330
and journey into this
mine even though he's

228
00:08:13,330 --> 00:08:15,700
gonna be concerned about
the dangers involved.

229
00:08:15,700 --> 00:08:17,570
He's gonna want the
treasure at the end.

230
00:08:17,570 --> 00:08:20,250
So that's gonna be-- actually
it becomes Steve's main thing,

231
00:08:20,250 --> 00:08:20,750
main goal.

232
00:08:20,750 --> 00:08:22,440
And what I like
about this, again,

233
00:08:22,438 --> 00:08:24,728
this is all a little silly,
but what I do like about it

234
00:08:24,730 --> 00:08:27,190
is that we've got the
emotional core of Dustin

235
00:08:27,185 --> 00:08:28,065
going to get his dad.

236
00:08:28,060 --> 00:08:30,580
And we've also got the fun
element of the treasure,

237
00:08:30,580 --> 00:08:33,250
and we know that it's
danger because Adolf died.

238
00:08:33,250 --> 00:08:34,120
We don't know how.

239
00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:36,880
His dad has probably
been missing.

240
00:08:36,875 --> 00:08:37,375
Right.

241
00:08:37,375 --> 00:08:38,885
MATT DUFFER: Yeah,
Dustin's dad is missing.

242
00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:40,300
ROSS DUFFER: He's
missing and he's

243
00:08:40,297 --> 00:08:43,027
been missing for a
period of time that

244
00:08:43,030 --> 00:08:44,590
makes us nervous about him.

245
00:08:44,590 --> 00:08:46,540
I mean, he's a
kooky guy, right.

246
00:08:46,540 --> 00:08:48,520
He probably-- like,
I feel like he goes--

247
00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:51,020
you know, he goes off, they
lose track of them all the time,

248
00:08:51,020 --> 00:08:53,650
so Dustin's mom may know about
this, may not mention him,

249
00:08:53,650 --> 00:08:56,020
and may just not have been
in touch with him at all.

250
00:08:56,020 --> 00:08:58,400
So he could really be
miss-- properly missing.

251
00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:00,300
I think it needs to be long
enough that Dustin's concerned.

252
00:09:00,295 --> 00:09:01,695
Dustin is really
worried about his dad,

253
00:09:01,690 --> 00:09:03,740
and there's some humor here
in that Steve is mostly

254
00:09:03,740 --> 00:09:04,870
excited about the treasure.

255
00:09:04,865 --> 00:09:08,285
I can already see those
scenes playing out

256
00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:09,820
in sort of a fun way.

257
00:09:09,820 --> 00:09:12,960
I think that's how Dustin
could convince Steve to stay.

258
00:09:12,955 --> 00:09:15,075
Now there's nothing
in my googling

259
00:09:15,070 --> 00:09:17,380
that says there's
anything super--

260
00:09:17,380 --> 00:09:20,290
supernatural happening
in Superstition Mountain,

261
00:09:20,290 --> 00:09:22,270
but it is called
Superstition Mountain.

262
00:09:22,270 --> 00:09:24,280
And why haven't we
found this mine before?

263
00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:25,450
Why can no one find it?

264
00:09:25,450 --> 00:09:28,840
I feel like this gives an excuse
to hint at that there could

265
00:09:28,840 --> 00:09:31,660
be something supernatural
here in the same way

266
00:09:31,660 --> 00:09:34,780
that it is an Indiana
Jones, which we can hint at.

267
00:09:34,780 --> 00:09:38,690
Hint at-- oh my God,
you can see what

268
00:09:38,690 --> 00:09:41,750
a bad, messy writer we are.

269
00:09:41,750 --> 00:09:44,130
I've misspelled
things left and right.

270
00:09:44,130 --> 00:09:47,720
Hint at something supernatural.

271
00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:48,550
Okay.

272
00:09:48,545 --> 00:09:49,835
What is the supernatural?

273
00:09:49,835 --> 00:09:50,965
I don't know.

274
00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,370
I don't know if we
have to know right now.

275
00:09:53,366 --> 00:09:53,906
Right.

276
00:09:53,907 --> 00:09:55,737
Something is in the
mine-- something maybe--

277
00:09:55,740 --> 00:09:58,320
maybe there's-- maybe
there's a rumor of something

278
00:09:58,320 --> 00:09:58,950
in the mines.

279
00:09:58,950 --> 00:10:00,480
ROSS DUFFER: Remember we
didn't have the demogorgon

280
00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:02,850
or anything when we wrote that
"Stranger Things" paragraph.

281
00:10:02,850 --> 00:10:04,230
MATT DUFFER:
Something not human.

282
00:10:04,225 --> 00:10:06,665
ROSS DUFFER: Something not
human living in the mine

283
00:10:06,660 --> 00:10:08,070
and protecting it.

284
00:10:08,070 --> 00:10:08,870
Right?

285
00:10:08,865 --> 00:10:09,515
Well.

286
00:10:09,510 --> 00:10:10,250
Potentially?

287
00:10:10,245 --> 00:10:11,135
Right.

288
00:10:11,130 --> 00:10:12,210
Could be.

289
00:10:12,207 --> 00:10:12,917
Is that too much?

290
00:10:12,915 --> 00:10:14,225
No, I mean, the story--

291
00:10:14,220 --> 00:10:16,770
It's starting-- it's
starting to sound like smog,

292
00:10:16,772 --> 00:10:17,352
like a dragon.

293
00:10:17,355 --> 00:10:20,155
Okay, we don't want that.

294
00:10:20,151 --> 00:10:21,751
MATT DUFFER: Maybe--
I don't know.

295
00:10:21,750 --> 00:10:23,080
Maybe it has something
to do with the treasure.

296
00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:23,790
Maybe it doesn't.

297
00:10:23,788 --> 00:10:25,908
I don't think we have
to figure that out.

298
00:10:25,910 --> 00:10:27,410
ROSS DUFFER: But
there's some reason

299
00:10:27,410 --> 00:10:32,520
why no one in 100 year-- or
90 years has found this place.

300
00:10:32,518 --> 00:10:33,688
There's got to be something.

301
00:10:33,685 --> 00:10:35,695
MATT DUFFER: I'm just got to
put down any ideas I have.

302
00:10:35,690 --> 00:10:37,650
It's important to just
jot down a lot of ideas.

303
00:10:37,648 --> 00:10:41,688
Maybe Dustin's dad isn't the
only person who's gone missing.

304
00:10:41,690 --> 00:10:44,360
ROSS DUFFER: He definitely
isn't, not maybe.

305
00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:46,710
MATT DUFFER: Gone
missing-- many have gone--

306
00:10:46,705 --> 00:10:48,085
have gone missing
in these mines.

307
00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:50,120
ROSS DUFFER: Leading
with Adolf Ruth.

308
00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:53,660
No, but, I mean, that's
ancient history, right.

309
00:10:53,660 --> 00:10:54,860
People-- people more recent.

310
00:10:54,860 --> 00:10:56,820
Maybe people have gone
missing in these mines--

311
00:10:56,818 --> 00:10:59,508
And one last idea before
we start writing this--

312
00:10:59,510 --> 00:11:02,930
and Dustin's dad,
this is important,

313
00:11:02,930 --> 00:11:10,110
isn't the only one
looking for this treasure.

314
00:11:10,110 --> 00:11:12,690
So now we've got some bad guys.

315
00:11:12,690 --> 00:11:13,720
MATT DUFFER: Right.

316
00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:16,820
ROSS DUFFER: Some bad guys
are also looking for treasure.

317
00:11:16,815 --> 00:11:18,015
MATT DUFFER: Like bad--

318
00:11:18,015 --> 00:11:18,895
bad treasure hunters.

319
00:11:18,890 --> 00:11:20,310
ROSS DUFFER: Because as
we mentioned earlier,

320
00:11:20,310 --> 00:11:22,740
what you're going to need
is, besides the drive,

321
00:11:22,740 --> 00:11:24,490
now we've sort of
got two drives,

322
00:11:24,487 --> 00:11:26,067
but they're all
leading-- they're both

323
00:11:26,070 --> 00:11:28,540
leading to the same
destination, which is helpful.

324
00:11:28,540 --> 00:11:31,110
But we also have to start
throwing obstacles in.

325
00:11:31,110 --> 00:11:33,690
So they don't know where
to go, obstacle one,

326
00:11:33,690 --> 00:11:35,340
and then we're
setting up the idea

327
00:11:35,340 --> 00:11:37,620
that there are going to be
villains here both human

328
00:11:37,620 --> 00:11:39,420
and maybe not so human.

329
00:11:39,420 --> 00:11:41,530
So now we need to write
this out so it's coherent.

330
00:11:41,530 --> 00:11:42,030
Right?

331
00:11:42,030 --> 00:11:42,390
Right.

332
00:11:42,390 --> 00:11:43,520
So we have a lot of ideas.

333
00:11:43,520 --> 00:11:45,230
I'm just gonna start
roughing this out.

334
00:11:45,228 --> 00:11:46,768
We'll clean it up as we go.

335
00:11:46,770 --> 00:11:51,780
After the events
of season three,

336
00:11:51,780 --> 00:12:00,900
Dustin decides to set
out and find his--

337
00:12:00,900 --> 00:12:08,550
find his dad who's
living in Arizona.

338
00:12:08,550 --> 00:12:10,190
He recruits friend--

339
00:12:10,185 --> 00:12:12,155
Why is he--

340
00:12:12,150 --> 00:12:13,920
sorry, but why is he
suddenly setting out?

341
00:12:13,920 --> 00:12:14,520
I don't know why.

342
00:12:14,520 --> 00:12:16,590
I mean, I was thinking it
was something emotional

343
00:12:16,590 --> 00:12:18,900
like he wants to find him.

344
00:12:18,900 --> 00:12:21,150
I mean-- I mean, I'm
saying does he need to have--

345
00:12:21,150 --> 00:12:23,910
does he need here something as
specific as his dad is missing?

346
00:12:23,910 --> 00:12:24,820
It could be so maybe like.

347
00:12:24,820 --> 00:12:26,040
That maybe, like,
Claudia, the mom

348
00:12:26,040 --> 00:12:27,100
gets a phone call or something.

349
00:12:27,095 --> 00:12:29,045
Like I feel like we need
something to prompt it aside

350
00:12:29,040 --> 00:12:29,970
from, hey, I miss my dad.

351
00:12:29,970 --> 00:12:30,890
I wanna go see my dad.

352
00:12:30,887 --> 00:12:33,387
Yeah, something that sets
him off on his journey.

353
00:12:33,390 --> 00:12:34,650
Could it be Cerebro related?

354
00:12:34,650 --> 00:12:36,330
So Dustin has this like radio--

355
00:12:36,330 --> 00:12:37,230
Yes, it could be.

356
00:12:37,230 --> 00:12:37,980
Cerebro radio.

357
00:12:37,980 --> 00:12:41,760
So he could intercept something,
a strange message on Cerebro.

358
00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:44,190
Yeah.

359
00:12:44,190 --> 00:12:46,800
MATT DUFFER: That's-- why I
like that it's a little bit more

360
00:12:46,800 --> 00:12:51,290
specific to Dustin
intercepts a strange--

361
00:12:51,292 --> 00:12:52,502
I don't want to use strange--

362
00:12:58,475 --> 00:12:59,855
After the events
of season three,

363
00:12:59,850 --> 00:13:02,520
Dustin intercepts an
odd message on Cerebro,

364
00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:06,920
which a message he believes--

365
00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:13,410
he believes is, in fact,
from a communication

366
00:13:13,410 --> 00:13:15,540
from his estranged father.

367
00:13:18,330 --> 00:13:21,600
He [INAUDIBLE]---- he recruits his
friend Steve and Steve's car,

368
00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:24,380
of course, to assist
him in his journey.

369
00:13:24,375 --> 00:13:25,505
However, when they arrive--

370
00:13:25,500 --> 00:13:26,800
Wait, we haven't
said he was going--

371
00:13:26,802 --> 00:13:27,632
I haven't set it--

372
00:13:27,635 --> 00:13:28,685
I haven't set up Arizona.

373
00:13:28,680 --> 00:13:29,390
Oay.

374
00:13:29,385 --> 00:13:31,175
Strange father, he decides--

375
00:13:31,178 --> 00:13:33,218
I'm just say he decides
he has-- he wants to go--

376
00:13:33,220 --> 00:13:34,390
Who'll assist him in his--

377
00:13:34,387 --> 00:13:36,897
He wants to go
check on his dad.

378
00:13:36,900 --> 00:13:39,080
His dad-- his dad who lived--

379
00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:41,710
MATT DUFFER: You know what, I'm
going to change odd to cryptic.

380
00:13:41,705 --> 00:13:43,075
ROSS DUFFER: Yeah.

381
00:13:43,070 --> 00:13:45,620
[INAUDIBLE] with his
dad in this messages.

382
00:13:45,620 --> 00:13:48,080
Turns out Dustin's dad,
not unlike his son,

383
00:13:48,080 --> 00:13:53,720
loves a good adventure.

384
00:13:53,715 --> 00:13:57,125
Cryptic message on Cerebro,
a message he believes

385
00:13:57,120 --> 00:13:59,790
is, in fact, a communication
from his estranged father.

386
00:13:59,790 --> 00:14:06,180
Dustin decides he wants to check
on his dad who lives close--

387
00:14:06,180 --> 00:14:07,410
it's okay, whatever.

388
00:14:07,410 --> 00:14:08,080
This is the key.

389
00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:09,700
I mean, this is going to
be a little messy at first.

390
00:14:09,700 --> 00:14:11,430
However, when they
arrive in Arizona,

391
00:14:11,430 --> 00:14:23,420
they discover that
Dustin's dad is missing--

392
00:14:23,420 --> 00:14:28,810
ROSS DUFFER: To find the long
lost treasure of the Lost

393
00:14:28,810 --> 00:14:34,670
Dutchman's Mine hidden.

394
00:14:34,670 --> 00:14:37,120
Okay.

395
00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:47,960
Steve and Dustin now set off to
both find Dustin's dad as well

396
00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:50,450
as this-- as long as this--

397
00:14:50,445 --> 00:14:53,125
as well-- as well
as the treasure.

398
00:14:53,120 --> 00:14:53,630
Treasure.

399
00:14:53,630 --> 00:14:57,410
However, they aren't
the only ones.

400
00:14:57,410 --> 00:14:58,910
However, they
aren't the only ones

401
00:14:58,910 --> 00:15:00,930
looking for this treasure--

402
00:15:00,934 --> 00:15:04,804
And they soon discover
there's a reason--

403
00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:15,220
a reason that no
one has discovered

404
00:15:15,220 --> 00:15:17,290
this treasure in over--

405
00:15:17,290 --> 00:15:22,040
has discovered this
mine in over 300 years.

406
00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:27,220
There's something lurking
there, lurking in the dark.

407
00:15:27,222 --> 00:15:30,912
I think this last
sentence we could do looking

408
00:15:30,910 --> 00:15:35,890
for the treasure, and they
soon find themselves embroiled

409
00:15:35,890 --> 00:15:38,050
in a-- can we get a
sentence like that?

410
00:15:44,210 --> 00:15:50,390
Adventure involving--
involving thieves.

411
00:15:54,540 --> 00:15:55,360
OK.

412
00:15:55,362 --> 00:15:56,322
Wait, let me read it.

413
00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:57,070
I'm going to read it through.

414
00:15:57,070 --> 00:15:57,760
Hold on.

415
00:15:57,760 --> 00:15:59,150
Okay, here we go.

416
00:15:59,153 --> 00:16:00,823
Steve and Dustin
spinoff limited series.

417
00:16:00,820 --> 00:16:02,740
Okay, it does not have a title.

418
00:16:02,740 --> 00:16:06,320
Steve and Dustin-- you can just
say the Lost Dutchman's Mine.

419
00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:06,820
I mean--

420
00:16:06,820 --> 00:16:08,610
MATT DUFFER: Yeah, that
sounds like a fun--

421
00:16:08,612 --> 00:16:10,422
it's kind of got
that Indiana Jones--

422
00:16:10,420 --> 00:16:12,110
ROSS DUFFER: Yeah.

423
00:16:12,110 --> 00:16:13,690
Again, it's a little silly but--

424
00:16:13,690 --> 00:16:15,700
Doesn't sound great.

425
00:16:15,700 --> 00:16:16,990
No.

426
00:16:16,990 --> 00:16:19,760
Okay, okay, Steve and Dustin
and the Lost Dutchman's Mine.

427
00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:20,760
Okay, here we go.

428
00:16:20,758 --> 00:16:22,048
Let's see how this is sounding.

429
00:16:22,050 --> 00:16:23,780
So first of all, you
can see how we start out

430
00:16:23,780 --> 00:16:25,030
with a bunch of sketchy ideas.

431
00:16:25,030 --> 00:16:26,840
They don't all make
it into the paragraph

432
00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:30,350
because we want to keep
it short and tight.

433
00:16:30,350 --> 00:16:34,250
But so some of these
ideas move over

434
00:16:34,250 --> 00:16:38,390
into our brainstorming
in blue sky phase, which

435
00:16:38,390 --> 00:16:39,990
we'll get into later.

436
00:16:39,992 --> 00:16:40,702
Okay, here we go.

437
00:16:40,700 --> 00:16:41,780
You want to read out
see how it sounds?

438
00:16:41,780 --> 00:16:42,700
Yeah, I can read it.

439
00:16:42,697 --> 00:16:43,457
Okay, here we go.

440
00:16:43,460 --> 00:16:44,930
After the events
of season three,

441
00:16:44,930 --> 00:16:47,600
Dustin intercepts a
cryptic message on Cerebro,

442
00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:49,040
a message he
believes is, in fact,

443
00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:51,490
a communication from
his estranged father.

444
00:16:51,490 --> 00:16:52,490
That sounds pretty good.

445
00:16:52,490 --> 00:16:52,990
Okay.

446
00:16:52,990 --> 00:16:55,310
A concerned Dustin decides
to check on his dad who

447
00:16:55,310 --> 00:16:56,780
lives in Arizona.

448
00:16:56,780 --> 00:16:58,400
He recruits his
good friend Steve

449
00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:00,920
and Steve's car, of course,
to assist him in his journey.

450
00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:03,800
However, when Dustin and
Steve arrive in Arizona,

451
00:17:03,800 --> 00:17:07,550
they discover that
Dustin's dad is missing.

452
00:17:07,550 --> 00:17:09,980
How about they find that
Dustin's dad is missing and has

453
00:17:09,980 --> 00:17:11,660
been missing for--

454
00:17:11,660 --> 00:17:17,870
and has been missing
for many years?

455
00:17:17,869 --> 00:17:18,879
Many months.

456
00:17:18,877 --> 00:17:19,457
Many months.

457
00:17:19,460 --> 00:17:20,070
Let's see.

458
00:17:20,067 --> 00:17:20,897
[INTERPOSING VOICES]

459
00:17:20,900 --> 00:17:21,530
He'd be dead.

460
00:17:21,525 --> 00:17:22,665
What is he doing in the--

461
00:17:22,662 --> 00:17:23,332
That's a good.

462
00:17:23,329 --> 00:17:24,459
That's a great
question for the show.

463
00:17:24,462 --> 00:17:24,622
All right, fine.

464
00:17:24,619 --> 00:17:25,369
You can say years.

465
00:17:25,369 --> 00:17:27,069
Has been, in fact--
and has, in fact--

466
00:17:27,069 --> 00:17:27,999
That feels aggressive.

467
00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:28,970
Missing for many months.

468
00:17:28,970 --> 00:17:29,510
I'm going to say--

469
00:17:29,510 --> 00:17:30,510
I'm going to say months.

470
00:17:30,510 --> 00:17:34,130
We'll talk-- we'll
debate this off camera.

471
00:17:34,130 --> 00:17:37,310
Turns out that-- turns
out that Dustin's dad,

472
00:17:37,310 --> 00:17:40,220
very much like his son, loves
a good adventure and is set off

473
00:17:40,220 --> 00:17:42,110
to find the lost--

474
00:17:42,110 --> 00:17:43,880
missing-- the Lost
Dutchman's Mine--

475
00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:46,790
ROSS DUFFER: The rumored at
home of a great treasure.

476
00:17:46,785 --> 00:17:49,165
MATT DUFFER: Steve-- Dustin
and Steve now set off to find

477
00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:51,350
Dustin's dad as
well as the gold--

478
00:17:51,350 --> 00:17:53,030
ROSS DUFFER: As well
as the treasure.

479
00:17:53,030 --> 00:17:55,550
However, they ain't the
only ones looking for this.

480
00:17:55,550 --> 00:17:57,410
And they soon find
themselves embroiled

481
00:17:57,410 --> 00:18:00,080
in an adventure involving
thieves, treasure hunters,

482
00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:02,510
and something else, something
lurking in the dark,

483
00:18:02,510 --> 00:18:05,330
something not quite human.

484
00:18:05,330 --> 00:18:07,910
Again, what I would do if
we had a little more time

485
00:18:07,910 --> 00:18:09,510
is I would go
through and clean up.

486
00:18:09,510 --> 00:18:12,320
We've got a few repetitive
words and things like this,

487
00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:14,810
but, again, these
paragraphs really--

488
00:18:14,810 --> 00:18:16,710
they're for yourself,
and, of course,

489
00:18:16,710 --> 00:18:20,580
you can send them to close
friends, or in our case,

490
00:18:20,580 --> 00:18:23,870
we sent our Montauk
paragraph out to our agent.

491
00:18:23,870 --> 00:18:26,180
It's really just to see
how is this feeling.

492
00:18:26,180 --> 00:18:27,380
What's working about this?

493
00:18:27,380 --> 00:18:29,800
What's not working about this?

494
00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:31,310
And that's really
the point of this,

495
00:18:31,310 --> 00:18:34,420
and is this something that
it's getting you excited.

496
00:18:34,415 --> 00:18:36,745
So we're leaving
this as unfinished.

497
00:18:36,740 --> 00:18:38,900
It's not perfect, but
it's good to walk away

498
00:18:38,900 --> 00:18:42,230
from a paragraph
like this and look

499
00:18:42,230 --> 00:18:43,470
at it again with fresh eyes.

500
00:18:43,470 --> 00:18:47,330
So normally I would leave or I
would take a break for the day,

501
00:18:47,330 --> 00:18:50,040
sleep, look at it in the
morning, continue to hone it.

502
00:18:50,042 --> 00:18:51,502
Yeah, you fall
in love with this,

503
00:18:51,500 --> 00:18:54,080
this is what I want to write,
this doesn't see spinoff,

504
00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:56,690
this is the one, then we
would start developing it.

505
00:18:56,690 --> 00:18:57,820
What is that in the mine?

506
00:18:57,820 --> 00:18:59,570
You know, who are these
guys that are also

507
00:18:59,570 --> 00:19:00,290
looking for the treasure?

508
00:19:00,290 --> 00:19:01,970
That's all the stuff
will get into later.

509
00:19:01,970 --> 00:19:03,650
And, again, Steve and
Dustin are already

510
00:19:03,650 --> 00:19:05,690
fully developed characters.

511
00:19:05,690 --> 00:19:08,160
In your version of this,
you would just say,

512
00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:11,660
hey, a high school
or a middle schooler

513
00:19:11,660 --> 00:19:16,150
gets a cryptic message
from his estranged father,

514
00:19:16,145 --> 00:19:17,525
and then you build
it from there.

515
00:19:17,520 --> 00:19:19,160
You don't need to go
into-- you don't even

516
00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:20,120
need names necessarily.

517
00:19:20,118 --> 00:19:21,888
MATT DUFFER: Again,
for the Montauk one,

518
00:19:21,890 --> 00:19:24,390
we just talked about friends,
family, and teachers.

519
00:19:24,392 --> 00:19:25,352
ROSS DUFFER: That's it.

520
00:19:25,350 --> 00:19:27,080
That's all we had,
and that's Okay.

521
00:19:27,080 --> 00:19:29,760
But a lot of that is going
to come in the next stage

522
00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:31,920
once you have this big idea.

523
00:19:31,917 --> 00:19:34,837


524
00:19:37,761 --> 00:19:39,501
So now I think
what we'd like you

525
00:19:39,500 --> 00:19:42,800
to do is start to come
up with some ideas.

526
00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:47,750
So throw out a bunch of ideas,
pick your favorite three

527
00:19:47,750 --> 00:19:50,780
to five ideas and write
out a paragraph for them

528
00:19:50,780 --> 00:19:53,720
much like the paragraph we
wrote for our imaginary Steve

529
00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:55,040
and Dustin spinoff.

530
00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:58,370
And then remember if you get
stuck, don't be frustrated.

531
00:19:58,370 --> 00:20:00,980
Be generous to yourself.

532
00:20:00,980 --> 00:20:01,480
Be patient.

533
00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:02,730
It should be fun.

534
00:20:02,730 --> 00:20:04,200
It should be a fun process.

535
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:07,220
And the other thing I would
say that we talked about

536
00:20:07,220 --> 00:20:09,800
is just reminding you,
which is that maybe you

537
00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:12,860
come up with eight ideas, a
couple of them are really bad.

538
00:20:12,860 --> 00:20:13,790
That's Okay.

539
00:20:13,787 --> 00:20:14,867
Try putting them together.

540
00:20:14,870 --> 00:20:17,960
Maybe that'll open up-- maybe
combining these two will

541
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:19,410
bring something new to life.

542
00:20:19,410 --> 00:20:22,500
So that's always a
fun exercise to do.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,970


2
00:00:05,950 --> 00:00:07,210
We love writing.

3
00:00:07,210 --> 00:00:08,560
It is a fun process.

4
00:00:08,560 --> 00:00:10,540
Yes, it is frustrating at times.

5
00:00:10,540 --> 00:00:11,590
It gets scary at times.

6
00:00:11,590 --> 00:00:12,650
You get stuck.

7
00:00:12,650 --> 00:00:15,910
It doesn't feel like you're ever
going to get unstuck sometimes.

8
00:00:15,910 --> 00:00:19,990
But what we try to do with this
class is show you our process,

9
00:00:19,990 --> 00:00:21,970
because this is the
process that we found,

10
00:00:21,970 --> 00:00:26,810
for us, made the writing
process as smooth as possible.

11
00:00:26,808 --> 00:00:27,848
And as fun as possible.

12
00:00:27,850 --> 00:00:28,890
And as fun as possible.

13
00:00:28,892 --> 00:00:31,182
And of course, there
are bumps along the way.

14
00:00:31,180 --> 00:00:32,990
We've written outlines
that don't work.

15
00:00:32,990 --> 00:00:34,780
We've written scripts
that don't work.

16
00:00:34,780 --> 00:00:35,650
But that's okay.

17
00:00:35,650 --> 00:00:38,410
We at least now know
when stuff isn't working.

18
00:00:38,410 --> 00:00:41,710
We know how to go about
solving those issues.

19
00:00:41,710 --> 00:00:44,770
That makes it a lot less
stressful and a lot more--

20
00:00:44,770 --> 00:00:46,270
less pressure on us.

21
00:00:46,270 --> 00:00:48,550
And that allows us to
enjoy it a lot more.

22
00:00:48,550 --> 00:00:50,800
In fact, I would say there
was a point in our life--

23
00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:54,880
there was, like, a two to four
years part of our lives where

24
00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:56,860
writing was really
painful and not fun.

25
00:00:56,860 --> 00:00:58,030
It felt like torture.

26
00:00:58,030 --> 00:00:58,870
Pulling teeth.

27
00:00:58,870 --> 00:01:00,330
Yeah, it felt
like pulling teeth.

28
00:01:00,328 --> 00:01:03,428
If it's feeling
like torture to you,

29
00:01:03,430 --> 00:01:05,480
you may be doing
something wrong.

30
00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:07,150
And so that's what we realized.

31
00:01:07,150 --> 00:01:10,000
It was like, it's not that
we didn't enjoy writing.

32
00:01:10,003 --> 00:01:12,173
It was that we were approaching
it in the wrong way.

33
00:01:12,170 --> 00:01:14,180
So if it is feeling
like that to you,

34
00:01:14,183 --> 00:01:15,853
that doesn't mean
you're not meant to be

35
00:01:15,850 --> 00:01:17,350
a writer or anything like that.

36
00:01:17,350 --> 00:01:20,860
It just means that your
process should probably change.

37
00:01:20,855 --> 00:01:23,235
Hopefully, our process doesn't
make it feel like torture.

38
00:01:23,230 --> 00:01:25,000
But if it's not
working for you, you

39
00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:27,520
will find, hopefully, your
own process that works.

40
00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,300


41
00:01:33,550 --> 00:01:37,460
Before we get into you doing
anything writing related,

42
00:01:37,455 --> 00:01:38,835
I think we have
to talk about one

43
00:01:38,830 --> 00:01:40,660
of the least fun parts
of the process, which

44
00:01:40,663 --> 00:01:43,663
is writing habits.

45
00:01:43,660 --> 00:01:46,030
But I cannot tell you
how many people we know,

46
00:01:46,033 --> 00:01:47,953
how many people, aspiring
writers or whatever,

47
00:01:47,950 --> 00:01:49,360
this is the downfall in that.

48
00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:52,900
It's so easy to just
not write anything.

49
00:01:52,900 --> 00:01:53,610
It's so easy to--

50
00:01:53,613 --> 00:01:54,283
Procrastinate.

51
00:01:54,280 --> 00:01:57,520
--procrastinate, to delay,
to stare at a blank page,

52
00:01:57,520 --> 00:01:58,630
to surf the internet.

53
00:01:58,630 --> 00:02:00,880
And before you know it,
you've lost two years,

54
00:02:00,880 --> 00:02:02,270
and you have 10 pages.

55
00:02:02,270 --> 00:02:04,420
So it is important
to develop something

56
00:02:04,420 --> 00:02:07,280
of a routine for yourself.

57
00:02:07,280 --> 00:02:10,360
It's very, very
difficult to focus.

58
00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:12,490
I'll tell you a little
bit how Ross and I do it

59
00:02:12,490 --> 00:02:13,420
and how we focus.

60
00:02:13,420 --> 00:02:16,000
We certainly don't stay focused
throughout the entire day.

61
00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:17,020
But we do our very best.

62
00:02:17,020 --> 00:02:18,370
We keep each other in check.

63
00:02:18,370 --> 00:02:18,910
That helps.

64
00:02:18,910 --> 00:02:22,240
But if you don't have a writing
partner, that's fine, too.

65
00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:24,820
We like to start really
early in the morning.

66
00:02:24,820 --> 00:02:27,010
Like, we think--
if I'm not going

67
00:02:27,010 --> 00:02:29,870
right away, if my brain isn't
locked into writing mode,

68
00:02:29,870 --> 00:02:33,560
whatever that is, early morning,
then I'm going to fall apart.

69
00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:35,590
I'm not going to be able
to start mid-afternoon.

70
00:02:35,590 --> 00:02:36,730
I mean, sometimes
we'll have stuff

71
00:02:36,730 --> 00:02:38,500
now with "Stranger
Things" where we're

72
00:02:38,500 --> 00:02:40,480
trying to start writing
at, like, 2:00 PM.

73
00:02:40,480 --> 00:02:41,710
And it's always a disaster.

74
00:02:41,710 --> 00:02:43,480
So we've got to get
started right away

75
00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:44,650
with that cup of coffee.

76
00:02:44,650 --> 00:02:47,380
And then we give ourselves
a long time to write.

77
00:02:47,380 --> 00:02:51,130
Like, we write from
roughly, like, 9:00,

78
00:02:51,130 --> 00:02:53,710
and then we stop
around 6:00 or 7:00,

79
00:02:53,710 --> 00:02:55,630
which is a really,
really long writing day.

80
00:02:55,630 --> 00:02:57,460
To me, it makes the
day less stressful

81
00:02:57,460 --> 00:02:59,540
because I feel like
I have a lot of time.

82
00:02:59,540 --> 00:03:01,540
I have a lot of room
to make mistakes.

83
00:03:01,540 --> 00:03:05,300
And then if my mind wanders,
it's not the end of the world.

84
00:03:05,300 --> 00:03:06,910
And there are other writers--

85
00:03:06,910 --> 00:03:09,490
I always think about
Stephen King, right?

86
00:03:09,490 --> 00:03:10,850
I know we all look up to him.

87
00:03:10,850 --> 00:03:12,980
He's one of the most prolific
writers in the world.

88
00:03:12,980 --> 00:03:16,330
I think he has a 2,000
words a day goal.

89
00:03:16,330 --> 00:03:19,300
And as soon as he accomplishes
that, he's done for the day.

90
00:03:19,300 --> 00:03:20,710
He writes 2,000
words, he's done.

91
00:03:20,710 --> 00:03:23,470
Sometimes he's done by, like,
11:30 AM, sometimes he's

92
00:03:23,470 --> 00:03:25,600
done by 2:00 PM, whenever
he hits that goal.

93
00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:27,220
And that really
works for him, right?

94
00:03:27,220 --> 00:03:29,890
And then he goes and
watches, like, baseball games

95
00:03:29,890 --> 00:03:31,510
or whatever it is.

96
00:03:31,510 --> 00:03:33,620
So everybody has
something very different.

97
00:03:33,620 --> 00:03:35,440
Some people like the
morning to themselves

98
00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:37,090
without having to
think about writing.

99
00:03:37,090 --> 00:03:39,280
So I think the important
thing is figuring out

100
00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:43,330
what works for you, but setting
goals for yourself, setting up

101
00:03:43,330 --> 00:03:45,250
a routine for yourself.

102
00:03:45,250 --> 00:03:47,240
Try to stay off the internet.

103
00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:49,540
We like working
out of our houses.

104
00:03:49,540 --> 00:03:52,810
Some people prefer being in
a public space like a coffee

105
00:03:52,810 --> 00:03:55,810
shop, right, because that
forces them to focus.

106
00:03:55,810 --> 00:03:57,790
They find it's less distracting.

107
00:03:57,790 --> 00:03:59,650
I find it more distracting.

108
00:03:59,650 --> 00:04:01,810
Whatever it is for you works.

109
00:04:01,810 --> 00:04:04,210
Maybe you have a day
job, and you can't do it.

110
00:04:04,210 --> 00:04:07,090
Well, maybe two hours every
night when you come home,

111
00:04:07,090 --> 00:04:08,750
and you just sit
down and you do it.

112
00:04:08,750 --> 00:04:11,940
And you just find whatever
time you have and go,

113
00:04:11,937 --> 00:04:13,267
this is when I'm going to write.

114
00:04:13,270 --> 00:04:15,640
And you spend that
time actually writing.

115
00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:16,860
And you try to focus.

116
00:04:16,860 --> 00:04:19,270
You could have the best
big idea in the world,

117
00:04:19,269 --> 00:04:20,769
but if you don't
have the discipline

118
00:04:20,769 --> 00:04:24,849
to sit down and actually
spend the time to write it,

119
00:04:24,850 --> 00:04:26,080
it's just going to sit there.

120
00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:28,860


121
00:04:31,755 --> 00:04:33,635
Another downfall we
see is that people just

122
00:04:33,630 --> 00:04:34,350
get frustrated.

123
00:04:34,350 --> 00:04:36,870
I mean, they are working, and
they are putting in the hours,

124
00:04:36,870 --> 00:04:39,060
but then they just get lost.

125
00:04:39,060 --> 00:04:40,380
A script just seems broken.

126
00:04:40,380 --> 00:04:41,940
The script isn't working.

127
00:04:41,940 --> 00:04:43,630
And you just kind
of throw it away.

128
00:04:43,630 --> 00:04:45,990
It's so easy to get,
like, lost in the woods

129
00:04:45,990 --> 00:04:47,280
is kind of what we call it.

130
00:04:47,280 --> 00:04:50,310
It just feels--
like, 60 pages, 100,

131
00:04:50,310 --> 00:04:52,580
if you're doing a show,
120 pages, roughly,

132
00:04:52,580 --> 00:04:53,580
if you're doing a movie.

133
00:04:53,580 --> 00:04:55,030
It doesn't seem like a lot.

134
00:04:55,030 --> 00:04:57,630
But it's very easy
to get lost in there,

135
00:04:57,630 --> 00:05:00,100
lose sight of the
bigger picture.

136
00:05:00,100 --> 00:05:02,220
And I think that happens
more often than not

137
00:05:02,220 --> 00:05:04,470
to writers, every writer.

138
00:05:04,470 --> 00:05:07,170
It certainly happened to us
when we were starting out.

139
00:05:07,170 --> 00:05:09,390
I mean, we toiled around
with a script forever.

140
00:05:09,390 --> 00:05:10,620
I mean, we got really lost.

141
00:05:10,617 --> 00:05:11,697
And nothing ever happened.

142
00:05:11,700 --> 00:05:13,860
It just ended up
wasting a lot of time.

143
00:05:13,860 --> 00:05:16,710
What we're going to try to do
with this class is kind of walk

144
00:05:16,710 --> 00:05:20,640
you through kind of a
step-by-step process

145
00:05:20,640 --> 00:05:23,700
that will hopefully
allow you to avoid that,

146
00:05:23,700 --> 00:05:26,220
avoid that sense of
being completely lost.

147
00:05:26,220 --> 00:05:28,620
When we wrote "Stranger
Things," or "Montauk,"

148
00:05:28,620 --> 00:05:30,750
as it was known back
then, we wrote it on spec.

149
00:05:30,750 --> 00:05:32,710
And what spec means,
if you don't know,

150
00:05:32,710 --> 00:05:35,190
is that we developed
it on our own.

151
00:05:35,187 --> 00:05:36,267
There was no one attached.

152
00:05:36,270 --> 00:05:39,000
There was no guarantee of
it selling or much less

153
00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:39,860
getting made.

154
00:05:39,857 --> 00:05:41,937
We were just doing it
completely on our own, which

155
00:05:41,940 --> 00:05:45,750
is very freeing because we're
the only opinions at this stage

156
00:05:45,750 --> 00:05:46,610
that really matter.

157
00:05:46,613 --> 00:05:48,033
It's scary, because
you don't know

158
00:05:48,030 --> 00:05:51,660
if you're putting in all this
time and it won't go anywhere.

159
00:05:51,660 --> 00:05:54,090
So that's the trade-off.

160
00:05:54,090 --> 00:05:56,620
But we enjoy just
developing stuff on our own.

161
00:05:56,620 --> 00:05:58,470
And so that's what we
were doing with this.

162
00:05:58,470 --> 00:06:00,870
The other danger, though,
of working on spec

163
00:06:00,870 --> 00:06:04,740
is if you're getting
paid to write something,

164
00:06:04,740 --> 00:06:07,770
generally you're going
to be given deadlines

165
00:06:07,770 --> 00:06:08,610
by that company.

166
00:06:08,610 --> 00:06:10,650
They're going to expect
things at a certain date.

167
00:06:10,652 --> 00:06:12,872
If you're writing it
on spec, well, there

168
00:06:12,870 --> 00:06:16,270
are no real deadlines unless you
create deadlines for yourself.

169
00:06:16,267 --> 00:06:17,847
And I think that
that can occasionally

170
00:06:17,850 --> 00:06:20,130
be something that helps people.

171
00:06:20,130 --> 00:06:24,450
Now, I'd be lying to you if
I said that Matt and I were

172
00:06:24,450 --> 00:06:26,310
great at hitting deadlines.

173
00:06:26,310 --> 00:06:28,860
We create deadlines for
ourselves all the time.

174
00:06:28,860 --> 00:06:30,870
We rarely make them.

175
00:06:30,870 --> 00:06:34,830
But I do think it is
important to set goalposts

176
00:06:34,830 --> 00:06:37,800
for yourself and
go, okay, well, I'm

177
00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:40,950
going to work on this outline
for the next two weeks.

178
00:06:40,950 --> 00:06:46,530
And then I'm hoping that
by Saturday, July 13,

179
00:06:46,530 --> 00:06:49,050
I'm going to be moving
on into the script stage.

180
00:06:49,050 --> 00:06:52,020
Now, what this does is it
gives you some structure.

181
00:06:52,020 --> 00:06:53,520
And I think that
that can be helpful

182
00:06:53,520 --> 00:06:54,930
if you're writing it on spec.

183
00:06:54,930 --> 00:06:58,800
The danger of it being, you
may be moving onto a stage

184
00:06:58,800 --> 00:07:00,300
before you're ready.

185
00:07:00,300 --> 00:07:03,330
And that's why when I say Matt
and I blow past our deadlines

186
00:07:03,330 --> 00:07:05,410
all the time, we do
not want to do that.

187
00:07:05,410 --> 00:07:08,100
We have done that in the past,
where we jump in the script

188
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or we jump into fleshing
out an outline too early.

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And then what
happens is you end up

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wasting additional
weeks continuing

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to work on something where
you've just gone too far ahead.

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And like Matt's saying,
you get lost in the woods,

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and you have to go
backwards in time,

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throw all that out,
and start from scratch.

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And that is a much
bigger time waster.

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Just make sure not to
move on to the next stage

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until you're feeling
very confident,

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because, as Matt's saying,
it's not like we just

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wasted a few weeks on projects.

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We wasted at least
a year on projects

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where the issue was actually all
the way back to this big idea.

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It was missing some key element.

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And maybe we knew it in our
gut, but we needed to move on.

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We felt we needed to move
on to those next stages.

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And we just went too early.

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So we'd advise you
not to do that.

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No, it's good to create
sort of artificial deadlines

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for yourself.

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And sometimes, the
real world will hit you

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with a deadline of its own.

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So in the case of
"Hidden," I mean,

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that happened because we
were extremely low on money

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at that point.

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We were about to run out.

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We had about a month?

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A month and a half.

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A month and a half in order
to get this script written.

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And it felt like we kind
of had a gun to our heads,

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that we had to get
this script written.

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We had to write a script.

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We had to sell it.

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It felt kind of like
an impossible task.

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But it gave us this
sort of urgency

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and adrenaline that we didn't
have in some of the earlier

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scripts that we had written.

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And that really helped us.

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The same if you end up working
for a studio or whatever,

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you're going to have these
scary deadlines that you're

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going to have to hit.

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A little bit of urgency and
a little bit of a deadline

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is good.

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Don't-- I think something we
did early on is we just indulged

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too much.

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We spent too long on stuff.

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It's good-- a little
bit of speed is good.

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A little bit of speed.

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A little bit of speed is good.

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One thing that helps us
as we're working on ideas

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is that we work with each other,
so we have a writing partner.

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So we're able to bounce
ideas off of one another.

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We're very honest
with each other.

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We also grew up,
obviously, together,

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so we've watched all the
same movies and the TV shows.

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We have the same references.

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00:09:22,050 --> 00:09:25,650
We have mostly the same
things that we love.

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So that helps.

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00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:28,950
We have, obviously,
quite the shorthand.

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But I think it can
be helpful if you

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00:09:31,620 --> 00:09:34,860
have a sounding board, someone
else that you can bounce ideas

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off of.

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00:09:35,590 --> 00:09:37,030
You go to someone
that you trust,

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whether it's a friend or
family or someone you've

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00:09:39,330 --> 00:09:40,140
met in school.

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00:09:40,140 --> 00:09:41,940
And you can go, hey,
I have some ideas,

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00:09:41,940 --> 00:09:44,610
and I want to see how
you respond to them.

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00:09:44,610 --> 00:09:46,500
I think that that's
also something that can

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00:09:46,500 --> 00:09:48,070
work as part of your process.

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00:09:48,068 --> 00:09:50,608
One thing that helps Ross and
I in terms of staying focused

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00:09:50,610 --> 00:09:52,860
is that we have the
other one to check.

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00:09:52,860 --> 00:09:56,280
So if suddenly I'm on the
internet, Ross will go, Matt,

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00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:57,230
what are you doing?

263
00:09:57,225 --> 00:09:59,435
I don't see you on my
Google document with me.

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00:09:59,430 --> 00:10:01,110
Like, where are you?

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00:10:01,110 --> 00:10:01,980
Focus back in.

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00:10:01,980 --> 00:10:04,530
So it does help to
have a writing partner.

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00:10:04,530 --> 00:10:06,720
We know most people
don't have a twin,

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00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:09,060
so we're fortunate in the
sense that we have twins.

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Oftentimes, we know
people who find--

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00:10:11,375 --> 00:10:12,755
who do have a
writing partner who

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find someone who shares
their sensibilities who

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they enjoy working with.

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00:10:15,640 --> 00:10:18,480
But we also have a lot of
friends who write on their own,

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00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:20,350
and they don't
have that partner.

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00:10:20,350 --> 00:10:24,750
So to sort of refocus them, I
think if you're working alone,

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then that means it's
more important than ever

277
00:10:27,450 --> 00:10:32,640
that you have a routine and
structure and deadlines, all

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00:10:32,640 --> 00:10:34,080
of the stuff that
we talked about,

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00:10:34,080 --> 00:10:36,540
because you don't have someone
else checking in with you.

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00:10:36,540 --> 00:10:38,420
Maybe you're going to
say, hey, in two weeks,

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00:10:38,415 --> 00:10:41,025
I'm going to send this outline
to my friend for feedback.

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00:10:41,020 --> 00:10:43,020
And maybe they'll check
in with you in two weeks

283
00:10:43,020 --> 00:10:46,140
and go, hey, how's
that outline coming?

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That helps.

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00:10:46,770 --> 00:10:48,720
So there are ways around it.

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00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:50,790
But whatever you do, and
this is very personal,

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00:10:50,790 --> 00:10:52,620
but come up with a
way to give yourself

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00:10:52,620 --> 00:10:53,730
a little bit of structure.

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00:10:53,730 --> 00:10:55,560
If you are working
with a writing partner,

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00:10:55,563 --> 00:10:57,153
you may both have
your own strengths.

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00:10:57,150 --> 00:10:59,580
For Matt and I,
for instance, I'm

292
00:10:59,580 --> 00:11:01,610
generally trying to
keep pushing us forward.

293
00:11:01,610 --> 00:11:02,610
We got to get this done.

294
00:11:02,610 --> 00:11:03,570
We got to write this outline.

295
00:11:03,570 --> 00:11:04,740
We got to get to this script.

296
00:11:04,740 --> 00:11:04,980
Right.

297
00:11:04,980 --> 00:11:07,320
Matt is very good at
going, well, wait a minute,

298
00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:08,700
this isn't figured out now.

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00:11:08,700 --> 00:11:10,770
It's a little bit like
checks and balances.

300
00:11:10,770 --> 00:11:13,890
So I think we sort of
push and pull each other,

301
00:11:13,890 --> 00:11:17,560
and we find a good balance there
where we are making progress.

302
00:11:17,563 --> 00:11:19,233
We're not getting too
lost in the woods.

303
00:11:19,230 --> 00:11:21,180
But at the same time,
we're making sure

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00:11:21,180 --> 00:11:23,860
that everything is up to par.

305
00:11:23,860 --> 00:11:25,870
MATT (VOICEOVER): So in
this next assignment,

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00:11:25,870 --> 00:11:27,850
find someone you
trust who can serve

307
00:11:27,850 --> 00:11:29,980
as your sounding
board for your ideas

308
00:11:29,980 --> 00:11:33,450
or to help keep you
accountable to your deadlines.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,890


2
00:00:12,040 --> 00:00:14,770
So now you've got
some ideas right now.

3
00:00:14,770 --> 00:00:16,360
It's time to pick
your favorite idea.

4
00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:19,400
So hopefully this is the
idea that if you wake up,

5
00:00:19,400 --> 00:00:22,030
you're feeling really good
about it, you're excited,

6
00:00:22,030 --> 00:00:23,650
you can't wait to
write, you can't

7
00:00:23,650 --> 00:00:25,480
wait to get into
final draft and start

8
00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:27,730
making-- turning it into a
script, but like hold up,

9
00:00:27,730 --> 00:00:28,790
hold up, hold up.

10
00:00:28,790 --> 00:00:30,850
So what-- we're actually
going to do something

11
00:00:30,850 --> 00:00:33,140
more fun than that, more
fun than writing the script.

12
00:00:33,140 --> 00:00:38,000
So the first thing we do
and this is in a lot of ways

13
00:00:38,003 --> 00:00:39,673
the most fun part of
the process for us,

14
00:00:39,670 --> 00:00:41,230
because you've got
the idea down, right?

15
00:00:41,230 --> 00:00:41,620
That's so hard.

16
00:00:41,620 --> 00:00:43,780
You got an idea, which
is really, really hard

17
00:00:43,780 --> 00:00:45,190
and really taxing.

18
00:00:45,190 --> 00:00:47,200
But once you have the
idea, the fun part

19
00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:48,800
is to explore that idea.

20
00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:51,280
So this is something
we call blue-skying,

21
00:00:51,280 --> 00:00:53,570
we say we're going
to blue-sky our idea.

22
00:00:53,570 --> 00:00:56,560
And basically that just means
no pressure brainstorming.

23
00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:58,570
And remember, you could
start blue-skying,

24
00:00:58,570 --> 00:01:00,520
you can start
brainstorming an idea,

25
00:01:00,520 --> 00:01:02,920
and it's not
getting you excited.

26
00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:04,180
So you can always go back.

27
00:01:04,180 --> 00:01:06,940
I mean, you're never forced
to stick with an idea.

28
00:01:06,937 --> 00:01:08,267
I mean, we do that all the time.

29
00:01:08,270 --> 00:01:11,020
And one way you know
it's a good idea

30
00:01:11,020 --> 00:01:12,970
is that it starts to
unlock a lot of doors.

31
00:01:12,970 --> 00:01:15,640
So as you're thinking
about the idea,

32
00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:17,860
as you're brainstorming
it, suddenly you

33
00:01:17,860 --> 00:01:19,190
go, oh, what about this?

34
00:01:19,190 --> 00:01:19,870
What about that?

35
00:01:19,870 --> 00:01:20,740
It's exciting.

36
00:01:20,740 --> 00:01:24,910
It's just like, oh, wow, this is
a really fun sandbox to play in

37
00:01:24,910 --> 00:01:26,950
and there's so much, almost
too much, to do here.

38
00:01:26,952 --> 00:01:29,082
That was certainly the case
with "Stranger Things."

39
00:01:29,077 --> 00:01:30,127
We had a psychic girl.

40
00:01:30,130 --> 00:01:31,300
We had monsters.

41
00:01:31,300 --> 00:01:32,440
We had a police chief.

42
00:01:32,440 --> 00:01:33,590
We had another dimension.

43
00:01:33,590 --> 00:01:34,090
We're like--

44
00:01:34,090 --> 00:01:35,200
Oh my god, oh
my god, oh my god,

45
00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:36,790
we just had all this
stuff, and we just wanted--

46
00:01:36,790 --> 00:01:38,560
we started to spit
all these ideas.

47
00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:40,870
But I think the
most important thing

48
00:01:40,870 --> 00:01:43,600
is to trust yourself and
trust what you're feeling,

49
00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:45,460
and just you want to
feel that passion,

50
00:01:45,460 --> 00:01:46,790
you want to feel the excitement.

51
00:01:46,793 --> 00:01:48,343
If you've got that, great.

52
00:01:48,340 --> 00:01:49,620
We should start blue-skying.

53
00:01:49,620 --> 00:01:52,460


54
00:01:55,765 --> 00:01:57,645
So usually when Ross
and I are blue-skying,

55
00:01:57,640 --> 00:02:02,450
what we do is we get
together, we hit on music,

56
00:02:02,450 --> 00:02:05,920
we open up our computers,
and then we just start to bat

57
00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:06,610
around ideas.

58
00:02:06,610 --> 00:02:11,050
So we throw out, it's almost
stream of consciousness.

59
00:02:11,050 --> 00:02:13,570
So it's just, we just throw
out any and every idea

60
00:02:13,570 --> 00:02:14,430
that we have.

61
00:02:14,430 --> 00:02:15,950
We jot it all down.

62
00:02:15,950 --> 00:02:18,550
It's super sketchy,
very, very messy.

63
00:02:18,550 --> 00:02:20,080
A lot of the ideas we throw out.

64
00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:21,790
Will never see the light of day.

65
00:02:21,790 --> 00:02:22,940
No one will ever read them.

66
00:02:22,940 --> 00:02:25,230
This is like a very personal
part of the process that's

67
00:02:25,232 --> 00:02:26,922
just for yourself,
but it's always

68
00:02:26,920 --> 00:02:28,240
good to have too many ideas.

69
00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:30,430
You can always pull
from them later.

70
00:02:30,430 --> 00:02:31,390
You'll be surprised.

71
00:02:31,390 --> 00:02:34,270
I think as we stepped through
our brainstorming for "Stranger

72
00:02:34,270 --> 00:02:36,550
Things" how some ideas
we had very early on

73
00:02:36,550 --> 00:02:41,470
became something we used in
season two or season three.

74
00:02:41,470 --> 00:02:44,410
So it's always good to have
a huge grab bag of ideas

75
00:02:44,410 --> 00:02:47,470
and just start to throw
any and everything out.

76
00:02:47,468 --> 00:02:49,138
And the reason we
like, even though it

77
00:02:49,135 --> 00:02:51,855
is stream of consciousness,
why we like writing it down

78
00:02:51,850 --> 00:02:54,220
is because then you can go
back, then you sleep on it,

79
00:02:54,220 --> 00:02:55,450
you come back the next day.

80
00:02:55,450 --> 00:02:58,090
You read through sort of your
thought process and these ideas

81
00:02:58,090 --> 00:03:01,630
and go, well, this here,
this little line here,

82
00:03:01,630 --> 00:03:04,960
that's really sticking out as a
really-- something really cool.

83
00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:07,240
Maybe we should build on
that and go from there.

84
00:03:07,240 --> 00:03:10,240
It's nice to just
write it down and keep

85
00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:13,060
a document of your process.

86
00:03:13,060 --> 00:03:16,150
We typically spend, I don't
know, anywhere from a week

87
00:03:16,150 --> 00:03:17,410
to two weeks on this.

88
00:03:17,410 --> 00:03:19,410
I think that was the case
for "Stranger Things."

89
00:03:19,410 --> 00:03:21,880
I mean, we spent about two
weeks throwing out ideas.

90
00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:24,160
I like giving yourself
a lot of time on this,

91
00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:27,450
because then again, it
lowers the pressure.

92
00:03:27,447 --> 00:03:29,527
And that if you have a day
that's not particularly

93
00:03:29,530 --> 00:03:31,570
productive and you don't
come up with a big idea,

94
00:03:31,572 --> 00:03:33,162
you don't start
getting frustrated.

95
00:03:33,158 --> 00:03:35,198
You're like, okay, well,
there's always tomorrow.

96
00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:37,200
You're going to have
days, good days,

97
00:03:37,195 --> 00:03:39,325
and you're going to have
bad days, and that's okay.

98
00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:40,150
Don't stress out.

99
00:03:40,150 --> 00:03:42,570
It's important to be patient
and generous with yourself.

100
00:03:42,567 --> 00:03:44,527
So give yourself a little
bit of time for this.

101
00:03:44,530 --> 00:03:45,730
Just get it all out there.

102
00:03:45,730 --> 00:03:47,060
Vomit it all out.

103
00:03:47,060 --> 00:03:50,800
And I think it's all
helpful, good and bad.

104
00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:53,660


105
00:03:57,010 --> 00:03:59,090
So we're going to show
you our blue-sky document

106
00:03:59,093 --> 00:04:01,473
for "Montauk," which eventually
became "Stranger Things,"

107
00:04:01,468 --> 00:04:01,988
right?

108
00:04:01,990 --> 00:04:04,690
Ross and I write it down
as we're thinking it.

109
00:04:04,690 --> 00:04:06,750
So you're seeing really
what was in our heads

110
00:04:06,745 --> 00:04:07,875
as we were writing it down.

111
00:04:07,870 --> 00:04:10,210
No one one's ever
seen this before.

112
00:04:10,210 --> 00:04:13,180
But you'll really get a sense
of how we generated the idea

113
00:04:13,180 --> 00:04:14,640
and how it evolved.

114
00:04:14,643 --> 00:04:17,063
In terms of the kind of things
you're growing to blue-sky,

115
00:04:17,060 --> 00:04:18,130
you're going to be
thinking about everything.

116
00:04:18,130 --> 00:04:20,470
You're going to be thinking
about character, setting,

117
00:04:20,470 --> 00:04:24,610
world, mythology, drive,
story, literally everything.

118
00:04:24,610 --> 00:04:26,320
Which sounds
overwhelming, but it's not

119
00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:27,950
because it's fun
because you can bounce

120
00:04:27,945 --> 00:04:30,585
from thinking about characters
to thinking about setting

121
00:04:30,580 --> 00:04:31,660
to thinking about story.

122
00:04:31,660 --> 00:04:32,160
I mean--

123
00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:34,360
You get stuck on one
thing, you move to the next.

124
00:04:34,357 --> 00:04:36,437
And it's just-- you're
going to see this document,

125
00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:38,170
it's a little chaotic,
but we're going

126
00:04:38,170 --> 00:04:40,270
to go through and show
you each of those things

127
00:04:40,270 --> 00:04:41,690
that we were talking
about and how

128
00:04:41,687 --> 00:04:43,837
it led to this bigger piece.

129
00:04:43,840 --> 00:04:46,220
Something that's not going
to be in this document,

130
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but it is something
you can think about,

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you saw sort of
doing it on the fly,

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00:04:49,900 --> 00:04:53,410
and I don't think we
nailed it, which is title,

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00:04:53,410 --> 00:04:56,680
and that's something
else you can blue-sky.

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00:04:56,680 --> 00:05:00,130
I mean, for "Stranger
Things," Montauk came to us

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00:05:00,130 --> 00:05:02,290
instantly just because we--

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00:05:02,290 --> 00:05:04,060
it's a cool word.

137
00:05:04,060 --> 00:05:06,070
There's something a
little spooky about it.

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00:05:06,070 --> 00:05:09,130
Now when it came to
changing the title due to,

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00:05:09,130 --> 00:05:13,850
we weren't able to shoot
in Montauk due to cost,

140
00:05:13,850 --> 00:05:15,580
so we had to move it to Atlanta.

141
00:05:15,580 --> 00:05:16,700
So it had to change.

142
00:05:16,700 --> 00:05:19,330
And we didn't want to
just do call it, Hawkins.

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00:05:19,330 --> 00:05:21,670
We didn't want to just do
it as a make-believe town

144
00:05:21,670 --> 00:05:22,520
as the title.

145
00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:24,340
It's not-- wasn't
very exciting to us.

146
00:05:24,340 --> 00:05:26,690
So we just came up
with a bunch of ideas.

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00:05:26,690 --> 00:05:27,820
You know we had The Keep.

148
00:05:27,820 --> 00:05:30,400
We had Indigo, which
was going to be the name

149
00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:32,260
of the government program.

150
00:05:32,260 --> 00:05:34,900
And of course, amidst that
we had "Stranger Things."

151
00:05:34,900 --> 00:05:36,670
And I think ultimately
it sort of boiled

152
00:05:36,670 --> 00:05:39,790
down to Indigo and
Stranger Things.

153
00:05:39,790 --> 00:05:42,190
Indigo sounds really
weird now, but that

154
00:05:42,190 --> 00:05:43,600
was sort of the runner-up.

155
00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:46,540
And one fun thing we did,
and this is if you do

156
00:05:46,540 --> 00:05:51,820
want to take a beat away
from your blue-skying,

157
00:05:51,820 --> 00:05:55,750
we sort of mocked up
each title in Photoshop

158
00:05:55,750 --> 00:05:57,810
in a font that we
thought was sort

159
00:05:57,808 --> 00:06:00,098
of what we wanted to actually
do for the show, that got

160
00:06:00,100 --> 00:06:01,440
across the vibe of the show.

161
00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:03,190
Well, I was always
Team Stranger Things,

162
00:06:03,190 --> 00:06:04,520
and it looked good.

163
00:06:04,522 --> 00:06:05,982
It looked like a
Stephen King book.

164
00:06:05,980 --> 00:06:07,840
Maybe because it just made
me think of needful things.

165
00:06:07,840 --> 00:06:09,790
It may have not been
any more difficult

166
00:06:09,790 --> 00:06:12,250
or complicated than that,
but for whatever reason,

167
00:06:12,250 --> 00:06:13,520
that's why we liked it.

168
00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:15,940
And that's why the show is
now called "Stranger Things."

169
00:06:15,940 --> 00:06:16,570
Let's look at that.

170
00:06:16,570 --> 00:06:17,860
Actually look at the doc again.

171
00:06:17,862 --> 00:06:19,122
You can do title in that.

172
00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:20,600
That's one of many elements.

173
00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:24,640
So let's go through and sort
of step through this little--

174
00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:26,890
it's going to be a little
chaotic looking at the doc,

175
00:06:26,890 --> 00:06:30,830
but this was exactly what
we did back in the day.

176
00:06:30,830 --> 00:06:32,810
And you're going to see
our thought process.

177
00:06:32,810 --> 00:06:34,810
MATT DUFFER: So we'll
start off with characters.

178
00:06:34,810 --> 00:06:37,150
The first thing we wrote
is, "Sam Rockwell, opposite

179
00:06:37,150 --> 00:06:38,610
of McConaughy,
lives on a beach."

180
00:06:38,608 --> 00:06:40,398
So this is Hopper that
we're writing about.

181
00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:41,740
Again, I don't have
to specify that we're

182
00:06:41,740 --> 00:06:42,620
talking about Hopper.

183
00:06:42,615 --> 00:06:45,315
This is just for us, as long
as we understand what we're

184
00:06:45,310 --> 00:06:46,510
writing, it doesn't matter.

185
00:06:46,510 --> 00:06:49,720
Also Sam Rockwell means a
lot of things to me and Ross.

186
00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:52,660
We know what type of
character we're describing

187
00:06:52,660 --> 00:06:54,170
when we say Sam Rockwell.

188
00:06:54,170 --> 00:06:55,390
This is not for anybody else.

189
00:06:55,390 --> 00:06:56,110
It's just for us.

190
00:06:56,110 --> 00:07:00,220
So Sam Rockwell is shorthand
for like, a book of things.

191
00:07:00,220 --> 00:07:02,140
Well, and I think the
most important thing,

192
00:07:02,140 --> 00:07:04,180
and I think this is
opposite of McConaughy,

193
00:07:04,183 --> 00:07:06,353
in this "True Detective"
was coming out of the time,

194
00:07:06,350 --> 00:07:08,330
but I think that
by Sam Rockwell,

195
00:07:08,330 --> 00:07:11,170
we meant that he's not your
typical Hollywood hero.

196
00:07:11,170 --> 00:07:14,890
This isn't-- we didn't say,
if we wrote Tom Cruise lives

197
00:07:14,890 --> 00:07:16,200
on a beach, that gives us--

198
00:07:16,200 --> 00:07:16,910
Very different.

199
00:07:16,908 --> 00:07:20,258
Very different, very
different vibes, you know.

200
00:07:20,260 --> 00:07:21,970
Dwayne Johnson lives on a beach.

201
00:07:21,970 --> 00:07:23,050
Very different vibe.

202
00:07:23,050 --> 00:07:25,610
And then we start talking
a little bit about plot,

203
00:07:25,610 --> 00:07:26,200
you'll see.

204
00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:30,190
"They've opened a portal, you
don't understand, snatchers."

205
00:07:30,190 --> 00:07:32,060
So, again, snatchers
is not a good name.

206
00:07:32,058 --> 00:07:33,848
That eventually becomes
demogorgons, right?

207
00:07:33,850 --> 00:07:36,100
But that's the origin of
the demogorgons right there.

208
00:07:36,100 --> 00:07:38,530
"People are going
missing, you understand,

209
00:07:38,530 --> 00:07:41,350
that's the third person that's
gone missing, they've drowned,

210
00:07:41,350 --> 00:07:43,790
they're saying they drowned
in the lake or the ocean."

211
00:07:43,792 --> 00:07:46,002
Remember this used to be
set right next to the ocean.

212
00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:47,380
"You don't believe
that, do you?"

213
00:07:47,375 --> 00:07:49,905
So this is the idea that
its government lies, right?

214
00:07:49,900 --> 00:07:51,610
We even ask ourselves
questions in this.

215
00:07:51,610 --> 00:07:52,780
We write down our questions.

216
00:07:52,777 --> 00:07:54,337
"How do we keep
these kids involved?"

217
00:07:54,340 --> 00:07:55,800
And then we say,
"maybe the sheriff

218
00:07:55,798 --> 00:07:57,038
isn't the major character."

219
00:07:57,033 --> 00:07:59,203
So it's interesting that
we actually started it out,

220
00:07:59,200 --> 00:08:00,370
and that's probably
why we started out

221
00:08:00,370 --> 00:08:01,570
writing about Sam
Rockwell, is we

222
00:08:01,570 --> 00:08:03,490
had Hopper was going to
be the main character.

223
00:08:03,487 --> 00:08:05,737
Well, if you remember
it started with prisoners.

224
00:08:05,740 --> 00:08:07,660
So, again, that's
the-- you know,

225
00:08:07,660 --> 00:08:10,840
you've got this police
character as the lead.

226
00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:14,080
But I think we made a
mental note to, wait,

227
00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:16,420
can we steer this
more towards the kids.

228
00:08:16,420 --> 00:08:18,100
How do we keep
these kids involved?

229
00:08:18,100 --> 00:08:19,990
We didn't know the
answer, and that's okay.

230
00:08:19,990 --> 00:08:21,460
You can ask yourself,
like Matt's saying,

231
00:08:21,460 --> 00:08:22,480
ask yourself questions.

232
00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:24,280
We don't know how
this is going to work,

233
00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:26,770
but we know we want to
keep the kids involved

234
00:08:26,770 --> 00:08:28,780
in the investigation of
their missing friend.

235
00:08:28,780 --> 00:08:30,590
But then we say,
"kids are dying,

236
00:08:30,590 --> 00:08:32,290
getting yanked into
another dimension,

237
00:08:32,289 --> 00:08:35,379
his bike is just sitting there,
where the hell did he go?"

238
00:08:35,375 --> 00:08:37,755
So we're starting to introduce
some imagery that actually

239
00:08:37,750 --> 00:08:40,510
did end up in the final
show, and actually

240
00:08:40,510 --> 00:08:41,800
on the poster for the show.

241
00:08:41,799 --> 00:08:42,909
"What happened to him.

242
00:08:42,909 --> 00:08:44,739
Everybody's looking
for this kid."

243
00:08:44,740 --> 00:08:47,140
And then we reintroduce
the sheriff.

244
00:08:47,140 --> 00:08:50,410
So that's huge right
there, that early

245
00:08:50,407 --> 00:08:51,487
brainstorming right there.

246
00:08:51,490 --> 00:08:53,200
We started to develop
some of the core--

247
00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:54,040
Core elements.

248
00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:55,290
Core elements of the plot.

249
00:08:55,290 --> 00:08:56,850
What that drive is.

250
00:08:56,850 --> 00:08:59,190
Another thing that we
get into in this document

251
00:08:59,190 --> 00:09:00,490
is worldbuilding, right?

252
00:09:00,490 --> 00:09:04,830
So we go into, "are the two
worlds bleeding into our world.

253
00:09:04,830 --> 00:09:06,690
The wormhole is expanding.

254
00:09:06,690 --> 00:09:09,180
You see, you need to be able
to get into the other world.

255
00:09:09,180 --> 00:09:10,410
There are openings.

256
00:09:10,410 --> 00:09:12,060
Mouths to this world."

257
00:09:12,060 --> 00:09:14,790
"Perhaps one of the kids
accidentally goes into it.

258
00:09:14,790 --> 00:09:15,990
It draws you in.

259
00:09:15,990 --> 00:09:16,890
With what?

260
00:09:16,890 --> 00:09:19,080
Something trance-like, enticing.

261
00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:22,860
Dancing particles, almost
like moths, fluttering around.

262
00:09:22,860 --> 00:09:24,510
The wormhole is expanding.

263
00:09:24,510 --> 00:09:27,030
This universe is
bleeding into our own."

264
00:09:27,030 --> 00:09:29,820
What I think is
interesting about this

265
00:09:29,820 --> 00:09:32,550
is some of these ideas don't
make it into season one,

266
00:09:32,550 --> 00:09:34,980
but some of them make
it into later seasons.

267
00:09:34,980 --> 00:09:37,290
We do have a mouth to
another world, which

268
00:09:37,290 --> 00:09:38,500
does make it into season one.

269
00:09:38,498 --> 00:09:40,248
MATT DUFFER: We end
up calling it the rip.

270
00:09:40,248 --> 00:09:42,538
What didn't make it
as the trance-like thing

271
00:09:42,540 --> 00:09:44,790
or the dancing particles.

272
00:09:44,790 --> 00:09:46,980
Dancing particles was
really the prototype

273
00:09:46,980 --> 00:09:50,270
for what would become the
Mind Flayer in season two.

274
00:09:56,700 --> 00:09:58,480
We started to get
overloaded with ideas,

275
00:09:58,477 --> 00:10:00,057
so you'll see as we
move into outline,

276
00:10:00,060 --> 00:10:04,690
that's just an idea that just
didn't make it into that pilot

277
00:10:04,690 --> 00:10:05,190
script.

278
00:10:05,190 --> 00:10:07,050
But again, no ideas
are bad ideas.

279
00:10:07,050 --> 00:10:09,000
This all came around.

280
00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:11,710
The fact that this world
is bleeding into our own,

281
00:10:11,710 --> 00:10:14,430
that also became a core
element of season two.

282
00:10:14,430 --> 00:10:17,460
It didn't really play
a role in season one.

283
00:10:17,460 --> 00:10:19,650
But again, we're just
throwing out these ideas.

284
00:10:19,650 --> 00:10:22,410
And this is day one
of brainstorming.

285
00:10:22,410 --> 00:10:24,660
And you can see how much
we're already coming up with.

286
00:10:24,660 --> 00:10:26,040
I'm going to
skip a little bit,

287
00:10:26,035 --> 00:10:28,115
but I'm going to go
into what is probably

288
00:10:28,110 --> 00:10:32,220
the most important five minutes
of brainstorming in our lives.

289
00:10:32,220 --> 00:10:36,000
And you'll see it all as we
were writing out in real time,

290
00:10:36,002 --> 00:10:36,962
back in, what was this?

291
00:10:36,960 --> 00:10:38,490
Looked like April 14.

292
00:10:38,490 --> 00:10:40,620
We said, "there's a world
underneath this world.

293
00:10:40,620 --> 00:10:41,650
Two worlds."

294
00:10:41,650 --> 00:10:43,540
So that's the upside
down, obviously.

295
00:10:43,537 --> 00:10:45,117
"This world is
encroaching into ours."

296
00:10:45,120 --> 00:10:48,030
We're repeating something we've
already said, but that's okay.

297
00:10:48,030 --> 00:10:50,100
"Increased military presence.

298
00:10:50,100 --> 00:10:51,510
They've unleashed this thing.

299
00:10:51,510 --> 00:10:52,920
It's not going to stop.

300
00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:54,180
Maybe it's a kid with powers.

301
00:10:54,180 --> 00:10:54,900
Is that weird.

302
00:10:54,900 --> 00:10:56,580
Or maybe a girl of sorts.

303
00:10:56,580 --> 00:10:58,950
Certainly can take
inspiration from that.

304
00:10:58,950 --> 00:11:01,980
Then we have this kid who can't
connect with anyone, who begins

305
00:11:01,980 --> 00:11:03,300
to connect with this girl.

306
00:11:03,300 --> 00:11:04,230
She kisses him.

307
00:11:04,230 --> 00:11:05,180
Very ET-like."

308
00:11:05,180 --> 00:11:05,680
Who--

309
00:11:05,680 --> 00:11:06,940
And that's talking
about Mike now.

310
00:11:06,940 --> 00:11:07,440
Mike.

311
00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:08,220
"Very ET-like.

312
00:11:08,220 --> 00:11:09,390
Who are you?

313
00:11:09,390 --> 00:11:11,130
I was experimented on.

314
00:11:11,130 --> 00:11:12,480
Explodes his head."

315
00:11:12,480 --> 00:11:15,690
So that didn't-- that didn't
make it in, but that could be

316
00:11:15,690 --> 00:11:16,440
cool.

317
00:11:16,440 --> 00:11:17,910
"This place, it's
going to open up.

318
00:11:17,910 --> 00:11:18,810
Don't you get it?

319
00:11:18,810 --> 00:11:20,010
Something more innocent.

320
00:11:20,010 --> 00:11:21,270
The government wants her.

321
00:11:21,270 --> 00:11:23,620
They're tracking her
down," et cetera.

322
00:11:23,620 --> 00:11:24,220
So, and then--

323
00:11:24,220 --> 00:11:25,720
How do we get to
this other place?

324
00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:27,030
I can show you.

325
00:11:27,030 --> 00:11:27,880
Like the "Matrix."

326
00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:30,160
So this right here is
the creation of Eleven.

327
00:11:30,155 --> 00:11:31,785
So this is when we
came up with Eleven.

328
00:11:31,780 --> 00:11:34,740
So I don't know if this is an
hour worth of brainstorming

329
00:11:34,740 --> 00:11:36,690
or less, but we
started with a show

330
00:11:36,690 --> 00:11:41,160
about a sheriff investigating
a missing kid to introducing

331
00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:44,130
the idea of the Upside Down and
a girl with psionic abilities,

332
00:11:44,130 --> 00:11:47,860
and the whole ET aspect of
the show, which is, I think,

333
00:11:47,860 --> 00:11:50,610
really essential to
why it was successful,

334
00:11:50,610 --> 00:11:51,880
was generated right here.

335
00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:53,880
And we're even questioning,
is this a good idea?

336
00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:55,740
Is that weird?

337
00:11:55,740 --> 00:11:57,860
And obviously, we
got excited about it

338
00:11:57,860 --> 00:11:58,860
because we kept writing.

339
00:11:58,860 --> 00:12:00,540
When I think that's
the thing we talked about

340
00:12:00,540 --> 00:12:02,130
too in the big idea
phase, it's like,

341
00:12:02,130 --> 00:12:03,670
does this open a lot of doors?

342
00:12:03,670 --> 00:12:06,630
And so suddenly we're
going, as you can see,

343
00:12:06,630 --> 00:12:10,050
one door opens-- the girl
suddenly opened the door to,

344
00:12:10,053 --> 00:12:11,973
wait a minute, now she
can have a relationship

345
00:12:11,970 --> 00:12:14,740
with our protagonist
boy character.

346
00:12:14,738 --> 00:12:15,778
Well, that's interesting.

347
00:12:15,780 --> 00:12:17,160
So that opens up
a door as, wait,

348
00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:19,560
now, she can show
him where Will is.

349
00:12:19,560 --> 00:12:22,840
So earlier a couple
paragraphs before we said,

350
00:12:22,840 --> 00:12:25,260
how do we get the kids
involved in this investigation?

351
00:12:25,260 --> 00:12:27,330
We just got our
answer right here.

352
00:12:27,332 --> 00:12:29,792
And then you can tell we got
excited about this character

353
00:12:29,790 --> 00:12:31,290
because we keep
writing about her.

354
00:12:31,290 --> 00:12:32,920
"She's not from
another dimension."

355
00:12:32,923 --> 00:12:35,343
So there we're clarifying she's
not from this Upside Down.

356
00:12:35,340 --> 00:12:36,390
"She's one of them.

357
00:12:36,390 --> 00:12:37,920
They captured her.

358
00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:40,350
I was born here," meaning
in the laboratory.

359
00:12:40,350 --> 00:12:42,270
"We can do her backstory.

360
00:12:42,270 --> 00:12:45,360
Telepathy, powers,
experimentation.

361
00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:46,770
No one understands it.

362
00:12:46,770 --> 00:12:49,680
And we have to overlay that with
the everyday evil, suburbia,

363
00:12:49,680 --> 00:12:50,520
depression."

364
00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:55,470
Okay, so there we're starting
to move from just very rapidly

365
00:12:55,470 --> 00:12:58,600
from character and
story into themes.

366
00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:02,370
So we're going-- we're
talking about what can we do

367
00:13:02,370 --> 00:13:03,720
thematically with this story.

368
00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:06,030
Again, this is why it's a
little bit chaotic and all

369
00:13:06,030 --> 00:13:07,350
over the place.

370
00:13:07,350 --> 00:13:08,820
That's good and fine.

371
00:13:08,820 --> 00:13:11,170
So we're saying,
"but it's an evil.

372
00:13:11,170 --> 00:13:14,400
We have to overlay that with
the everyday evil, suburbia,

373
00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:16,020
depression, evil.

374
00:13:16,020 --> 00:13:18,810
How perfect everything is,
but everything is not perfect.

375
00:13:18,810 --> 00:13:20,610
We put on a face for the public.

376
00:13:20,610 --> 00:13:21,870
The inner darkness.

377
00:13:21,870 --> 00:13:23,280
That's what it's about."

378
00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:26,430
So suddenly we're going, okay,
what is the theme of this show?

379
00:13:26,430 --> 00:13:28,560
For some people,
their process is,

380
00:13:28,560 --> 00:13:31,650
that's the starting
kernel of their idea.

381
00:13:31,650 --> 00:13:33,330
That's not how Matt and I work.

382
00:13:33,330 --> 00:13:37,620
What we do is we're coming up
with that story with characters

383
00:13:37,620 --> 00:13:40,110
that resonate with us
and with the drive.

384
00:13:40,110 --> 00:13:42,660
And through that, as we're
developing it, we go, okay,

385
00:13:42,660 --> 00:13:43,320
that's--

386
00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:45,180
there's something
more about this story

387
00:13:45,180 --> 00:13:47,140
that I think can be
impactful for people.

388
00:13:47,140 --> 00:13:53,200
So, in this case, it's sort of
Matt and I grew up in suburbia.

389
00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:55,500
So it's going, okay,
maybe there's--

390
00:13:55,500 --> 00:13:59,160
everything seems perfect,
but beneath it, there's more.

391
00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:01,830
And I think that got
us excited about, okay,

392
00:14:01,830 --> 00:14:03,220
this story can be more.

393
00:14:03,220 --> 00:14:05,730
It's not just about
finding a kidnapped kid.

394
00:14:05,730 --> 00:14:08,300
It's not just about
kids fighting monsters.

395
00:14:08,297 --> 00:14:10,377
There's something a little
more resonant about it.

396
00:14:10,380 --> 00:14:13,500
So, again, that can be
something that you come up

397
00:14:13,500 --> 00:14:15,330
with when you're
discovering your big idea,

398
00:14:15,330 --> 00:14:19,830
or like us, it can come through
the process of blue-skying it.

399
00:14:19,830 --> 00:14:23,400
But hopefully your story starts
to take on more resonance

400
00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:25,080
as you're developing it.

401
00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:27,780
Now the one thing that
you're not going to see,

402
00:14:27,780 --> 00:14:31,260
if you sort of zoom in and read
through this document or pause

403
00:14:31,258 --> 00:14:33,298
the screen, the one thing
you're not going to see

404
00:14:33,300 --> 00:14:35,850
is a lot of us talking
about location or setting.

405
00:14:35,850 --> 00:14:39,240
And that's really because
part of the big idea

406
00:14:39,240 --> 00:14:40,750
was this is set in Montauk.

407
00:14:40,747 --> 00:14:42,327
We didn't really
feel the need that we

408
00:14:42,330 --> 00:14:45,390
needed to go into a lot of
detail blue-skying that.

409
00:14:45,390 --> 00:14:46,500
We knew what it was.

410
00:14:46,500 --> 00:14:48,180
I actually think
it is a good idea

411
00:14:48,180 --> 00:14:50,640
to write out some ideas
about the location

412
00:14:50,640 --> 00:14:52,510
because that can
lead to story ideas.

413
00:14:52,513 --> 00:14:54,183
Like, even then, we
didn't do this here,

414
00:14:54,180 --> 00:14:55,930
but I think it would
have been a good idea

415
00:14:55,930 --> 00:14:58,920
to start talking about what are
some cool locations we could

416
00:14:58,920 --> 00:15:02,760
explore within the world of,
say, Montauk, or eventually

417
00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:03,810
Hawkins, right?

418
00:15:03,810 --> 00:15:05,160
You can talk about the arcade.

419
00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:07,270
You can talk about the
movie theater, the mall.

420
00:15:07,273 --> 00:15:08,943
You could talk about
the kids' basement.

421
00:15:08,940 --> 00:15:09,810
The Fish 'N Fry.

422
00:15:09,810 --> 00:15:13,380
And start thinking about
what are cool, like,

423
00:15:13,380 --> 00:15:15,300
mini settings within
the larger setting,

424
00:15:15,300 --> 00:15:19,590
and that might actually lead
to more ideas and cool ideas.

425
00:15:19,590 --> 00:15:21,840
So it's something that we
didn't do as much back then,

426
00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:23,970
but we do it now when
we're working on an idea.

427
00:15:23,970 --> 00:15:26,910
We definitely try to
think about setting.

428
00:15:26,910 --> 00:15:27,410
Yes.

429
00:15:27,410 --> 00:15:30,720


430
00:15:34,250 --> 00:15:36,750
As you're starting to throw
out all of these ideas, what's

431
00:15:36,750 --> 00:15:39,300
going to have started as, like,
a really, really rough sketch

432
00:15:39,300 --> 00:15:41,510
is going to start to get
filled in a little bit more.

433
00:15:41,508 --> 00:15:44,188
So, hopefully, what was
really blurry at first

434
00:15:44,190 --> 00:15:46,920
is going to start to slowly
come more and more into focus,

435
00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:49,670
and you're going to get a
sense of what this show is.

436
00:15:49,667 --> 00:15:51,747
Like, we're starting to
see "Stranger Things," not

437
00:15:51,750 --> 00:15:53,130
completely, but a little bit.

438
00:15:53,130 --> 00:15:55,530
It's like our vision is
getting a little bit better.

439
00:15:55,530 --> 00:15:57,720
But you see how much
of "Stranger Things"

440
00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:00,270
came out in the
blue-sky process.

441
00:16:00,270 --> 00:16:02,130
That the big idea--

442
00:16:02,130 --> 00:16:04,230
and I think a lot of people
put too much pressure

443
00:16:04,230 --> 00:16:06,450
on every stage, and
it is a process.

444
00:16:06,450 --> 00:16:08,650
You've got to take it
a little bit at a time.

445
00:16:08,650 --> 00:16:11,990
So this-- Eleven wasn't
in the big idea, which

446
00:16:11,985 --> 00:16:13,115
is hard to think about now.

447
00:16:13,110 --> 00:16:14,370
It's hard to think
about "Stranger Things"

448
00:16:14,370 --> 00:16:14,760
without Eleven.

449
00:16:14,760 --> 00:16:15,750
She wasn't in that paragraph.

450
00:16:15,750 --> 00:16:16,620
She wasn't in the paragraph.

451
00:16:16,620 --> 00:16:19,410
But now we've got demogorgons,
they're called snatchers.

452
00:16:19,410 --> 00:16:22,180
We've got Eleven, she
doesn't have a name yet,

453
00:16:22,180 --> 00:16:24,210
but we know there's a
girl with psychic powers.

454
00:16:24,212 --> 00:16:25,922
We know that she's
going to bond and have

455
00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:29,160
sort of an innocent relationship
with our young boy lead.

456
00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:32,400
We've got a broken sheriff,
who we're calling Sam Rockwell.

457
00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:34,020
We've got the kid's mom.

458
00:16:34,020 --> 00:16:35,460
We talk about her in here.

459
00:16:35,460 --> 00:16:37,860
It's a lot of what the
show's going to become.

460
00:16:37,860 --> 00:16:41,340


461
00:16:43,542 --> 00:16:45,002
As you're working
on this, you're

462
00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:48,060
going to start to explore
the tone of your piece.

463
00:16:48,060 --> 00:16:50,640
You're going to
start to figure out

464
00:16:50,640 --> 00:16:52,110
what is the mood of the piece.

465
00:16:52,110 --> 00:16:54,480
And that really is
what-- what is tone,

466
00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:56,040
when people ask what is tone.

467
00:16:56,040 --> 00:16:58,800
I mean, really it is a feeling.

468
00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:01,560
Like, what feeling
does it evoke in you?

469
00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:03,870
What mood does it evoke?

470
00:17:03,870 --> 00:17:05,620
And "Stranger
Things," of course,

471
00:17:05,619 --> 00:17:06,869
has many different tones.

472
00:17:06,869 --> 00:17:08,999
We knew it was going to
have these horror elements,

473
00:17:08,994 --> 00:17:12,154
but see, as we're discovering
this character of Eleven,

474
00:17:12,150 --> 00:17:13,710
the tone is shifting
a little bit.

475
00:17:13,710 --> 00:17:18,750
So it's becoming a little
less of a cop supernatural

476
00:17:18,750 --> 00:17:21,720
procedural, which honestly
sounds a little boring,

477
00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:24,240
and it's becoming-- it's
getting a little bit more

478
00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:26,220
of that Spielberg vibe into it.

479
00:17:26,220 --> 00:17:30,930
We're moving a little bit away
from some of the darker Stephen

480
00:17:30,930 --> 00:17:35,070
King themes, which were
in the original paragraph,

481
00:17:35,070 --> 00:17:36,930
and infusing them
with a little bit more

482
00:17:36,930 --> 00:17:38,460
of that Spielberg vibe.

483
00:17:38,460 --> 00:17:40,330
The kids are becoming
a bigger part of it.

484
00:17:40,330 --> 00:17:41,760
So the tone is evolving.

485
00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:44,290
And I remember, it's not
written down in this document,

486
00:17:44,290 --> 00:17:45,550
but it's something
that we talked about

487
00:17:45,550 --> 00:17:47,190
and why we were
excited about the idea,

488
00:17:47,190 --> 00:17:49,110
is that it would
allow us to explore

489
00:17:49,110 --> 00:17:50,730
a lot of different tones.

490
00:17:50,730 --> 00:17:53,910
It's why we had basically
three generations.

491
00:17:53,910 --> 00:17:57,840
We had adults, we had
teens, and we had kids.

492
00:17:57,840 --> 00:18:00,390
And each of them was
going to be able to allow

493
00:18:00,388 --> 00:18:01,678
us to explore a different tone.

494
00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:03,570
It was something that
excited us about TV.

495
00:18:03,570 --> 00:18:05,880
It's like, oh, we can have
three different types of movies,

496
00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:07,670
four different types
of movies, and kind of

497
00:18:07,672 --> 00:18:08,832
weave them together.

498
00:18:08,830 --> 00:18:10,770
And you can see in
the document even,

499
00:18:10,770 --> 00:18:12,600
we do mention certain
movies, whether it's

500
00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:15,090
the "Matrix" or a big
one when we came up

501
00:18:15,090 --> 00:18:17,730
with the character
of Eleven was "ET."

502
00:18:17,730 --> 00:18:21,610
When we write "ET," it brings
up a lot of memories for us

503
00:18:21,610 --> 00:18:23,680
and it also brings
a specific tone,

504
00:18:23,680 --> 00:18:25,860
which is a tone that
you don't see a lot.

505
00:18:25,860 --> 00:18:28,170
And we got excited
about, hey, I haven't

506
00:18:28,170 --> 00:18:30,870
seen this a lot in
general and I certainly

507
00:18:30,870 --> 00:18:32,970
don't remember the
last time I've seen it

508
00:18:32,970 --> 00:18:35,190
on TV, which is your
telling something

509
00:18:35,190 --> 00:18:38,010
from the point of view of kids.

510
00:18:38,010 --> 00:18:41,580
But I remember being
scared by it as a kid.

511
00:18:41,580 --> 00:18:42,690
Elliott got in danger.

512
00:18:42,690 --> 00:18:43,780
He got really sick.

513
00:18:43,780 --> 00:18:44,850
I was worried for ET.

514
00:18:44,850 --> 00:18:47,340
They find ET and he's dying.

515
00:18:47,340 --> 00:18:49,140
The stakes always felt real.

516
00:18:49,140 --> 00:18:51,050
And I think that was
something we realized

517
00:18:51,053 --> 00:18:52,473
early on as we
were brainstorming,

518
00:18:52,470 --> 00:18:54,930
this is, we can have
fun with these kids,

519
00:18:54,930 --> 00:18:58,500
but at the heart of it, we've
got this missing kid and we

520
00:18:58,500 --> 00:18:59,430
got real danger.

521
00:18:59,430 --> 00:19:01,800
And we wanted, even though
the kids were young,

522
00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:03,540
we wanted to put
them in real danger

523
00:19:03,540 --> 00:19:05,860
and we wanted the audience
to feel worried for them.

524
00:19:05,860 --> 00:19:08,820
And I think that was an
important part of the evolution

525
00:19:08,820 --> 00:19:10,080
of "Stranger Things."

526
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:11,760
But I think the
bigger point here

527
00:19:11,760 --> 00:19:14,520
is, you don't have to
have the tone down.

528
00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:17,790
Let it-- you can discover it, it
can change, and it can evolve.

529
00:19:17,790 --> 00:19:19,590
And you can even
see in this stuff

530
00:19:19,590 --> 00:19:21,630
that we were reading to
you that it was actually

531
00:19:21,630 --> 00:19:24,660
quite a bit more violent and
dark than it ended up being.

532
00:19:24,660 --> 00:19:26,730
So we had Eleven
exploding heads.

533
00:19:26,730 --> 00:19:29,580
So we do have her
killing agents,

534
00:19:29,580 --> 00:19:31,980
but we don't have the
Cronenberg scanners thing

535
00:19:31,980 --> 00:19:33,510
where heads are exploding.

536
00:19:33,510 --> 00:19:35,220
I mean, in our
heads, initially this

537
00:19:35,220 --> 00:19:36,750
was going to be extremely gory.

538
00:19:36,750 --> 00:19:39,360
So that ended up
kind of going away.

539
00:19:39,360 --> 00:19:41,280
So be patient,
allow it to evolve,

540
00:19:41,280 --> 00:19:43,950
and be open to the tone
shifting and evolving

541
00:19:43,950 --> 00:19:46,980
as you continue to
blue-sky and brainstorm.

542
00:19:46,980 --> 00:19:49,800
There are a lot of tones
going within "Stranger Things,"

543
00:19:49,800 --> 00:19:52,980
but the tone that we are
hoping holds all this together

544
00:19:52,980 --> 00:19:54,660
and holds all these
different threads

545
00:19:54,660 --> 00:19:56,190
and different story
strands together

546
00:19:56,190 --> 00:19:58,110
is a sense of sincerity.

547
00:19:58,110 --> 00:20:01,140
That's the stories that matter
and I fell in love with,

548
00:20:01,140 --> 00:20:06,540
whether it was "ET," or "The
Goonies," or any of these films

549
00:20:06,540 --> 00:20:09,210
that made us want to make
films in the first place.

550
00:20:09,210 --> 00:20:13,200
If there's a joke, it's out
of a result of the situation,

551
00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:16,440
but the stakes are still real,
and the friendships are still

552
00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:18,600
real, and we're not
making light of anything.

553
00:20:18,600 --> 00:20:21,150
We wanted to put a
lot of heart into it.

554
00:20:21,150 --> 00:20:24,240
It really is about friendships,
and it's about family,

555
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:25,830
and not to be
embarrassed by that.

556
00:20:25,830 --> 00:20:26,910
To actually embrace that.

557
00:20:26,910 --> 00:20:27,510
It's not-- right.

558
00:20:27,510 --> 00:20:28,770
It's not-- it's not ironic.

559
00:20:28,770 --> 00:20:30,650
We never wanted to
be ironic, or meta,

560
00:20:30,647 --> 00:20:32,727
or winking at the audience,
or anything like that.

561
00:20:32,730 --> 00:20:35,340
So even though you have
all these disparate tones,

562
00:20:35,340 --> 00:20:39,240
in terms of horror, and comedy,
and romance, and all of that,

563
00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:41,630
you have something that kind
of ties it all together.

564
00:20:41,625 --> 00:20:43,505
So it doesn't feel like
a mishmash of things.

565
00:20:43,500 --> 00:20:44,370
It all coheres.

566
00:20:44,370 --> 00:20:47,710


567
00:20:50,767 --> 00:20:53,097
So now what you're going
to do is you're going to take

568
00:20:53,100 --> 00:20:55,140
your big idea and you're
going to blue-sky it,

569
00:20:55,138 --> 00:20:57,178
which means you're going
to come up, like we did,

570
00:20:57,180 --> 00:21:01,360
a bunch of ideas, almost stream
of consciousness that this idea

571
00:21:01,360 --> 00:21:01,860
gives you.

572
00:21:01,860 --> 00:21:03,850
Hopefully it's going
to open a lot of doors.

573
00:21:03,850 --> 00:21:06,410
And so you're going to just keep
opening those doors wherever

574
00:21:06,407 --> 00:21:06,987
they take you.

575
00:21:06,990 --> 00:21:10,410
Whether it's about setting,
or character, or plot,

576
00:21:10,410 --> 00:21:11,820
or mythology.

577
00:21:11,820 --> 00:21:13,950
Just whatever doors
open, just follow

578
00:21:13,950 --> 00:21:17,930
the stream of consciousness and
just get it all down on paper.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:06,070


2
00:00:06,071 --> 00:00:08,711
Whatever this thing is
it's not traveling far.

3
00:00:08,715 --> 00:00:10,325
Will's body, it was a fake.

4
00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:12,700
I don't think my parents
ever loved each other.

5
00:00:12,700 --> 00:00:13,200
[GUNSHOT]

6
00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:16,390
It's not safe.

7
00:00:16,392 --> 00:00:20,192
OK so hopefully, if you've
done some blue skying,

8
00:00:20,190 --> 00:00:22,590
you've come up with
some various characters

9
00:00:22,590 --> 00:00:27,810
just how like we did with 11
with our Sheriff Sam Rockwell

10
00:00:27,810 --> 00:00:28,720
character.

11
00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:30,460
So now that you've
got all these,

12
00:00:30,460 --> 00:00:32,340
another thing that
we often do is

13
00:00:32,340 --> 00:00:34,500
we start listing
all the characters,

14
00:00:34,497 --> 00:00:36,577
the ones that we think are
going to make the show.

15
00:00:36,580 --> 00:00:39,810
But again, even though we are
going in a little more detail

16
00:00:39,810 --> 00:00:41,580
now by making a list
of our characters,

17
00:00:41,580 --> 00:00:43,840
we want to start really broad.

18
00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:48,060
We don't want to get lost in
the woods of too many details.

19
00:00:48,060 --> 00:00:51,030
So we're going to show you right
now like the initial list we

20
00:00:51,030 --> 00:00:53,040
made of characters
that we thought

21
00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:54,540
could be integral to this show.

22
00:00:54,540 --> 00:00:57,420
So as you see in
this document, we've

23
00:00:57,420 --> 00:01:00,870
got kid who has taken, Tommy.

24
00:01:00,870 --> 00:01:01,870
That it becomes well.

25
00:01:01,870 --> 00:01:04,140
So some of these
names did not stick.

26
00:01:04,140 --> 00:01:06,180
And again, I think
the reason that

27
00:01:06,180 --> 00:01:08,340
is obviously the first
character we wrote down.

28
00:01:08,340 --> 00:01:11,330
Why we know for a
fact that character

29
00:01:11,325 --> 00:01:13,205
is going to make the
show because the show is

30
00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:16,290
about the drive of the show
is about a missing kid, right?

31
00:01:16,290 --> 00:01:18,720
Sometimes it's nice to
throw some names out just

32
00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:20,230
to give you something
to hook onto.

33
00:01:20,230 --> 00:01:23,850
We've got best friend Joel.

34
00:01:23,850 --> 00:01:26,550
Joel obviously will
become Mike later on,

35
00:01:26,550 --> 00:01:29,700
nerd friend, Neil, who
eventually becomes Lucas.

36
00:01:29,700 --> 00:01:30,630
Yeah.

37
00:01:30,630 --> 00:01:34,710
We've got overweight friend,
Dustin, Joel's parents,

38
00:01:34,710 --> 00:01:36,690
we don't go into any
detail about them.

39
00:01:36,690 --> 00:01:39,060
Joyce and Guy, I
mean, his name is Guy.

40
00:01:39,060 --> 00:01:41,220
That's how vague
this is right now.

41
00:01:41,220 --> 00:01:44,300
We've got Tommy's
parents, Tommy being-

42
00:01:44,295 --> 00:01:45,375
Is Will.

43
00:01:45,370 --> 00:01:47,370
So Joyce, we
obviously switched.

44
00:01:47,370 --> 00:01:49,710
Again, all of these names
are on Wendy, Arthur.

45
00:01:49,710 --> 00:01:52,740
Sheriff, we went into a lot
of detail there, Sheriff's

46
00:01:52,740 --> 00:01:55,310
pregnant wife, she obviously
didn't make the show.

47
00:01:55,305 --> 00:01:57,185
Not all these characters
are going to come up

48
00:01:57,180 --> 00:01:58,700
with are going to make it.

49
00:01:58,703 --> 00:02:00,123
As you continue
to develop, you're

50
00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:02,730
going to see who's
going to make it

51
00:02:02,730 --> 00:02:05,310
in who's essential to
the plot and who's not.

52
00:02:05,310 --> 00:02:07,110
We've got Sheriff's daughter.

53
00:02:07,110 --> 00:02:09,310
That character obviously
didn't make it.

54
00:02:09,310 --> 00:02:13,530
We've got escapee,
which was eventually

55
00:02:13,530 --> 00:02:18,070
becomes 11, the
escapee from the lab.

56
00:02:18,070 --> 00:02:21,060
So again, baby steps,
we're starting very small.

57
00:02:21,060 --> 00:02:24,090
We're just going these are some
of the characters who might

58
00:02:24,090 --> 00:02:26,250
make it in terms of the names.

59
00:02:26,250 --> 00:02:27,810
That can be a fun detour.

60
00:02:27,810 --> 00:02:29,130
You're hitting a wall.

61
00:02:29,130 --> 00:02:32,100
You're getting sort of
tired of blue skying in it.

62
00:02:32,100 --> 00:02:33,840
One thing we like to
go is we'll just go

63
00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:36,750
into like Social Security site.

64
00:02:36,750 --> 00:02:39,930
And we'll punch in,
we'll figure out

65
00:02:39,930 --> 00:02:42,510
do the quick little
math in terms of what

66
00:02:42,510 --> 00:02:45,210
when these kids would be born.

67
00:02:45,210 --> 00:02:48,360
So in the case of this, it
was like sometime in the '70s.

68
00:02:48,357 --> 00:02:49,437
And we would just type in.

69
00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:50,580
And then you can choose.

70
00:02:50,580 --> 00:02:55,740
You can go top 1,000
names from 1972.

71
00:02:55,740 --> 00:02:58,140
And you're going to get
a list starting with most

72
00:02:58,140 --> 00:03:00,000
common to least common names.

73
00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:03,690
And you can start to look
through and make sure.

74
00:03:03,685 --> 00:03:06,065
First of all, you make sure
the names are period correct.

75
00:03:06,060 --> 00:03:09,480
And also you can start to
assign names to your characters.

76
00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,450
Now, obviously the names we
assigned here did not stick.

77
00:03:12,450 --> 00:03:14,890
But it can start to
give you a little hook

78
00:03:14,893 --> 00:03:15,813
into these characters.

79
00:03:15,810 --> 00:03:16,600
Yeah, it's funny.

80
00:03:16,602 --> 00:03:19,652
Again how oh, you
just seem like a Matt.

81
00:03:19,650 --> 00:03:22,620
You just seem like
a Trevor, a Lee.

82
00:03:22,620 --> 00:03:25,170
A name does kind of
give you some sense,

83
00:03:25,170 --> 00:03:27,510
or you might have an impression
of someone what someone

84
00:03:27,510 --> 00:03:28,990
is like with a specific name.

85
00:03:28,990 --> 00:03:31,080
It's a small thing,
but actually does help

86
00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,760
provide very early
little bits of definition

87
00:03:34,757 --> 00:03:36,337
as you're starting
with the character.

88
00:03:36,340 --> 00:03:38,630
In shorthand if you're
working with a writing partner

89
00:03:38,632 --> 00:03:39,382
to talk about it.

90
00:03:39,385 --> 00:03:40,765
Hey, so Joel is
going to go here.

91
00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:41,460
And then Joel is
going to go here.

92
00:03:41,460 --> 00:03:42,130
Yeah, exactly.

93
00:03:42,127 --> 00:03:44,607
That's it's just a
shorthand for you to do.

94
00:03:44,610 --> 00:03:46,600
You're just trying
to come up with who

95
00:03:46,597 --> 00:03:48,927
are some characters that might
populate this story-line.

96
00:03:48,930 --> 00:03:54,850


97
00:03:54,846 --> 00:03:58,726
In terms of deciding
which characters are really

98
00:03:58,723 --> 00:04:00,143
going to make it,
which characters

99
00:04:00,140 --> 00:04:01,490
are going to become
essential to the show,

100
00:04:01,490 --> 00:04:03,220
Ross touched on this
a little bit before.

101
00:04:03,222 --> 00:04:05,182
You've got to start with
the most obvious ones.

102
00:04:05,180 --> 00:04:07,010
In this case, we
obviously the show

103
00:04:07,010 --> 00:04:09,740
does not exist without
the kid who goes missing.

104
00:04:09,740 --> 00:04:11,520
Then you work from there.

105
00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:13,550
We knew he was going
to have friends who are

106
00:04:13,550 --> 00:04:14,720
going to be looking for him.

107
00:04:14,717 --> 00:04:16,517
So we know those friends
are going to exist

108
00:04:16,517 --> 00:04:17,597
and be a part of the show.

109
00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:19,430
We know there's going
to be a Sheriff a part

110
00:04:19,430 --> 00:04:21,350
of the show who's looking
for the missing kid.

111
00:04:21,347 --> 00:04:24,467
We know the kid's
friends, the missing kid

112
00:04:24,470 --> 00:04:26,560
is going to have a family.

113
00:04:26,562 --> 00:04:28,522
We know he's going to
have a mother who's going

114
00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:29,600
to be a central character.

115
00:04:29,603 --> 00:04:30,983
So you just start working there.

116
00:04:30,980 --> 00:04:33,110
And the story
itself will dictate

117
00:04:33,110 --> 00:04:35,890
which characters are essential.

118
00:04:35,892 --> 00:04:37,852
Once we started to
think these characters are

119
00:04:37,850 --> 00:04:40,440
going to make it, we go
into a little more detail.

120
00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:43,220
We've got Joyce
Byers, Will's mom.

121
00:04:43,220 --> 00:04:44,930
OK, she's now switched we.

122
00:04:44,930 --> 00:04:45,760
We got the name.

123
00:04:45,763 --> 00:04:47,183
We got the name
right this time.

124
00:04:47,180 --> 00:04:48,710
And even the last
name, actually,

125
00:04:48,710 --> 00:04:52,420
once you're confident that a
character is going to survive

126
00:04:52,423 --> 00:04:54,593
and you're going to exist
within your show, it's fun

127
00:04:54,590 --> 00:04:55,630
to give them a last name.

128
00:04:55,632 --> 00:04:57,832
It starts to again,
just help give them

129
00:04:57,830 --> 00:04:59,240
an identity in your head.

130
00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:01,100
So you started really
broad, and now we're

131
00:05:01,100 --> 00:05:03,230
going into just a
little more detail.

132
00:05:03,230 --> 00:05:07,760
We're saying Will's mom, single,
husband left a long time ago.

133
00:05:07,760 --> 00:05:10,370
That's all, he's a deadbeat.

134
00:05:10,370 --> 00:05:14,540
Drug addict we say maybe she
has an older daughter, ellipses.

135
00:05:14,540 --> 00:05:16,730
And then we go into the
older daughter character,

136
00:05:16,730 --> 00:05:19,070
Vicki Byers, very
pretty, beginning

137
00:05:19,070 --> 00:05:23,840
of trouble at a young age,
16, in with a bad group,

138
00:05:23,840 --> 00:05:27,290
a group of older kids who
pick on our hero kids.

139
00:05:27,290 --> 00:05:31,400
We then say Billy Flanagan,
high school bully,

140
00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:33,680
Vickie's boyfriend, leader
of a group of friends,

141
00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:36,230
trouble makes fun of
our kids, dangerous,

142
00:05:36,230 --> 00:05:39,200
gets a knife, et cetera,
the evil side of our town.

143
00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:41,690
Now, the reason I'm
sharing these two with you

144
00:05:41,690 --> 00:05:44,570
is because elements of
these characters made

145
00:05:44,570 --> 00:05:46,730
into the show, these
specific characters

146
00:05:46,730 --> 00:05:49,070
did not make it into season one.

147
00:05:49,070 --> 00:05:52,790
Vickie Byers a version
of that became Nancy.

148
00:05:52,790 --> 00:05:54,950
So we didn't give Joyce
a daughter anymore.

149
00:05:54,950 --> 00:05:57,830
And parts of Vickie
ended up moving over

150
00:05:57,830 --> 00:06:02,090
to Nancy in that
she's the nice girl,

151
00:06:02,090 --> 00:06:05,300
but she gets sort of drawn
into a slightly darker

152
00:06:05,300 --> 00:06:06,800
side with Steve.

153
00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:10,790
The Billy Flanagan character,
Billy ends up playing a role,

154
00:06:10,790 --> 00:06:13,040
a Billy character
very similar to this

155
00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:15,550
ends up playing a
role in season two.

156
00:06:15,545 --> 00:06:17,195
And we keep that
name, actually.

157
00:06:17,190 --> 00:06:22,790
We do keep that name
but some of this of Steve

158
00:06:22,790 --> 00:06:24,370
is softened a bit.

159
00:06:24,373 --> 00:06:25,793
But even in the
original pilot, he

160
00:06:25,790 --> 00:06:28,340
is a little scarier, a
little more dangerous, more

161
00:06:28,340 --> 00:06:29,040
of a bully.

162
00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:32,900
So some of these elements from
this Billy Flanagan character

163
00:06:32,900 --> 00:06:34,940
became Steve.

164
00:06:34,940 --> 00:06:38,090
So Vicki and Billy were
like very early prototypes

165
00:06:38,090 --> 00:06:41,420
for who would become, what
would become Nancy and Steve.

166
00:06:41,420 --> 00:06:45,960
And again, just like with blue
sky, just like your big idea,

167
00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:48,770
and none of this is it's all
useful to have all of this.

168
00:06:48,770 --> 00:06:51,560
And obviously, we felt pretty
confident at this stage

169
00:06:51,563 --> 00:06:53,483
that these characters
would make it because we

170
00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:54,620
started fleshing them out.

171
00:06:54,620 --> 00:06:55,790
They obviously didn't.

172
00:06:55,790 --> 00:06:56,680
That's OK.

173
00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:58,700
You're in the story is
going to keep evolving,

174
00:06:58,700 --> 00:07:00,830
and stuff's going to
get pushed to the side.

175
00:07:00,830 --> 00:07:02,410
And that's just
part of the process.

176
00:07:02,405 --> 00:07:08,945


177
00:07:08,942 --> 00:07:10,772
So again, you've
started out really broad.

178
00:07:10,775 --> 00:07:13,465
You have a really rough list
of the characters, you think.

179
00:07:13,460 --> 00:07:15,710
And once you're more
confident, which

180
00:07:15,710 --> 00:07:18,030
ones are going to
make it into the show,

181
00:07:18,032 --> 00:07:19,492
you should start
fleshing them out.

182
00:07:19,490 --> 00:07:21,140
You should start
to zoom in on them.

183
00:07:21,140 --> 00:07:22,380
Explore that character.

184
00:07:22,380 --> 00:07:24,050
I think as you explore
that character,

185
00:07:24,050 --> 00:07:26,280
it'll illuminate
more whether or not

186
00:07:26,275 --> 00:07:27,655
they're worth
having in the show,

187
00:07:27,650 --> 00:07:29,360
whether or not they're
interesting enough

188
00:07:29,358 --> 00:07:31,098
to be a major
character in your show.

189
00:07:31,100 --> 00:07:34,440
So one of the characters, we
are fairly confident early on.

190
00:07:34,442 --> 00:07:35,402
I mean, you never know.

191
00:07:35,400 --> 00:07:39,200
But we were pretty confident
the Sheriff character ultimately

192
00:07:39,200 --> 00:07:41,480
would become Chief
Hopper, that Hopper

193
00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:43,010
was going to be a
part of the show

194
00:07:43,005 --> 00:07:44,635
that we were going
to have the Sheriff.

195
00:07:44,630 --> 00:07:47,270
And so we started to
really flesh him out.

196
00:07:47,270 --> 00:07:49,040
So you can actually
see, we started

197
00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:51,890
to sketch him out a
little bit beyond remember

198
00:07:51,890 --> 00:07:55,730
he started out just Sam
Rockwell not McConaughey

199
00:07:55,732 --> 00:07:56,692
on a beach [INAUDIBLE].

200
00:07:56,690 --> 00:07:59,300
So then we took that, and
now we've suggested maybe--

201
00:07:59,300 --> 00:08:01,820
Had a Sheriff
which is not any more

202
00:08:01,820 --> 00:08:03,170
detailed than Sam Rockwell.

203
00:08:03,170 --> 00:08:06,860
And now, we're like
OK, let's actually

204
00:08:06,860 --> 00:08:08,900
give this guy a little
more of a backstory,

205
00:08:08,900 --> 00:08:10,730
a little bit of a dramatic hat.

206
00:08:10,730 --> 00:08:12,480
So and some of this,
yeah OK let's see.

207
00:08:12,482 --> 00:08:13,192
It's interesting.

208
00:08:13,190 --> 00:08:15,870
So we said maybe it was
a family man in New York.

209
00:08:15,870 --> 00:08:17,240
His son died, car accident.

210
00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:19,520
Now he's fucked up, left
the city to come here,

211
00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:21,560
pictures of family
and house, lives

212
00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:23,930
in a shack near the beach,
this was Montauk, still,

213
00:08:23,930 --> 00:08:26,870
drinks too much,
smokes too much,

214
00:08:26,870 --> 00:08:31,130
over a course of series falls
for Joyce who is also broken,

215
00:08:31,130 --> 00:08:34,640
comes to terms with his past
as he solves her son's murder.

216
00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:37,550
So actually, that's
all spot on, really.

217
00:08:37,549 --> 00:08:40,579
In terms of Hopper,
obviously, we switched his son

218
00:08:40,580 --> 00:08:43,720
and made that a daughter,
but the rest of it is true.

219
00:08:43,723 --> 00:08:45,143
So what we were
doing with Hopper,

220
00:08:45,140 --> 00:08:47,900
and I remember actually
as we were working on

221
00:08:47,900 --> 00:08:48,770
like really early.

222
00:08:48,770 --> 00:08:51,260
This was probably even pre
the Sam Rockwell epiphany,

223
00:08:51,263 --> 00:08:53,183
is that he was really
going to be more modeled

224
00:08:53,180 --> 00:08:55,190
after Chief Brody
in Jaws, that he

225
00:08:55,190 --> 00:08:57,800
was going to be kind of a
family man Sheriff, and then.

226
00:08:57,800 --> 00:09:00,300
That's why we the
wife in the all of that.

227
00:09:00,300 --> 00:09:03,590
But then looking at how this
was going to be a TV show,

228
00:09:03,590 --> 00:09:05,780
we wanted to do something
a little bit more

229
00:09:05,775 --> 00:09:06,905
with the Sheriff character.

230
00:09:06,900 --> 00:09:08,670
We also didn't
want to copy Jaws.

231
00:09:08,670 --> 00:09:10,110
We want to do
something different.

232
00:09:10,110 --> 00:09:13,520
And so we wanted
to give him more

233
00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:17,330
of an interesting
complex backstory.

234
00:09:17,330 --> 00:09:19,850
And that's where
we, and so suddenly,

235
00:09:19,850 --> 00:09:21,650
he no longer has
a pregnant wife.

236
00:09:21,650 --> 00:09:24,860
He has a wife who he's divorced
from or estranged from.

237
00:09:24,860 --> 00:09:28,580
And he had, they had a
daughter together who died.

238
00:09:28,580 --> 00:09:30,500
And that, what we
liked about that is it

239
00:09:30,500 --> 00:09:32,660
gave us real emotional
stakes in terms

240
00:09:32,660 --> 00:09:36,010
of this, what's happening now
in the present day in terms

241
00:09:36,010 --> 00:09:38,510
of the investigation, in terms
of the search for the missing

242
00:09:38,510 --> 00:09:39,770
boy, in search of Will.

243
00:09:39,770 --> 00:09:41,660
He's lost a child,
so suddenly, it

244
00:09:41,660 --> 00:09:44,480
takes on more meaning
to him, the search

245
00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,070
for the search for Will.

246
00:09:46,070 --> 00:09:49,980
That, of course, leads naturally
to a connection with Joyce,

247
00:09:49,980 --> 00:09:50,480
right?

248
00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:51,620
Because she's lost her son.

249
00:09:51,620 --> 00:09:55,400
So they have both lost
a child, and perhaps he

250
00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:58,050
thinks in bringing
her, saving her child,

251
00:09:58,050 --> 00:09:59,660
he can kind of sort
of redeem himself.

252
00:09:59,660 --> 00:10:01,760
So suddenly, we're like
OK that's a character.

253
00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:03,890
That's a fully fleshed
out are and we've

254
00:10:03,890 --> 00:10:05,690
got an anchor so
we sort of we're

255
00:10:05,690 --> 00:10:07,400
starting to understand
who Hopper is.

256
00:10:07,400 --> 00:10:10,970
So we also do this with other
characters, but not all of them

257
00:10:10,965 --> 00:10:11,845
are that fleshed out.

258
00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:16,040
That came to us, and obviously,
this all mostly stuck.

259
00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:20,510
Other characters let's look at
like our description of Lucas,

260
00:10:20,510 --> 00:10:22,670
nerd dungeon master,
dresses in black,

261
00:10:22,670 --> 00:10:27,360
glasses, LOTR, that's Lord
of the Rings, fantasy books,

262
00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:29,810
video games, unkempt.

263
00:10:29,810 --> 00:10:32,660
That's nothing really like
the Lucas that is in the show

264
00:10:32,660 --> 00:10:33,200
at all.

265
00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:35,840
Dustin, we describe
as diminutive.

266
00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:39,230
I mean, there's not much else
we're talking about Dustin.

267
00:10:39,230 --> 00:10:43,250
This is not-- these are not
very evolved characters, not

268
00:10:43,250 --> 00:10:44,970
in the same way that Hopper is.

269
00:10:44,968 --> 00:10:46,758
And that's OK, because
sometimes this stuff

270
00:10:46,760 --> 00:10:49,640
is going to come very
quickly like hopper clearly

271
00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:53,810
in a quick little brainstorming
session as is documented here.

272
00:10:53,810 --> 00:10:56,200
We got his whole backstory,
and we got his arc.

273
00:10:56,203 --> 00:10:58,373
That is not going to be the
case of every character,

274
00:10:58,370 --> 00:11:00,110
and you don't want
to beat yourself up

275
00:11:00,110 --> 00:11:01,320
because that's not the case.

276
00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:01,720
It's OK.

277
00:11:01,715 --> 00:11:03,415
So some of this is
not going to be right,

278
00:11:03,410 --> 00:11:04,700
but you've got to throw it out.

279
00:11:04,702 --> 00:11:06,932
And the stuff that stick is
sticks is going to stick.

280
00:11:06,930 --> 00:11:08,930
And stuff that doesn't
is just going to go away.

281
00:11:08,930 --> 00:11:10,500
Again, it's nobody's
going to read this.

282
00:11:10,500 --> 00:11:11,010
It doesn't matter.

283
00:11:11,010 --> 00:11:11,510
Yeah.

284
00:11:11,510 --> 00:11:17,290


285
00:11:17,290 --> 00:11:20,860
When you're working on these
characters and developing it,

286
00:11:20,860 --> 00:11:23,440
one good thing to
do that, we do a lot

287
00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:25,750
is we mind our own
lives, whether it's

288
00:11:25,750 --> 00:11:29,080
childhood or the life we're
living now and looking

289
00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:33,220
at our friends or
personalities that we in trying

290
00:11:33,220 --> 00:11:35,260
to be inspired by that.

291
00:11:35,260 --> 00:11:39,520
And because you really want
these characters to feel real.

292
00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:42,400
And so I think that
can really help flesh

293
00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:45,340
a character out is just
looking at your own life.

294
00:11:45,340 --> 00:11:47,170
I think Joyce
initially started out

295
00:11:47,170 --> 00:11:49,360
a lot more like our mom.

296
00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:51,760
I think that was the
initial sort of prototype

297
00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:55,600
is we were basing her a
little bit more on our mom.

298
00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:57,940
And some of the friends
were based on Dustin

299
00:11:57,940 --> 00:12:00,080
and stuff were based on
our friends growing up,

300
00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:01,600
little kernels of them, right?

301
00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:02,950
So that helps.

302
00:12:02,950 --> 00:12:06,610
Sometimes it helps to give
them a physical characteristic,

303
00:12:06,610 --> 00:12:08,990
I mean, anything that
will help you see them,

304
00:12:08,985 --> 00:12:10,365
start to think
about what they're

305
00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:13,120
interested in, what they like.

306
00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:15,970
And specific things can help.

307
00:12:15,970 --> 00:12:19,060
So if you look at this example
for Mike, so we said he's shy.

308
00:12:19,060 --> 00:12:21,820
We said birthmark
along his neck, face,

309
00:12:21,820 --> 00:12:23,770
kids make fun of him
for it, so that's,

310
00:12:23,770 --> 00:12:26,190
we're starting to get actually
a little bit more specific.

311
00:12:26,187 --> 00:12:28,477
Whether it's physical,
or it could be a stutter,

312
00:12:28,475 --> 00:12:30,105
it could be a million
different things.

313
00:12:30,100 --> 00:12:32,410
But sometimes that
can be a shorthand

314
00:12:32,410 --> 00:12:34,720
for the audience to
start to understand

315
00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:36,110
who this character is.

316
00:12:36,112 --> 00:12:37,572
And then as we
moved into the show,

317
00:12:37,570 --> 00:12:40,390
we realized we didn't
need that to define Mike.

318
00:12:40,390 --> 00:12:42,700
And I would also say
in terms of the shy,

319
00:12:42,700 --> 00:12:46,210
we originally basing him a
lot on sort of us we were

320
00:12:46,210 --> 00:12:48,470
pretty shy kids growing up.

321
00:12:48,470 --> 00:12:51,040
And so I think it was
a shorthand for us

322
00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:52,480
to write that character.

323
00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:55,690
Then we see Finn Wolfhard's
audition, it evolves.

324
00:12:55,690 --> 00:12:56,980
Finn is not a shy kid.

325
00:12:56,980 --> 00:12:58,000
That character evolves.

326
00:12:58,000 --> 00:12:59,620
And I think it
evolves into something

327
00:12:59,620 --> 00:13:02,200
that was more interesting,
more specific to the show.

328
00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:04,760
But it's OK to start
with your life.

329
00:13:04,762 --> 00:13:06,972
And you can always let it
evolve either in the script

330
00:13:06,970 --> 00:13:10,170
or pass the script once you
actually move into production.

331
00:13:10,165 --> 00:13:16,165


332
00:13:16,162 --> 00:13:22,212
So just as your story is going
to have sort of go from A to B,

333
00:13:22,210 --> 00:13:25,390
Will's missing we
got to find Will.

334
00:13:25,390 --> 00:13:28,570
So you've got a drive, and
you're going to have obstacles

335
00:13:28,565 --> 00:13:29,445
along the way, right?

336
00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:32,510
You're going from one
point to another point.

337
00:13:32,507 --> 00:13:34,087
And again, there are
going to be a lot

338
00:13:34,090 --> 00:13:37,550
of little points between Will
missing and finding Will.

339
00:13:37,545 --> 00:13:38,925
Otherwise, you
don't have a show.

340
00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:41,020
So there's going to be a
lot of stuff in between.

341
00:13:41,020 --> 00:13:43,270
But it's important to know
where you're going with it.

342
00:13:43,270 --> 00:13:45,130
And it's the same
with the characters.

343
00:13:45,130 --> 00:13:48,700
Mike starts off as shy,
not very confident.

344
00:13:48,700 --> 00:13:51,100
He falls in love, comes of age.

345
00:13:51,100 --> 00:13:54,370
It's a very broad character arc,
but it is the character arc.

346
00:13:54,370 --> 00:13:58,570
Hopper is broken due to
the death of his daughter.

347
00:13:58,570 --> 00:14:02,080
By finding Will, he's able to
find some sort of redemption

348
00:14:02,080 --> 00:14:03,100
for himself.

349
00:14:03,100 --> 00:14:04,810
And he's able to
find himself again.

350
00:14:04,810 --> 00:14:07,150
That is a very simple arc.

351
00:14:07,150 --> 00:14:10,510
And I think again, you're going
to want to pick the characters.

352
00:14:10,510 --> 00:14:13,960
You can't give everyone
this incredible arc.

353
00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:16,810
We have a ton of side
characters in Stranger Things

354
00:14:16,810 --> 00:14:18,140
that don't have a big arc.

355
00:14:18,140 --> 00:14:20,140
The arcs aren't going to
feel satisfying or earn

356
00:14:20,140 --> 00:14:22,470
because you're trying to give
everyone this amazing arc.

357
00:14:22,473 --> 00:14:24,583
But at that point,
what ends up happening is

358
00:14:24,580 --> 00:14:26,020
or we find happening
is you end up

359
00:14:26,020 --> 00:14:31,110
shortchanging the characters
who you want to have this.

360
00:14:31,108 --> 00:14:32,648
You have the great
arc plan for them.

361
00:14:32,650 --> 00:14:35,110
You're just going to end up
shortchanging those characters.

362
00:14:35,108 --> 00:14:38,038
So it's important to focus
on the ones who are really

363
00:14:38,042 --> 00:14:39,252
essential in terms of arcing.

364
00:14:39,250 --> 00:14:41,080
And the other characters are
going to be great characters.

365
00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:42,910
They just might
not have this sort

366
00:14:42,910 --> 00:14:46,540
of grand emotional
arc in the same way

367
00:14:46,540 --> 00:14:48,880
that Hopper does or
Joyce or whatever.

368
00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:52,360
And of the kids, we
gave Mike the biggest arc

369
00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:53,920
in terms of him coming of age.

370
00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:58,780
But for Lucas and Dustin, their
arc is even much simpler than

371
00:14:58,780 --> 00:14:59,320
Mike's.

372
00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:02,170
We don't have time for them to
go through that full journey

373
00:15:02,170 --> 00:15:04,300
that Mike does in season one.

374
00:15:04,300 --> 00:15:05,680
They fall apart.

375
00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:08,350
Their friendship breaks apart,
and they're able to mend it.

376
00:15:08,350 --> 00:15:10,780
I mean, Dustin kind of
starts like nerdy and awesome

377
00:15:10,780 --> 00:15:12,820
and he kind of is a nerdy
and awesome at the end

378
00:15:12,820 --> 00:15:15,460
even though he's still
confident in who he is.

379
00:15:15,460 --> 00:15:17,860
So you know, he
doesn't have a big arc,

380
00:15:17,863 --> 00:15:19,283
but he's a really
great character.

381
00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:21,160
But you're going to
want to pick and choose

382
00:15:21,155 --> 00:15:23,895
which of those characters you
want to give full arcs to.

383
00:15:23,890 --> 00:15:29,580


384
00:15:29,578 --> 00:15:32,278
So you're going to have
these arcs or some of them

385
00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:36,750
right now where
you're A to B, we

386
00:15:36,748 --> 00:15:38,288
know where Hopper
is going to end up.

387
00:15:38,290 --> 00:15:40,420
We know where we
want Joyce to go.

388
00:15:40,420 --> 00:15:42,420
We know where we were on
Lucas and Dustin to go.

389
00:15:42,420 --> 00:15:45,420
We know where we want Mike
and 11 to go, just roughly, A

390
00:15:45,420 --> 00:15:47,940
to B. We don't know the
journey, but we know roughly

391
00:15:47,940 --> 00:15:49,980
where we want them
to start and end up.

392
00:15:49,980 --> 00:15:52,470
So what's interesting about
writing a pilot script is

393
00:15:52,470 --> 00:15:55,750
you're just doing the A. Their
journey is just beginning,

394
00:15:55,750 --> 00:15:57,460
you can't get them to be.

395
00:15:57,460 --> 00:16:00,690
So for instance,
Hopper, right, we set up

396
00:16:00,690 --> 00:16:02,880
that he's popping Tuinal.

397
00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:05,610
But we wait until the
end of that pilot script

398
00:16:05,610 --> 00:16:08,100
to even reveal that
he had had a family

399
00:16:08,100 --> 00:16:09,630
and that his daughter had died.

400
00:16:09,630 --> 00:16:12,600
And we use that as oh wait,
there's more to this character

401
00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:13,890
than I thought.

402
00:16:13,890 --> 00:16:16,060
But we don't even explore it.

403
00:16:16,060 --> 00:16:17,880
We just tell you,
the audience that

404
00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:19,380
at the very end of the episode.

405
00:16:19,380 --> 00:16:22,120
And then we know, and
anyone reading the script

406
00:16:22,122 --> 00:16:22,832
is going to know.

407
00:16:22,830 --> 00:16:25,050
Oh, this is an important
part of this character,

408
00:16:25,050 --> 00:16:27,460
and I know they're going
to continue to explore it.

409
00:16:27,460 --> 00:16:28,980
But don't race it.

410
00:16:28,980 --> 00:16:31,690
Really, we're just setting
up who these people, are

411
00:16:31,692 --> 00:16:33,402
and we're starting
them on their journey.

412
00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:35,850
But that arc for
Mike for instance,

413
00:16:35,850 --> 00:16:37,840
he meets 11 at the
ending of the pilot.

414
00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:39,420
He's not coming of age yet.

415
00:16:39,420 --> 00:16:41,220
He's just meeting
the person that's

416
00:16:41,220 --> 00:16:42,360
going to change his life.

417
00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:44,070
But we don't know how she's
going to change his life.

418
00:16:44,070 --> 00:16:45,570
We don't know that she's
going to change his life.

419
00:16:45,570 --> 00:16:46,560
We don't know that.

420
00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:49,240
So we're just starting
them off on their journey.

421
00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:51,520
So I think sometimes, and
this has happened with us.

422
00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:54,030
We want to race along too far.

423
00:16:54,030 --> 00:16:56,820
Lucas and Dustin are best
friends still in the pilot.

424
00:16:56,820 --> 00:16:59,470
We haven't even hinted at
any discord between them.

425
00:16:59,467 --> 00:17:00,297
We're going to wait.

426
00:17:00,300 --> 00:17:02,190
I think it is a big
mistake that some people make

427
00:17:02,190 --> 00:17:04,110
in terms of, and we
make it all the time.

428
00:17:04,109 --> 00:17:06,419
We have to keep reminding
ourselves simplify, simplify,

429
00:17:06,420 --> 00:17:06,920
simplify.

430
00:17:06,920 --> 00:17:07,530
Slow down.

431
00:17:07,530 --> 00:17:09,090
And slow down.

432
00:17:09,089 --> 00:17:10,829
You get very
excited, and you try

433
00:17:10,829 --> 00:17:14,699
to cram way too much into
a single script, just,

434
00:17:14,700 --> 00:17:16,440
and everyone's always
they're worried

435
00:17:16,440 --> 00:17:17,400
about they want to get across.

436
00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:19,690
They want to get across that
this is a great character.

437
00:17:19,692 --> 00:17:22,832
They want to get across yeah,
you want to tell everything,

438
00:17:22,829 --> 00:17:24,269
all your ideas about Hopper.

439
00:17:24,270 --> 00:17:24,960
Slow down.

440
00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:25,800
You have time.

441
00:17:25,800 --> 00:17:27,420
It gets going to
get overwhelming,

442
00:17:27,420 --> 00:17:28,920
and the script is
not going to work,

443
00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:31,590
so just a little bit at a time.

444
00:17:31,590 --> 00:17:32,910
Simplicity is your friend.

445
00:17:32,910 --> 00:17:35,000
Yeah, this is just
step one of many steps.

446
00:17:34,995 --> 00:17:35,705
Yeah.

447
00:17:35,700 --> 00:17:41,770


448
00:17:41,771 --> 00:17:44,101
In terms of when we're
developing characters, I mean,

449
00:17:44,100 --> 00:17:45,520
there's a lot of
tricks we can do.

450
00:17:45,517 --> 00:17:47,907
Like we said, we pull
a lot from our lives

451
00:17:47,910 --> 00:17:49,650
and from people we know.

452
00:17:49,650 --> 00:17:52,710
And then there's also
something that's, I don't know,

453
00:17:52,710 --> 00:17:54,690
it's been effective
for us in terms of we

454
00:17:54,690 --> 00:17:58,800
take a character
who is a stereotype,

455
00:17:58,800 --> 00:18:01,020
the jock, the cheerleader.

456
00:18:01,020 --> 00:18:01,830
The nerd.

457
00:18:01,830 --> 00:18:05,880
The nerd or whatever
like Steve whatever

458
00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:08,730
is the perfect example or Nancy
is a good example of something

459
00:18:08,730 --> 00:18:10,770
who starts out of this
stereotype, someone

460
00:18:10,770 --> 00:18:12,970
who the audience
thinks that they know.

461
00:18:12,970 --> 00:18:14,970
The good thing about that
is immediately you go,

462
00:18:14,970 --> 00:18:16,830
OK, I think I know
who this person is.

463
00:18:16,832 --> 00:18:17,792
So they're comfortable.

464
00:18:17,790 --> 00:18:20,820
They're like, OK, this is
the douche bag jock, right?

465
00:18:20,820 --> 00:18:22,600
And then you flip
that on its head.

466
00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:25,420
So you go wait, there's more to
this character than you think.

467
00:18:25,423 --> 00:18:27,093
This is something
that John Hughes who's

468
00:18:27,090 --> 00:18:29,220
a writer director we
obviously look up to a lot

469
00:18:29,220 --> 00:18:30,150
did all the time.

470
00:18:30,150 --> 00:18:31,710
I mean, it's the classic
Breakfast Club thing.

471
00:18:31,710 --> 00:18:32,960
You meet all these characters.

472
00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:34,830
You have each of the
characters assumes

473
00:18:34,830 --> 00:18:36,300
they know the other
character based

474
00:18:36,300 --> 00:18:38,720
on these stereotypes, these
assumptions that they've made.

475
00:18:38,718 --> 00:18:40,258
And then over the
course of the film,

476
00:18:40,260 --> 00:18:41,460
you kind of peel
back those layers,

477
00:18:41,460 --> 00:18:43,170
and you realize there's
a lot more to them.

478
00:18:43,170 --> 00:18:45,210
What it does is it gives
the audience something

479
00:18:45,212 --> 00:18:47,612
to hook onto and go,
OK, that's the nerd.

480
00:18:47,610 --> 00:18:49,080
That's the cheerleader.

481
00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:50,860
That's the douchebag boyfriend.

482
00:18:50,862 --> 00:18:51,572
That's the thing.

483
00:18:51,570 --> 00:18:54,990
But what we like to do is
real life isn't that simple.

484
00:18:54,990 --> 00:18:56,910
No one can be that
easily defined.

485
00:18:56,910 --> 00:18:58,860
But again, just be
careful you don't have

486
00:18:58,860 --> 00:19:00,450
to peel back much in the pilot.

487
00:19:00,450 --> 00:19:02,730
You can just hint at
it or even not at all.

488
00:19:02,730 --> 00:19:06,030
But for Hopper for instance, two
lines at the end of the pilot.

489
00:19:06,030 --> 00:19:09,900
Oh, someone says
he lost his kid.

490
00:19:09,900 --> 00:19:11,760
Thanks for coming out teach.

491
00:19:11,760 --> 00:19:12,870
We really appreciate it.

492
00:19:15,456 --> 00:19:17,286
She died a few years back.

493
00:19:17,290 --> 00:19:18,280
Sorry.

494
00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:20,130
His kid.

495
00:19:20,130 --> 00:19:21,230
That's it.

496
00:19:21,230 --> 00:19:22,400
We know there's more to him.

497
00:19:22,403 --> 00:19:24,073
And we're going to
go into that further,

498
00:19:24,070 --> 00:19:26,680
but we're just hinting that
there's more beneath this

499
00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:28,470
and just like right just a cop.

500
00:19:28,465 --> 00:19:34,335


501
00:19:34,336 --> 00:19:36,906
The other important
thing, right, and I've

502
00:19:36,910 --> 00:19:40,750
touched on this a little bit
is that these characters are

503
00:19:40,750 --> 00:19:41,720
going to surprise you.

504
00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:44,560
So they are kind of
living, breathing things.

505
00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:46,810
I think if you've
created a good character,

506
00:19:46,810 --> 00:19:48,850
and what's going to
happen is and you

507
00:19:48,847 --> 00:19:50,677
have to stay true to
their character, right?

508
00:19:50,680 --> 00:19:53,020
So as we said there's
going to be a drive,

509
00:19:53,020 --> 00:19:55,540
and you're going to throw
obstacles in their path.

510
00:19:55,540 --> 00:19:59,350
And you're going to kind
of a little bit watch

511
00:19:59,350 --> 00:20:03,140
how these characters are going
to overcome that obstacle.

512
00:20:03,137 --> 00:20:04,717
And I think if you're
doing something,

513
00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:06,910
and it's not organic to who
they are as a character,

514
00:20:06,910 --> 00:20:08,410
it's going to be
pretty obvious it's

515
00:20:08,410 --> 00:20:09,710
going to feel really wrong.

516
00:20:09,710 --> 00:20:11,980
And so oftentimes,
this is what's

517
00:20:11,980 --> 00:20:16,310
cool about writing is they
become very real in a sense.

518
00:20:16,307 --> 00:20:17,887
Because you don't
want to manufacture.

519
00:20:17,890 --> 00:20:19,100
You don't want to force them.

520
00:20:19,098 --> 00:20:21,638
They're going to kind of a
little bit do their own thing.

521
00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:25,690
And what's fun about that is
they can often surprise you.

522
00:20:25,690 --> 00:20:31,310


523
00:20:31,306 --> 00:20:33,386
So hopefully in your
blue sky and you've

524
00:20:33,390 --> 00:20:35,970
come up with some
possible characters

525
00:20:35,973 --> 00:20:38,643
that you want that you think you
need to tell the story that you

526
00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:40,180
want to inhabit this world.

527
00:20:40,180 --> 00:20:44,430
So you're going to make a list
now of possible characters.

528
00:20:44,430 --> 00:20:47,220
This is a good something that
we did and you saw us do,

529
00:20:47,220 --> 00:20:48,520
and it can be really helpful.

530
00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:49,470
You're going to make a list.

531
00:20:49,470 --> 00:20:51,120
You can come up with
names if you want.

532
00:20:51,120 --> 00:20:53,040
Just pick three to
five that you think

533
00:20:53,040 --> 00:20:54,960
are necessary to
tell this story.

534
00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:56,670
And then start to
flesh them out.

535
00:20:56,670 --> 00:20:59,150
Don't do that for all the
characters just some of them.

536
00:20:59,153 --> 00:21:00,823
You have an idea that
pops in your head.

537
00:21:00,820 --> 00:21:02,990
Oh here's a good idea for
an arc for this character.

538
00:21:02,987 --> 00:21:03,747
Jot it down.

539
00:21:03,750 --> 00:21:06,150
Or just say this is Lucas.

540
00:21:06,150 --> 00:21:06,780
He's a nerd.

541
00:21:06,780 --> 00:21:07,500
He wears black.

542
00:21:07,500 --> 00:21:09,420
He has glasses.

543
00:21:09,420 --> 00:21:10,380
He gets bullied.

544
00:21:10,380 --> 00:21:12,060
It can be that basic.

545
00:21:12,060 --> 00:21:14,020
But just come up with
that initial list.

546
00:21:14,020 --> 00:21:16,170
And I think it's going to
be really helpful as you

547
00:21:16,170 --> 00:21:19,400
move forward to the
next stage of writing.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:10,440


2
00:00:10,437 --> 00:00:11,957
Where'd it go?

3
00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:12,560
Where is it?

4
00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:25,790
Will!

5
00:00:25,790 --> 00:00:28,830
OK, so now that you have, you
know, some of your characters

6
00:00:28,830 --> 00:00:31,020
roughed out or some
ideas for the characters,

7
00:00:31,020 --> 00:00:33,490
I think it is worth
thinking about the world

8
00:00:33,488 --> 00:00:35,278
that these characters
are going to inhabit.

9
00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:39,000
So this setting-- we had
talked about this a little bit

10
00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:41,460
in terms of we didn't
do a lot of research

11
00:00:41,460 --> 00:00:44,970
when it came to Montauk
and ultimately Hawkins.

12
00:00:44,970 --> 00:00:48,010
It was small town by
the beach, whatever.

13
00:00:48,010 --> 00:00:49,740
But I think something
that's worth doing

14
00:00:49,740 --> 00:00:53,280
is start talking about
sort out the mini settings

15
00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:55,680
within your bigger
setting, the locations

16
00:00:55,680 --> 00:00:57,270
that your characters
can exist in.

17
00:00:57,270 --> 00:00:59,460
So for "Stranger
Things," for instance,

18
00:00:59,460 --> 00:01:01,950
you got Mike's basement
is a major one.

19
00:01:01,950 --> 00:01:02,720
You got the core--

20
00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:03,930
ROSS DUFFER: The,
gym the junkyard.

21
00:01:03,930 --> 00:01:05,370
MATT DUFFER: The
gym, yeah, junkyard,

22
00:01:05,370 --> 00:01:07,290
and you don't have to
do a "Lord of the Rings"

23
00:01:07,290 --> 00:01:09,540
style or George RR Martin map.

24
00:01:09,540 --> 00:01:12,000
Just write down some
of these locations

25
00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:14,850
that really could offer
a really good setting

26
00:01:14,850 --> 00:01:15,690
for certain scenes.

27
00:01:15,690 --> 00:01:17,580
It's just nice to start--

28
00:01:17,580 --> 00:01:19,770
again, you're not going
to have a super in focus

29
00:01:19,770 --> 00:01:22,230
picture of your
world at this point,

30
00:01:22,230 --> 00:01:25,430
but it's gonna start coming
a little bit more in focus.

31
00:01:25,427 --> 00:01:26,757
So you have some characters now.

32
00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:28,580
Start to think
about that setting

33
00:01:28,575 --> 00:01:29,705
that they're gonna inhabit.

34
00:01:29,700 --> 00:01:34,360
And I remember, like, early
on season three, we came in--

35
00:01:34,355 --> 00:01:36,485
we had a writers room at
this point, and we came in

36
00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:39,390
and the writers had done
this exact exercise,

37
00:01:39,390 --> 00:01:42,060
enlisted a bunch of
possible locations

38
00:01:42,060 --> 00:01:44,520
that would be fun to
explore in season three.

39
00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:46,080
And one of them was a mall.

40
00:01:46,080 --> 00:01:47,950
And we went, well,
that's interesting.

41
00:01:47,947 --> 00:01:50,277
That would be a fun place for
our characters to inhabit.

42
00:01:50,280 --> 00:01:52,680
So it's possible that
one of these locations

43
00:01:52,680 --> 00:01:55,510
ends up becoming more
important to your plot.

44
00:01:55,513 --> 00:01:56,803
So it's always a good exercise.

45
00:01:56,805 --> 00:01:59,225
Season two-- season
two was tunnels.

46
00:01:59,220 --> 00:02:01,350
I remember we're just
like tunnels are cool.

47
00:02:01,345 --> 00:02:01,845
Like--

48
00:02:01,845 --> 00:02:03,125
ROSS DUFFER: It's
our very thing.

49
00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:04,340
MATT DUFFER: Yeah,
we all like tunnels,

50
00:02:04,340 --> 00:02:05,970
and then that does
sort of become

51
00:02:05,970 --> 00:02:07,380
a major part of the season.

52
00:02:07,380 --> 00:02:08,760
And one of my favorite
things in the season

53
00:02:08,759 --> 00:02:10,559
are all those sort of
underground tunnels

54
00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:12,120
that the kids have to
navigate in the finale.

55
00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:12,990
ROSS DUFFER: So,
again, you don't

56
00:02:12,990 --> 00:02:15,410
need to know how it's going
to play a role in your script.

57
00:02:15,407 --> 00:02:18,567
It can just be a good exercise
to start filling out this world

58
00:02:18,570 --> 00:02:21,110
and going, OK, well,
in their journey maybe

59
00:02:21,108 --> 00:02:21,898
they could go here.

60
00:02:21,900 --> 00:02:23,230
Maybe they could go to the mall.

61
00:02:23,233 --> 00:02:24,293
Maybe they could go here.

62
00:02:24,295 --> 00:02:26,065
You're just filling
it out, more detail.

63
00:02:26,063 --> 00:02:27,483
You don't have to
use any of this,

64
00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:29,310
but it's going to be it's
going to be good to have.

65
00:02:29,310 --> 00:02:30,040
Yeah.

66
00:02:30,041 --> 00:02:32,991


67
00:02:36,430 --> 00:02:38,510
There's another version
in terms of your setting

68
00:02:38,510 --> 00:02:41,290
or your world where it's not
based in reality at all, which

69
00:02:41,290 --> 00:02:46,600
is what we had with this other
dimension in "Stranger Things."

70
00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:51,310
Now it wasn't super
developed initially

71
00:02:51,310 --> 00:02:53,800
when we were first coming up
with the idea in the pilot.

72
00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:56,620
You saw some of this rough
idea we had of, like, a mouth

73
00:02:56,620 --> 00:02:58,600
leading to the other
world and all of this,

74
00:02:58,600 --> 00:03:02,320
but one thing that we had
talked about early on is--

75
00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:05,110
and some of this was for
budgetary reasons and also

76
00:03:05,110 --> 00:03:07,090
we were very much
inspired by "Poltergeist."

77
00:03:07,090 --> 00:03:11,120
We didn't see that world where
the little girl was taken.

78
00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:13,270
So it was in-- for
us, it was like, well,

79
00:03:13,270 --> 00:03:15,640
that might be scary if
we never actually see it.

80
00:03:15,640 --> 00:03:16,490
We never see it.

81
00:03:16,490 --> 00:03:17,410
We never go into
the upside down.

82
00:03:17,410 --> 00:03:18,760
We're only hearing it over--

83
00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:19,470
that was-- right?

84
00:03:19,470 --> 00:03:20,470
It was the initial idea.

85
00:03:20,470 --> 00:03:21,930
We're only hearing
it over walkies.

86
00:03:21,928 --> 00:03:24,078
We're only hearing it
over radios or whatnot.

87
00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:26,200
So it was like it
would all be left up

88
00:03:26,200 --> 00:03:28,800
to the imagination
of the viewer.

89
00:03:28,795 --> 00:03:29,565
Yes.

90
00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:33,850
And ultimately that
went away pretty quickly

91
00:03:33,850 --> 00:03:36,190
as we started to write
the show because we

92
00:03:36,190 --> 00:03:37,450
realized this is a show.

93
00:03:37,450 --> 00:03:38,530
This is not a movie.

94
00:03:38,530 --> 00:03:39,660
I'm starting to get antsy.

95
00:03:39,663 --> 00:03:40,583
I want to go in there.

96
00:03:40,580 --> 00:03:41,650
I want to see what's--

97
00:03:41,650 --> 00:03:42,490
I want to see what.

98
00:03:42,490 --> 00:03:44,350
We still limited how
often we went in there,

99
00:03:44,350 --> 00:03:45,310
but we did go in there.

100
00:03:45,308 --> 00:03:47,498
And then that forced
us to evolve it more

101
00:03:47,500 --> 00:03:51,100
and actually explain what
this world would look like,

102
00:03:51,100 --> 00:03:53,860
but when we wrote the pilot--

103
00:03:53,860 --> 00:03:56,410
and you'll see in our outline
and when we actually go

104
00:03:56,410 --> 00:03:57,970
into more detail in the pilot--

105
00:03:57,970 --> 00:04:00,010
we didn't know a whole lot.

106
00:04:00,010 --> 00:04:03,220
It didn't even have a name
in terms of the upside

107
00:04:03,220 --> 00:04:05,370
down wasn't even what
we were calling it.

108
00:04:05,370 --> 00:04:07,120
In the beginning it
was called the nether,

109
00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:08,890
which is more of a placeholder.

110
00:04:08,890 --> 00:04:10,720
The upside down name
came about later

111
00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:12,610
in the writing of
episode five when

112
00:04:12,610 --> 00:04:14,380
Mike is trying to
explain where Will is,

113
00:04:14,380 --> 00:04:17,680
and he flips a DandD board
over and says upside down.

114
00:04:17,680 --> 00:04:24,640
What if this is Hawkins,
and this is where Will is,

115
00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:25,540
the upside down?

116
00:04:25,540 --> 00:04:27,610
And that just sort
of stuck, and that just

117
00:04:27,610 --> 00:04:29,920
became the terminology
to which we've

118
00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:31,630
referred to this other world.

119
00:04:31,630 --> 00:04:34,930
And then practically, we had
to do something very simple

120
00:04:34,930 --> 00:04:37,330
because we kind of do a huge
visual effects extravaganza.

121
00:04:37,330 --> 00:04:40,630
And so that started to effect
what this world would actually

122
00:04:40,630 --> 00:04:41,410
look like.

123
00:04:41,410 --> 00:04:44,170
But, again, you know,
so you can start--

124
00:04:44,170 --> 00:04:46,920
you can start to-- you can be
pretty vague at the beginning

125
00:04:46,923 --> 00:04:49,093
here, and you don't have
to have it all figured out.

126
00:04:49,090 --> 00:04:51,640
If you're telling a show this
is an eight-hour process,

127
00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:54,010
you're not gonna
have all eight hours

128
00:04:54,010 --> 00:04:55,340
fully mapped out at this point.

129
00:04:55,340 --> 00:04:56,630
Well, I think it's important.

130
00:04:56,632 --> 00:04:59,002
So it just-- to
reemphasize something

131
00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:00,940
my brother's saying
there, when we're going in

132
00:05:00,940 --> 00:05:03,630
and we're pitching to Netflix,
we're pitching the show,

133
00:05:03,628 --> 00:05:05,918
and we have the pilot, it's
not called the upside down.

134
00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:07,330
There's no-- there's--

135
00:05:07,330 --> 00:05:10,450
the spores and the vines, I
mean, none of that none of that

136
00:05:10,450 --> 00:05:12,160
is figured out,
and we didn't get

137
00:05:12,158 --> 00:05:13,448
hammered by Netflix about that.

138
00:05:13,450 --> 00:05:15,730
It was like could you
describe the mythology

139
00:05:15,730 --> 00:05:16,600
of this other world.

140
00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:17,770
Like, they don't-- whatever.

141
00:05:17,767 --> 00:05:19,407
They get it is a
scary other dimension.

142
00:05:19,410 --> 00:05:20,410
You're going to figure--

143
00:05:20,410 --> 00:05:22,180
you're going to give
it-- figure it out.

144
00:05:22,180 --> 00:05:25,120
I think something that is
intimidating to a lot of people

145
00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:26,620
and it was certainly
intimidating us

146
00:05:26,620 --> 00:05:28,440
when we started is
you see these products

147
00:05:28,438 --> 00:05:29,978
and they're fully
done, fully formed,

148
00:05:29,980 --> 00:05:31,300
and you just get overwhelmed.

149
00:05:31,300 --> 00:05:33,300
It's like how am I going
to figure all this out.

150
00:05:33,300 --> 00:05:34,920
And the answer is
one step at a time.

151
00:05:34,923 --> 00:05:37,093
Like, so a lot of this stuff
wasn't even figured out

152
00:05:37,090 --> 00:05:39,400
when we sold it to Netflix.

153
00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:43,000
So that should relieve
a lot of pressure

154
00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:46,270
from you to not get overwhelmed
and it's just a little bit

155
00:05:46,270 --> 00:05:46,850
at a time.

156
00:05:46,850 --> 00:05:48,100
And even as you're
writing your script

157
00:05:48,100 --> 00:05:49,640
it's not going to
all be figured out.

158
00:05:49,642 --> 00:05:50,922
So allow--

159
00:05:50,920 --> 00:05:52,450
It's going to be a process.

160
00:05:52,450 --> 00:05:54,730
Even after we had
written the pilot script

161
00:05:54,730 --> 00:05:56,230
and we were meeting
with people, we

162
00:05:56,228 --> 00:05:58,268
did start to get asked
questions about the world,

163
00:05:58,270 --> 00:06:00,260
and that forced us to sit down--

164
00:06:00,255 --> 00:06:01,135
And think about it.

165
00:06:01,130 --> 00:06:04,090
And think about it and talk
about it more and whatnot.

166
00:06:04,090 --> 00:06:05,540
And it'll evolve.

167
00:06:05,540 --> 00:06:08,050
It'll start to evolve,
and then eventually when

168
00:06:08,050 --> 00:06:10,780
we decided we have to go
in there once we started

169
00:06:10,780 --> 00:06:14,380
moving into writing later
scripts for Netflix,

170
00:06:14,380 --> 00:06:16,720
we went, OK, what could
this world look like.

171
00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:18,190
We talked about "Silent Hill."

172
00:06:18,190 --> 00:06:19,720
We talked about "Alien."

173
00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:21,670
We talked about the
aesthetics of it.

174
00:06:21,670 --> 00:06:24,110
Again, that wasn't figured
out on the pilot stage,

175
00:06:24,110 --> 00:06:27,190
and that was-- in our
instance, that was OK.

176
00:06:27,190 --> 00:06:28,960
Again, it's going
to be baby steps.

177
00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:31,180
All of this is
to say it's good

178
00:06:31,180 --> 00:06:34,690
actually to say simple
and vague and you're fine.

179
00:06:34,690 --> 00:06:37,300
It's not-- don't expect it to
be fully formed at this stage.

180
00:06:37,300 --> 00:06:39,580
Don't try to make
it fully formed.

181
00:06:39,580 --> 00:06:42,410
Just stay-- continue
to stay zoomed out.

182
00:06:42,410 --> 00:06:45,350


183
00:06:48,290 --> 00:06:49,900
Similar to the
aesthetic or whatever

184
00:06:49,900 --> 00:06:52,840
of the upside down of this
alternate dimension, we have

185
00:06:52,840 --> 00:06:56,270
this sort of psychic space
that 11 exists in, which was we

186
00:06:56,265 --> 00:06:57,645
called the black
void where she's

187
00:06:57,640 --> 00:06:59,980
in just completely black space.

188
00:06:59,980 --> 00:07:04,660
And, again, you know, that came
about, we realized as we were

189
00:07:04,660 --> 00:07:05,970
writing it, I mean, we had--

190
00:07:05,970 --> 00:07:08,980
we needed a way to
visualize how 11 was

191
00:07:08,980 --> 00:07:10,390
using these psionic abilities.

192
00:07:10,390 --> 00:07:11,880
We wanted to be
kind of in her head

193
00:07:11,878 --> 00:07:13,418
as she was doing
these things and she

194
00:07:13,420 --> 00:07:14,620
was making psychic contact.

195
00:07:14,615 --> 00:07:16,995
It was like, well, how in the
world do we visualize this.

196
00:07:16,990 --> 00:07:19,750
We don't have a bajillion
dollars to do this all CG,

197
00:07:19,748 --> 00:07:21,288
and we didn't want
to do it that way.

198
00:07:21,290 --> 00:07:22,210
We wanted to keep it simple.

199
00:07:22,210 --> 00:07:22,880
And practical.

200
00:07:22,877 --> 00:07:24,967
And we wanted to
do it practical.

201
00:07:24,970 --> 00:07:27,130
There was a movie that
came out "Under the Skin."

202
00:07:27,130 --> 00:07:31,480
Now-- that Jonathan Glazer
made with Scarlett Johansson

203
00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:33,680
where he had this
really cool effect.

204
00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:37,000
It's like a really simple effect
where Scarlett Johansson was

205
00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:39,850
in this strange--

206
00:07:39,850 --> 00:07:41,800
just surrounded
completely by black.

207
00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:44,060
And I think did
maybe he did have--

208
00:07:44,060 --> 00:07:45,040
Some reflection.

209
00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:47,680
Some reflective [INAUDIBLE]
it's been a while.

210
00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:49,290
But what's
interesting-- you know,

211
00:07:49,288 --> 00:07:51,078
it's worth pointing
out a couple of things.

212
00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:55,310
A, that's an idea that came much
later that evolved as you're

213
00:07:55,313 --> 00:07:56,233
working on the script.

214
00:07:56,230 --> 00:07:58,730
It wasn't there when we sold
the script just like the upside

215
00:07:58,730 --> 00:08:00,430
down wasn't really figured out.

216
00:08:00,430 --> 00:08:05,440
It was something that came to us
and also that it was very much

217
00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:07,600
inspired by another
film that we had seen

218
00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:10,660
and a film that is completely
unlike "Stranger Things."

219
00:08:10,660 --> 00:08:13,580
I mean, it's kind of almost
an experimental film.

220
00:08:13,577 --> 00:08:14,407
"Under the Skin" is.

221
00:08:14,410 --> 00:08:15,640
It's a weird film.

222
00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:23,070
So it's good to watch all sorts
of types of movies, not just--

223
00:08:23,065 --> 00:08:25,335
don't just watch-- if
you love Marvel movies,

224
00:08:25,330 --> 00:08:27,190
don't just watch Marvel movies.

225
00:08:27,190 --> 00:08:30,800
Try watch everything
because even if it doesn't--

226
00:08:30,803 --> 00:08:33,223
the tone of "Under the Skin"
is so different than the tone

227
00:08:33,220 --> 00:08:37,020
of "Stranger Things," but it
still had an element in there

228
00:08:37,015 --> 00:08:38,335
that was really helpful for us.

229
00:08:38,330 --> 00:08:40,990
And inspiring and I think and
again it could be a painting.

230
00:08:40,990 --> 00:08:44,110
It could be a photograph
that you love.

231
00:08:44,110 --> 00:08:47,870
It could be in the case of the
spore-like aspect of the upside

232
00:08:47,870 --> 00:08:48,370
down.

233
00:08:48,370 --> 00:08:49,870
It could be a video game.

234
00:08:49,870 --> 00:08:50,800
MATT DUFFER: Yeah,
that came from--

235
00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:52,120
that was inspired
by "Silent Hill."

236
00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:54,040
ROSS DUFFER: Again,
you're going to be looking

237
00:08:54,037 --> 00:08:56,087
at things love and
things that inspire you,

238
00:08:56,090 --> 00:08:59,800
and that's a perfectly
valid thing to do.

239
00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:02,760


240
00:09:06,710 --> 00:09:08,720
For this assignment,
just start making

241
00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:11,440
a simple list of locations
where your characters can exist.

242
00:09:11,435 --> 00:09:15,625
MATT DUFFER: It can be as basic
as a bedroom a gym or tunnels.

243
00:09:15,620 --> 00:09:18,500
Start simple and have fun.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,940


2
00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:10,720
So hopefully as you're
doing your blue skying,

3
00:00:10,720 --> 00:00:13,090
you're working on
your characters,

4
00:00:13,090 --> 00:00:15,700
you're working on
some setting, stuff

5
00:00:15,700 --> 00:00:17,980
is starting to become a
little bit more into focus.

6
00:00:17,980 --> 00:00:22,360
And we did talk about how your
characters go from A to B,

7
00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:24,260
especially your most
important characters.

8
00:00:24,260 --> 00:00:27,010
They have a little
arc from A to B.

9
00:00:27,010 --> 00:00:29,530
What we haven't
talked about as much

10
00:00:29,530 --> 00:00:32,830
is a story arc 'cause your
story arc is also going

11
00:00:32,830 --> 00:00:34,810
to want to go from A to B.

12
00:00:34,810 --> 00:00:38,440
Now if you have a very sort
of simple drive to your story

13
00:00:38,440 --> 00:00:42,380
as we did in "Stranger Things,"
which is Will's missing.

14
00:00:42,380 --> 00:00:43,390
We have to find Will.

15
00:00:43,390 --> 00:00:46,330
So all of our
characters in season one

16
00:00:46,330 --> 00:00:49,840
have the same drive,
which is to find Will.

17
00:00:49,840 --> 00:00:54,620
Hopper had it, the kids
had it, the teens have it,

18
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which and those are sort
of what we talk about as

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are each of those is a
different generation,

20
00:00:58,660 --> 00:01:00,610
a generational
storyline, which is

21
00:01:00,610 --> 00:01:03,040
one of the early ideas we had
that we were excited about.

22
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And they all have
the same drive,

23
00:01:04,780 --> 00:01:07,690
which was really
helpful on season one,

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and it helped really
unite the season.

25
00:01:09,767 --> 00:01:11,347
So we know that
everyone's going to go

26
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from A, which is Will disappears
and this thing happens

27
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and changes their lives.

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00:01:17,380 --> 00:01:19,360
B, we're going to
find Will, right.

29
00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:20,740
So we know that, which is great.

30
00:01:20,740 --> 00:01:23,100
But within each of
those storylines,

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they're going to have sort
of an individual arc for how

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they get from A to B.

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00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:29,440
And as we were
developing this season--

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and it's even in
our pitch to Netflix

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00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:33,940
where we talk about each
of these generations

36
00:01:33,940 --> 00:01:38,320
and we talk very broadly
about their story arcs

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00:01:38,320 --> 00:01:43,000
as in they start here on A
and they go to here on B.

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00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:46,950
We did not have a lot of detail
about that journey from A to B.

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00:01:46,945 --> 00:01:50,895
We put in a few ideas,
a few ideas we had,

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but we didn't put
a lot because what

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00:01:52,750 --> 00:01:54,580
all we wanted to
communicate-- and all

42
00:01:54,580 --> 00:01:56,590
that was really
important is we knew

43
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where their starting point
was, which is in the pilot,

44
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and where their destination was.

45
00:02:01,570 --> 00:02:03,460
If you don't know
their destination,

46
00:02:03,460 --> 00:02:05,230
it's going to be
challenging because you

47
00:02:05,230 --> 00:02:07,880
don't know what to set up
at their starting point.

48
00:02:07,880 --> 00:02:10,450
So you really do need
to try to, if you can,

49
00:02:10,449 --> 00:02:15,249
have at least a broad sense
of where you want them to go.

50
00:02:15,250 --> 00:02:18,180


51
00:02:20,618 --> 00:02:23,388
You know, obviously so
we have this big story arc,

52
00:02:23,390 --> 00:02:25,490
but one thing we found
when we were blue skying

53
00:02:25,490 --> 00:02:31,500
is that we wanted to have three
groups of characters, right.

54
00:02:31,500 --> 00:02:33,500
We wanted to have kids,
we wanted to have teens,

55
00:02:33,500 --> 00:02:36,560
we want to have adults,
and that each of them

56
00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:38,420
was going to have
their own little mini

57
00:02:38,420 --> 00:02:42,020
arc within the big arc, the
big arc being find Will.

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00:02:42,020 --> 00:02:43,910
So they would each
be kind of-- they

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00:02:43,910 --> 00:02:46,100
would each be moving
towards that goal

60
00:02:46,100 --> 00:02:47,840
but in very different ways.

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00:02:47,840 --> 00:02:50,420
And it was like, since they
all have the same drive,

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00:02:50,420 --> 00:02:51,920
how do we differentiate
them, right?

63
00:02:51,920 --> 00:02:54,580
Like, it was like how do we--
they all have the same goal.

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00:02:54,580 --> 00:02:55,580
How is that going to go?

65
00:02:55,580 --> 00:02:56,090
Find Will?

66
00:02:56,090 --> 00:02:57,830
Aren't they just going to
be colliding and overlapping

67
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the whole time?

68
00:02:58,190 --> 00:03:00,230
We're like, OK, so it's
just we thought about as

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00:03:00,230 --> 00:03:01,810
one big puzzle, and
they're each going

70
00:03:01,813 --> 00:03:04,793
to be solving one big
piece of the puzzle that's

71
00:03:04,790 --> 00:03:06,530
necessary to find Will.

72
00:03:06,530 --> 00:03:08,920
So the kids are solving
one piece of the puzzle,

73
00:03:08,922 --> 00:03:10,882
the adults are solving
one piece of the puzzle,

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00:03:10,880 --> 00:03:12,960
and the teens are solving
one piece of the puzzle.

75
00:03:12,963 --> 00:03:16,013
And then we thought in
the penultimate episode,

76
00:03:16,010 --> 00:03:18,150
so we were going to
have them all combined.

77
00:03:18,152 --> 00:03:20,362
So we're going to have all
three generations combine.

78
00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:22,910
They're going to share
their information,

79
00:03:22,910 --> 00:03:25,760
they're each going to have
a key piece of information

80
00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:27,800
vital to saving Will,
and then they're

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00:03:27,800 --> 00:03:32,150
going to use that so join
forces and ultimately save Will.

82
00:03:32,150 --> 00:03:34,730
But if you removed one
storyline, it wouldn't work.

83
00:03:34,730 --> 00:03:36,590
They would be--
they would not have

84
00:03:36,590 --> 00:03:40,400
one key piece of information
that's necessary to save Will.

85
00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:41,830
He would get
eaten by Demogorg.

86
00:03:41,830 --> 00:03:42,790
He would get-- right.

87
00:03:42,788 --> 00:03:44,508
So we found this,
like, to be, like, kind

88
00:03:44,510 --> 00:03:47,120
of a really effective structure
for the show for "Stranger

89
00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:50,520
Things" and as much as it
changes from season to season,

90
00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:53,690
so as different
as two is from one

91
00:03:53,690 --> 00:03:56,250
and season three is from
one, they all kind of

92
00:03:56,250 --> 00:03:57,880
have that core
structure which we have.

93
00:03:57,875 --> 00:04:00,775
We splinter our
groups, and they're all

94
00:04:00,770 --> 00:04:03,230
in their own sort of
adventure or horror story.

95
00:04:03,230 --> 00:04:05,960
But every time they're
learning some essential piece

96
00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:08,540
of the puzzle, they
kind of come together

97
00:04:08,540 --> 00:04:10,490
and put all their
information in their brains

98
00:04:10,490 --> 00:04:12,450
together in order to
solve the greater mystery.

99
00:04:12,448 --> 00:04:17,028
That's a story arc that's very
specific to what we discovered

100
00:04:17,029 --> 00:04:18,409
in our blue sky process.

101
00:04:18,410 --> 00:04:21,410
But I'm hopefully as you're
doing your blue skying,

102
00:04:21,410 --> 00:04:24,020
you're also coming up with
a structure that works

103
00:04:24,020 --> 00:04:25,520
specifically for your story.

104
00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:28,380


105
00:04:31,232 --> 00:04:33,642
One thing that's going
to come up inevitably

106
00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:35,350
if you're developing
a television show

107
00:04:35,350 --> 00:04:37,210
is this idea of, OK, what is.

108
00:04:37,210 --> 00:04:38,100
Is this a one off?

109
00:04:38,100 --> 00:04:39,460
Is this a limited series?

110
00:04:39,460 --> 00:04:40,540
Is it multiple seasons?

111
00:04:40,540 --> 00:04:42,120
Do you need to start
figuring out what

112
00:04:42,123 --> 00:04:43,603
those multiple seasons are?

113
00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:45,850
Our opinion is that can get
really overwhelming if you

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00:04:45,850 --> 00:04:47,180
start doing that right now.

115
00:04:47,180 --> 00:04:49,810
I think that when we were
developing "Stranger Things"

116
00:04:49,810 --> 00:04:51,770
specifically, it was
going to be a one off.

117
00:04:51,770 --> 00:04:53,110
It was going to be a season one.

118
00:04:53,110 --> 00:04:55,450
We knew we were going to
get asked the question of,

119
00:04:55,450 --> 00:04:58,450
OK, inevitably if this
thing is successful,

120
00:04:58,453 --> 00:05:00,373
you know, what does this
season two look like?

121
00:05:00,370 --> 00:05:02,870
Can this-- does this have
potential to continue?

122
00:05:02,865 --> 00:05:04,245
The answer seemed
pretty obvious.

123
00:05:04,240 --> 00:05:06,620
It came to us-- you know,
wasn't-- it wasn't hard it was.

124
00:05:06,615 --> 00:05:08,805
Like, OK, well, we knew
they were going to find Will

125
00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:10,220
and they were going
to rescue Will

126
00:05:10,217 --> 00:05:12,247
and they were going to
bring him back home.

127
00:05:12,250 --> 00:05:14,510
Will's been-- we don't know
what's happened with Will.

128
00:05:14,508 --> 00:05:16,298
Like, we knew he was
going to be off screen

129
00:05:16,300 --> 00:05:18,930
for the majority of the season,
that he was going to come back.

130
00:05:18,925 --> 00:05:20,505
So we knew if there
were going to be

131
00:05:20,500 --> 00:05:22,150
a continuation of
the story that we're

132
00:05:22,150 --> 00:05:23,350
going to have to focus on Will.

133
00:05:23,350 --> 00:05:24,930
He's been in this
alternate dimension.

134
00:05:24,933 --> 00:05:26,903
We don't know what the
hell happened to him.

135
00:05:26,900 --> 00:05:29,380
We knew that was a story
arc that we would pitch,

136
00:05:29,380 --> 00:05:31,310
and that's honestly
all we pitched

137
00:05:31,312 --> 00:05:32,772
when we went into
Netflix because I

138
00:05:32,770 --> 00:05:36,280
think the key is developing
a really great first season.

139
00:05:36,280 --> 00:05:39,570
I mean, we're all about just
taking it one step at a time

140
00:05:39,572 --> 00:05:41,152
because otherwise
you get overwhelmed.

141
00:05:41,155 --> 00:05:44,445
In our opinion, it's so
hard to just tell a story

142
00:05:44,440 --> 00:05:46,500
and tell a simple story well--

143
00:05:46,495 --> 00:05:47,155
That works.

144
00:05:47,153 --> 00:05:47,693
That works.

145
00:05:47,695 --> 00:05:48,835
Yeah, that just works.

146
00:05:48,830 --> 00:05:50,860
And certainly for
our first script,

147
00:05:50,860 --> 00:05:52,210
that was just the drive.

148
00:05:52,210 --> 00:05:55,570
Can we tell a story
that is very simple

149
00:05:55,570 --> 00:05:58,000
and that works that keeps
the reader turning the pages

150
00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:01,480
and then goes from A to
B. And I think that really

151
00:06:01,480 --> 00:06:03,100
should be the focus right now.

152
00:06:03,100 --> 00:06:05,350
Because guess what, if
you tell a great story,

153
00:06:05,350 --> 00:06:09,840
you're going to find a
way in to tell that sequel

154
00:06:09,836 --> 00:06:13,276
or the second season or
whatever it happens to be,

155
00:06:13,280 --> 00:06:15,340
but really I think
the goal right now

156
00:06:15,340 --> 00:06:18,470
should be to just focus on
let's tell a simple cool story.

157
00:06:18,470 --> 00:06:20,380
It has a goal, and
you achieve that goal

158
00:06:20,380 --> 00:06:21,670
at the end of this story.

159
00:06:21,670 --> 00:06:24,560


160
00:06:27,442 --> 00:06:30,832
As we're talking about
developing an arc-- in fact,

161
00:06:30,827 --> 00:06:33,157
this applies to everything
we've talked about right now,

162
00:06:33,160 --> 00:06:37,860
which is just stay
pretty zoomed out.

163
00:06:37,860 --> 00:06:40,200
It's overwhelming
enough, in my opinion,

164
00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:42,150
to just get a good pilot script.

165
00:06:42,150 --> 00:06:45,810
Don't start thinking about
your seventh season arc.

166
00:06:45,810 --> 00:06:51,300
Don't write a 30-page
world-building mythology book.

167
00:06:51,300 --> 00:06:54,060
Don't write a 20-page back
story for each character.

168
00:06:54,060 --> 00:06:55,470
I mean, listen, you can do that.

169
00:06:55,470 --> 00:06:57,810
I just worry you're never
going to finish your script,

170
00:06:57,810 --> 00:06:59,690
and, again, you're going
to get lost in the--

171
00:06:59,685 --> 00:07:01,355
I really think you're
going to get lost.

172
00:07:01,352 --> 00:07:02,402
It's so easy to get lost.

173
00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:04,150
I know Ross and I are
not the only writers

174
00:07:04,150 --> 00:07:05,310
who this happens to.

175
00:07:05,310 --> 00:07:07,860
We're just-- lose
sight of where you are.

176
00:07:07,860 --> 00:07:10,260
So to us-- and we've
made that mistake.

177
00:07:10,260 --> 00:07:12,600
I mean, I've lost years
of my life doing this.

178
00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:14,580
I'm trying to save you
years, which is just

179
00:07:14,580 --> 00:07:18,520
stay really zoomed out, keep it
really simple in terms of arcs,

180
00:07:18,517 --> 00:07:20,347
in terms of characters,
in terms of setting,

181
00:07:20,350 --> 00:07:22,260
in terms of everything
that we've talked about.

182
00:07:22,260 --> 00:07:24,590
As we go forward with this
class, what we're going to do

183
00:07:24,593 --> 00:07:26,073
is we're still
pretty wide, right,

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00:07:26,072 --> 00:07:27,782
and then we're going
to just slowly start

185
00:07:27,780 --> 00:07:31,180
to do this until you have--
until you have your pilot

186
00:07:31,180 --> 00:07:31,680
script.

187
00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:34,920
And even from then, it's going
to continue to evolve and get

188
00:07:34,920 --> 00:07:35,850
more specific.

189
00:07:35,848 --> 00:07:36,768
Don't get overwhelmed.

190
00:07:36,765 --> 00:07:38,285
It's like the eye
doctor, you know,

191
00:07:38,280 --> 00:07:40,030
where they're putting
in different lenses,

192
00:07:40,030 --> 00:07:42,510
and it just, like, it's going
to start out really blurry

193
00:07:42,510 --> 00:07:44,860
and it's going to keep
getting more and more focused.

194
00:07:44,860 --> 00:07:46,440
And I think that
sometimes you're

195
00:07:46,437 --> 00:07:47,517
just like why can't I see.

196
00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:48,600
Why is it all blurry?

197
00:07:48,600 --> 00:07:49,200
That's [INAUDIBLE]--

198
00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:50,940
Or you're doing-- like,
I'm doing it's so blurry

199
00:07:50,940 --> 00:07:51,510
and unfocused.

200
00:07:51,510 --> 00:07:52,510
I'm doing something wrong.

201
00:07:52,510 --> 00:07:53,880
It doesn't look like
this finished movie

202
00:07:53,880 --> 00:07:55,590
that I just saw this weekend
or that finished show

203
00:07:55,590 --> 00:07:56,820
that I just saw and I loved.

204
00:07:56,820 --> 00:07:57,930
Why is it not that good?

205
00:07:57,930 --> 00:07:59,820
Why is it not that specific?

206
00:07:59,820 --> 00:08:01,410
My characters aren't that good.

207
00:08:01,410 --> 00:08:03,570
Like, they shouldn't
be at this point.

208
00:08:03,570 --> 00:08:05,210
[INTERPOSING VOICES]

209
00:08:05,208 --> 00:08:06,998
And I think what happens
in a lot of people

210
00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:08,970
then they get frustrated, and
they go, oh, well, whatever.

211
00:08:08,970 --> 00:08:10,000
I can't do this.

212
00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:12,390
And then-- and then they
abandon what they're working on.

213
00:08:12,390 --> 00:08:12,890
It's like--

214
00:08:12,890 --> 00:08:13,650
Or they give up.

215
00:08:13,650 --> 00:08:15,030
They don't want to--
they're like I can't write.

216
00:08:15,030 --> 00:08:15,750
I can't do it.

217
00:08:15,750 --> 00:08:18,360
But, like, we never saw
ourselves as writers,

218
00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:21,210
and I do think
that there's a way

219
00:08:21,210 --> 00:08:24,510
that you can take this
process and you take it slow.

220
00:08:24,510 --> 00:08:26,850
I mean, but even
now, even having

221
00:08:26,850 --> 00:08:30,480
done this for quite some
time now constantly,

222
00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:32,520
we start to see
ourselves get lost,

223
00:08:32,520 --> 00:08:34,560
and we go, oh, whoa,
whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

224
00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:36,239
Zoom out, zoom out, zoom out.

225
00:08:36,238 --> 00:08:38,408
We say that all the time
in the writers room, right.

226
00:08:38,405 --> 00:08:39,155
Zoom out, right.

227
00:08:39,155 --> 00:08:39,695
Zoom out.

228
00:08:39,690 --> 00:08:42,000
We take a step
back, take a breath,

229
00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:44,070
and go OK, what are
the big beats here.

230
00:08:44,070 --> 00:08:45,120
What's the A to B?

231
00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:48,630
Is that working because
we're going into details now

232
00:08:48,630 --> 00:08:50,890
in something's missing
from the bigger picture.

233
00:08:50,890 --> 00:08:53,300
So blurry is good right now.

234
00:08:53,304 --> 00:08:56,144


235
00:08:58,992 --> 00:09:02,682
OK, so at this point,
you know a little bit more

236
00:09:02,680 --> 00:09:03,520
about your setting.

237
00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:06,010
Hopefully a little bit
more about your characters,

238
00:09:06,010 --> 00:09:08,470
a little bit more about your
story, and your story arc.

239
00:09:08,470 --> 00:09:10,360
And I think it's
worth taking the time

240
00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:12,000
to sort of write
that down because

241
00:09:11,998 --> 00:09:13,538
right now, your
document, if it looks

242
00:09:13,540 --> 00:09:16,480
anything like our document, it's
going to be kind of messy or--

243
00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:17,010
Chaotic.

244
00:09:17,005 --> 00:09:18,295
Extremely chaotic and messy.

245
00:09:18,290 --> 00:09:19,750
So just-- I think
it's worth-- it's not

246
00:09:19,750 --> 00:09:21,540
going to be super time
consuming, this part

247
00:09:21,542 --> 00:09:24,942
of the process, but just carve
out the ideas that you don't

248
00:09:24,940 --> 00:09:27,190
need any more, focus in on
the ideas that are good,

249
00:09:27,190 --> 00:09:33,370
and just write a clean
organized one page

250
00:09:33,370 --> 00:09:37,180
description of your concept
and your idea including

251
00:09:37,180 --> 00:09:39,820
now some-- a little bit
more detail about characters

252
00:09:39,822 --> 00:09:41,532
and about the setting
that they exist in.

253
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And the antagonist.

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I mean, if you just think about
our Steve and Dustin example,

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now we haven't had a week
or so to blue sky that,

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but if we had,
imagine the details

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00:09:53,710 --> 00:09:55,360
that we could start to add here.

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00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:57,580
Who-- who is Dustin's dad?

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00:09:57,580 --> 00:09:59,950
And where exactly was
he living, and who

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are these other thieves that
are going after this treasure?

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00:10:04,300 --> 00:10:08,020
And what is it actually that
is lurking within those mines?

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00:10:08,020 --> 00:10:11,620
There were so many things
in that initial paragraph

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that we're missing that if we
had had a week of blue skying,

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we would have been able to
start to fill in those details.

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00:10:17,930 --> 00:10:19,360
And then we've got a pitch.

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00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:22,280
Yeah, right, you have
easy, easy page, easy page.

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00:10:22,283 --> 00:10:23,953
You might have a
little bit over a page.

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00:10:23,950 --> 00:10:25,370
Let's fine, a page
and a half, whatever.

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00:10:25,370 --> 00:10:27,750
But try not to make it too
long because I think it's good

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00:10:27,745 --> 00:10:29,205
to keep it, again, simple.

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00:10:29,200 --> 00:10:31,890
Stay wide, stay zoomed out.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,470


2
00:00:05,605 --> 00:00:07,235
So now that you've
got your big idea,

3
00:00:07,230 --> 00:00:09,540
it's time to move into
the outline stage.

4
00:00:09,540 --> 00:00:11,940
I know you're going to have
this feeling, this impulse,

5
00:00:11,940 --> 00:00:14,190
of, like-- you're very excited
about your idea, right?

6
00:00:14,190 --> 00:00:16,890
And you're going to want to
jump immediately into script.

7
00:00:16,890 --> 00:00:18,750
We would really
highly encourage you

8
00:00:18,750 --> 00:00:22,290
to resist that
impulse, because you're

9
00:00:22,290 --> 00:00:23,440
going to run into problems.

10
00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:25,200
That's how you get
lost in the woods.

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00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:26,990
That's how you lose
sight of where you are.

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00:00:26,992 --> 00:00:29,072
You can lose years of
your life to this process.

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00:00:29,073 --> 00:00:31,243
You can have a script that
you just can never finish

14
00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:33,570
and you end up throwing away
because you get frustrated.

15
00:00:33,573 --> 00:00:36,933
It's worth taking the time
to plan and to figure out

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00:00:36,930 --> 00:00:41,250
exactly where you're going
while you're still zoomed out,

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00:00:41,250 --> 00:00:43,530
before you dive in.

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00:00:43,530 --> 00:00:44,800
Before you really zoom in.

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00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:47,190
So that's why we're big, big
proponents of the outline.

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00:00:47,190 --> 00:00:49,860


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00:00:53,710 --> 00:00:56,140
The way we see an outline
is that it's very much--

22
00:00:56,140 --> 00:00:59,260
it's like a bird's eye
view of your script.

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00:00:59,260 --> 00:01:00,850
Sometimes we look
at a script as,

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00:01:00,850 --> 00:01:02,920
like, you're building
this house, right?

25
00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:04,780
And so looking at
your last assignment,

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00:01:04,780 --> 00:01:06,640
you have sort of a
one page foundation.

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00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:09,020
This is what you're going
to build your house on.

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00:01:09,020 --> 00:01:11,560
It's like the concrete
on the ground,

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00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:13,520
and you're going to
build up from there.

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00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:16,180
So you don't just start
throwing up beams, or walls,

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00:01:16,180 --> 00:01:18,430
or painting things,
or putting in doors.

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00:01:18,432 --> 00:01:20,892
What you're going to do, is
you're going to do a blueprint.

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00:01:20,890 --> 00:01:21,910
You're going to do a drawing.

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00:01:21,910 --> 00:01:23,240
And that's really the next step.

35
00:01:23,243 --> 00:01:25,373
And so that's what this
outline is going to be for.

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00:01:25,368 --> 00:01:27,908
It's going to let you see the
big picture before you actually

37
00:01:27,910 --> 00:01:30,520
start spending all the time
in actual construction.

38
00:01:30,518 --> 00:01:32,558
And I think, again,
you're going to have this--

39
00:01:32,560 --> 00:01:34,660
you're going to want to even
rush through this stage.

40
00:01:34,660 --> 00:01:35,740
I think you're going to have--

41
00:01:35,740 --> 00:01:37,870
the instinct is going to be,
let me get through this outline

42
00:01:37,870 --> 00:01:40,080
stage as fast as possible
so I can get to the script,

43
00:01:40,078 --> 00:01:41,798
so I can get to that
beautiful house.

44
00:01:41,800 --> 00:01:43,810
Again, we think you
should resist that.

45
00:01:43,810 --> 00:01:46,340
You should spend longer
on the outline stage

46
00:01:46,338 --> 00:01:47,378
than on the script stage.

47
00:01:47,380 --> 00:01:48,100
At least we do.

48
00:01:48,100 --> 00:01:50,640
We spend probably twice as
long on the outline stage

49
00:01:50,642 --> 00:01:51,852
as we do on the script stage.

50
00:01:51,850 --> 00:01:54,550
Because if the outline
is good and strong,

51
00:01:54,550 --> 00:01:57,490
the script is going to write
itself very, very quickly.

52
00:01:57,490 --> 00:02:00,070
Hitchcock would
come to his first day

53
00:02:00,070 --> 00:02:01,480
on set of a new movie.

54
00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:04,330
He would say, all right,
the picture's over.

55
00:02:04,330 --> 00:02:06,520
Now I just have to go
and put it on film.

56
00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:09,940
And why he's saying that is
because he's done the legwork

57
00:02:09,940 --> 00:02:10,990
prior to getting there.

58
00:02:10,990 --> 00:02:12,310
He's got his storyboards.

59
00:02:12,310 --> 00:02:14,440
He knows the lenses
he's going to use.

60
00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:16,300
He knows when he's going to cut.

61
00:02:16,300 --> 00:02:18,280
He's cast his actors.

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00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:21,070
Every major choice
has been made.

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00:02:21,070 --> 00:02:24,460
Now the filming of the
picture is almost a formality.

64
00:02:24,460 --> 00:02:27,220
And we're going to
take that and apply it

65
00:02:27,220 --> 00:02:29,830
to the script stage,
where the outline is

66
00:02:29,830 --> 00:02:32,830
where you put in all the legwork
and you make the choices.

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00:02:32,830 --> 00:02:36,060
The actual writing of
the script is more just,

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00:02:36,060 --> 00:02:37,060
you're making it pretty.

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00:02:37,060 --> 00:02:38,680
You're putting the
final touches on.

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00:02:38,680 --> 00:02:41,380
But it is like Hitchcock
with his films.

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00:02:41,380 --> 00:02:42,670
It's more of a formality.

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00:02:42,670 --> 00:02:44,590
The big decisions have
already been made.

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00:02:44,590 --> 00:02:47,390


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00:02:51,140 --> 00:02:53,830
So there are a lot of
different ways to outline.

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00:02:53,830 --> 00:02:57,130
Ross and I have, over the years,
kind of refined and developed

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00:02:57,130 --> 00:02:58,930
our own process of outlining.

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00:02:58,930 --> 00:03:01,640
We do it in two stages.

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00:03:01,640 --> 00:03:05,130
The first stage is what we
call the scaffolding outline.

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00:03:05,133 --> 00:03:06,803
It's kind of the
outline of the outline.

80
00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:09,770
It's a rougher, sketchier
version of the outline.

81
00:03:09,770 --> 00:03:13,060
So it's an even more zoomed
out version of an outline.

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00:03:13,060 --> 00:03:14,170
Say two to three pages.

83
00:03:14,170 --> 00:03:16,100
Just the big, big beats.

84
00:03:16,098 --> 00:03:18,638
But again, just like Matt was
saying with the blueprint, very

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00:03:18,640 --> 00:03:20,650
easy to adjust and move around.

86
00:03:20,650 --> 00:03:22,180
You're not in the weeds yet.

87
00:03:22,180 --> 00:03:24,090
And you want to focus
on getting that right.

88
00:03:24,090 --> 00:03:25,840
So once you get the
scaffolding outlined

89
00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:27,590
so you're really happy
with it-- you know,

90
00:03:27,590 --> 00:03:29,410
it's like just two or
three pages, right?

91
00:03:29,410 --> 00:03:32,290
Then you move into what we're
calling the final outline

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00:03:32,290 --> 00:03:32,890
stage.

93
00:03:32,890 --> 00:03:36,940
And that'll be a full, fleshed
out, more detailed outline.

94
00:03:36,940 --> 00:03:38,650
Once you get that
right, then you'll

95
00:03:38,650 --> 00:03:40,370
be ready to go
into script stage.

96
00:03:40,370 --> 00:03:43,780
So if you're scaffolding
outline is two to three pages,

97
00:03:43,780 --> 00:03:46,150
your final outline
should be anywhere

98
00:03:46,150 --> 00:03:48,580
from around 10 to
15 pages if you're

99
00:03:48,580 --> 00:03:51,500
trying to write an
hour long pilot script.

100
00:03:51,497 --> 00:03:53,077
And one thing we
would suggest is just

101
00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:55,370
to really take your time with
this part of the process,

102
00:03:55,372 --> 00:03:57,192
because if you
get this right, we

103
00:03:57,190 --> 00:03:59,800
promise you you're going
to have a good script.

104
00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:02,200
And it's also very
easy and malleable,

105
00:04:02,195 --> 00:04:03,075
like Matt was saying.

106
00:04:03,070 --> 00:04:04,900
This is the time to play around.

107
00:04:04,900 --> 00:04:06,610
You'll see, as we
go through, how

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00:04:06,605 --> 00:04:08,235
we developed "Stranger
Things," and how

109
00:04:08,230 --> 00:04:11,230
we wrote an outline for
"Stranger Things," how often we

110
00:04:11,230 --> 00:04:14,230
were changing things, moving
things around, and trying out

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00:04:14,230 --> 00:04:14,950
different scenes.

112
00:04:14,950 --> 00:04:16,780
This is the time to play around.

113
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114
00:04:23,500 --> 00:04:25,930
Before you go in and
start breaking down

115
00:04:25,930 --> 00:04:28,630
each of the storylines,
something that maybe you

116
00:04:28,630 --> 00:04:31,390
thought about in
your blue sky process

117
00:04:31,390 --> 00:04:33,130
is, how are you going
to open this story?

118
00:04:33,130 --> 00:04:35,440
Because generally what
you're going to want to have,

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00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:37,030
in most cases, is
you're going to want

120
00:04:37,030 --> 00:04:38,200
to have an opening hook.

121
00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:40,600
And an opening hook
is just something

122
00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:43,960
right away, right as you start
your script, that really--

123
00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:45,190
well, it hooks the audience.

124
00:04:45,190 --> 00:04:46,210
It draws them in.

125
00:04:46,210 --> 00:04:49,090
It's something
exciting or mysterious.

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00:04:49,090 --> 00:04:52,390
Whatever it is, it sort of
gets them into your story

127
00:04:52,390 --> 00:04:53,680
and propels them forward.

128
00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:55,660
If you think about
a famous example,

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00:04:55,660 --> 00:04:57,400
take "Raiders of the Lost Ark."

130
00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:00,870
You're starting in media res,
meaning the story's already

131
00:05:00,872 --> 00:05:02,082
in the middle of progression.

132
00:05:02,080 --> 00:05:03,290
You don't know where you are.

133
00:05:03,288 --> 00:05:04,658
You're in some sort of jungle.

134
00:05:04,660 --> 00:05:10,300
You learn that this guy
is raiding this tomb that

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00:05:10,300 --> 00:05:12,190
has all these booby
traps, and there's

136
00:05:12,190 --> 00:05:13,630
a giant rolling
boulder, and there

137
00:05:13,630 --> 00:05:14,680
are other people chasing him.

138
00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:15,730
It's all very exciting.

139
00:05:15,730 --> 00:05:17,860
He escapes on a plane.

140
00:05:17,860 --> 00:05:20,470
There's no way you're
going to stop watching,

141
00:05:20,470 --> 00:05:23,740
or stop turning those pages,
because you're enthralled.

142
00:05:23,740 --> 00:05:25,570
But you don't really
know who this guy is.

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00:05:25,570 --> 00:05:28,120
You don't know what he's
doing or what his goals are,

144
00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:29,740
and the mystery draws you in.

145
00:05:29,740 --> 00:05:31,660
Then it slows down.

146
00:05:31,660 --> 00:05:33,400
It introduces who Indy is.

147
00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:37,930
We see him at school, we
see what he's teaching.

148
00:05:37,930 --> 00:05:41,230
And then we set up the
main tension, or drive,

149
00:05:41,230 --> 00:05:44,260
of that movie, which is
to find the lost Ark.

150
00:05:44,260 --> 00:05:47,330
But those scenes, post the
beginning, are much slower.

151
00:05:47,330 --> 00:05:50,350
But what the beginning gets you
is, the audience is like, OK,

152
00:05:50,350 --> 00:05:51,010
I'm in.

153
00:05:51,010 --> 00:05:52,510
This is an exciting story.

154
00:05:52,510 --> 00:05:54,410
Now we can slow down,
we can take our time.

155
00:05:54,410 --> 00:05:56,050
We're going to tell you
who this character is.

156
00:05:56,050 --> 00:05:57,730
We're going to set
up our main drive.

157
00:05:57,730 --> 00:05:59,920
Whereas, if you take
that opening hook away,

158
00:05:59,920 --> 00:06:01,540
suddenly I'm not as invested.

159
00:06:01,540 --> 00:06:03,340
I'm just watching a
teacher at school.

160
00:06:03,340 --> 00:06:07,210
I'm not as drawn into the story.

161
00:06:07,210 --> 00:06:10,120
So that's a very elaborate
example of an opening hook.

162
00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:14,840
For "Stranger Things"
it was not so elaborate.

163
00:06:14,843 --> 00:06:16,763
MATT DUFFER: In the case
of "Stranger Things,"

164
00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:18,740
it became Hawkins National Lab.

165
00:06:18,740 --> 00:06:21,290
We see that something
mysterious is going on.

166
00:06:21,290 --> 00:06:22,520
There's alarms.

167
00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:24,470
We see that this lab
is on fire and there's

168
00:06:24,470 --> 00:06:25,850
a scientist burning.

169
00:06:25,850 --> 00:06:27,290
Later in the
shooting script, this

170
00:06:27,290 --> 00:06:29,720
changed to the scientist
being chased and killed

171
00:06:29,720 --> 00:06:31,040
by an offscreen monster.

172
00:06:33,620 --> 00:06:34,310
That's it.

173
00:06:34,310 --> 00:06:36,840
It's actually a very sort of
simple, straightforward opening

174
00:06:36,840 --> 00:06:37,340
hook.

175
00:06:37,340 --> 00:06:40,730
And then we cut to suburbia,
and we see our kids

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00:06:40,730 --> 00:06:42,260
playing Dungeons and Dragons.

177
00:06:42,260 --> 00:06:43,550
MIKE WHEELER: The Demogorgon!

178
00:06:43,550 --> 00:06:46,610
But what it gives us
is this sense of mystery.

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00:06:46,610 --> 00:06:50,090
This sense of, oh, something
bad is happening in this town.

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00:06:50,090 --> 00:06:52,430
And what does it have
to do with these kids

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00:06:52,430 --> 00:06:55,250
playing this fantasy
game in a basement?

182
00:06:55,250 --> 00:06:57,080
And so suddenly the
audience goes, oh, OK.

183
00:06:57,080 --> 00:06:59,750
This isn't just some
typical coming of age story.

184
00:06:59,750 --> 00:07:02,150
There's something more
sinister going on here.

185
00:07:02,150 --> 00:07:04,130
And it puts you on
edge a little bit,

186
00:07:04,130 --> 00:07:06,260
and it just keeps
the reader turning

187
00:07:06,260 --> 00:07:09,180
the page, which is what's so
important about an opening

188
00:07:09,180 --> 00:07:09,680
hook.

189
00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:13,060


190
00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:19,160
So when we set about writing
the outline for "Montauk,"

191
00:07:19,163 --> 00:07:20,583
or what became
"Stranger Things"--

192
00:07:20,580 --> 00:07:22,660
and this is the next thing
you should do, really--

193
00:07:22,663 --> 00:07:26,283
is break down or figure out,
what are your main storylines?

194
00:07:26,285 --> 00:07:28,415
What main storylines are
you going to be following?

195
00:07:28,410 --> 00:07:28,960
Yes.

196
00:07:28,962 --> 00:07:30,422
In the case of
"Stranger Things,"

197
00:07:30,420 --> 00:07:35,910
we identified those storylines
as Hopper, Joyce, Mike,

198
00:07:35,910 --> 00:07:37,260
and Eleven.

199
00:07:37,260 --> 00:07:39,010
Those were the four
main stories we

200
00:07:39,010 --> 00:07:41,010
were going to be following
in the pilot episode.

201
00:07:41,010 --> 00:07:43,170
And then so what we
basically start doing

202
00:07:43,170 --> 00:07:46,590
is we just break down the
beats of each of those stories.

203
00:07:46,588 --> 00:07:48,628
We're not showing you the
order of the pilot yet.

204
00:07:48,630 --> 00:07:50,220
We're just going,
OK, let's take Hopper

205
00:07:50,220 --> 00:07:52,140
and let's see what are
the beats of his story?

206
00:07:52,137 --> 00:07:55,407
And we just go through that with
each of our main storylines.

207
00:07:55,402 --> 00:07:56,862
Now there's a
good question here,

208
00:07:56,860 --> 00:07:58,850
which is how many
storylines should you have?

209
00:07:58,850 --> 00:08:00,600
And I guess it just
depends on your story.

210
00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:02,220
So we found with
"Stranger Things"

211
00:08:02,220 --> 00:08:04,320
that four is kind
of the sweet spot.

212
00:08:04,320 --> 00:08:06,750
If we start following
more than four storylines,

213
00:08:06,750 --> 00:08:08,910
it starts to get muddled,
because you're away

214
00:08:08,910 --> 00:08:10,970
from a storyline for too long.

215
00:08:10,973 --> 00:08:12,393
Like we have five
storylines, that

216
00:08:12,390 --> 00:08:14,970
means you're away from
Eleven for too long,

217
00:08:14,970 --> 00:08:17,640
and you can't get hooked or
engaged by her storyline,

218
00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:19,390
because you're away
from her for too long.

219
00:08:19,390 --> 00:08:21,120
So four is kind
of our sweet spot.

220
00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:22,770
We try to limit it to that.

221
00:08:22,770 --> 00:08:25,620
But you may also have a
story where you really

222
00:08:25,620 --> 00:08:27,670
have just one major storyline.

223
00:08:27,670 --> 00:08:30,090
I mean, if you look at "Breaking
Bad" for instance, right?

224
00:08:30,090 --> 00:08:34,290
You've got Walter White, who's
a really strong A-storyline.

225
00:08:34,289 --> 00:08:35,889
It's less of an
ensemble show than us.

226
00:08:35,887 --> 00:08:38,427
So if you are "Breaking Bad,"
you're going to have a Walter

227
00:08:38,429 --> 00:08:40,739
White as your A-storyline
most of the time,

228
00:08:40,740 --> 00:08:43,170
and he's going to be
really leading the charge.

229
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And then you're going
to have a subplot or two

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00:08:45,210 --> 00:08:47,370
that are much less
intricate that you're

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00:08:47,370 --> 00:08:48,570
sort of weaving throughout.

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00:08:48,570 --> 00:08:49,980
But what we're going
to talk to you about

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00:08:49,980 --> 00:08:51,330
is how we do "Stranger Things."

234
00:08:51,330 --> 00:08:54,000
Which, again, in this case
of the pilot, it's really--

235
00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:56,100
while there are additional
little other scenes,

236
00:08:56,100 --> 00:08:57,330
like with the scientists--

237
00:08:57,330 --> 00:08:57,900
Nancy.

238
00:08:57,900 --> 00:09:00,810
And Nancy-- the main
storylines are these four.

239
00:09:00,810 --> 00:09:02,820
And we're going to go
through how we broke down

240
00:09:02,820 --> 00:09:04,950
each of those four storylines.

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00:09:04,950 --> 00:09:07,080
MATT DUFFER: First we
zero in on Hopper, OK?

242
00:09:07,080 --> 00:09:10,560
And then we figure out, what
are the beats within his story?

243
00:09:10,560 --> 00:09:11,700
What is a story beat?

244
00:09:11,700 --> 00:09:13,980
A story beat is
basically a scene.

245
00:09:13,980 --> 00:09:17,730
Hopper, in the pilot, has five
story beats, or five scenes.

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00:09:17,725 --> 00:09:19,355
ROSS DUFFER: So you
just go by letters.

247
00:09:19,350 --> 00:09:22,770
Like, A, B, C, D,
E. And the key here

248
00:09:22,770 --> 00:09:27,120
is that each story beat
leads directly to the next.

249
00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:31,020
So the end of story
beat A is setting up

250
00:09:31,020 --> 00:09:32,970
what story beat B is.

251
00:09:32,970 --> 00:09:37,920
Story beat B goes to
C, C to D, D to E.

252
00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:41,010
And hopefully the
most exciting moment

253
00:09:41,010 --> 00:09:45,000
happens on E. So what happens is
then, when these storylines all

254
00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:47,310
go together, all the
big exciting moments--

255
00:09:47,308 --> 00:09:47,848
They build.

256
00:09:47,850 --> 00:09:49,560
--it just gets more
and more intense.

257
00:09:49,560 --> 00:09:52,380
It builds, and builds, and
everyone's most exciting story

258
00:09:52,380 --> 00:09:54,210
beat is at the end
of the episode.

259
00:09:54,210 --> 00:09:56,640
And it has this sort
of crescendoing effect,

260
00:09:56,640 --> 00:10:00,000
and it gives you the climax
to this particular episode.

261
00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:01,760
If you imagine
you're stacking them,

262
00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:04,260
they should be building on one
another, like Ross is saying.

263
00:10:04,260 --> 00:10:06,990
But it should have this
sort of forward momentum.

264
00:10:06,990 --> 00:10:09,030
You should never be
paddling in place.

265
00:10:09,030 --> 00:10:10,740
If scene B is doing
the same thing

266
00:10:10,740 --> 00:10:14,340
as seen A, or scene
D has looped back

267
00:10:14,340 --> 00:10:15,950
and is doing the
same thing as A,

268
00:10:15,950 --> 00:10:17,580
the audience is going
to get impatient.

269
00:10:17,580 --> 00:10:19,890
It's just like you're
treading water.

270
00:10:19,890 --> 00:10:21,900
So you want it to have--

271
00:10:21,902 --> 00:10:24,362
you want it-- this is something
at least Ross and I do-- we

272
00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:25,900
always want it moving forward.

273
00:10:25,900 --> 00:10:27,560
We want it pushing forward.

274
00:10:27,562 --> 00:10:29,522
And we'll show you a
little bit how we did that

275
00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:30,560
with each of our stories.

276
00:10:30,562 --> 00:10:33,802


277
00:10:37,150 --> 00:10:38,670
So, you know, especially--

278
00:10:38,670 --> 00:10:41,340
I mean, this is really a little
bit more specific to pilot,

279
00:10:41,340 --> 00:10:43,710
but beat A, really
you're just going

280
00:10:43,710 --> 00:10:45,090
to be introducing
your character.

281
00:10:45,090 --> 00:10:45,600
That's it.

282
00:10:45,602 --> 00:10:47,312
Just introduce your
character, and that's

283
00:10:47,310 --> 00:10:48,340
the first scene you're going
to be introducing them.

284
00:10:48,340 --> 00:10:49,570
Just seeing them
in their normal life.

285
00:10:49,570 --> 00:10:50,700
This is who this person is.

286
00:10:50,700 --> 00:10:52,080
If they're already
in action, then we're

287
00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:54,390
not going to even understand
who this character is.

288
00:10:54,390 --> 00:10:57,450
So let's just take it nice and
slow and just be, like, hey,

289
00:10:57,450 --> 00:10:58,370
this is Mike Wheeler.

290
00:10:58,368 --> 00:11:00,158
He's a nerdy kid who
likes to play Dungeons

291
00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:01,650
and Dragons with his friends.

292
00:11:01,650 --> 00:11:02,580
That's a beat.

293
00:11:02,580 --> 00:11:04,680
You don't need to
do more than that.

294
00:11:04,680 --> 00:11:07,590
Beat B is usually
the inciting incident.

295
00:11:07,590 --> 00:11:09,810
And the inciting
incident is important.

296
00:11:09,810 --> 00:11:12,660
That's what's going to set
your character in motion.

297
00:11:12,660 --> 00:11:15,060
So something is going to happen.

298
00:11:15,060 --> 00:11:17,160
Something a little bit
out of the ordinary

299
00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:19,700
that's not something that
happens every day to them.

300
00:11:19,698 --> 00:11:21,988
In the case of "Stranger
Things," the inciting incident

301
00:11:21,990 --> 00:11:24,750
for most of all of our
characters, Will goes missing.

302
00:11:24,750 --> 00:11:26,270
They learn a boy
has gone missing.

303
00:11:26,272 --> 00:11:27,482
That's the inciting incident.

304
00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:29,520
It's really what we
talked about earlier, which

305
00:11:29,522 --> 00:11:30,812
is the drive.

306
00:11:30,810 --> 00:11:35,520
The main drive of your storyline
needs to kick in around here.

307
00:11:35,520 --> 00:11:39,330
Something goes wrong, they're
set on some sort of task.

308
00:11:39,330 --> 00:11:41,880
You need to find the lost
Ark, if you're Indiana Jones.

309
00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:44,690
Whatever it is, that's
happening around here.

310
00:11:44,687 --> 00:11:46,017
This is getting the second beat.

311
00:11:46,020 --> 00:11:49,080
So we've hooked the audience,
we've introduced our character,

312
00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:50,950
and now something's happening.

313
00:11:50,952 --> 00:11:52,412
Something's changing
in their life.

314
00:11:52,410 --> 00:11:54,300
Someone's been kidnapped.

315
00:11:54,300 --> 00:11:55,740
There's a murder
that's happened.

316
00:11:55,740 --> 00:11:58,080
Whatever it is in your
story, something's

317
00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:01,140
kicking off your
character's drive.

318
00:12:01,140 --> 00:12:03,280
And now it's like
they have a goal

319
00:12:03,278 --> 00:12:04,568
that they're trying to achieve.

320
00:12:04,570 --> 00:12:06,740
Which, in the case, of
course, of "Stranger Things,"

321
00:12:06,737 --> 00:12:07,967
is Will's gone missing.

322
00:12:07,963 --> 00:12:08,883
We've got to find him.

323
00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:11,880
So the minute Will disappears,
that's our inciting incident,

324
00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:14,460
and it's going to end up
kicking off the drive for all

325
00:12:14,460 --> 00:12:15,590
of our characters.

326
00:12:15,592 --> 00:12:17,552
So in B you've set up
your inciting incident.

327
00:12:17,550 --> 00:12:18,630
You've set up your drive.

328
00:12:18,630 --> 00:12:20,670
You set up, kind of, the main
tension for your character.

329
00:12:20,670 --> 00:12:21,870
The "let's find Will."

330
00:12:21,870 --> 00:12:25,650
So then obviously C is going to
be starting to look for Will.

331
00:12:25,650 --> 00:12:28,290
Your first simple beat
of the search for Will,

332
00:12:28,290 --> 00:12:30,680
usually in the case
of "Stranger Things,"

333
00:12:30,683 --> 00:12:32,853
they're going to take the
most obvious avenue first.

334
00:12:32,850 --> 00:12:34,420
OK, well, where was he last?

335
00:12:34,417 --> 00:12:35,247
He was in the woods.

336
00:12:35,250 --> 00:12:37,440
So you're going to have a scene
of them searching the woods.

337
00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:38,040
Whatever.

338
00:12:38,040 --> 00:12:39,750
And then he's not
going to be there.

339
00:12:39,750 --> 00:12:40,500
Obviously, right?

340
00:12:40,500 --> 00:12:41,670
So they're going
to be, like, oh,

341
00:12:41,670 --> 00:12:43,830
this isn't as simple as we
thought it was going to be.

342
00:12:43,830 --> 00:12:45,840
Beat D, they're going to
have to take a detour,

343
00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:47,820
go a little bit deeper
into their search.

344
00:12:47,820 --> 00:12:50,310
And eventually that's going
to lead to the final beat,

345
00:12:50,310 --> 00:12:54,210
E, which, as Ross said, is going
to be the most exciting beat.

346
00:12:54,210 --> 00:12:56,580
So hopefully it's something
a little bit surprising.

347
00:12:56,580 --> 00:12:59,640
Like the search for Will
leads to something surprising.

348
00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:01,980
In the case of, like,
Mike and the boys,

349
00:13:01,980 --> 00:13:03,420
it's discovering Eleven.

350
00:13:03,420 --> 00:13:04,450
That's a turn.

351
00:13:04,450 --> 00:13:06,030
It's not what they expected.

352
00:13:06,030 --> 00:13:07,410
So they have their drive now.

353
00:13:07,410 --> 00:13:09,780
They're going to try,
initially, with beat C,

354
00:13:09,780 --> 00:13:11,570
do whatever is the most obvious.

355
00:13:11,568 --> 00:13:13,858
And then we're going to throw
an obstacle in their way.

356
00:13:13,860 --> 00:13:18,240
That obvious solution, obviously
doesn't lead them to Will.

357
00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:20,370
But they learn
something else, or find

358
00:13:20,370 --> 00:13:23,220
something else, that then
leads to the next beat.

359
00:13:23,220 --> 00:13:24,810
We throw a new obstacle.

360
00:13:24,810 --> 00:13:27,540
Well, we can't find
Will in this way.

361
00:13:27,535 --> 00:13:28,415
It's not that simple.

362
00:13:28,410 --> 00:13:30,960
But then, like Matt's saying,
something surprising happens.

363
00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:31,830
They find Eleven.

364
00:13:31,830 --> 00:13:33,720
And you go, OK, well--

365
00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:35,760
you're leaving the
audience on this sort

366
00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:39,130
of a bit of a cliffhanger
of, OK, who is this girl?

367
00:13:39,125 --> 00:13:41,255
What does she have to do
with Will's disappearance?

368
00:13:41,250 --> 00:13:42,900
They're intrigued to keep going.

369
00:13:42,900 --> 00:13:44,940
And you just keep
building on it from there.

370
00:13:44,940 --> 00:13:45,900
New obstacles.

371
00:13:45,900 --> 00:13:47,310
What happens next with Eleven?

372
00:13:47,310 --> 00:13:48,810
Well, she clearly
knows something,

373
00:13:48,810 --> 00:13:50,100
but she won't tell our boys.

374
00:13:50,100 --> 00:13:51,920
There's a new obstacle.

375
00:13:51,920 --> 00:13:53,520
So we just keep
throwing obstacles,

376
00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:55,710
and you just keep building
on it, beat, after beat,

377
00:13:55,710 --> 00:13:56,520
after beat.

378
00:13:56,520 --> 00:13:59,350
So the boys, what do
they find in the woods?

379
00:13:59,350 --> 00:14:01,890
They don't find Will,
which is an obstacle.

380
00:14:01,890 --> 00:14:02,670
He's not here.

381
00:14:02,670 --> 00:14:05,910
But they find this mysterious
girl, Eleven, in the woods.

382
00:14:05,910 --> 00:14:08,280
And that really
becomes a cliffhanger

383
00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:10,410
to their story, which
ends our episode.

384
00:14:10,410 --> 00:14:13,500
And it makes the audience want
to find out what happens next.

385
00:14:13,500 --> 00:14:14,820
Who is this girl?

386
00:14:14,820 --> 00:14:18,160
So a cliffhanger-- that's really
what a cliffhanger can do.

387
00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:19,390
We're not giving answers yet.

388
00:14:19,390 --> 00:14:21,390
We're not telling the
audience who this girl is.

389
00:14:21,390 --> 00:14:24,510
We're not even finishing what
that scene was in the woods.

390
00:14:24,510 --> 00:14:27,730
They just spot this girl,
and we just cut out.

391
00:14:27,730 --> 00:14:29,730
And hopefully you're
leaving the audience going,

392
00:14:29,730 --> 00:14:32,190
oh, I want to find
out what happens next.

393
00:14:32,190 --> 00:14:35,550
I want to see how these
boys interact with this girl.

394
00:14:35,550 --> 00:14:37,560
I want to know, does this
girl have the answers

395
00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:38,600
to what happened to Will?

396
00:14:38,602 --> 00:14:43,232
So we cut it off short
before we get the answers

397
00:14:43,230 --> 00:14:44,320
to any of those questions.

398
00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:45,780
So that means the
audience is going

399
00:14:45,780 --> 00:14:47,490
to want to continue
the story and they're

400
00:14:47,488 --> 00:14:49,918
going to want to watch,
hopefully, episode two.

401
00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:51,400
We try to enter
episodes at a point

402
00:14:51,402 --> 00:14:53,612
where the audience is just
going to really want more.

403
00:14:53,610 --> 00:14:55,290
They're going to
want answers to what

404
00:14:55,290 --> 00:14:57,510
happened in the final scene.

405
00:14:57,510 --> 00:15:00,240
I mean, sometimes we do more
of a classic cliffhanger,

406
00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:03,990
where we leave a
character in grave danger.

407
00:15:03,990 --> 00:15:05,300
So we did this in season one.

408
00:15:05,295 --> 00:15:07,445
I think it was
episode five, when

409
00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:09,540
Nancy crossed through a tree.

410
00:15:09,540 --> 00:15:11,790
She's searching for
her lost friend,

411
00:15:11,790 --> 00:15:14,660
and she finds herself trapped
inside the upside down.

412
00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:19,480
Nancy!

413
00:15:19,477 --> 00:15:21,307
MATT DUFFER: And so we
ended it right there.

414
00:15:21,310 --> 00:15:23,490
So obviously people want to
know what happens to Nancy.

415
00:15:23,490 --> 00:15:24,430
Is she going to live or not?

416
00:15:24,430 --> 00:15:25,920
So they click on
the next episode.

417
00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:28,350
The question is, is
Nancy going to survive?

418
00:15:28,350 --> 00:15:31,100
That's just a very
basic, simple question,

419
00:15:31,098 --> 00:15:32,638
but it's going to
drive your audience

420
00:15:32,640 --> 00:15:35,570
to wanting to keep finding out
what happens next in the story.

421
00:15:35,565 --> 00:15:38,725


422
00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:44,240
So now that we've talked
about a cliffhanger,

423
00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:47,520
and we've talked about generally
what these beats should do,

424
00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:51,380
we're going to step you through
what we wrote out for Hopper,

425
00:15:51,380 --> 00:15:52,790
and his beats in the storyline.

426
00:15:52,790 --> 00:15:56,630
And this is taken directly
from our scaffolding outline

427
00:15:56,630 --> 00:15:59,070
for the pilot script
that we wrote in 2014.

428
00:15:59,070 --> 00:15:59,570
Right.

429
00:15:59,570 --> 00:16:01,400
So here it is.

430
00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:05,990
Hopper, story beat A. We say,
"see him at his shitty shack

431
00:16:05,990 --> 00:16:08,870
by the ocean, drinking, et
cetera, pictures of family,

432
00:16:08,870 --> 00:16:10,320
he's clearly fucked up.

433
00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:12,230
See him getting to
work and dealing

434
00:16:12,230 --> 00:16:16,490
with normal, simple
town stuff/deputy."

435
00:16:16,490 --> 00:16:18,800
Again, like we
said before, story

436
00:16:18,800 --> 00:16:21,710
beat A should really be just
introducing this character.

437
00:16:21,710 --> 00:16:24,170
So this is how we decided
it was best to introduce,

438
00:16:24,170 --> 00:16:25,700
Hopper which is just--

439
00:16:25,700 --> 00:16:27,630
we set up his home life.

440
00:16:27,630 --> 00:16:30,950
We hint at the fact that
he used to have a family.

441
00:16:30,950 --> 00:16:33,170
But again, we're not
giving answers to that yet.

442
00:16:33,170 --> 00:16:35,960
But we're just foreshadowing
what's going to come later.

443
00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:37,670
And then we see him
in his normal life.

444
00:16:37,670 --> 00:16:39,140
And the scene
doesn't have to even

445
00:16:39,140 --> 00:16:41,240
have dialogue, which is
the instance of Hopper's

446
00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:41,900
introduction.

447
00:16:41,900 --> 00:16:43,860
We're showing it
purely visually.

448
00:16:43,860 --> 00:16:45,740
So let's look at
story beat B, which is--

449
00:16:45,740 --> 00:16:50,120
so Hopper's next scene is, he
"learns about disappearance."

450
00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:51,860
That's all we wrote.

451
00:16:51,860 --> 00:16:54,230
Again, you can be very simple
here in the scaffolding.

452
00:16:54,233 --> 00:16:56,403
You don't have to figure
out how he learns about it.

453
00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:58,070
You don't have to
figure out that scene.

454
00:16:58,067 --> 00:16:58,847
In fact, don't.

455
00:16:58,850 --> 00:16:59,990
That's what he's
going to be doing.

456
00:16:59,990 --> 00:17:01,910
And that, of course, is
the inciting incident

457
00:17:01,910 --> 00:17:03,060
that we were talking
about earlier.

458
00:17:03,060 --> 00:17:04,190
He learns about a disappearance.

459
00:17:04,190 --> 00:17:05,720
This is something
a little bit out

460
00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:08,190
of the ordinary
that comes his way.

461
00:17:08,190 --> 00:17:09,830
And again, if you
have more ideas,

462
00:17:09,827 --> 00:17:11,867
if you have an idea for
what that scene would be,

463
00:17:11,869 --> 00:17:13,369
sure, jot it down.

464
00:17:13,369 --> 00:17:16,099
But we recommend not getting
lost in the woods here.

465
00:17:16,099 --> 00:17:17,849
He learns about
his disappearance.

466
00:17:17,849 --> 00:17:20,749
You can see how simple
and bare bones that is.

467
00:17:20,750 --> 00:17:22,090
Baby steps.

468
00:17:22,088 --> 00:17:23,628
And then we go into
Hopper story beat

469
00:17:23,630 --> 00:17:26,360
C. We go into just a tiny
bit more detail here.

470
00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:29,599
We say he "investigates
scene of the fallen bike.

471
00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:31,520
No sign of Will anywhere.

472
00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:33,740
Sees strange town car."

473
00:17:33,740 --> 00:17:35,870
So, again, as we
mentioned earlier,

474
00:17:35,870 --> 00:17:39,350
story beat C is he's learned
about the disappearance.

475
00:17:39,350 --> 00:17:41,360
This is Hopper's
inciting incidents.

476
00:17:41,360 --> 00:17:43,730
He now has to find
this boy, right?

477
00:17:43,728 --> 00:17:45,018
And so what is his first thing?

478
00:17:45,020 --> 00:17:47,780
He's going to go look
where he first disappeared.

479
00:17:47,780 --> 00:17:49,910
He finds his bike,
but not much else.

480
00:17:49,910 --> 00:17:51,170
Very simple beat.

481
00:17:51,170 --> 00:17:54,710
And then beat D is him
continuing his investigation.

482
00:17:54,710 --> 00:17:56,960
Ideally C would lead
a little better to D

483
00:17:56,960 --> 00:17:59,810
than we have right now, but
anyway, he goes to look at--

484
00:17:59,813 --> 00:18:00,983
But actually, you know what?

485
00:18:00,980 --> 00:18:03,560
It did work in the
show, because he got--

486
00:18:03,560 --> 00:18:05,590
he goes there,
and Hopper doesn't

487
00:18:05,585 --> 00:18:06,715
think this is very serious.

488
00:18:06,710 --> 00:18:09,000
He thinks Will has
just, like, run off.

489
00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:09,500
Right?

490
00:18:09,500 --> 00:18:11,810
But he goes to the woods,
and he gets a bad feeling.

491
00:18:11,810 --> 00:18:14,750
Something occurs there that
makes him a little bit uneasy.

492
00:18:14,750 --> 00:18:16,280
Why would he just
abandon his bike?

493
00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:18,260
Boys don't just
leave their bikes.

494
00:18:18,260 --> 00:18:20,510
So now he's starting to go
take this a little bit more

495
00:18:20,510 --> 00:18:21,350
seriously.

496
00:18:21,350 --> 00:18:23,990
That takes him back
to Joyce's house.

497
00:18:23,990 --> 00:18:27,920
And so story beat D. So this
is the fourth scene for Hopper.

498
00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:29,960
He "speaks with
Joyce at her house,

499
00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:32,660
finds something strange."

500
00:18:32,660 --> 00:18:34,010
Again, we're really vague here.

501
00:18:34,010 --> 00:18:35,620
We didn't spend
time brainstorming

502
00:18:35,618 --> 00:18:37,908
what it is he finds strange
because that doesn't really

503
00:18:37,910 --> 00:18:38,870
matter right now.

504
00:18:38,870 --> 00:18:40,950
But we're hinting
that maybe there's--

505
00:18:40,950 --> 00:18:42,770
we're going to
introduce something

506
00:18:42,770 --> 00:18:44,720
vaguely supernatural here.

507
00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:45,980
Again, we're just--

508
00:18:45,980 --> 00:18:48,950
Hopper is going from,
oh, this kid's missing,

509
00:18:48,950 --> 00:18:50,870
I better go look for
him, to, OK, this

510
00:18:50,870 --> 00:18:53,450
is starting to escalate
into something serious.

511
00:18:53,450 --> 00:18:55,020
And he's starting
to get concerned.

512
00:18:55,020 --> 00:18:56,630
And then we go
into Hopper's story

513
00:18:56,630 --> 00:18:58,340
beat E. Let's see what we wrote.

514
00:18:58,340 --> 00:19:01,340
"Maybe they begin to sweep
the ocean for a body,

515
00:19:01,340 --> 00:19:03,320
but Sheriff is skeptical.

516
00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:05,570
Sees town car from
earlier again.

517
00:19:05,570 --> 00:19:07,520
Follows it to the radio tower.

518
00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:09,350
The hell is going on in there?

519
00:19:09,350 --> 00:19:10,460
Beginning of a mystery."

520
00:19:10,460 --> 00:19:14,540
Now, if you've seen the show,
and you remember the pilot

521
00:19:14,540 --> 00:19:18,350
episode, a lot of this didn't
actually happen in the pilot.

522
00:19:18,350 --> 00:19:21,110
But this was what we
wrote in the script,

523
00:19:21,110 --> 00:19:22,850
and this is what
we sold to Netflix,

524
00:19:22,850 --> 00:19:25,640
is that we wanted to
get Hopper to the point

525
00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:29,480
where he was starting to sense
that this is somehow connected

526
00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:30,650
to this lab.

527
00:19:30,650 --> 00:19:34,550
And what ended up happening as
we were developing this show,

528
00:19:34,550 --> 00:19:36,620
is we started to
slow some beats down.

529
00:19:36,620 --> 00:19:40,130
For instance, we have Barb get
taken at the end of the pilot

530
00:19:40,130 --> 00:19:40,920
as well.

531
00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:42,950
We were moving things
a little faster

532
00:19:42,950 --> 00:19:45,380
than we needed to once we
really got into the story.

533
00:19:45,380 --> 00:19:48,020
And we started to push some
of that, including this,

534
00:19:48,020 --> 00:19:49,220
to later episodes.

535
00:19:49,220 --> 00:19:50,840
And what we ended
up doing is just--

536
00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:53,180
he is unnerved, as Matt says.

537
00:19:53,180 --> 00:19:54,500
He's getting concerned.

538
00:19:54,500 --> 00:19:56,600
But instead of
doing a story beat

539
00:19:56,600 --> 00:19:59,210
where he's connecting
to the lab already,

540
00:19:59,210 --> 00:20:03,330
we just reveal that his
daughter has passed away.

541
00:20:03,330 --> 00:20:05,330
So we just ended up
revealing character for him,

542
00:20:05,330 --> 00:20:06,620
as opposed to story.

543
00:20:06,620 --> 00:20:09,800
But either way, I think what's
important to take away here

544
00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:12,950
is how simple these
beats start out.

545
00:20:12,950 --> 00:20:14,240
Just a couple lines.

546
00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:17,840
Or in some cases-- "learns
about disappearance--" one line.

547
00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:19,970
Very, very simple beats.

548
00:20:19,970 --> 00:20:22,130
And also, it's
actually surprising

549
00:20:22,130 --> 00:20:23,360
how little time you have.

550
00:20:23,360 --> 00:20:24,860
Not a lot has happened here.

551
00:20:24,860 --> 00:20:28,040
We set up the character, we
get him started on his journey,

552
00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:30,110
he senses something
bad is happening,

553
00:20:30,110 --> 00:20:34,040
we reveal a little bit about
his backstory, that's it.

554
00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:37,550
That's plenty to do
for Hopper's storyline.

555
00:20:37,550 --> 00:20:39,400
We're trying to
tell you generally

556
00:20:39,397 --> 00:20:40,977
what these beach
should be, but you're

557
00:20:40,980 --> 00:20:42,440
story is going to dictate stuff.

558
00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:45,170
We spend a long time, when we
are learning to write, going,

559
00:20:45,165 --> 00:20:45,665
oh!

560
00:20:45,665 --> 00:20:48,935
The inciting incident has
to happen here on page 15!

561
00:20:48,930 --> 00:20:51,020
And you're just going
to end up forcing it.

562
00:20:51,020 --> 00:20:53,570
As long as the story is
flowing, you're going to be OK.

563
00:20:53,570 --> 00:20:57,650
So, again, stay zoomed out, keep
working it, and go from there.

564
00:20:57,650 --> 00:21:00,580


565
00:21:03,442 --> 00:21:05,402
So once you've written
out all the main beats

566
00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:06,960
for your characters,
the next step

567
00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:09,360
is to do what we call a weave.

568
00:21:09,360 --> 00:21:12,250
So this is where we weave
all the storylines together,

569
00:21:12,253 --> 00:21:13,923
because obviously
they're separated out.

570
00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:15,930
We just have Hopper,
separated from Joyce,

571
00:21:15,930 --> 00:21:17,500
separated from Eleven.

572
00:21:17,500 --> 00:21:18,810
So what you want to do is--

573
00:21:18,810 --> 00:21:19,080
This part's fun.

574
00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:21,210
--you want to weave
those stories together.

575
00:21:21,210 --> 00:21:22,800
And so all you're
going to be doing--

576
00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,380
roughly the story
will be dictating

577
00:21:25,380 --> 00:21:26,700
which scenes should go first.

578
00:21:26,700 --> 00:21:29,460
But you're going to play around
with scene order as you go,

579
00:21:29,460 --> 00:21:31,360
and just kind of
feel out pacing.

580
00:21:31,360 --> 00:21:31,860
Yeah.

581
00:21:31,860 --> 00:21:33,420
And then you'll
read it through.

582
00:21:33,420 --> 00:21:35,220
Pacing will be off,
you'll reshuffle it,

583
00:21:35,220 --> 00:21:36,250
read it through again.

584
00:21:36,250 --> 00:21:38,010
This is why it's
good that everything

585
00:21:38,010 --> 00:21:39,960
is bare bones and
really simple right now.

586
00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:43,980
It's very easy to just cut,
paste, and move it around.

587
00:21:43,980 --> 00:21:45,540
Like a little shuffle board.

588
00:21:45,540 --> 00:21:47,790
You can look at
what we did here.

589
00:21:47,790 --> 00:21:52,140
We start with Mike, A. Then
Hopper A, then Joyce A. Then

590
00:21:52,140 --> 00:21:55,110
it goes to Mike B, and
Joyce and Hopper B.

591
00:21:55,110 --> 00:21:57,540
And what's interesting
about our--

592
00:21:57,540 --> 00:22:00,450
structurally, the one thing
that's unique, I would say,

593
00:22:00,450 --> 00:22:04,410
about our pilot is then we go,
Eleven A. So we're waiting.

594
00:22:04,410 --> 00:22:06,570
Eleven doesn't really come
in through about halfway

595
00:22:06,570 --> 00:22:07,320
through the story.

596
00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:10,350
Once we've kicked off
everyone else's storylines,

597
00:22:10,350 --> 00:22:11,400
then she comes in.

598
00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:14,240
Then we do Mike C. And
then we go back to Eleven.

599
00:22:14,235 --> 00:22:15,875
Eleven B. And so
what we're doing

600
00:22:15,870 --> 00:22:18,090
is we're just taking
those beats that we've

601
00:22:18,090 --> 00:22:19,670
written for each
character, and we're

602
00:22:19,668 --> 00:22:21,208
putting them together
and making sure

603
00:22:21,210 --> 00:22:23,790
that this whole thing
flows as a story.

604
00:22:23,790 --> 00:22:26,520
I would say normally,
like when we first do it--

605
00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:28,350
say we have four
storylines, right?

606
00:22:28,350 --> 00:22:32,940
It usually goes AAAA, and then
you returned to the first A.

607
00:22:32,940 --> 00:22:35,130
Then you go BBBB.

608
00:22:35,130 --> 00:22:36,220
Then CCCC.

609
00:22:36,220 --> 00:22:37,140
Then DDDD.

610
00:22:37,140 --> 00:22:38,940
EEEE.

611
00:22:38,940 --> 00:22:42,210
And usually it never
breaks down that simply.

612
00:22:42,210 --> 00:22:45,510
And you'll see,
for pacing reasons,

613
00:22:45,510 --> 00:22:47,790
you may not want to order
it exactly like that.

614
00:22:47,790 --> 00:22:51,990
For instance, we held off, as
Ross was saying, on Eleven.

615
00:22:51,990 --> 00:22:53,940
Again it's not a science.

616
00:22:53,940 --> 00:22:57,750
But I would say,
whatever A is, whatever--

617
00:22:57,750 --> 00:22:59,610
A being one of
your main character

618
00:22:59,610 --> 00:23:03,300
storylines, and generally
what you want that to be is--

619
00:23:03,300 --> 00:23:05,500
even on something like
"Stranger Things,"

620
00:23:05,497 --> 00:23:07,077
we're going to have
a storyline that's

621
00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:08,550
weighted a little
more heavily, I

622
00:23:08,550 --> 00:23:10,590
would say, than the
other storylines.

623
00:23:10,590 --> 00:23:13,180
And that's going to be
dependent, episode to episode.

624
00:23:13,180 --> 00:23:15,480
So for this one, we're
starting with the kids.

625
00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:17,910
With Mike and DandD.
That storyline

626
00:23:17,910 --> 00:23:20,160
is weighted just a
little more heavily

627
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:23,220
than the Joyce and Hopper
and Eleven storylines.

628
00:23:23,220 --> 00:23:25,650
That way we know, when
we go back to that

629
00:23:25,650 --> 00:23:28,200
and their storyline is moving
a little further and faster

630
00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:30,660
than everyone else's, it just
gives it a little bit more

631
00:23:30,660 --> 00:23:32,620
of an engine as
you move forward.

632
00:23:32,620 --> 00:23:35,110
And I think something
else we think about--

633
00:23:35,110 --> 00:23:38,520
again, we initially
start AAAA, BBBB--

634
00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:40,620
but sometimes those
shuffle around.

635
00:23:40,620 --> 00:23:43,050
And the reason is, something
you want to think about--

636
00:23:43,050 --> 00:23:45,090
or we do quite a
bit-- is just want

637
00:23:45,090 --> 00:23:49,080
scenes to juxtapose in energy.

638
00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:51,030
I'm sure you've seen
movies or shows where

639
00:23:51,030 --> 00:23:53,550
it's just action scene
after action scene

640
00:23:53,550 --> 00:23:54,940
after action scene.

641
00:23:54,940 --> 00:23:57,330
And it kind of wears you down,
and you start zoning out,

642
00:23:57,330 --> 00:23:59,250
and you're not excited,
even though the action

643
00:23:59,247 --> 00:24:01,017
in and of itself is exciting.

644
00:24:01,017 --> 00:24:02,847
There's amazing visual
effects, or whatever.

645
00:24:02,850 --> 00:24:04,410
But you just kind
of get worn down.

646
00:24:04,410 --> 00:24:06,180
And then there's
the opposite, where

647
00:24:06,180 --> 00:24:09,330
you have three long
talky scenes in a row,

648
00:24:09,330 --> 00:24:10,740
and you start to fall asleep.

649
00:24:10,740 --> 00:24:13,330
And people are going to change
the channel at that point.

650
00:24:13,330 --> 00:24:15,140
So what we want to do is--

651
00:24:15,140 --> 00:24:17,790
you don't want the
energy of every scene

652
00:24:17,790 --> 00:24:18,860
to be exactly the same.

653
00:24:18,855 --> 00:24:20,985
And that's going to help
you figure out your order.

654
00:24:20,980 --> 00:24:22,690
So you'll read it
through, and you'll go,

655
00:24:22,688 --> 00:24:25,918
oh, I don't know if I want
these two monologues right

656
00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:26,730
next to each other.

657
00:24:26,730 --> 00:24:29,300
But maybe that monologue
will sit really nicely

658
00:24:29,295 --> 00:24:30,425
after that exciting action.

659
00:24:30,420 --> 00:24:32,310
Or maybe after that
monologue, let's

660
00:24:32,310 --> 00:24:34,410
go to a really energetic
action sequence,

661
00:24:34,410 --> 00:24:37,380
or a really scary sequence,
to give the audience a jolt.

662
00:24:37,380 --> 00:24:40,350
I think you can just-- we're
real big advocates of just

663
00:24:40,350 --> 00:24:42,840
kind of feeling it
out at this stage.

664
00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:44,970
You'll sense when it's
starting to get bored.

665
00:24:44,970 --> 00:24:47,770
I mean, one thing that we do,
is we just read it through.

666
00:24:47,770 --> 00:24:49,890
And if my eyes are
starting to glaze a little

667
00:24:49,890 --> 00:24:51,870
bit, or I just
lose focus in terms

668
00:24:51,870 --> 00:24:54,120
of what I'm reading when I'm
reading my own material--

669
00:24:54,120 --> 00:24:56,040
I mean, you'll get bored
by your own material.

670
00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:56,820
Trust me.

671
00:24:56,820 --> 00:24:59,250
You get bored, then you
go, OK, something's wrong.

672
00:24:59,250 --> 00:25:01,890
Let me reshuffle or
rework this a little bit.

673
00:25:01,890 --> 00:25:05,300


674
00:25:07,917 --> 00:25:09,997
When all is said and
done and you've broken down

675
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:12,940
each of your beats of
your scaffolding outline,

676
00:25:12,940 --> 00:25:16,670
it should look something like
these pages here that we have.

677
00:25:16,670 --> 00:25:18,700
And as you can see
how simple it is--

678
00:25:18,700 --> 00:25:20,530
it's like a page and a half.

679
00:25:20,530 --> 00:25:24,100
Each one has four to five beats.

680
00:25:24,100 --> 00:25:26,410
Again, this isn't a
science, but you can go--

681
00:25:26,410 --> 00:25:28,210
OK, roughly if
each of these beats

682
00:25:28,210 --> 00:25:30,730
is, say, three and
a half pages, we

683
00:25:30,730 --> 00:25:32,860
can then see how
many beats you have.

684
00:25:32,860 --> 00:25:35,230
In this case, it's--

685
00:25:35,230 --> 00:25:37,870
I believe it's around 17.

686
00:25:37,870 --> 00:25:38,640
Yeah it's 17.

687
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:39,590
It's 17 beats.

688
00:25:39,590 --> 00:25:41,500
So this is the
only math we're ever

689
00:25:41,500 --> 00:25:43,750
going to suggest that
you do sometimes.

690
00:25:43,750 --> 00:25:51,220
Which is, you can go, OK,
17 times 3.5, equals 59.5.

691
00:25:51,220 --> 00:25:55,300
That means you've got about
a 60 page script, which

692
00:25:55,300 --> 00:25:57,130
is about perfect for a pilot.

693
00:25:57,130 --> 00:25:58,960
And again, it is not a science.

694
00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:01,380
It's not going to end up
exactly 59 and a half pages.

695
00:26:01,380 --> 00:26:01,880
Right.

696
00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:02,110
Right.

697
00:26:02,110 --> 00:26:03,880
Some of these beats are
going to end up short.

698
00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:04,870
But some are going to be long.

699
00:26:04,870 --> 00:26:06,940
And hopefully it's going
to be roughly like this.

700
00:26:06,940 --> 00:26:09,430
Because we've certainly
done this exercise, right?

701
00:26:09,430 --> 00:26:11,810
Where we do the
calculation and we're like,

702
00:26:11,810 --> 00:26:13,090
this episode's feeling long?

703
00:26:13,090 --> 00:26:13,660
How is it?

704
00:26:13,660 --> 00:26:16,070
And it's 200 pages, or
something ridiculous.

705
00:26:16,070 --> 00:26:17,020
And we go, whoa!

706
00:26:17,020 --> 00:26:18,190
What are we doing?

707
00:26:18,190 --> 00:26:20,120
And you have to go back
in and dive it down.

708
00:26:20,120 --> 00:26:22,410
So you don't have to
do this calculation.

709
00:26:22,405 --> 00:26:24,285
But sometimes we do it
just to give ourselves

710
00:26:24,280 --> 00:26:26,470
a sense of where we
are and making sure

711
00:26:26,470 --> 00:26:28,660
we don't end up
writing, accidentally,

712
00:26:28,660 --> 00:26:32,710
a 200 page pilot, which
obviously would not

713
00:26:32,710 --> 00:26:34,030
be a good situation.

714
00:26:34,030 --> 00:26:37,340


715
00:26:40,403 --> 00:26:41,823
So now we've
gone through how we

716
00:26:41,820 --> 00:26:44,160
built our scaffolding outline
for "Stranger Things."

717
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:45,930
I think it's worth
you taking the time

718
00:26:45,930 --> 00:26:48,670
to build a scaffolding outline
for your own script idea.

719
00:26:48,667 --> 00:26:50,247
The way you should
probably start here

720
00:26:50,250 --> 00:26:55,500
is to identify the main
storylines for your episode.

721
00:26:55,500 --> 00:26:58,830
In our case, remember, we
had four major storylines.

722
00:26:58,830 --> 00:27:02,130
And then you want to identify
the beats within each

723
00:27:02,130 --> 00:27:03,300
of those storylines.

724
00:27:03,300 --> 00:27:05,370
So start with one storyline,
and then figure out

725
00:27:05,370 --> 00:27:06,510
all the main beats.

726
00:27:06,510 --> 00:27:07,870
Probably four to five beats.

727
00:27:07,865 --> 00:27:08,495
Four to five.

728
00:27:08,490 --> 00:27:09,630
Like Eleven had three beats.

729
00:27:09,630 --> 00:27:10,260
So fewer beats.

730
00:27:10,255 --> 00:27:12,545
So it could be anywhere
from three to five beats

731
00:27:12,540 --> 00:27:14,100
for each of those storylines.

732
00:27:14,100 --> 00:27:18,960
Once you're happy with that,
then weave them together.

733
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:20,700
And then read that
weave through.

734
00:27:20,700 --> 00:27:23,250
It's probably not going to
flow perfectly the first time.

735
00:27:23,250 --> 00:27:26,220
Then reorganize it, shuffle
it around, try it again.

736
00:27:26,220 --> 00:27:27,870
Maybe you need
to delete a beat.

737
00:27:27,870 --> 00:27:31,320
Or whatever you need to do, to
try to just get this flow as

738
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:32,220
good as you can get.

739
00:27:32,220 --> 00:27:33,600
And once you've
done that, you'll

740
00:27:33,595 --> 00:27:36,445
have your scaffolding outline.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,330


2
00:00:06,180 --> 00:00:09,270
So hopefully, now, you have a
scaffolding outline that you're

3
00:00:09,270 --> 00:00:10,750
feeling pretty good about.

4
00:00:10,750 --> 00:00:11,640
That's great.

5
00:00:11,640 --> 00:00:14,830
That's a huge step toward
writing this script.

6
00:00:14,830 --> 00:00:16,590
So the next step,
really, is to take

7
00:00:16,590 --> 00:00:18,450
this scaffolding
outline and you're

8
00:00:18,450 --> 00:00:19,740
gonna start to flesh it out.

9
00:00:19,740 --> 00:00:23,090
And you're gonna create what
we call our final outline.

10
00:00:23,093 --> 00:00:25,263
So what this really does
is you're gonna take those,

11
00:00:25,260 --> 00:00:27,450
say, two pages of a
scaffolding outline

12
00:00:27,450 --> 00:00:29,820
and you're going to turn
it into 10 to 15 pages.

13
00:00:29,820 --> 00:00:31,500
So you're gonna,
basically, start

14
00:00:31,500 --> 00:00:33,480
by going in scene by scene.

15
00:00:33,480 --> 00:00:36,120
And you're gonna start
adding in a lot of details.

16
00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:38,160
You're gonna add description.

17
00:00:38,160 --> 00:00:41,670
You're gonna go into more,
the actual beats of the scene.

18
00:00:41,670 --> 00:00:44,910
You're even gonna write some
basic dialogue, if you want to.

19
00:00:44,910 --> 00:00:47,490
So you're really just starting
to make this thing come alive.

20
00:00:47,490 --> 00:00:51,460
How can I make this great
and as exciting as possible?

21
00:00:51,460 --> 00:00:53,970
So again, one scene at a time.

22
00:00:53,970 --> 00:00:57,180
Hopefully, it ends up being
around 10 to 15 pages.

23
00:00:57,180 --> 00:00:59,100
And this is what you're
gonna take to script.

24
00:00:59,100 --> 00:01:02,040
So what we'll do now is we'll
look at the final outline we

25
00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:03,330
had for "Stranger Things."

26
00:01:03,330 --> 00:01:05,160
You'll notice how messy this is.

27
00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:08,010
Like, excuse the typos, but
we-- we didn't wanna clean it up

28
00:01:08,010 --> 00:01:10,470
for you guys, because we wanted
you to see exactly how it

29
00:01:10,470 --> 00:01:11,500
was when we did it.

30
00:01:11,498 --> 00:01:13,288
This is, again, just
for you at this point.

31
00:01:13,290 --> 00:01:14,500
This is not for anybody else.

32
00:01:14,498 --> 00:01:16,138
So messy is OK.

33
00:01:16,140 --> 00:01:19,830
If you want to clean it up,
your version, that's also fine,

34
00:01:19,832 --> 00:01:22,292
if you-- especially if you're
sharing it with someone else.

35
00:01:22,290 --> 00:01:24,200
This is something
that, until now,

36
00:01:24,203 --> 00:01:26,373
we've never really shared
with anyone but ourselves.

37
00:01:26,370 --> 00:01:28,470
So this was, again, just for us.

38
00:01:28,470 --> 00:01:30,930
And it's still the process
we use to this day.

39
00:01:30,930 --> 00:01:33,420
We then, though, do clean
it up, because we do

40
00:01:33,420 --> 00:01:35,190
have to share it with Netflix.

41
00:01:35,190 --> 00:01:38,830
But this is exactly our
process, even today.

42
00:01:38,830 --> 00:01:41,950
So let's take this what-- let's
go through this first scene,

43
00:01:41,950 --> 00:01:43,080
which is the DandD scene.

44
00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:45,600
And we'll show you, you know,
in the scaffolding outline,

45
00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:48,870
it was, essentially,
kids play DandD. And now,

46
00:01:48,870 --> 00:01:50,130
let's see what it's become.

47
00:01:50,130 --> 00:01:52,260
And we use a lot
of dashes, just--

48
00:01:52,260 --> 00:01:53,010
Lots of dashes--

49
00:01:53,010 --> 00:01:55,430
--just so we don't have to
worry about punctuation while

50
00:01:55,427 --> 00:01:56,787
we're doing this.

51
00:01:56,790 --> 00:01:59,850
"Water sprinklers, hissing,
arcing across a pristine lawn."

52
00:01:59,850 --> 00:02:02,730
And then, we widen to reveal
we're now in suburbia.

53
00:02:02,730 --> 00:02:05,460
"We take a moment to
survey our surroundings.

54
00:02:05,460 --> 00:02:08,160
Fall, leaves blowing, chill
in the air, beautiful.

55
00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:10,650
One-story houses
wind up the street.

56
00:02:10,650 --> 00:02:12,630
Identical, uniform,
hatchback cars

57
00:02:12,630 --> 00:02:14,590
in driveways, power lines--" OK.

58
00:02:14,593 --> 00:02:16,263
We're getting a little
over descriptive.

59
00:02:16,260 --> 00:02:19,440
Here, "Families watching
TV through the windows.

60
00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:22,270
Our attention settles on
a mundane two-story house

61
00:02:22,270 --> 00:02:24,270
tucked away at the end
of the cul-de-sac, lights

62
00:02:24,270 --> 00:02:25,290
glowing within.

63
00:02:25,290 --> 00:02:27,510
The mailbox reads
'The Wheelers.'

64
00:02:27,510 --> 00:02:31,560
Overlay voiceover of a boy
talking about darkness, danger,

65
00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:33,690
and the imminent death
which awaits them."

66
00:02:33,690 --> 00:02:35,940
"We now cut into
this boy's room."

67
00:02:35,940 --> 00:02:38,310
We got "a group of
12-year-old boys play

68
00:02:38,310 --> 00:02:41,010
'Dungeons and Dragons'
cross-legged on the carpeted

69
00:02:41,010 --> 00:02:43,590
floor, Star Wars
posters on walls,

70
00:02:43,590 --> 00:02:45,930
miniatures on the
ground on a gridded map.

71
00:02:45,930 --> 00:02:48,120
We meet our Dungeon
Master, Mike Wheeler.

72
00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:51,210
He has a birthmark along the
side of his face, shaggy hair.

73
00:02:51,210 --> 00:02:53,310
His friends,
Dustin, Will, Lucas,

74
00:02:53,310 --> 00:02:55,110
sit beside him cross-legged.

75
00:02:55,110 --> 00:02:57,570
Dustin is overweight
in a black t-shirt

76
00:02:57,570 --> 00:02:59,060
and wears a Viking helmet."

77
00:02:59,060 --> 00:03:00,150
That didn't make it in.

78
00:03:00,150 --> 00:03:02,700
But when we're trying to
establish he's playing a dwarf.

79
00:03:02,700 --> 00:03:04,830
"Will has a purple robe and wig.

80
00:03:04,830 --> 00:03:05,820
He's a wizard."

81
00:03:05,820 --> 00:03:07,880
He wasn't wearing it, but
he is still the wizard.

82
00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:08,100
MATT DUFFER: Yep.

83
00:03:08,100 --> 00:03:10,200
ROSS DUFFER: "Lucas
wears a plastic chain.

84
00:03:10,200 --> 00:03:11,250
He's playing a knight.

85
00:03:11,250 --> 00:03:12,510
They are riveted by Mike.

86
00:03:12,510 --> 00:03:14,160
He's a hell of a storyteller.

87
00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:15,900
Attacked by evil monsters.

88
00:03:15,900 --> 00:03:18,420
Will is scared. 'Shit, shit,
shit.'" So we're getting

89
00:03:18,420 --> 00:03:20,540
a little basic
dialogue in there.

90
00:03:20,538 --> 00:03:22,828
"Dustin says, 'Don't be a
wuss,' says they should stick

91
00:03:22,830 --> 00:03:23,580
together.

92
00:03:23,580 --> 00:03:25,200
Will takes offense.

93
00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:27,630
I think this is Will
sort of became Lucas.

94
00:03:27,630 --> 00:03:29,160
But yeah, "'I'm not a pussy.

95
00:03:29,160 --> 00:03:30,690
I'm a great wizard.'

96
00:03:30,690 --> 00:03:32,640
They get into an
escalating argument.

97
00:03:32,640 --> 00:03:34,350
'Guys.' They slam
into one another,

98
00:03:34,350 --> 00:03:35,970
knock one another down."

99
00:03:35,970 --> 00:03:37,380
That didn't actually happen.

100
00:03:37,380 --> 00:03:39,690
"Suddenly, bam, bam, bam,
there's knocking on the door.

101
00:03:39,690 --> 00:03:40,620
It's Karen.

102
00:03:40,620 --> 00:03:43,650
She swings open the
door, 'Hey, all right.

103
00:03:43,650 --> 00:03:44,730
That's enough.

104
00:03:44,732 --> 00:03:45,692
You're making a racket.

105
00:03:45,690 --> 00:03:46,900
Holly's just gotta go to bed.

106
00:03:46,898 --> 00:03:47,458
No buts.

107
00:03:47,460 --> 00:03:49,440
Game over.' Mike deflates."

108
00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:51,600
And then, "Mike
follows his mom

109
00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:54,930
past Holly's room,
downstairs, still pleading.

110
00:03:54,930 --> 00:03:55,770
'Come on, mom.

111
00:03:55,770 --> 00:03:57,060
15 more minutes.

112
00:03:57,060 --> 00:03:58,350
'No is no.

113
00:03:58,350 --> 00:04:00,510
It's a school night, too late.'

114
00:04:00,510 --> 00:04:02,910
Behind him, Dustin
and Lucas trail.

115
00:04:02,910 --> 00:04:04,250
And Will and they argue.

116
00:04:04,250 --> 00:04:06,000
'You're such an idiot.'
'You're an idiot.'

117
00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:07,860
Suddenly, Dustin pauses.

118
00:04:07,860 --> 00:04:09,030
We follow his gaze.

119
00:04:09,030 --> 00:04:11,640
He is looking in
on Nancy's room.

120
00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:12,900
The door is cracked.

121
00:04:12,900 --> 00:04:14,580
She's on her bed
on the phone, cord

122
00:04:14,580 --> 00:04:17,790
wrapped around her fingers,
legs kicked in the air.

123
00:04:17,790 --> 00:04:19,050
Dustin gawks.

124
00:04:19,050 --> 00:04:20,550
Nancy notices.

125
00:04:20,550 --> 00:04:21,600
'What the fuck?

126
00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:23,460
Get out of my room, freak.'

127
00:04:23,460 --> 00:04:25,410
'I'm not in your
room, technically.'

128
00:04:25,410 --> 00:04:27,660
Wham, she slams the door on him.

129
00:04:27,660 --> 00:04:30,810
A beat and then Dustin
explodes outside beaming.

130
00:04:30,810 --> 00:04:32,760
'Guys, Nancy just talked to me.'

131
00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:34,090
Mike covers his ears.

132
00:04:34,090 --> 00:04:36,840
He can't listen to this.
'Shut up.' 'Her boobs.'

133
00:04:36,840 --> 00:04:37,680
'Shut up.

134
00:04:37,680 --> 00:04:41,280
I'm not listening.' Will asks,
'Hey, can you guys play again

135
00:04:41,280 --> 00:04:43,290
tomorrow?' 'Yeah, tomorrow.'

136
00:04:43,290 --> 00:04:45,900
They bike off and then we
have a little bit of dialogue

137
00:04:45,900 --> 00:04:47,730
describing, I think,
what they're doing

138
00:04:47,730 --> 00:04:49,170
as they're backing off.
'You need to cast a Spell

139
00:04:49,170 --> 00:04:51,120
of Protection.' 'I think
we should hide behind that

140
00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:51,690
column.'

141
00:04:51,690 --> 00:04:52,110
'No.

142
00:04:52,110 --> 00:04:53,530
We need to push
them to the side.'

143
00:04:53,527 --> 00:04:55,197
the sound of their
talking fades.

144
00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:56,640
Mike is all alone again.

145
00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:57,990
He shuts the garage door.

146
00:04:57,990 --> 00:04:58,890
It grinds shut."

147
00:04:58,890 --> 00:05:01,470
And so we-- I don't know why
we don't have the flickering

148
00:05:01,470 --> 00:05:02,070
light in here.

149
00:05:02,070 --> 00:05:04,080
But, somehow, that wound
back up in the script.

150
00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:07,680
I don't know why that went away
from the-- from the outline--

151
00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:08,680
the scaffolding outline.

152
00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:11,080
But as you can see, as
we read that out, it's

153
00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:14,680
not exactly what ended up in the
final script, but it's pretty--

154
00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:16,100
pretty, pretty, pretty close.

155
00:05:16,100 --> 00:05:19,610
Even some of that
dialogue stayed the same.

156
00:05:19,608 --> 00:05:22,148
We figure-- found some stuff,
like cast a Spell of Protection

157
00:05:22,150 --> 00:05:23,290
later on in here.

158
00:05:23,290 --> 00:05:24,420
We moved that up earlier.

159
00:05:24,415 --> 00:05:26,135
But the general
beats are there.

160
00:05:26,135 --> 00:05:28,515
We got a little descriptive
on the neighborhood and stuff

161
00:05:28,510 --> 00:05:31,090
and we stripped some of that
down when we went to script,

162
00:05:31,090 --> 00:05:33,490
just to make sure the pacing--
but, again, we're really

163
00:05:33,490 --> 00:05:34,530
starting to fill this in.

164
00:05:34,532 --> 00:05:38,412
It went from the kids play
DandD to, suddenly, now,

165
00:05:38,410 --> 00:05:39,680
we've got a lot going on.

166
00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:41,680
We're introducing
these characters

167
00:05:41,683 --> 00:05:43,603
when we're describing
the beats that happened.

168
00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:45,610
And I think what's
really important is--

169
00:05:45,610 --> 00:05:47,410
and the way you do
something like that--

170
00:05:47,410 --> 00:05:49,780
say you have-- in your
scaffolding outline "Kids play

171
00:05:49,780 --> 00:05:50,420
DandD."

172
00:05:50,415 --> 00:05:51,795
Well, you're not
gonna just write

173
00:05:51,790 --> 00:05:54,820
a scene about kids having
fun, playing DandD. That's not

174
00:05:54,820 --> 00:05:56,170
really much of a scene.

175
00:05:56,170 --> 00:05:58,690
And how are you gonna get
across their various characters?

176
00:05:58,690 --> 00:06:00,730
Because that's really the
purpose of this scene.

177
00:06:00,730 --> 00:06:03,030
Remember, story beat
A is you're trying

178
00:06:03,032 --> 00:06:04,242
to introduce your characters.

179
00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:05,950
And that's what we're
trying to do here.

180
00:06:05,950 --> 00:06:11,050
And one really effective way
to do it is through conflict.

181
00:06:11,050 --> 00:06:13,840
What it allows is that we get
to see, through this conflict,

182
00:06:13,840 --> 00:06:17,530
how each of them wants to tackle
defeating this demogorgon.

183
00:06:17,530 --> 00:06:20,620
We get to see a little bit of
their characters in the way

184
00:06:20,620 --> 00:06:23,050
that they respond to
this conflict, right?

185
00:06:23,050 --> 00:06:25,590
So we have Dustin,
who's a little more--

186
00:06:25,590 --> 00:06:27,280
He-- he's a little
bit more careful.

187
00:06:27,277 --> 00:06:29,107
He's a little bit more
prudent and cautious.

188
00:06:29,110 --> 00:06:29,530
Pragmatic.

189
00:06:29,530 --> 00:06:30,970
Pragmatic, you
might say, right?

190
00:06:30,970 --> 00:06:33,070
He wants to cast a Spell
of Protection in the scene.

191
00:06:33,070 --> 00:06:34,090
He wants to protect them.

192
00:06:34,090 --> 00:06:35,470
He wants-- he's
a little bit more

193
00:06:35,465 --> 00:06:36,675
taking the defensive route.

194
00:06:36,670 --> 00:06:40,000
Then, we have Lucas, who's a
little bit bolder, a little bit

195
00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:42,660
more courageous, in
terms of his style.

196
00:06:42,662 --> 00:06:44,372
He wants to-- he wants
to just go for it.

197
00:06:44,370 --> 00:06:47,170
And then, you have Will,
who's just shy and unsure

198
00:06:47,170 --> 00:06:48,100
and a little bit lost.

199
00:06:48,100 --> 00:06:49,230
He doesn't know what to do.

200
00:06:49,225 --> 00:06:51,165
And he really is
looking to his friends

201
00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:53,050
for answers in terms
of what he should do

202
00:06:53,050 --> 00:06:54,720
and how he should
tackle the demogorgon.

203
00:06:54,717 --> 00:06:56,947
So he's clearly not the
leader in this situation.

204
00:06:56,950 --> 00:06:59,710
And then, you have Mike, who's
the ultimate, ultimate leader,

205
00:06:59,710 --> 00:07:03,250
because he's the Dungeon Master
and he's running-- basically,

206
00:07:03,250 --> 00:07:04,990
leading the entire session.

207
00:07:04,990 --> 00:07:07,900
In this very simple scene,
where the conflict is simply

208
00:07:07,900 --> 00:07:11,650
how to defeat an imaginary
monster in a silly game of DandD,

209
00:07:11,650 --> 00:07:14,800
we're learning a lot about
who each of these characters

210
00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,960
are, just in terms of how
they're handling the problem

211
00:07:17,957 --> 00:07:18,787
that they're facing.

212
00:07:18,790 --> 00:07:20,920
And we're also
setting up the conflict

213
00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:23,890
to come between Dustin and
Lucas and that their approaches

214
00:07:23,890 --> 00:07:25,510
of things are very different.

215
00:07:25,510 --> 00:07:26,660
Now, this is just a game.

216
00:07:26,660 --> 00:07:29,260
But it's gonna end up
applying to real life later.

217
00:07:29,260 --> 00:07:30,910
And if you remember
their story arc,

218
00:07:30,910 --> 00:07:33,370
in terms of they're falling
apart and then, you know,

219
00:07:33,370 --> 00:07:36,770
getting back together, that's
gonna play a role later on.

220
00:07:36,770 --> 00:07:38,350
And so we've now
introduced our kids.

221
00:07:38,350 --> 00:07:40,110
And then, we know,
also, in this story

222
00:07:40,110 --> 00:07:42,190
beat, we need to
introduce Mike's family,

223
00:07:42,190 --> 00:07:43,850
because they're all
gonna play a role.

224
00:07:43,850 --> 00:07:45,220
And again, how do we do that?

225
00:07:45,220 --> 00:07:45,730
Mike?

226
00:07:45,730 --> 00:07:46,980
ROSS DUFFER: Through conflict.

227
00:07:46,980 --> 00:07:48,690
Mom, we're in the
middle of a campaign.

228
00:07:48,688 --> 00:07:49,478
You mean the end?

229
00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:50,800
15 after.

230
00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:53,450
The mom says, you
can't play DandD anymore.

231
00:07:53,450 --> 00:07:56,030
And so, again, stakes are
very low at this point,

232
00:07:56,030 --> 00:07:58,030
because we're just
introducing these characters.

233
00:07:58,030 --> 00:07:59,200
This is their normal life.

234
00:07:59,200 --> 00:08:02,260
But through conflict and
Mike arguing with his mom,

235
00:08:02,260 --> 00:08:03,760
we're gonna be able
to meet the mom.

236
00:08:03,760 --> 00:08:05,260
We're gonna be able
to meet the dad.

237
00:08:05,260 --> 00:08:06,830
We're gonna be
able to meet Nancy.

238
00:08:06,830 --> 00:08:09,850
So in not very many
pages, in-- in this case,

239
00:08:09,850 --> 00:08:13,300
in this outline, just
a couple paragraphs,

240
00:08:13,300 --> 00:08:15,700
we're getting across
a lot of characters.

241
00:08:15,700 --> 00:08:17,110
Hopefully, it's a fun scene.

242
00:08:17,110 --> 00:08:19,220
And we're-- we're
really setting the stage

243
00:08:19,220 --> 00:08:20,900
to-- of what's to come.

244
00:08:20,900 --> 00:08:24,280
And so, again, the engine
that's driving it, because we

245
00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:26,330
do not have a drive yet--

246
00:08:26,330 --> 00:08:28,690
so what we're doing is
we're creating conflict

247
00:08:28,690 --> 00:08:30,790
within this scene to
give it that engine,

248
00:08:30,790 --> 00:08:32,770
to keep you turning the
pages, and to introduce

249
00:08:32,770 --> 00:08:35,740
these characters in an
exciting and fun way.

250
00:08:41,799 --> 00:08:44,159
So you're gonna do what
we did with that DandD scene

251
00:08:44,159 --> 00:08:47,129
for each of your scenes,
for all of your story beats.

252
00:08:47,130 --> 00:08:49,200
You're gonna end up
with something in the 10

253
00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:50,550
to 20-page range.

254
00:08:50,550 --> 00:08:53,370
Maybe it's a little too long
right now and it's 25 pages.

255
00:08:53,370 --> 00:08:54,330
That's fine.

256
00:08:54,330 --> 00:08:55,140
Don't freak out.

257
00:08:55,140 --> 00:08:58,260
What you're then going to do
is you're gonna read it all,

258
00:08:58,260 --> 00:08:59,280
from beginning to end.

259
00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:02,280
And you're just gonna see
how it paces and how it flows

260
00:09:02,280 --> 00:09:04,620
and what's working and
what's not working.

261
00:09:04,620 --> 00:09:07,560
And we promise you, it's not
gonna be completely working.

262
00:09:07,560 --> 00:09:10,050
I don't think we've
ever written an outline

263
00:09:10,050 --> 00:09:12,990
and read it through the
first time and had it work.

264
00:09:12,990 --> 00:09:15,100
Even though we felt good
about the scaffolding,

265
00:09:15,100 --> 00:09:17,140
I think as you flesh it
out and read it through,

266
00:09:17,142 --> 00:09:18,602
you're gonna realize
that there are

267
00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:20,370
other issues you didn't see--

268
00:09:20,370 --> 00:09:21,250
Pacing issues and--

269
00:09:21,245 --> 00:09:22,875
Maybe this scene
here is just, like--

270
00:09:22,870 --> 00:09:25,020
it's in the way and-- and
it's killing the pacing.

271
00:09:25,020 --> 00:09:27,940
And can you figure out a way
to get that information across

272
00:09:27,940 --> 00:09:28,890
in an earlier scene?

273
00:09:28,890 --> 00:09:30,030
And so you're gonna keep--

274
00:09:30,030 --> 00:09:32,150
basically, you just
keep working on it.

275
00:09:32,145 --> 00:09:33,275
Or you realize, oh, wait.

276
00:09:33,270 --> 00:09:34,810
Do I really need this scene?

277
00:09:34,810 --> 00:09:36,900
There's no way you're
gonna write this all out

278
00:09:36,900 --> 00:09:38,880
and it's gonna work
completely perfectly.

279
00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:39,480
So--

280
00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:40,380
Like, for example--

281
00:09:40,380 --> 00:09:42,210
here's just one
of many examples.

282
00:09:42,210 --> 00:09:45,150
In the pilot, we had an early
storyline with Eleven, right?

283
00:09:45,150 --> 00:09:47,820
Who's-- she's being held in
the base before she escapes.

284
00:09:47,820 --> 00:09:48,420
OK?

285
00:09:48,420 --> 00:09:52,380
We now return to the military
base, radar spinning around.

286
00:09:52,380 --> 00:09:53,740
We cut inside the base.

287
00:09:53,742 --> 00:09:55,202
We're traveling
down a dark tunnel.

288
00:09:55,200 --> 00:09:58,080
We find a young girl is
being held in a captive--

289
00:09:58,080 --> 00:09:59,400
in a windowless room.

290
00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:01,360
There's a tattoo on her wrist.

291
00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:04,530
There's a single lamp and the
agent is interrogating her.

292
00:10:04,530 --> 00:10:06,270
She's shaking, crying.

293
00:10:06,270 --> 00:10:07,740
"It's not my fault."

294
00:10:07,740 --> 00:10:10,110
She's hinting that
something took this boy.

295
00:10:10,110 --> 00:10:11,190
What took the boy?

296
00:10:11,190 --> 00:10:12,180
What boy?

297
00:10:12,180 --> 00:10:12,990
I can hear him.

298
00:10:12,990 --> 00:10:13,920
I can hear the boy.

299
00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:14,700
He's screaming.

300
00:10:14,700 --> 00:10:16,050
She begins to cry.

301
00:10:16,050 --> 00:10:17,550
And then, they shut
the door on her.

302
00:10:17,550 --> 00:10:18,050
OK?

303
00:10:18,050 --> 00:10:19,770
So remember how we
talked about how

304
00:10:19,770 --> 00:10:22,620
we ended up having Eleven's
storyline go halfway

305
00:10:22,620 --> 00:10:23,490
through the script?

306
00:10:23,490 --> 00:10:25,950
It's because we had
so much to introduce

307
00:10:25,950 --> 00:10:28,260
in the first half of our
pilot that we didn't really

308
00:10:28,260 --> 00:10:31,260
have time to do an Eleven
introduction scene.

309
00:10:31,260 --> 00:10:33,270
So instead, we sort
of caught her--

310
00:10:33,270 --> 00:10:36,600
we-- we go back into this--
this-- stuff like this

311
00:10:36,600 --> 00:10:37,940
later when we do flashbacks.

312
00:10:37,943 --> 00:10:39,363
What we did is we
just cut to her.

313
00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:41,430
She's already escaped the lab.

314
00:10:41,430 --> 00:10:43,110
And she's going to Benny's.

315
00:10:43,110 --> 00:10:45,570
And that way, it saved
us a room to introduce

316
00:10:45,570 --> 00:10:48,930
Mike and Hopper and
Joyce and all of that

317
00:10:48,930 --> 00:10:51,360
up front, because we cut
out a scene like this,

318
00:10:51,355 --> 00:10:52,985
because it was just
hurting the pacing.

319
00:10:52,980 --> 00:10:56,350
And in fact, it improved when
we introduced Eleven and didn't

320
00:10:56,347 --> 00:10:57,927
even know that she
came from the base.

321
00:10:57,930 --> 00:11:00,210
It gave us an--
an air of mystery

322
00:11:00,210 --> 00:11:01,860
that we actually
ended up liking.

323
00:11:01,860 --> 00:11:05,380
So this whole scene just
ended up getting cut.

324
00:11:05,377 --> 00:11:06,957
Now, this is gonna
look like more work

325
00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:09,090
than it is, because a lot
of this is cut and paste.

326
00:11:09,085 --> 00:11:11,855
But we're cutting
scenes, tweaking scenes,

327
00:11:11,850 --> 00:11:13,170
moving stuff around.

328
00:11:13,170 --> 00:11:16,740
And it's dozens and dozens
and dozens of pages of this.

329
00:11:16,740 --> 00:11:20,370
Because at this thing, you're
writing this on spec, right?

330
00:11:20,370 --> 00:11:23,430
This is-- you don't have anyone
else to hold you accountable,

331
00:11:23,430 --> 00:11:24,630
except yourself.

332
00:11:24,630 --> 00:11:26,350
Yes, you can share with people.

333
00:11:26,350 --> 00:11:29,040
But the most important
critic is gonna be yourself.

334
00:11:29,040 --> 00:11:30,210
Keep reading this thing.

335
00:11:30,210 --> 00:11:31,110
Keep molding it.

336
00:11:31,110 --> 00:11:34,170
Again, this stage is the
stage where you can change

337
00:11:34,170 --> 00:11:35,530
things and delete things.

338
00:11:35,525 --> 00:11:37,655
Writing that scene that I
just talked to you about,

339
00:11:37,650 --> 00:11:42,300
about Eleven being interrogated
by an agent in the lab,

340
00:11:42,300 --> 00:11:45,480
that would've taken
hours and hours to write.

341
00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:46,590
Even in script form.

342
00:11:46,590 --> 00:11:47,400
In script form.

343
00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:48,960
That would've taken a long time.

344
00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:52,290
And then, you would've-- so
if you can cut it right now,

345
00:11:52,290 --> 00:11:53,220
it's a lot easier.

346
00:11:53,220 --> 00:11:56,070
Because to do little rough
dashes, like we're doing,

347
00:11:56,070 --> 00:11:56,730
is fast.

348
00:11:56,730 --> 00:11:59,130
You can, quote, unquote,
"Write scenes in the final

349
00:11:59,130 --> 00:12:00,240
outline quickly.

350
00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:01,830
You can delete them quickly."

351
00:12:01,830 --> 00:12:04,050
So you've gotta just
keep reading this thing.

352
00:12:04,050 --> 00:12:06,750
And don't be afraid to move
stuff around, to delete stuff,

353
00:12:06,750 --> 00:12:08,520
to say, hey, you know what?

354
00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:11,160
This storyline
just isn't working.

355
00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:12,670
Let me reevaluate.

356
00:12:12,670 --> 00:12:15,420
And then, you can always go
back into the scaffolding stage

357
00:12:15,420 --> 00:12:17,830
and go, OK, I'm gonna
break these beats again.

358
00:12:17,830 --> 00:12:19,380
We do that all the time.

359
00:12:19,380 --> 00:12:20,950
It's just gonna be a process.

360
00:12:20,950 --> 00:12:22,350
And again, I think we had--

361
00:12:22,350 --> 00:12:25,230
when I-- when I went through to
gather all this for the class,

362
00:12:25,230 --> 00:12:29,040
we had probably 150
pages of this outline,

363
00:12:29,040 --> 00:12:32,280
just over and over again,
just keep on working it.

364
00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:41,190
One thing that's also important
as you're doing these scenes

365
00:12:41,190 --> 00:12:42,790
is something that--

366
00:12:42,790 --> 00:12:44,790
that we always try
to do is you can

367
00:12:44,790 --> 00:12:47,760
have characters' inner rooms,
but not even a lot of the time.

368
00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:49,710
You can just cut to
them in this location.

369
00:12:49,710 --> 00:12:51,870
And then, don't have
them exit the room.

370
00:12:51,870 --> 00:12:54,240
You don't need your
characters to always go.

371
00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:55,710
Occasionally, this is fine.

372
00:12:55,710 --> 00:12:58,480
But a lot of the times, it's
just completely unnecessary.

373
00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:01,500
You don't need them to
go, OK, let's find Will.

374
00:13:01,500 --> 00:13:02,100
OK, guys.

375
00:13:02,100 --> 00:13:03,930
And then, we don't
have to watch them.

376
00:13:03,930 --> 00:13:05,880
Like, everyone gets up,
grabs their backpacks,

377
00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:06,750
leaves the room.

378
00:13:06,750 --> 00:13:08,770
That's just what we
call shoe leather.

379
00:13:08,770 --> 00:13:10,170
It's unnecessary to the story.

380
00:13:10,170 --> 00:13:12,330
If you go, OK, we're
gonna go find Will,

381
00:13:12,330 --> 00:13:14,400
you can cut to
them finding Will.

382
00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:16,380
For instance, in--
in the pilot episode

383
00:13:16,380 --> 00:13:18,780
of-- of "Stranger
Things," or "Montauk,"

384
00:13:18,780 --> 00:13:22,590
we have Hopper learn from
Dustin and Mike and Lucas

385
00:13:22,590 --> 00:13:25,740
that Will often goes home
by-- on a road-- what

386
00:13:25,740 --> 00:13:27,000
they call Mirkwood.

387
00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:29,640
And so next time
we cut to Hopper,

388
00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:32,670
he's already in-- walking
down that road at Mirkwood.

389
00:13:32,670 --> 00:13:33,570
We understand.

390
00:13:33,570 --> 00:13:36,270
And we've also set up, from
the prior beat, that that's

391
00:13:36,270 --> 00:13:37,290
where he's gonna go.

392
00:13:37,290 --> 00:13:40,350
We don't see him leave the
school, drive over to Mirkwood.

393
00:13:40,345 --> 00:13:41,225
It's really boring.

394
00:13:41,220 --> 00:13:43,870
And I think-- I think
that will kill your pacing

395
00:13:43,872 --> 00:13:46,082
and just make your script
longer than it needs to be.

396
00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:47,880
So yeah, look out
for that excess fat

397
00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:49,140
and-- and cut it out.

398
00:13:54,952 --> 00:13:57,162
So now that you have your
scaffolding outline, right,

399
00:13:57,160 --> 00:13:59,470
and you've woven it
all together and you

400
00:13:59,470 --> 00:14:00,970
think that's working,
now, it's time

401
00:14:00,970 --> 00:14:03,280
to do what we did
with that DandD scene

402
00:14:03,280 --> 00:14:05,460
and just start
fleshing it all out.

403
00:14:05,455 --> 00:14:07,335
So you're gonna take
your scaffolding outline

404
00:14:07,330 --> 00:14:08,560
that you've woven together.

405
00:14:08,560 --> 00:14:10,480
And you're gonna go
one beat at a time,

406
00:14:10,477 --> 00:14:12,307
starting from the
beginning, and you're just

407
00:14:12,310 --> 00:14:15,700
gonna flesh out each
story beat or each scene.

408
00:14:15,700 --> 00:14:17,810
And you're gonna do that
for all of the scenes.

409
00:14:17,808 --> 00:14:20,348
And when you're done with that,
you're gonna read it through.

410
00:14:20,350 --> 00:14:24,050
Hopefully, again, this is
in the 10 to 15-page range.

411
00:14:24,050 --> 00:14:25,540
So it's gonna be a lot longer.

412
00:14:25,540 --> 00:14:27,430
If something is
really not working,

413
00:14:27,430 --> 00:14:29,740
it actually is too
overwhelming to try

414
00:14:29,740 --> 00:14:34,060
to fix a major problem in this
stage, just zoom back out,

415
00:14:34,060 --> 00:14:37,780
return to the scaffolding stage,
make some adjustments there.

416
00:14:37,780 --> 00:14:40,090
Then, go back into
the final outline.

417
00:14:40,090 --> 00:14:43,210
Again, Ross and I spend longer
on this stage on the outline

418
00:14:43,210 --> 00:14:44,650
than we do on the actual script.

419
00:14:44,650 --> 00:14:46,300
We almost spend
double the time on it.

420
00:14:46,300 --> 00:14:48,880
And we do that because
we believe this is, aside

421
00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:51,250
from developing
the big idea, this

422
00:14:51,250 --> 00:14:52,570
is the most important step.

423
00:14:52,570 --> 00:14:55,660
This is you putting in
all of the work, really.

424
00:14:55,660 --> 00:14:57,550
And again, if you
do this correctly,

425
00:14:57,550 --> 00:14:58,960
then the script itself--

426
00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:00,340
writing the script
itself, you'll

427
00:15:00,340 --> 00:15:02,170
never get stuck in that stage.

428
00:15:02,170 --> 00:15:05,000
You'll never stick that script
in a drawer and to never return

429
00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:05,500
it.

430
00:15:05,500 --> 00:15:06,830
You're gonna finish that script.

431
00:15:06,833 --> 00:15:08,473
So just get this outline down.

432
00:15:08,470 --> 00:15:09,820
Spend some time on this.

433
00:15:09,820 --> 00:15:11,360
Spend a lot of time on this.

434
00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:12,280
And get this right.

435
00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:13,780
Once you have the
final outline, you

436
00:15:13,780 --> 00:15:16,100
can finally move
to script stage,

437
00:15:16,100 --> 00:15:18,360
which is what we'll cover next.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,240


2
00:00:06,020 --> 00:00:09,590
So now, hopefully you
have your final outline.

3
00:00:09,590 --> 00:00:12,320
I know it's been
a-- a long journey.

4
00:00:12,318 --> 00:00:14,358
If you've been working on
this big idea of yours,

5
00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:15,900
it's been a long
journey to get here.

6
00:00:15,902 --> 00:00:22,202
But now, we can finally safely
move into the script stage.

7
00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:24,230
So what you're going
to take is-- again,

8
00:00:24,230 --> 00:00:26,780
that outline should be
relatively detailed.

9
00:00:26,780 --> 00:00:28,520
So now we're just making it--

10
00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:29,630
we're making it pretty.

11
00:00:29,630 --> 00:00:32,150
We're formatting into
the screenplay format.

12
00:00:32,150 --> 00:00:35,960
We're adding in a lot
more of the dialogue.

13
00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:38,120
Again, maybe you had
some ideas for dialogue,

14
00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:41,000
but now you're going to
add all of the dialogue.

15
00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:44,600
You're going to smooth out
all of your descriptions,

16
00:00:44,600 --> 00:00:45,920
transitions from one to--

17
00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:47,000
one scene to the next.

18
00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:49,850
So you're really just
putting on the final touches.

19
00:00:49,850 --> 00:00:52,950
You're making your house
beautiful and livable now.

20
00:00:52,950 --> 00:00:55,710
So this is really the
final step of this process.

21
00:00:55,707 --> 00:00:58,037
So one thing we're not going
to get into in this class

22
00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:00,200
is how to format your script.

23
00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:01,940
Most of these programs,
whether you're

24
00:01:01,940 --> 00:01:05,270
working on Final Draft
or WriterDuet, which

25
00:01:05,269 --> 00:01:08,029
is what we work on,
it will automatically

26
00:01:08,030 --> 00:01:09,110
format it for you.

27
00:01:09,110 --> 00:01:11,900
And the best thing to do is
just to look at, read, you know,

28
00:01:11,900 --> 00:01:13,820
any screenplay, and
you'll be able to see

29
00:01:13,820 --> 00:01:16,450
pretty quickly how these studios
want your scripts formatted.

30
00:01:16,450 --> 00:01:18,980
ROSS DUFFER: Sort of scene
heading and capitalizing

31
00:01:18,980 --> 00:01:21,580
character names when you first
meet them, all of that stuff.

32
00:01:21,583 --> 00:01:23,003
There are a bunch
of little rules.

33
00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:24,500
They're actually very simple.

34
00:01:24,500 --> 00:01:27,050
And again, you can
find any information

35
00:01:27,050 --> 00:01:29,420
you want on that
online, so we're not

36
00:01:29,420 --> 00:01:31,410
going to get too much into that.

37
00:01:31,410 --> 00:01:33,440
It's very simple
and straightforward.

38
00:01:33,440 --> 00:01:36,730


39
00:01:39,517 --> 00:01:41,097
So if you have a
good final outline,

40
00:01:41,100 --> 00:01:42,810
if you feel confident
in that final outline

41
00:01:42,810 --> 00:01:44,230
and that final
outline is, indeed,

42
00:01:44,227 --> 00:01:46,487
working, the script itself--

43
00:01:46,490 --> 00:01:48,490
again, this is a little
bit more of a formality.

44
00:01:48,490 --> 00:01:49,820
Yeah, you're adding in dialogue.

45
00:01:49,823 --> 00:01:50,893
You're making it pretty.

46
00:01:50,897 --> 00:01:52,977
But it shouldn't take as
long as the outline took.

47
00:01:52,980 --> 00:01:54,510
At least it doesn't
take us as long.

48
00:01:54,510 --> 00:01:55,010
Yeah.

49
00:01:55,010 --> 00:01:58,860
It usually takes
us around two weeks

50
00:01:58,860 --> 00:02:02,340
to turn a final outline
into a final script.

51
00:02:02,340 --> 00:02:03,840
And I think that
is how long it took

52
00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:07,710
us to write the pilot
for "Stranger Things."

53
00:02:07,710 --> 00:02:10,050
This is really
just the formality.

54
00:02:10,050 --> 00:02:11,790
This is Hitchcock showing up.

55
00:02:11,790 --> 00:02:12,900
Picture's done.

56
00:02:12,900 --> 00:02:14,220
Now I just have to film it.

57
00:02:14,220 --> 00:02:15,960
I should mention,
though, and this--

58
00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:17,320
because this has happened to us.

59
00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:19,040
It didn't happen with
the "Montauk" pilot.

60
00:02:19,035 --> 00:02:19,385
No.

61
00:02:19,380 --> 00:02:21,760
But it has happened with
other scripts that we've written

62
00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:24,010
and it's happened to us with
"Stranger Things" scripts

63
00:02:24,010 --> 00:02:26,880
where you think you have a
final outline that works.

64
00:02:26,880 --> 00:02:27,980
You move into script.

65
00:02:27,975 --> 00:02:29,855
You're writing the
script, and just something

66
00:02:29,850 --> 00:02:32,470
is just not working.

67
00:02:32,472 --> 00:02:34,182
Actually, this happens
to us quite a bit.

68
00:02:34,180 --> 00:02:36,930
So that's normal, first of
all, so you shouldn't be

69
00:02:36,930 --> 00:02:38,730
distressed or upset about that.

70
00:02:38,730 --> 00:02:41,880
What you really should do then
is kind of what we were saying,

71
00:02:41,880 --> 00:02:43,740
you know, when you're
in the final outline,

72
00:02:43,740 --> 00:02:45,870
how you maybe need
to back out again

73
00:02:45,870 --> 00:02:47,440
into the scaffolding outline.

74
00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:50,100
So if you're in the script
and something really

75
00:02:50,100 --> 00:02:52,230
doesn't seem to be working,
or you read it through

76
00:02:52,230 --> 00:02:55,600
and it doesn't seem to be
working, just go back a step.

77
00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:57,450
Go back into the outline stage.

78
00:02:57,450 --> 00:02:58,710
Revisit the outline.

79
00:02:58,710 --> 00:03:01,410
If you're going to make any sort
of major structural changes,

80
00:03:01,410 --> 00:03:03,200
make those changes
in the outline stage,

81
00:03:03,198 --> 00:03:04,738
not while you're in
the script stage,

82
00:03:04,740 --> 00:03:07,540
because it's just
too time consuming.

83
00:03:07,537 --> 00:03:09,867
And I think another mistake
sometimes people are going

84
00:03:09,870 --> 00:03:12,480
to make is that they're
going to over-write it.

85
00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:14,760
They're like, oh, this is
the-- this is a script.

86
00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:15,810
That was just an outline.

87
00:03:15,810 --> 00:03:17,310
Now I'm going to
make it all-- write

88
00:03:17,310 --> 00:03:19,950
all these fancy descriptions
and all of this.

89
00:03:19,950 --> 00:03:22,710
I'm going to show-- prove to
everyone what a great writer

90
00:03:22,710 --> 00:03:23,580
I am.

91
00:03:23,580 --> 00:03:25,080
Try to resist that,
and we're going

92
00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,330
to go into more detail
in a second in terms

93
00:03:27,330 --> 00:03:29,940
of at least the way we
write and the way that we

94
00:03:29,940 --> 00:03:31,740
find is the most effective.

95
00:03:31,740 --> 00:03:34,540
But you're not
writing a novel here.

96
00:03:34,540 --> 00:03:37,260
Even though this is a
script, you're really just--

97
00:03:37,260 --> 00:03:40,260
it is an outline for what is
ultimately going to get filmed.

98
00:03:40,260 --> 00:03:43,410
You don't want to write more
than you-- than you need.

99
00:03:43,410 --> 00:03:46,950
This is still going to be a
bare-bones relatively simple

100
00:03:46,950 --> 00:03:47,820
document.

101
00:03:47,820 --> 00:03:51,060


102
00:03:53,067 --> 00:03:54,647
So now what we're
going to do is we're

103
00:03:54,650 --> 00:03:56,510
going to show you a scene
from our final outline,

104
00:03:56,510 --> 00:03:58,590
and then we're going to
show you how we translated

105
00:03:58,593 --> 00:04:01,133
that scene into our script.

106
00:04:01,130 --> 00:04:04,160
So you're going to see what
stayed the same, what changed,

107
00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:06,350
what additions we put in there.

108
00:04:06,345 --> 00:04:07,975
Hopefully that'll
help give you a sense

109
00:04:07,970 --> 00:04:11,230
of how you can move from your
outline into the script stage.

110
00:04:11,228 --> 00:04:12,768
So the scene we're
going to look at

111
00:04:12,770 --> 00:04:14,810
is the scene between
Eleven and Benny.

112
00:04:14,805 --> 00:04:16,435
And if you remember
back in season one,

113
00:04:16,430 --> 00:04:17,870
if you've seen
"Stranger Things,"

114
00:04:17,870 --> 00:04:22,370
Benny is the owner and
cook of Benny's Fish 'N--

115
00:04:22,370 --> 00:04:26,300
well, it was a fish restaurant
and became a burger joint

116
00:04:26,300 --> 00:04:27,410
in the final show.

117
00:04:27,410 --> 00:04:31,080
But anyway, he's caught Eleven
trying to steal food from him.

118
00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:34,950
And now he's feeding her and
trying to figure out who she is

119
00:04:34,948 --> 00:04:36,988
and what she's doing, is
she a runaway, whatever.

120
00:04:36,990 --> 00:04:38,620
So let's look at what
that scene looked

121
00:04:38,615 --> 00:04:41,305
like in the final outline first.

122
00:04:41,300 --> 00:04:42,740
Back to Fish N' Fly.

123
00:04:42,740 --> 00:04:43,820
Hiss.

124
00:04:43,820 --> 00:04:45,500
Salmon hisses on a plate.

125
00:04:45,500 --> 00:04:46,450
Again, so it was fish.

126
00:04:46,450 --> 00:04:47,450
It turned into a burger.

127
00:04:47,450 --> 00:04:48,830
Salmon hisses on plate.

128
00:04:48,830 --> 00:04:52,070
Benny is cooking for Eleven
some actually good cooked food,

129
00:04:52,070 --> 00:04:53,810
fish or salmon or something.

130
00:04:53,810 --> 00:04:56,210
They sit down together
in a small kitchen.

131
00:04:56,210 --> 00:04:59,030
Delicious, spelled
completely wrong.

132
00:04:59,030 --> 00:05:02,030
Scene where he tries to get
info out of her, asks about it.

133
00:05:02,030 --> 00:05:03,260
What's your name?

134
00:05:03,260 --> 00:05:04,910
Where's your parents?

135
00:05:04,910 --> 00:05:07,160
What are your parents'
names, et cetera?

136
00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:11,510
She finally speaks, but only
cryptically, also spelled

137
00:05:11,510 --> 00:05:12,140
totally wrong.

138
00:05:12,140 --> 00:05:14,450
Says that something
bad is coming.

139
00:05:14,450 --> 00:05:15,590
Paranoid.

140
00:05:15,590 --> 00:05:17,630
Sees headlights out window.

141
00:05:17,630 --> 00:05:18,350
Nervous.

142
00:05:18,350 --> 00:05:20,120
Someone's looking for her.

143
00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:21,290
So Benny picks up on this.

144
00:05:21,290 --> 00:05:22,580
Who is looking for you?

145
00:05:22,580 --> 00:05:25,730
She won't say, but her little
eyes are filled with fear.

146
00:05:25,730 --> 00:05:27,110
Benny is concerned.

147
00:05:27,110 --> 00:05:28,550
You stay here for now.

148
00:05:28,550 --> 00:05:29,750
You're safe here.

149
00:05:29,750 --> 00:05:33,530
She takes his hand, says
something about his past.

150
00:05:33,530 --> 00:05:35,450
I'm sorry about your friend.

151
00:05:35,450 --> 00:05:37,190
I'm sorry he drowned.

152
00:05:37,190 --> 00:05:38,750
Benny gets the chills.

153
00:05:38,750 --> 00:05:40,580
How do you know about him?

154
00:05:40,580 --> 00:05:44,840
El removes her hand, goes back
to eating, finishes her food.

155
00:05:44,840 --> 00:05:46,430
Benny is unnerved.

156
00:05:46,430 --> 00:05:47,660
You want more?

157
00:05:47,660 --> 00:05:48,560
El nods.

158
00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:51,800
As El continues to eat,
getting a second helping,

159
00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:54,360
Benny gets on the phone,
keeps his voice down

160
00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:55,370
so she can't hear her.

161
00:05:55,370 --> 00:05:55,970
Hey, Jean.

162
00:05:55,970 --> 00:05:56,180
Hey.

163
00:05:56,180 --> 00:05:56,960
It's Benny Hammond.

164
00:05:56,960 --> 00:05:57,920
Got a little girl here.

165
00:05:57,918 --> 00:05:59,658
I'm a little worried
she's going to run.

166
00:05:59,660 --> 00:06:01,760
Seems like she hasn't had
a bite to eat in a year.

167
00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:03,080
Hasn't spoken a word.

168
00:06:03,080 --> 00:06:04,160
Abused, I think.

169
00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:06,290
Must be a missing kid.

170
00:06:06,290 --> 00:06:07,670
This is him hearing about Will.

171
00:06:07,670 --> 00:06:09,560
Well, I've got a
found kid right here.

172
00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:11,330
I've got a bad
feeling about this.

173
00:06:11,330 --> 00:06:13,940
Jots down a number
for social services.

174
00:06:13,940 --> 00:06:16,130
So that's the final
outline for the scene.

175
00:06:16,127 --> 00:06:18,707
You'll see this is pretty close
to what ends up in the script,

176
00:06:18,710 --> 00:06:19,570
but there are some
key differences.

177
00:06:19,570 --> 00:06:21,360
But there are some
key differences, yeah.

178
00:06:21,362 --> 00:06:23,722
So Ross will now read that--
this scene in the script

179
00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:24,220
for us.

180
00:06:24,220 --> 00:06:27,090
Now I'm just going into
the scene real quick.

181
00:06:27,090 --> 00:06:28,070
Hiss, snap hiss.

182
00:06:28,070 --> 00:06:29,930
An Atlantic cod fries in oil.

183
00:06:29,930 --> 00:06:31,580
Benny tends it.

184
00:06:31,580 --> 00:06:34,520
He slides a plate of fish
and chips to the young girl.

185
00:06:34,520 --> 00:06:36,530
She's seated at the table.

186
00:06:36,530 --> 00:06:37,520
It's just her now.

187
00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:38,570
Regulars are gone.

188
00:06:38,570 --> 00:06:41,360
Her gown has been replaced
with a Fish 'N Fry t-shirt.

189
00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:43,220
It droops to her
knees like a dress.

190
00:06:43,220 --> 00:06:45,350
She stares at the
food with wide eyes.

191
00:06:45,350 --> 00:06:48,110
Benny-- figured you're
going to eat my food anyway.

192
00:06:48,110 --> 00:06:49,590
Might as well eat it right.

193
00:06:49,592 --> 00:06:51,802
The young girl reaches out
to pick up the fish, but--

194
00:06:51,800 --> 00:06:53,300
I said, right.

195
00:06:53,300 --> 00:06:56,900
Benny splashes hot sauce
on the fish, nods okay.

196
00:06:56,900 --> 00:06:58,850
She-- the girl
snatches up the fish

197
00:06:58,850 --> 00:07:00,920
and devours it, no utensils.

198
00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:03,230
Benny-- your parents
forget to feed you?

199
00:07:03,230 --> 00:07:05,450
The girl doesn't respond,
just keeps eating.

200
00:07:05,450 --> 00:07:07,040
That why you ran away?

201
00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:07,970
Still nothing.

202
00:07:07,970 --> 00:07:08,870
They hurt you?

203
00:07:08,870 --> 00:07:09,860
Nothing.

204
00:07:09,860 --> 00:07:12,380
And you went to the
hospital, that it?

205
00:07:12,380 --> 00:07:15,140
But you got scared, ran
off, found your way here?

206
00:07:15,140 --> 00:07:16,940
The girl finally
looks up at Benny.

207
00:07:16,940 --> 00:07:18,440
Has he hit close to the mark?

208
00:07:18,437 --> 00:07:20,267
It seems like she is
finally going to speak,

209
00:07:20,270 --> 00:07:23,000
but instead she nudges her
empty plate over to Benny.

210
00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:24,380
The message is clear--

211
00:07:24,380 --> 00:07:25,470
more.

212
00:07:25,470 --> 00:07:27,050
How about this?

213
00:07:27,050 --> 00:07:29,270
You get more, much as you like.

214
00:07:29,270 --> 00:07:31,610
But first, you've got to
answer a few of my questions.

215
00:07:31,610 --> 00:07:32,570
We got a deal?

216
00:07:32,570 --> 00:07:33,560
No response.

217
00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:34,520
We'll start easy.

218
00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:36,470
My name's Benny,
Benny Henderson.

219
00:07:36,470 --> 00:07:39,740
He holds out a hand, wraps
it around her tiny hand.

220
00:07:39,740 --> 00:07:40,820
Nice to meet you.

221
00:07:40,820 --> 00:07:41,870
And you are?

222
00:07:41,870 --> 00:07:43,250
Still no response.

223
00:07:43,250 --> 00:07:44,010
Benny sighs.

224
00:07:44,012 --> 00:07:45,472
He starts to withdraw
his hand when

225
00:07:45,470 --> 00:07:49,130
he notices a small tattoo on
the inside of her lower wrist.

226
00:07:49,130 --> 00:07:52,280
It reads in simple
black lettering, 11.

227
00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:53,330
Eleven?

228
00:07:53,330 --> 00:07:55,400
The young girl
yanks her hand away.

229
00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:57,170
What's that mean?

230
00:07:57,170 --> 00:07:58,370
No.

231
00:07:58,365 --> 00:07:59,245
Well, I'll be damned.

232
00:07:59,240 --> 00:08:00,260
She speaks.

233
00:08:00,260 --> 00:08:00,770
No?

234
00:08:00,770 --> 00:08:01,520
No what?

235
00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:02,630
Still nothing.

236
00:08:02,630 --> 00:08:04,790
All right, guess
no more fish then.

237
00:08:04,790 --> 00:08:08,150
Benny takes her plate and
starts to walk away when--

238
00:08:08,150 --> 00:08:09,260
Eleven.

239
00:08:09,260 --> 00:08:10,540
Benny turns back around.

240
00:08:10,540 --> 00:08:11,060
Eleven.

241
00:08:11,060 --> 00:08:11,560
Yeah.

242
00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:12,380
What's that mean?

243
00:08:12,380 --> 00:08:14,250
The young girl
points to herself.

244
00:08:14,250 --> 00:08:15,500
Eleven.

245
00:08:15,500 --> 00:08:17,120
We then cut forward.

246
00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:18,180
Benny is on the phone.

247
00:08:18,183 --> 00:08:19,103
I won't read all this.

248
00:08:19,100 --> 00:08:21,920
He's talking to Flor
who's-- works for Hopper,

249
00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:25,190
and he gets a number
for social services.

250
00:08:25,190 --> 00:08:27,290
Then we go back
into the main room

251
00:08:27,290 --> 00:08:29,570
where Eleven's
waiting for her food.

252
00:08:29,570 --> 00:08:31,640
Her legs sway beneath the table.

253
00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:34,200
She becomes aware of a
soft high-pitched noise.

254
00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:35,420
Eee-eee-eee.

255
00:08:35,419 --> 00:08:36,359
She looks up.

256
00:08:36,360 --> 00:08:37,430
It's the screen door.

257
00:08:37,429 --> 00:08:40,799
The wind is gently blowing it,
causing its hinges to squeak.

258
00:08:40,799 --> 00:08:42,199
Eee-eee-eee.

259
00:08:42,200 --> 00:08:43,970
It is incessant, annoying.

260
00:08:43,970 --> 00:08:45,260
She narrows her eyes.

261
00:08:45,260 --> 00:08:48,860
The door stops mid-swing
like it somehow froze.

262
00:08:48,860 --> 00:08:51,140
Eleven looks away, content now.

263
00:08:51,140 --> 00:08:51,920
Right.

264
00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:56,380
So I mean, as you can
see, mostly the same,

265
00:08:56,380 --> 00:08:58,030
but there are changes.

266
00:08:58,030 --> 00:08:59,920
We start with the fish frying.

267
00:08:59,920 --> 00:09:01,090
That's the same way.

268
00:09:01,090 --> 00:09:03,430
We cut to the-- we
cut to them eating.

269
00:09:03,430 --> 00:09:06,460
And then Benny is trying to
get information out of Eleven.

270
00:09:06,460 --> 00:09:07,720
That's the same in both.

271
00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:10,840
And I think it's important
here to sort of reiterate

272
00:09:10,840 --> 00:09:13,210
that idea that we talked
about earlier in the scene

273
00:09:13,210 --> 00:09:15,670
when we were talking about
the DandD scene, which is even

274
00:09:15,670 --> 00:09:19,270
a simple sort of quiet scene
like this, there is conflict.

275
00:09:19,270 --> 00:09:22,690
There's even yes--
there's no yelling even

276
00:09:22,690 --> 00:09:23,710
like in that DandD scene.

277
00:09:23,710 --> 00:09:23,800
No one's--

278
00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:25,240
I mean, Eleven's
hardly speaking.

279
00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:27,570
Eleven's hardly speaking,
but there is still conflict,

280
00:09:27,573 --> 00:09:32,683
the conflict being Benny is
trying to learn who Eleven is

281
00:09:32,680 --> 00:09:35,320
and if she ran from home
and what is her name.

282
00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:38,260
And Eleven is not
giving that information.

283
00:09:38,260 --> 00:09:39,450
Just like in the outline--

284
00:09:39,448 --> 00:09:40,238
She wants to eat.

285
00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:40,660
--she's not speaking.

286
00:09:40,660 --> 00:09:41,420
She just wants to eat.

287
00:09:41,420 --> 00:09:43,800
She's not-- wants to eat
and she certainly doesn't want

288
00:09:43,795 --> 00:09:44,805
to tell him who she is.

289
00:09:44,800 --> 00:09:45,460
She's--

290
00:09:45,460 --> 00:09:47,500
She doesn't-- she has
trust issues, right?

291
00:09:47,500 --> 00:09:48,480
Understandably.

292
00:09:48,475 --> 00:09:49,605
Obviously, we add detail.

293
00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:51,550
We're a little bit more
specific about the type of fish

294
00:09:51,550 --> 00:09:52,420
they're eating, you know.

295
00:09:52,420 --> 00:09:54,310
We didn't spend time
researching any of that

296
00:09:54,310 --> 00:09:56,440
in the outline stage, so we
started to look into, okay,

297
00:09:56,440 --> 00:09:57,520
what kind of food would they--

298
00:09:57,520 --> 00:09:57,940
Yeah.

299
00:09:57,940 --> 00:09:59,590
--probably be serving at a
place like this in Montauk?

300
00:09:59,590 --> 00:10:02,140
So you do start to get a little
bit specific, a little bit

301
00:10:02,140 --> 00:10:06,880
more specific about what
Benny's restaurant looks like.

302
00:10:06,883 --> 00:10:07,553
They hurt you?

303
00:10:10,500 --> 00:10:12,750
You went to the hospital,
you got scared, you ran off,

304
00:10:12,750 --> 00:10:13,340
you wound up here?

305
00:10:13,340 --> 00:10:13,880
Is that it?

306
00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:20,580
All right.

307
00:10:20,577 --> 00:10:22,907
I'll give this back, all
right, and you can have as much

308
00:10:22,910 --> 00:10:25,760
as you want, all right,
maybe even some ice cream.

309
00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:29,940
But you got to answer a few of
my questions first, all right?

310
00:10:29,940 --> 00:10:30,480
Got a deal?

311
00:10:33,150 --> 00:10:35,760
One change we do make,
though, she's not speaking,

312
00:10:35,760 --> 00:10:37,140
which is the same
as the outline.

313
00:10:37,140 --> 00:10:38,850
But in the script,
we have Benny try

314
00:10:38,850 --> 00:10:42,060
a new tactic, which he's
trying to withhold food

315
00:10:42,060 --> 00:10:43,710
from her in order to get--

316
00:10:43,710 --> 00:10:44,210
Right.

317
00:10:44,210 --> 00:10:45,660
--get information from her.

318
00:10:45,660 --> 00:10:48,240
Because I think, as we went
into scene, we were like, well,

319
00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:50,190
there's conflict here
that she's not speaking,

320
00:10:50,190 --> 00:10:52,510
but we wanted Benny to
be a little more active.

321
00:10:52,510 --> 00:10:55,870
So we added in that beat, which
is, I think, an improvement.

322
00:10:55,870 --> 00:10:58,470
So again, the scenes
are mostly the same,

323
00:10:58,470 --> 00:11:01,590
but we're adding in stuff to
make this scene a little better

324
00:11:01,590 --> 00:11:02,880
and a little bit more dynamic.

325
00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:04,500
And the same thing
goes with-- yeah.

326
00:11:04,497 --> 00:11:06,077
And there are two
other key changes.

327
00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:06,580
Yeah.

328
00:11:06,580 --> 00:11:09,600
One is he sees her
tattoo and she tells him

329
00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:11,240
her name, which is Eleven.

330
00:11:11,243 --> 00:11:12,663
And I think what's
nice about this

331
00:11:12,660 --> 00:11:15,690
is you're starting to have
these characters connect

332
00:11:15,690 --> 00:11:16,860
in more of a real way.

333
00:11:16,860 --> 00:11:18,760
Benny is starting
to care for her.

334
00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:19,260
Yeah.

335
00:11:19,260 --> 00:11:20,940
Hopefully the audience is
starting to care about Benny.

336
00:11:20,940 --> 00:11:22,530
They don't know he's
going to die soon.

337
00:11:22,530 --> 00:11:23,030
Yeah.

338
00:11:23,030 --> 00:11:25,080
But it's something
emotional that

339
00:11:25,075 --> 00:11:26,705
is, I think, better
in the final script

340
00:11:26,700 --> 00:11:27,780
than it is in the outline.

341
00:11:27,783 --> 00:11:30,163
The other key change
we made, of course,

342
00:11:30,160 --> 00:11:33,540
is we removed the
moment where she

343
00:11:33,540 --> 00:11:37,480
tells Benny she knows something
about his friend who died.

344
00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:37,980
She has--

345
00:11:37,980 --> 00:11:38,920
Her psychic powers.

346
00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:40,920
She's psychic, so she's
able to read his mind.

347
00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:43,170
We have a very
similar beat, right,

348
00:11:43,170 --> 00:11:45,400
where she stops the
swinging screen door.

349
00:11:45,395 --> 00:11:47,525
So it's still-- both beats
are doing the same thing

350
00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:49,100
or accomplishing the
same thing, which

351
00:11:49,103 --> 00:11:51,393
is revealing for the
audience that Eleven

352
00:11:51,390 --> 00:11:55,440
has psychic or psionic
abilities, and it's exciting.

353
00:11:55,440 --> 00:11:58,410
I think why it's
better in the script is

354
00:11:58,410 --> 00:12:00,970
it's just a little bit--
it's more visual, right?

355
00:12:00,973 --> 00:12:02,643
I mean, you're seeing
her use her powers

356
00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:03,950
to physically stop something.

357
00:12:03,953 --> 00:12:05,373
But I think the
real reason we did

358
00:12:05,370 --> 00:12:07,650
it was because it's
better to have that

359
00:12:07,650 --> 00:12:10,290
at the end of the scene
as a way to punch it out.

360
00:12:10,290 --> 00:12:12,840
It's good to have him
calling social services

361
00:12:12,843 --> 00:12:14,763
or writing down the
number for social services

362
00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:16,680
because you know the
next beat is going to be,

363
00:12:16,677 --> 00:12:19,227
quote unquote, "social
services showing up."

364
00:12:19,230 --> 00:12:21,510
So it is setting
up the next scene.

365
00:12:21,510 --> 00:12:23,520
Benny's going to involve
more people here.

366
00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:25,680
But that's not nearly
as strong of an out

367
00:12:25,680 --> 00:12:29,370
as Eleven demonstrating to the
audience for the first time

368
00:12:29,370 --> 00:12:31,080
that she has psionic
powers, that she's

369
00:12:31,080 --> 00:12:32,700
more than just a regular girl.

370
00:12:32,700 --> 00:12:36,130
[FAN SCREECHING]

371
00:12:43,980 --> 00:12:46,320
So that's a lot more of an
exciting, quote unquote,

372
00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:48,180
"cliffhanger" to
end your scene on.

373
00:12:48,180 --> 00:12:51,000
And it also creates a bit of--
whereas, before, Benny goes,

374
00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:53,970
wait, there's something
special about this girl, now,

375
00:12:53,970 --> 00:12:55,020
he doesn't know that.

376
00:12:55,020 --> 00:12:56,700
Only the audience
knows that, so we're

377
00:12:56,700 --> 00:12:59,910
creating a little bit of
dramatic irony here where--

378
00:12:59,910 --> 00:13:01,650
which is essentially,
the audience

379
00:13:01,650 --> 00:13:04,030
know something that
a character does not.

380
00:13:04,030 --> 00:13:06,420
So in this case, now the
audience is aware that this

381
00:13:06,420 --> 00:13:09,350
girl has some sort of special
abilities, but Benny doesn't.

382
00:13:09,348 --> 00:13:10,888
And that creates an
exciting question

383
00:13:10,890 --> 00:13:12,450
for the audience, which
is what's going to happen?

384
00:13:12,450 --> 00:13:14,490
Is Benny going to find
out about these powers?

385
00:13:14,490 --> 00:13:15,540
What's the next beat?

386
00:13:15,540 --> 00:13:17,550
It gives us-- it sort
of keeps, continues

387
00:13:17,550 --> 00:13:19,200
to propel the story forward.

388
00:13:19,200 --> 00:13:21,420
And like Matt's saying,
I'm on my edge of my seat

389
00:13:21,420 --> 00:13:23,550
now because this girl
has powers and Benny

390
00:13:23,550 --> 00:13:24,640
doesn't know about it.

391
00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:25,990
That's much more exciting.

392
00:13:25,990 --> 00:13:28,470
So we're continuing
to take these scenes

393
00:13:28,470 --> 00:13:30,190
and we're trying
to elevate them.

394
00:13:30,190 --> 00:13:34,490
But generally, the
beats stayed the same.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,350


2
00:00:05,858 --> 00:00:07,398
As you're moving
into script stage,

3
00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:08,480
and you're going
to start turning

4
00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:10,560
this outline into a script,
it's important to keep

5
00:00:10,563 --> 00:00:13,253
in mind there are three key
elements to every script--

6
00:00:13,250 --> 00:00:15,810
description, action,
and dialogue.

7
00:00:15,805 --> 00:00:17,185
Those are the
three things you're

8
00:00:17,180 --> 00:00:18,770
going to need to
practice and get good at.

9
00:00:18,770 --> 00:00:20,120
And you're going to have
to kind of figure out

10
00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:22,040
what your style
is in terms of how

11
00:00:22,040 --> 00:00:24,300
you do each of those things.

12
00:00:24,300 --> 00:00:27,200
And so Ross and I, when we
were learning how to write,

13
00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:29,060
the best thing to
do is actually not

14
00:00:29,060 --> 00:00:30,560
even to take a
screenwriting class.

15
00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:32,960
The best thing to do is
just to read other scripts.

16
00:00:32,955 --> 00:00:34,585
Read scripts from
movies that you like.

17
00:00:34,580 --> 00:00:37,490
Read-- you know, even
reading bad scripts helps.

18
00:00:37,490 --> 00:00:40,070
And the good news now is
that with the internet,

19
00:00:40,070 --> 00:00:42,510
most scripts are
available online.

20
00:00:42,510 --> 00:00:44,000
If you just Google
for them, you'll

21
00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:46,580
be able to find a PDF
for almost anything.

22
00:00:46,580 --> 00:00:49,970
You can read scripts
to old classic films.

23
00:00:49,970 --> 00:00:52,070
We would also suggest,
though, reading some more

24
00:00:52,070 --> 00:00:55,400
recent examples because
screenplay formatting, which

25
00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:57,680
I know we're not really
getting into right now much,

26
00:00:57,680 --> 00:00:59,880
but it has changed a
lot over the years.

27
00:00:59,875 --> 00:01:01,255
It's going to be
a little more up

28
00:01:01,250 --> 00:01:04,710
to date in terms of how we write
and format scripts these days.

29
00:01:04,710 --> 00:01:06,710
The best thing to do
is to find a screenwriter

30
00:01:06,710 --> 00:01:09,950
out there whose style you
enjoy, who writes in a way that

31
00:01:09,950 --> 00:01:11,510
feels a lot like you.

32
00:01:11,510 --> 00:01:13,490
When we were
learning how to write,

33
00:01:13,490 --> 00:01:15,140
we read a bunch of scripts.

34
00:01:15,140 --> 00:01:17,570
And we found a
couple that really

35
00:01:17,570 --> 00:01:19,790
spoke to us in
terms of their style

36
00:01:19,790 --> 00:01:22,220
that we really responded to.

37
00:01:22,220 --> 00:01:25,190
And one is a script
called "Panic Room," which

38
00:01:25,190 --> 00:01:29,180
is written by David Koepp, which
was made into a movie directed

39
00:01:29,180 --> 00:01:32,600
by David Fincher and starring
Jodie Foster and Kristen

40
00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:33,140
Stewart.

41
00:01:33,140 --> 00:01:35,000
So he's a great screenwriter.

42
00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:36,890
"Panic Room" was
a huge spec sale.

43
00:01:36,890 --> 00:01:38,360
I think that's
probably initially

44
00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:39,930
why we wanted to
look at that script.

45
00:01:39,930 --> 00:01:42,290
We also love that movie.

46
00:01:42,290 --> 00:01:45,290
And it's a really good script to
learn because of the simplicity

47
00:01:45,290 --> 00:01:46,100
of the storyline.

48
00:01:46,100 --> 00:01:48,740
Its two characters
trapped in one location.

49
00:01:48,740 --> 00:01:52,340
But let's look at how
he writes descriptions--

50
00:01:52,340 --> 00:01:55,550
"interior, top-floor
bedroom, day.

51
00:01:55,550 --> 00:01:59,330
Evan, Lydia, and Meg poke their
heads in a series of rooms one

52
00:01:59,330 --> 00:02:00,270
after the other.

53
00:02:00,270 --> 00:02:02,120
The two are flying by quickly.

54
00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:03,920
First, an upstairs bedroom--

55
00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:06,590
nice, roomy, looks
out on the courtyard."

56
00:02:06,590 --> 00:02:09,860
And then Evan says, top floor,
two bedrooms, one bathroom.

57
00:02:09,860 --> 00:02:13,340
And then in another scene
heading, "interior, den, day.

58
00:02:13,340 --> 00:02:15,170
Another floor,
another empty room.

59
00:02:15,170 --> 00:02:17,150
The trio passes through."

60
00:02:17,150 --> 00:02:19,630
Why I wanted to illustrate
this as David Koepp writes

61
00:02:19,627 --> 00:02:21,707
a lot of his descriptions
like this, which is they

62
00:02:21,710 --> 00:02:23,030
are very bare.

63
00:02:23,030 --> 00:02:25,070
I mean, he doesn't waste
time describing what

64
00:02:25,070 --> 00:02:26,630
any of these rooms looks like.

65
00:02:26,630 --> 00:02:29,450
He's already described it
as a New York brownstone.

66
00:02:29,450 --> 00:02:31,740
He doesn't really describe
it any more than that.

67
00:02:31,740 --> 00:02:33,000
I mean, the rooms are empty.

68
00:02:33,003 --> 00:02:34,673
But he doesn't go
into detail describing

69
00:02:34,670 --> 00:02:38,100
the color of the walls,
cracked paint, any of that.

70
00:02:38,100 --> 00:02:40,970
"Another floor, another
empty room--" boom, in, out.

71
00:02:40,970 --> 00:02:41,860
This script flies.

72
00:02:41,860 --> 00:02:44,360
And that's one reason we liked
it so much because, you know,

73
00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:46,190
when we're talking about how
important it is to get people

74
00:02:46,190 --> 00:02:47,720
to just keep flipping
the pages, there's

75
00:02:47,720 --> 00:02:49,970
no way you could start "Panic
Room" and not finish it.

76
00:02:49,970 --> 00:02:51,230
The only important thing--

77
00:02:51,230 --> 00:02:54,190
David Koepp knows this, right,
because it's his story--

78
00:02:54,190 --> 00:02:56,690
is that the only important thing
about the top-floor bedroom

79
00:02:56,690 --> 00:02:58,460
is that it looks out
onto the courtyard.

80
00:02:58,460 --> 00:02:59,280
So he puts that--

81
00:02:59,280 --> 00:02:59,780
Yes.

82
00:02:59,780 --> 00:03:01,040
--but nothing else.

83
00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:02,840
But that's good
because then it's

84
00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:05,900
highlighting that factor,
which is the only factor that's

85
00:03:05,903 --> 00:03:08,073
going to impact the narrative
in any meaningful way.

86
00:03:08,070 --> 00:03:09,500
So he does underscore that.

87
00:03:09,500 --> 00:03:11,960
But everything else he
leaves up to the imagination

88
00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:12,660
of the reader.

89
00:03:12,663 --> 00:03:13,833
That's how you should do it.

90
00:03:13,830 --> 00:03:15,860
And so I think if you
look at what we wrote,

91
00:03:15,860 --> 00:03:19,640
I think you can see how we took
inspiration from David's style.

92
00:03:19,640 --> 00:03:21,650
You can look at from
the shooting script

93
00:03:21,645 --> 00:03:22,525
of "Stranger Things."

94
00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:25,280
This is early on
after Will has--

95
00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:27,110
he's encountered
something in the road.

96
00:03:27,110 --> 00:03:28,730
And he's gotten off his bike.

97
00:03:28,730 --> 00:03:32,570
And he's trying to escape
whatever this evil is

98
00:03:32,570 --> 00:03:33,440
and get home.

99
00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:36,080
And we say, "Will
burst out of the woods.

100
00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:37,670
Up ahead, his house.

101
00:03:37,670 --> 00:03:40,970
It is small, one story,
lower class, falling apart."

102
00:03:40,970 --> 00:03:42,140
That's it.

103
00:03:42,140 --> 00:03:44,790
You know, in a book, if we
were writing "Stranger Things"

104
00:03:44,790 --> 00:03:48,500
as a novel, we'd probably go
into more detail describing

105
00:03:48,500 --> 00:03:52,430
the surroundings, describing
exactly how that house appears

106
00:03:52,430 --> 00:03:53,090
and looks like.

107
00:03:53,085 --> 00:03:54,335
What's the color of the walls?

108
00:03:54,335 --> 00:03:56,025
Is the paint peeling?

109
00:03:56,020 --> 00:03:57,740
Is the lawn overgrown?

110
00:03:57,740 --> 00:03:58,820
You know--

111
00:03:58,820 --> 00:03:59,900
Are these trees around?

112
00:03:59,900 --> 00:04:00,890
You know, are
there trees around?

113
00:04:00,890 --> 00:04:02,270
What is the
color of the grass?

114
00:04:02,265 --> 00:04:04,345
We just skipped all of
that because we want

115
00:04:04,340 --> 00:04:05,970
the reader to fly through this.

116
00:04:05,970 --> 00:04:08,780
We're giving them everything
that they really need to know,

117
00:04:08,780 --> 00:04:11,480
is that Will lives in
a lower-class house.

118
00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:12,710
And it's falling apart.

119
00:04:12,710 --> 00:04:14,570
And in falling
apart, they can start

120
00:04:14,570 --> 00:04:15,950
to-- they can imagine that.

121
00:04:15,950 --> 00:04:17,220
They get it.

122
00:04:17,220 --> 00:04:19,430
And then you'll-- your
production designer will fill

123
00:04:19,430 --> 00:04:19,760
that in.

124
00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:21,890
And you can work with your
production design later.

125
00:04:21,885 --> 00:04:23,905
I can't tell you how
much time we waste it

126
00:04:23,900 --> 00:04:25,400
early on when we
are learning how

127
00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:29,120
to write just trying to be fancy
and show off with our writing.

128
00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:29,960
No one cares.

129
00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:32,210
What matters is get the
information across you

130
00:04:32,210 --> 00:04:33,170
need to get across.

131
00:04:33,170 --> 00:04:33,920
That's it.

132
00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:35,270
Move on to the next beat.

133
00:04:35,270 --> 00:04:36,350
That's all you have to do.

134
00:04:36,353 --> 00:04:38,963
No executive's going to
be impressed by a big word

135
00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:39,650
that you use.

136
00:04:39,650 --> 00:04:42,320
You don't have to put a single
big word in your script.

137
00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:45,480
Just-- they're going to be
impressed by a good story.

138
00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:47,360
So that's description,
very simple.

139
00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:49,640
The same rules apply
really for everything else.

140
00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:51,800
It really definitely
applies to action, I think.

141
00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:53,180
I can't tell you
how many scripts

142
00:04:53,175 --> 00:04:55,555
we've read where the action
is kind of over described.

143
00:04:55,550 --> 00:04:56,420
We used to do that.

144
00:04:56,420 --> 00:04:57,860
We used to worry
about describing

145
00:04:57,860 --> 00:04:59,800
every beat, every punch.

146
00:04:59,802 --> 00:05:01,762
It's, like, you're not
an action choreographer.

147
00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:03,510
Like, you don't have
to figure it all out.

148
00:05:03,510 --> 00:05:05,040
Simple, clean is better.

149
00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:08,790
So, again, we learned a little
bit about this from David Koepp

150
00:05:08,790 --> 00:05:10,620
in terms of how quick
his action read.

151
00:05:10,620 --> 00:05:12,640
And that's because he
kept it very, very simple.

152
00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:15,130
So let's look at another
scene from "Panic Room."

153
00:05:15,130 --> 00:05:17,370
This is a little bit
deeper into the story.

154
00:05:17,370 --> 00:05:19,470
The way David Koepp
describes this

155
00:05:19,470 --> 00:05:23,700
is, "Meg's thumb tenses for
one good hard turn dash, dash.

156
00:05:23,700 --> 00:05:26,610
Then in the bedroom comma
Burnham leaps through the air,

157
00:05:26,610 --> 00:05:29,220
hurtling himself toward
the propane tank dash dash.

158
00:05:29,220 --> 00:05:31,260
Inside the duct, Meg
cranks the wheel.

159
00:05:31,260 --> 00:05:33,630
A spark sparks, a flame flames.

160
00:05:33,630 --> 00:05:36,400
And a hot blue cloud shoots
out in two directions,

161
00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:38,970
one toward the panic room,
the other toward the bedroom."

162
00:05:38,970 --> 00:05:40,980
He wrote that about as
simply as you could.

163
00:05:40,980 --> 00:05:43,300
He described only what
you needed to know.

164
00:05:43,300 --> 00:05:46,230
There's no flourishes about--

165
00:05:46,230 --> 00:05:47,730
"a flame flames."

166
00:05:47,730 --> 00:05:49,110
Like, it's so basic.

167
00:05:49,110 --> 00:05:50,310
"A spark sparks."

168
00:05:50,307 --> 00:05:52,137
I mean, it has a nice
rhythm to it actually.

169
00:05:52,140 --> 00:05:54,960
It's not-- it's good writing,
but it's very, very simple

170
00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:55,530
writing.

171
00:05:55,530 --> 00:05:57,750
So I'll show you
an example of how

172
00:05:57,750 --> 00:06:00,690
we wrote this in "Hidden,"
which, again, is a bomb shelter

173
00:06:00,690 --> 00:06:03,660
script we wrote that became
a film for Warner Brothers.

174
00:06:03,660 --> 00:06:05,400
So this is a scene
where, remember,

175
00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:08,970
they're trying to hide from
these so-called monsters that

176
00:06:08,970 --> 00:06:10,020
are on the surface.

177
00:06:10,020 --> 00:06:11,470
They're in the bomb shelter.

178
00:06:11,470 --> 00:06:15,630
One of our main characters, Ray,
is trying to close the door.

179
00:06:15,630 --> 00:06:18,870
But a Breather, who's our
monster, rips open the door.

180
00:06:18,870 --> 00:06:21,930
And we describe him as having
"a powerful and hulking body,

181
00:06:21,930 --> 00:06:25,140
heaving with every raspy
breath, a untangle of appendages

182
00:06:25,140 --> 00:06:27,870
drooping down his neck,
and most terrifying of all,

183
00:06:27,870 --> 00:06:29,220
glowing red eyes.

184
00:06:29,220 --> 00:06:32,280
The Breather suddenly hisses,
diving through the opening,

185
00:06:32,280 --> 00:06:33,600
lunging right at Ray.

186
00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:34,800
And whoom!

187
00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:37,710
Something large smashes the
Breather on the face so hard

188
00:06:37,710 --> 00:06:40,050
and knocks him a few
feet away from the door."

189
00:06:40,050 --> 00:06:42,730
So again, it's very
simple description.

190
00:06:42,730 --> 00:06:47,820
It's also spaced out, which is
something you can do to give--

191
00:06:47,820 --> 00:06:49,710
allow your action
room to breathe,

192
00:06:49,710 --> 00:06:51,990
allow people to keep
flipping through those pages.

193
00:06:51,990 --> 00:06:54,270
Like, what we like to
do is mirror the writing

194
00:06:54,270 --> 00:06:55,860
with the pace a little bit.

195
00:06:55,860 --> 00:06:59,040
So we could have smushed that
all together in a paragraph.

196
00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:01,620
But by spreading it
out, it highlights--

197
00:07:01,620 --> 00:07:02,460
--how fast.

198
00:07:02,460 --> 00:07:04,150
--how fast it goes
in each moment.

199
00:07:04,150 --> 00:07:07,050
And also makes your script
read really, really fast.

200
00:07:07,050 --> 00:07:09,060
You're just going to keep
flipping those pages.

201
00:07:09,060 --> 00:07:10,660
What's going to happen next?

202
00:07:10,660 --> 00:07:13,510
And again, very simple
language, very simple writing.

203
00:07:13,510 --> 00:07:16,380
So now we've talked about
action and descriptions.

204
00:07:16,380 --> 00:07:17,730
We should talk about dialogue.

205
00:07:17,730 --> 00:07:19,500
So this is actually
probably going

206
00:07:19,500 --> 00:07:22,520
to be the biggest difference
or biggest change,

207
00:07:22,523 --> 00:07:23,943
the most work
you're going to have

208
00:07:23,940 --> 00:07:26,980
to do when you're turning your
final outline into a script.

209
00:07:26,980 --> 00:07:29,130
Yeah, you may have had
some basic dialogue

210
00:07:29,130 --> 00:07:30,090
in your final outline.

211
00:07:30,090 --> 00:07:32,910
I think you saw that we had some
very spare dialogue in there,

212
00:07:32,910 --> 00:07:35,610
suggestions of really
what they could be saying.

213
00:07:35,610 --> 00:07:37,410
But it's pretty rough.

214
00:07:37,410 --> 00:07:40,920
So a lot of it at the time--
and we said it takes two weeks.

215
00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:43,110
A lot of that two weeks
is going to be spent

216
00:07:43,110 --> 00:07:44,880
kind of refining your dialogue.

217
00:07:44,880 --> 00:07:46,800
But again, just like
action descriptions,

218
00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:48,780
we think simplicity
is your friend here.

219
00:07:48,780 --> 00:07:52,020
Often just like how action
descriptions are overwritten,

220
00:07:52,020 --> 00:07:53,640
dialogue is often overwritten.

221
00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:55,140
Nobody talks like that.

222
00:07:55,140 --> 00:07:58,380
And I think it's also worth
looking again at "Panic Room."

223
00:07:58,380 --> 00:08:00,840
We looked at how David
Koepp wrote dialogue.

224
00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:03,050
So Ross and I will show
you our acting skills.

225
00:08:03,047 --> 00:08:04,377
And we're going to act this out.

226
00:08:04,380 --> 00:08:06,690
I'm going to be Sarah,
and he's going to be Meg.

227
00:08:06,690 --> 00:08:08,470
Sarah is the daughter, and Meg--

228
00:08:08,472 --> 00:08:09,182
Meg is the mom.

229
00:08:09,180 --> 00:08:09,720
You're the mother.

230
00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:10,980
I'm Jodie Foster, yeah.

231
00:08:10,980 --> 00:08:12,000
I'm Kristin Stewart.

232
00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:12,500
All right.

233
00:08:12,500 --> 00:08:13,090
All right.

234
00:08:13,090 --> 00:08:13,590
All right.

235
00:08:13,590 --> 00:08:15,420
We'll show him how it's done.

236
00:08:15,420 --> 00:08:16,170
What do we do?

237
00:08:16,170 --> 00:08:17,110
ROSS AS MEG: Wait.

238
00:08:17,113 --> 00:08:18,783
MATT AS SARAH: What
if they get in here?

239
00:08:18,780 --> 00:08:19,390
ROSS AS MEG: They can't.

240
00:08:19,387 --> 00:08:20,347
They can't get in here.

241
00:08:20,345 --> 00:08:21,195
No, they can't.

242
00:08:21,195 --> 00:08:22,325
MATT AS SARAH: I heard you.

243
00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:23,070
ROSS AS MEG: Feel okay?

244
00:08:23,070 --> 00:08:23,550
MATT AS SARAH: Yeah.

245
00:08:23,550 --> 00:08:24,210
ROSS AS MEG: Shaky?

246
00:08:24,210 --> 00:08:24,720
MATT AS SARAH: No.

247
00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:25,770
ROSS AS MEG: Chills?

248
00:08:25,770 --> 00:08:27,570
MATT AS SARAH: Mm-mm.

249
00:08:27,574 --> 00:08:28,414
That's it.

250
00:08:28,415 --> 00:08:28,915
That's it.

251
00:08:28,915 --> 00:08:30,625
Well, okay, that's--
first of all,

252
00:08:30,620 --> 00:08:33,520
you see why we went into writing
and directing and not acting.

253
00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:35,620
But also, you'll
see how simple--

254
00:08:35,620 --> 00:08:37,570
that simple that dialogue is.

255
00:08:37,570 --> 00:08:40,550
It's, like, I mean, this is
a kind of an extreme example.

256
00:08:40,548 --> 00:08:41,588
But you know what I mean?

257
00:08:41,590 --> 00:08:43,160
I like-- I like how quick it is.

258
00:08:43,159 --> 00:08:43,659
Yeah.

259
00:08:43,659 --> 00:08:45,909
I like that his dialogue
reads really quickly here

260
00:08:45,908 --> 00:08:47,198
because often people like that.

261
00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:49,300
And this is a situation
where they're really nervous.

262
00:08:49,300 --> 00:08:51,590
The mother and daughter are
firing back and forth first

263
00:08:51,592 --> 00:08:52,242
really fast.

264
00:08:52,240 --> 00:08:54,040
And something you also see--

265
00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:55,690
and this is something
we like to do

266
00:08:55,690 --> 00:08:59,830
as well that David Koepp does--
is he has the mom, played

267
00:08:59,830 --> 00:09:01,690
by Ross, repeating words.

268
00:09:01,690 --> 00:09:03,010
So she goes, "they can't.

269
00:09:03,010 --> 00:09:04,150
They can't get in here.

270
00:09:04,150 --> 00:09:05,000
No, they can't."

271
00:09:04,995 --> 00:09:06,375
She keeps repeating
"they can't."

272
00:09:06,370 --> 00:09:08,950
She's trying to reassure herself
that they won't get in there.

273
00:09:08,953 --> 00:09:10,333
But she's just looping.

274
00:09:10,330 --> 00:09:12,700
And that's something you
often don't see in dialogue,

275
00:09:12,700 --> 00:09:14,120
but you do see and
dialogue that's

276
00:09:14,117 --> 00:09:17,197
written well because that's
really how people speak,

277
00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:20,170
especially when they're in these
sort of anxious situations.

278
00:09:20,170 --> 00:09:21,140
They repeat themselves.

279
00:09:21,140 --> 00:09:22,930
I mean, we've been repeating
ourselves over and over

280
00:09:22,930 --> 00:09:23,510
in this class.

281
00:09:23,513 --> 00:09:25,183
And the editors have
just cut it out.

282
00:09:25,180 --> 00:09:25,720
Blue sky.

283
00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:26,260
Blue sky.

284
00:09:26,260 --> 00:09:26,860
Blue sky.

285
00:09:26,858 --> 00:09:27,398
Zoomed out.

286
00:09:27,400 --> 00:09:28,120
Zoomed out.

287
00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:28,990
More zoomed out.

288
00:09:28,988 --> 00:09:29,528
Baby steps.

289
00:09:29,530 --> 00:09:30,130
Baby steps.

290
00:09:30,130 --> 00:09:31,120
Baby steps.

291
00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:34,090
And throw in "you knows"
and "ums" and uncertainties.

292
00:09:34,090 --> 00:09:35,560
And we do a lot of dashes.

293
00:09:35,560 --> 00:09:36,650
You don't have to do that.

294
00:09:36,650 --> 00:09:39,490
But again, you want to
messy it up a little bit.

295
00:09:39,490 --> 00:09:42,050
Just, you want the dialogue
to keep pushing forward.

296
00:09:42,050 --> 00:09:44,340
You don't want it to always
loop around too much.

297
00:09:44,340 --> 00:09:46,090
You want to give it
that forward momentum.

298
00:09:46,090 --> 00:09:47,740
But you want to make
it a little messy.

299
00:09:47,740 --> 00:09:49,420
If it's too clean,
if it's too perfect,

300
00:09:49,420 --> 00:09:50,830
it's not going to feel real.

301
00:09:50,830 --> 00:09:52,900
You've spent your whole
life listening to people

302
00:09:52,900 --> 00:09:53,920
and how they talk.

303
00:09:53,915 --> 00:09:55,545
And so you just want
to try to get some

304
00:09:55,540 --> 00:09:57,820
of that realism in your script.

305
00:09:57,820 --> 00:09:59,320
Again, it's a little heightened.

306
00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:02,560
We're pushing it along a
little more unnaturally

307
00:10:02,560 --> 00:10:03,940
than it would be in real life.

308
00:10:03,940 --> 00:10:06,580
But you've got to fill it in
with those real-life details

309
00:10:06,580 --> 00:10:07,730
to make it come alive.

310
00:10:07,733 --> 00:10:09,773
And you also notice that
he doesn't-- you know,

311
00:10:09,775 --> 00:10:13,245
you'll see sometimes writers
will put in parentheses.

312
00:10:13,240 --> 00:10:16,030
They'll put a description of
how a character is feeling.

313
00:10:16,030 --> 00:10:17,710
So they'll put in anxious.

314
00:10:17,710 --> 00:10:21,160
He doesn't-- or nervous to tell
the reader and the actor how

315
00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:22,360
the character should feel.

316
00:10:22,362 --> 00:10:24,322
I think you should limit
how often you do this.

317
00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:27,730
So you'll notice here he does
it on that line that Meg,

318
00:10:27,730 --> 00:10:30,370
that Ross performed so
beautifully, where he says,

319
00:10:30,370 --> 00:10:32,410
Meg is nervous, is you're
going, "they can't.

320
00:10:32,412 --> 00:10:33,372
They can't get in here.

321
00:10:33,370 --> 00:10:34,150
No, they can't."

322
00:10:34,150 --> 00:10:36,830
He doesn't say
anxious or nervous.

323
00:10:36,828 --> 00:10:38,618
He doesn't tell you
how the mom is feeling.

324
00:10:38,620 --> 00:10:41,430
In fact, there's no descriptions
here in this dialogue.

325
00:10:41,430 --> 00:10:43,540
It's just a beautiful
nice chunk of dialogue.

326
00:10:43,540 --> 00:10:46,210
I don't think you should limit
how often you're breaking up

327
00:10:46,210 --> 00:10:48,460
dialogue with descriptions
because it just

328
00:10:48,460 --> 00:10:50,270
hurts the rhythm and the pace.

329
00:10:50,270 --> 00:10:52,240
You get that the mom is anxious.

330
00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:53,740
Again, your reader's not stupid.

331
00:10:53,740 --> 00:10:55,370
Your audience is not stupid.

332
00:10:55,370 --> 00:10:57,130
They understand
the mom is nervous.

333
00:10:57,130 --> 00:10:59,080
And that should come
across in the dialogue.

334
00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:01,460
If you're having to tell the
audience that she's anxious,

335
00:11:01,455 --> 00:11:03,555
that maybe your dialogue's
not working so well.

336
00:11:03,550 --> 00:11:05,420
Maybe you need to
rework that line.

337
00:11:05,420 --> 00:11:08,770
So now we're going to look
at a scene from season four

338
00:11:08,770 --> 00:11:12,160
to demonstrate how dialogue
works in "Stranger Things."

339
00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:17,140
This is a scene in episode
four, where Robin and Nancy go

340
00:11:17,140 --> 00:11:18,520
to Pennhurst Asylum.

341
00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:21,490
And they're trying to
convince the director

342
00:11:21,490 --> 00:11:23,110
of Pennhurst Asylum, Hatch--

343
00:11:23,110 --> 00:11:24,100
Impressive.

344
00:11:24,100 --> 00:11:25,960
--to let them
see Victor Creel,

345
00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:29,140
who they really desperately
need to talk to learn about--

346
00:11:29,140 --> 00:11:31,010
to learn some key information.

347
00:11:31,010 --> 00:11:32,690
So I'm going to read
some of the scene.

348
00:11:32,690 --> 00:11:34,450
I'm going to do the
descriptions in Hatch.

349
00:11:34,450 --> 00:11:38,860
Matt'll play Robin and
Nancy in the tour de force.

350
00:11:38,860 --> 00:11:42,970
So "interior Pennhurst Asylum,
Director Hatch's office, day.

351
00:11:42,970 --> 00:11:45,850
Director Hatch lowers the
resumes to reveal our girl

352
00:11:45,850 --> 00:11:47,200
sitting across from him.

353
00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:49,850
As Robin tugs annoyingly
at her collar,

354
00:11:49,850 --> 00:11:52,130
Nancy hands him another paper."

355
00:11:52,128 --> 00:11:53,918
MATT AS NANCY: And this
is a recommendation

356
00:11:53,920 --> 00:11:55,420
from Professor Brantley.

357
00:11:55,420 --> 00:11:58,060
ROSS AS HATCH: Oh, I know
Larry, quite well, actually.

358
00:11:58,060 --> 00:12:00,490
The director scans
the recommendation.

359
00:12:00,490 --> 00:12:04,060
(AS HATCH) You know what they
say, those who can't do, teach.

360
00:12:04,060 --> 00:12:06,040
He tosses down the
recommendation.

361
00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:08,200
Robin continues to
tug at her collar.

362
00:12:08,200 --> 00:12:09,400
She's being weird.

363
00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:11,230
Nancy gives her a look, stop it.

364
00:12:11,230 --> 00:12:13,240
Then back to the director.

365
00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:15,760
MATT AS NANCY: Yes, that's,
um, actually why we're here.

366
00:12:15,760 --> 00:12:18,180
We can only learn so
much in a classroom.

367
00:12:18,183 --> 00:12:20,353
ROSS AS HATCH: And I'm
sympathetic to your struggle,

368
00:12:20,350 --> 00:12:21,100
truly.

369
00:12:21,100 --> 00:12:24,070
But there is a protocol to
visiting a patient like Victor.

370
00:12:24,070 --> 00:12:25,480
You have to put in a request.

371
00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:26,980
Then you have to
undergo a screening

372
00:12:26,980 --> 00:12:29,920
process, at which point, the
board will make a decision.

373
00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:31,390
Robin and Nancy share looks.

374
00:12:31,390 --> 00:12:33,190
This is not going
how they hoped.

375
00:12:33,190 --> 00:12:34,840
Robin tugs at her collar again.

376
00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:36,450
Jesus, she's a mess.

377
00:12:36,445 --> 00:12:38,445
(AS HATCH) I can see
you're disappointed.

378
00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:41,350
But I'm more than happy to give
you a tour of our facility.

379
00:12:41,350 --> 00:12:43,630
Perhaps you could even speak
to some of our patients

380
00:12:43,630 --> 00:12:45,250
in our low-security wing.

381
00:12:45,250 --> 00:12:46,330
MATT AS NANCY: Right.

382
00:12:46,330 --> 00:12:47,230
We love that.

383
00:12:47,230 --> 00:12:49,690
It's just our thesis
is due next month.

384
00:12:49,690 --> 00:12:50,370
And--

385
00:12:50,373 --> 00:12:51,793
ROSS AS HATCH:
You're out of time.

386
00:12:51,790 --> 00:12:53,140
And whose fault is that?

387
00:12:53,140 --> 00:12:53,400
MATT AS NANCY: I--

388
00:12:53,395 --> 00:12:53,895
I know.

389
00:12:53,895 --> 00:12:56,625
It's just, uh-- yes,
our fault, absolutely.

390
00:12:56,620 --> 00:12:57,620
And I apologize.

391
00:12:57,620 --> 00:12:58,120
But--

392
00:12:58,120 --> 00:12:59,500
And I'm switching over to Robin.

393
00:12:59,500 --> 00:13:00,880
(AS ROBIN) Don't
apologize, Ruth.

394
00:13:00,875 --> 00:13:01,415
Screw that.

395
00:13:01,412 --> 00:13:03,372
ROSS DUFFER: Nancy shoots
Robin a shocked look.

396
00:13:03,370 --> 00:13:04,480
But Robin continues.

397
00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:05,290
MATT AS ROBIN: The
fact of the matter

398
00:13:05,290 --> 00:13:07,870
is we did put in the request
months ago and were denied.

399
00:13:07,870 --> 00:13:09,910
And then we reapplied
and were denied again.

400
00:13:09,912 --> 00:13:11,622
And coming here was
our last-ditch effort

401
00:13:11,620 --> 00:13:12,670
to save our thesis.

402
00:13:12,670 --> 00:13:14,950
And-- and I can't
breathe in this thing!

403
00:13:14,950 --> 00:13:17,650
She finally button's the
top button, sucks in some air.

404
00:13:17,650 --> 00:13:19,350
Nancy stares at
her with wide eyes.

405
00:13:19,348 --> 00:13:20,888
MATT AS NANCY: Rose,
maybe you should

406
00:13:20,890 --> 00:13:22,360
go outside and get some air.

407
00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:24,430
MATT AS ROBIN: Maybe I should,
Ruth, because you know what?

408
00:13:24,430 --> 00:13:25,780
I'm starting to think
that this whole thing was

409
00:13:25,780 --> 00:13:26,760
a colossal mistake.

410
00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:28,080
I'm breaking out in a rash.

411
00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:29,070
My boobs hurt.

412
00:13:29,070 --> 00:13:30,630
Nancy shoots daggers.

413
00:13:30,630 --> 00:13:31,950
WTF.

414
00:13:31,950 --> 00:13:33,660
Robin is ruining everything.

415
00:13:33,660 --> 00:13:36,180
Yet Rose keeps going.

416
00:13:36,180 --> 00:13:37,470
The truth is, Anthony--

417
00:13:37,470 --> 00:13:38,490
may I call you Anthony?

418
00:13:38,490 --> 00:13:39,070
Maybe we don't need any--

419
00:13:39,070 --> 00:13:40,620
These aren't
actually my clothes.

420
00:13:40,620 --> 00:13:41,340
Blah, blah, blah.

421
00:13:41,340 --> 00:13:43,350
She has a giant monologue here.

422
00:13:43,350 --> 00:13:45,780
I would love to hear Matt
read this entire monologue.

423
00:13:45,780 --> 00:13:49,860
But I think Maya Hawke does
it a lot better than he does.

424
00:13:49,860 --> 00:13:50,670
So--

425
00:13:50,670 --> 00:13:51,360
Rude.

426
00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:53,940
So we're going to stop there.

427
00:13:53,940 --> 00:13:56,520
But she basically does
this entire monologue.

428
00:13:56,520 --> 00:14:00,750
And she says-- she says
that she-- they want--

429
00:14:00,750 --> 00:14:02,760
all they need is 10
minutes with Victor.

430
00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:04,680
But she appeals to
his emotions here.

431
00:14:04,680 --> 00:14:06,180
I mean, that's the key of it.

432
00:14:06,180 --> 00:14:07,350
She appeals to his emotion.

433
00:14:07,350 --> 00:14:09,660
She talks about how
much it means to her

434
00:14:09,660 --> 00:14:11,850
and how she wants to be
exactly like Director Hatch

435
00:14:11,850 --> 00:14:14,520
and how fascinated she is with
the Victor Creel murders, blah,

436
00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:15,480
blah, blah, blah, blah.

437
00:14:15,478 --> 00:14:17,728
But she's taking a very
different tactic here in order

438
00:14:17,730 --> 00:14:18,230
to--

439
00:14:18,230 --> 00:14:20,880
And then we say, off
Director Hatch, staring,

440
00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:24,780
we cut to dash dash "whoom!"

441
00:14:24,780 --> 00:14:25,890
I'm back in 30.

442
00:14:25,890 --> 00:14:28,230
ROSS DUFFER: A shocked but
nevertheless very impressed

443
00:14:28,230 --> 00:14:31,710
Nancy gives Robin a secret
underhanded high five.

444
00:14:31,710 --> 00:14:34,290
And then we cut
to our next scene.

445
00:14:34,290 --> 00:14:36,180
The reason why we
think it works is

446
00:14:36,180 --> 00:14:41,040
because, one, Robin and Nancy
have a very clear goal, which

447
00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:43,170
is they need to see Victor.

448
00:14:43,170 --> 00:14:45,930
So that gives you an
engine to the scene

449
00:14:45,930 --> 00:14:48,150
and for this dialogue to work.

450
00:14:48,150 --> 00:14:50,640
Though Nancy and Robin
have the same goal,

451
00:14:50,640 --> 00:14:53,440
they're on different wavelengths
about how to go about that.

452
00:14:53,435 --> 00:14:54,815
So when Nancy's
doing this, she's

453
00:14:54,810 --> 00:14:57,180
just trying to
ask very politely.

454
00:14:57,180 --> 00:14:59,790
Our thesis is due next month.

455
00:14:59,790 --> 00:15:01,740
And you're out of time.

456
00:15:01,740 --> 00:15:02,970
Whose fault is that?

457
00:15:02,970 --> 00:15:06,550
Ours, absolutely,
and I do apologize.

458
00:15:06,550 --> 00:15:07,680
Don't apologize, Ruth.

459
00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:08,820
Screw that.

460
00:15:08,820 --> 00:15:12,150
Robin decides to go a
very different tactic.

461
00:15:12,150 --> 00:15:14,530
This is an instance
where we said, well,

462
00:15:14,530 --> 00:15:16,800
how the heck is she going
to convince this guy?

463
00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:19,230
And we thought this was
an opportunity for her

464
00:15:19,230 --> 00:15:20,310
to give a big speech.

465
00:15:20,310 --> 00:15:21,810
And so there are
going to be moments

466
00:15:21,810 --> 00:15:24,260
like that where you're not
being spare in your writing.

467
00:15:24,255 --> 00:15:26,135
And you give something--
you're going to give

468
00:15:26,130 --> 00:15:27,390
your character a monologue.

469
00:15:27,390 --> 00:15:28,590
And that's okay.

470
00:15:28,590 --> 00:15:31,830
But then we have Nancy, who's
on a very different wavelength.

471
00:15:31,830 --> 00:15:33,690
She's looking at
Robin in horror.

472
00:15:33,690 --> 00:15:35,580
This is not how this
was supposed to go.

473
00:15:35,580 --> 00:15:38,370
Hatch is sort of stunned by
this whole thing-- everyone

474
00:15:38,370 --> 00:15:39,630
on a bit of a different age.

475
00:15:39,630 --> 00:15:41,520
I'm starting to think
this whole thing is

476
00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:42,960
a colossal mistake.

477
00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:44,910
And that creates
a lot of conflict

478
00:15:44,910 --> 00:15:47,550
to keep that scene
moving, moving, moving.

479
00:15:47,550 --> 00:15:52,030
10 minutes with
Victor, it's all I ask.

480
00:15:52,034 --> 00:15:54,444


481
00:15:57,787 --> 00:15:59,617
In order to have good
dialogue, of course,

482
00:15:59,620 --> 00:16:02,530
you're also going to have to
have really strong characters.

483
00:16:02,528 --> 00:16:04,568
They're each going to have
to have their own sort

484
00:16:04,570 --> 00:16:06,400
of unique and distinct voice.

485
00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:09,310
You're going to find that
kind of as you're writing.

486
00:16:09,310 --> 00:16:11,960
But hopefully what's really
going to inform their voice

487
00:16:11,958 --> 00:16:13,748
is going to be a lot
of that character work

488
00:16:13,750 --> 00:16:17,320
you did when you were
working on the big ideas

489
00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:19,180
and the blue skying
and the outline stage.

490
00:16:19,180 --> 00:16:21,010
Hopefully you're starting
to have a sense of who

491
00:16:21,010 --> 00:16:21,850
these characters are.

492
00:16:21,850 --> 00:16:24,350
And you're going to find their
voice as you're writing them.

493
00:16:24,350 --> 00:16:25,910
They should never
be interchangeable.

494
00:16:25,910 --> 00:16:27,700
So you should never
be able to just swap

495
00:16:27,700 --> 00:16:31,780
a Will line with a Mike line, a
Hopper line with a Joyce line.

496
00:16:31,780 --> 00:16:33,970
It's like, no, no,
no, that's a sign

497
00:16:33,970 --> 00:16:36,970
that line is not specific
enough or unique enough

498
00:16:36,970 --> 00:16:41,210
to that character if you
just switch it at random.

499
00:16:41,212 --> 00:16:42,672
That's a good--
that's one good way

500
00:16:42,670 --> 00:16:45,770
of telling whether the
voices are specific enough.

501
00:16:45,765 --> 00:16:47,145
And just like
in the DandD scene,

502
00:16:47,140 --> 00:16:48,970
where their characters
and their personality

503
00:16:48,973 --> 00:16:52,993
has affected how they dealt with
in that scene the conflict of,

504
00:16:52,990 --> 00:16:54,690
how do we fight this
Demogorgon, that's

505
00:16:54,688 --> 00:16:56,228
going to really
apply to every scene.

506
00:16:56,230 --> 00:16:58,600
And it's their
character that's going

507
00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:01,340
to inform their point of view
to how to deal with conflict.

508
00:17:01,337 --> 00:17:02,917
And that's going to
allow the audience

509
00:17:02,920 --> 00:17:05,470
to even see more about who
these people really are.

510
00:17:05,470 --> 00:17:08,070
So just as a quick
example, we're

511
00:17:08,069 --> 00:17:10,389
going to look at another
scene from the pilot.

512
00:17:10,390 --> 00:17:14,830
This is where Joyce comes to
Hopper's office to tell him

513
00:17:14,829 --> 00:17:16,159
that her son is missing.

514
00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:19,300
So let's take a look at a
few lines from this scene.

515
00:17:19,300 --> 00:17:20,650
In this scene I'll be Joyce.

516
00:17:20,650 --> 00:17:21,550
okay.

517
00:17:21,550 --> 00:17:23,650
And I'll read-- and
you can be Hopper.

518
00:17:23,650 --> 00:17:26,620
"Joyce paces, dragging
on a cigarette.

519
00:17:26,619 --> 00:17:29,999
She's on edge, so far out she
might just fall right off."

520
00:17:29,995 --> 00:17:31,605
(AS JOYCE) I've been
waiting an hour--

521
00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:32,700
MATT AS HOPPER: And
I apologize again.

522
00:17:32,695 --> 00:17:33,945
ROSS AS JOYCE: A goddamn hour.

523
00:17:33,945 --> 00:17:35,155
MATT AS HOPPER: I understand.

524
00:17:35,153 --> 00:17:37,153
But a boy his age most
likely is playing hooky.

525
00:17:37,150 --> 00:17:38,290
ROSS AS JOYCE: Not my Will, no.

526
00:17:38,290 --> 00:17:39,140
He wouldn't do that.

527
00:17:39,140 --> 00:17:39,970
He's not like that.

528
00:17:39,968 --> 00:17:41,258
MATT AS HOPPER: You never know.

529
00:17:41,260 --> 00:17:43,330
My mother thought I was on
the debate team, when really I

530
00:17:43,330 --> 00:17:45,830
was screwing Chrissy Carpenter
in the back of my dad's boat.

531
00:17:45,830 --> 00:17:47,290
ROSS AS JOYCE:
Will's not like you.

532
00:17:47,288 --> 00:17:48,188
He's not like me.

533
00:17:48,190 --> 00:17:49,900
He's not like most.

534
00:17:49,895 --> 00:17:50,395
Okay.

535
00:17:50,395 --> 00:17:52,815
"She takes another drag of
her cigarette, fights tears."

536
00:17:52,810 --> 00:17:54,910
[CHUCKLES] Our
actors make fun of us

537
00:17:54,910 --> 00:17:58,070
for how often we
write "fight tears."

538
00:17:58,070 --> 00:17:59,350
We do like to do that.

539
00:17:59,350 --> 00:18:00,220
Right.

540
00:18:00,220 --> 00:18:00,850
Anyways.

541
00:18:00,850 --> 00:18:03,790
The reason that this
is worth looking at

542
00:18:03,790 --> 00:18:07,670
is it reveals a lot actually
about both of these characters

543
00:18:07,670 --> 00:18:08,170
here.

544
00:18:08,170 --> 00:18:09,430
You obviously have Joyce.

545
00:18:09,430 --> 00:18:12,250
We describe her as, so far,
"she's on edge so far out,

546
00:18:12,248 --> 00:18:13,538
she might just fall right off."

547
00:18:13,540 --> 00:18:15,740
And that's reflected
in the dialogue.

548
00:18:15,740 --> 00:18:17,860
But you notice in this
section of dialogue,

549
00:18:17,860 --> 00:18:20,120
we're not breaking this up
with a lot of descriptions.

550
00:18:20,120 --> 00:18:22,780
Yes, we take a beat to
describe that she's taking

551
00:18:22,780 --> 00:18:24,100
another drag of her cigarette.

552
00:18:24,100 --> 00:18:26,830
But for the most part,
it's just pure dialogue.

553
00:18:26,830 --> 00:18:28,480
She's on edge.

554
00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:29,950
She's upset.

555
00:18:29,950 --> 00:18:32,380
And then Hopper is a
little bit we've-- you know,

556
00:18:32,380 --> 00:18:33,490
set him up as a character.

557
00:18:33,490 --> 00:18:34,680
He's broken.

558
00:18:34,675 --> 00:18:38,265
You know, he's taking
this two and all.

559
00:18:38,260 --> 00:18:41,110
He's not exactly-- he
is, as we established

560
00:18:41,110 --> 00:18:43,540
on the very first line
we ever wrote about this,

561
00:18:43,540 --> 00:18:45,980
he's Sam Rockwell
not McConaughey.

562
00:18:45,980 --> 00:18:47,610
He's not that action hero.

563
00:18:47,608 --> 00:18:49,898
He's not going to leap in
and be like, oh, my goodness,

564
00:18:49,900 --> 00:18:50,890
your son's missing.

565
00:18:50,890 --> 00:18:52,000
Let me go find him.

566
00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:53,590
That's not the Hopper--

567
00:18:53,590 --> 00:18:56,680
that's not the Hopper we know
or that we wanted to write.

568
00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:58,660
He's a lot more
casual than that.

569
00:18:58,660 --> 00:19:01,390
He's not necessarily a
great police officer.

570
00:19:01,390 --> 00:19:03,820
So he's being pretty
casual about this.

571
00:19:03,820 --> 00:19:05,320
And that's creating conflict.

572
00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:08,650
Joyce is like, Matt's saying,
extraordinarily on edge.

573
00:19:08,650 --> 00:19:09,970
Hopper's point of view is--

574
00:19:09,970 --> 00:19:10,660
Hopper's laid.

575
00:19:10,660 --> 00:19:11,800
--eh, probably okay.

576
00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:14,800
And he's even making
a joke about screwing

577
00:19:14,800 --> 00:19:17,930
Chrissy Carpenter in the
back of his dad's boat.

578
00:19:17,932 --> 00:19:20,392
That's probably not the right
environment to make a joke,

579
00:19:20,390 --> 00:19:20,620
right?

580
00:19:20,620 --> 00:19:22,870
So you're starting-- I mean,
listen, he's apologizing.

581
00:19:22,870 --> 00:19:24,100
He's not a total asshole.

582
00:19:24,100 --> 00:19:26,710
But he's got that laid-back,
"I could give a shit"

583
00:19:26,710 --> 00:19:29,380
attitude that is going to be
rubbing Joyce the wrong way.

584
00:19:29,380 --> 00:19:31,180
So anyway, it's a simple scene.

585
00:19:31,180 --> 00:19:33,410
She's, you know, again,
in the scaffolding.

586
00:19:33,408 --> 00:19:35,198
And in fact, we showed
you the scaffolding.

587
00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:40,520
It was like, you know,
Joyce visits Hopper's office

588
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:42,150
and asks him to find
her son, right? it

589
00:19:42,145 --> 00:19:43,605
was something very
basic like that.

590
00:19:43,603 --> 00:19:46,303
And then this is us fleshing
it out with conflict

591
00:19:46,300 --> 00:19:49,280
and with, you know, very
specific character moments.

592
00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:51,700
And then you even-- you
can look at that next line.

593
00:19:51,700 --> 00:19:53,290
Joyce-- "he's got a
couple of friends.

594
00:19:53,290 --> 00:19:55,070
But everyone else
they dash dash.

595
00:19:55,065 --> 00:19:57,195
They make fun of him, call
him names, laugh at him,

596
00:19:57,190 --> 00:19:57,980
his clothes."

597
00:19:57,980 --> 00:20:01,300
You can see how we
repeat "they" twice.

598
00:20:01,300 --> 00:20:04,180
And again, that's just
trying to get messy--

599
00:20:04,180 --> 00:20:05,740
messy it all up a little bit.

600
00:20:05,740 --> 00:20:06,550
She's nervous.

601
00:20:06,550 --> 00:20:08,410
Like, we're saying she's pacing.

602
00:20:08,410 --> 00:20:09,570
People repeat words.

603
00:20:09,567 --> 00:20:11,647
People don't talk perfectly,
and particularly when

604
00:20:11,650 --> 00:20:12,900
they're nervous like Joyce is.

605
00:20:12,900 --> 00:20:15,820
So we like to messy it up to
give it a little more life.

606
00:20:15,815 --> 00:20:16,695
And it's also fast.

607
00:20:16,690 --> 00:20:18,700
We have-- this is, you
know, at the very beginning,

608
00:20:18,700 --> 00:20:19,630
"I've been waiting an hour.

609
00:20:19,630 --> 00:20:20,740
And I apologize again.

610
00:20:20,740 --> 00:20:21,460
A goddamn hour."

611
00:20:21,460 --> 00:20:22,400
It's very quick.

612
00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:23,900
They're almost on
top of each other.

613
00:20:23,900 --> 00:20:26,230
That's one reason we use
dashes to imply that.

614
00:20:26,230 --> 00:20:28,810
It's-- there's not a big
gap between that dialogue.

615
00:20:28,812 --> 00:20:30,522
They're basically
stepping on each other.

616
00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:32,800
It's very spare
and quick and fast.

617
00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:35,170
But because they're on
different points of views,

618
00:20:35,170 --> 00:20:37,120
it just keeps propelling
that scene forward.

619
00:20:37,120 --> 00:20:39,370
Joyce wants him to go find Will.

620
00:20:39,370 --> 00:20:42,040
Hopper doesn't
really give a shit.

621
00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:45,100
I have been waiting
here over an hour, Hopper.

622
00:20:45,100 --> 00:20:47,540
And I apologize again.

623
00:20:47,540 --> 00:20:48,940
I'm going out of my mind!

624
00:20:48,940 --> 00:20:52,090
Look, a boy his age, he's
probably just playing hooky.

625
00:20:52,090 --> 00:20:53,470
No, not my Will.

626
00:20:53,470 --> 00:20:54,610
He's not like that.

627
00:20:54,610 --> 00:20:55,560
He wouldn't do that.

628
00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:56,270
Well, you never know.

629
00:20:56,270 --> 00:20:57,820
I mean, my mom thought I
was on the debate team,

630
00:20:57,820 --> 00:20:59,740
when really, I was just screwing
Chrissy Carpenter in the back

631
00:20:59,740 --> 00:21:01,030
of my dad's Oldsmobile, so.

632
00:21:01,030 --> 00:21:03,370
Look, he's not
like you, Hopper.

633
00:21:03,370 --> 00:21:05,810
That's conflict right there,
just like with the warden

634
00:21:05,810 --> 00:21:06,310
scene.

635
00:21:06,310 --> 00:21:08,760


636
00:21:12,670 --> 00:21:15,250
Something else that we do
that, we find is effective,

637
00:21:15,250 --> 00:21:17,750
at least it helps us-- and I
think it does help the reader--

638
00:21:17,750 --> 00:21:21,610
which is we incorporate a lot of
sound and descriptions of sound

639
00:21:21,610 --> 00:21:23,200
into our scripts.

640
00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:27,040
We think it helps make it feel
more alive, more like you're

641
00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:28,430
actually watching it.

642
00:21:28,430 --> 00:21:32,200
We do a lot of "whooms"
and "whooshes" and "vrooms"

643
00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:35,500
and just stuff like that to
just-- a lot of times, for us,

644
00:21:35,500 --> 00:21:39,220
it's emphasizing cuts, where
we're going from one scene,

645
00:21:39,220 --> 00:21:42,220
maybe a quiet scene, and then
we like to punch the audience

646
00:21:42,220 --> 00:21:44,270
and go, oh, a big
sound happens here.

647
00:21:44,270 --> 00:21:44,770
Right.

648
00:21:44,770 --> 00:21:47,410
Like, here's, for
example, quick something

649
00:21:47,410 --> 00:21:50,680
from season four, where
this is episode seven.

650
00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:55,810
We have-- this is the big
Demogorgon fight with Hopper.

651
00:21:55,810 --> 00:21:57,760
"The wounded Demo
stumbles backwards

652
00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:00,160
in the pit, black blood
spewing all over the ground

653
00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:01,240
from its wounded mouth.

654
00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:03,850
And "choom," the door
finally snaps shut.

655
00:22:03,850 --> 00:22:07,330
And "bzz," a loud
buzzer sounds."

656
00:22:07,330 --> 00:22:09,040
So again, we're just
doing this stuff

657
00:22:09,040 --> 00:22:11,320
to fill it in, to give a
sense to the reader of what

658
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:13,990
this thing is going to
feel like and sound like.

659
00:22:13,990 --> 00:22:15,110
We love doing it.

660
00:22:15,110 --> 00:22:16,060
It's not necessary.

661
00:22:16,060 --> 00:22:17,920
But that may be a
style that you also

662
00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:19,450
want to apply to your script.

663
00:22:19,450 --> 00:22:22,300
And these sounds are also
really important for us,

664
00:22:22,300 --> 00:22:24,760
as I mentioned, for transitions.

665
00:22:24,760 --> 00:22:26,160
We'd like to go from quiet.

666
00:22:26,155 --> 00:22:30,135
And then, "vroom," Nancy
and Robin high five.

667
00:22:30,130 --> 00:22:32,620
"Vroom," a car's moving past.

668
00:22:32,620 --> 00:22:34,510
And we literally write
"vroom," like we're

669
00:22:34,510 --> 00:22:36,010
little children, in the script.

670
00:22:36,010 --> 00:22:40,100
To us, it helps emphasize
the sharpness of that cut.

671
00:22:40,100 --> 00:22:43,810
So sound can be something that
can be helping you in terms

672
00:22:43,810 --> 00:22:46,120
of writing transitions.

673
00:22:46,120 --> 00:22:49,270
In the pilot, Joyce
has just discovered

674
00:22:49,270 --> 00:22:50,650
that Will isn't here.

675
00:22:50,650 --> 00:22:52,300
She's talking to
Jonathan about it.

676
00:22:52,300 --> 00:22:53,350
She's concerned.

677
00:22:53,350 --> 00:22:55,240
He says, call the school.

678
00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:56,890
"The door slams shut.

679
00:22:56,890 --> 00:23:00,430
And then "eee," an
electronic bell blares."

680
00:23:00,430 --> 00:23:02,140
We're just communicating
to the audience

681
00:23:02,140 --> 00:23:04,960
how we're going to transition
these two different storylines.

682
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:07,960
So you're going from a
door slam to a bell ring.

683
00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:10,810
To us, it just keeps the
energy going, keeps it flowing,

684
00:23:10,810 --> 00:23:13,610
and sort of connects
one scene to the next.

685
00:23:13,610 --> 00:23:14,110
Right.

686
00:23:14,110 --> 00:23:16,330
So you know, another
thing that you can do

687
00:23:16,330 --> 00:23:18,580
is you can talk about the
music in a particular scene.

688
00:23:18,580 --> 00:23:20,170
We don't do this often.

689
00:23:20,170 --> 00:23:21,940
I mean, I've seen
writers who will

690
00:23:21,940 --> 00:23:24,100
put what music
choice they think is

691
00:23:24,100 --> 00:23:26,410
appropriate for the scene
in front of every scene.

692
00:23:26,410 --> 00:23:28,270
That's something you
can do, if you want.

693
00:23:28,270 --> 00:23:30,730
We don't do it
because unless you're

694
00:23:30,730 --> 00:23:33,310
providing your executive with,
like, a Spotify playlist--

695
00:23:33,308 --> 00:23:33,848
I don't know.

696
00:23:33,850 --> 00:23:34,540
It's hard.

697
00:23:34,540 --> 00:23:37,270
Every once in a while, you
can be specific about the song

698
00:23:37,270 --> 00:23:40,520
that you imagine in a scene if
it's very important for setting

699
00:23:40,523 --> 00:23:41,443
the mood of the scene.

700
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:43,030
I know in season
one, for instance,

701
00:23:43,030 --> 00:23:44,830
we specified that
we wanted to use

702
00:23:44,830 --> 00:23:46,630
Joy Division's "Atmosphere."

703
00:23:46,630 --> 00:23:48,820
We definitely wrote
that into the script.

704
00:23:48,820 --> 00:23:51,190
Like Matt's saying, sometimes
people put more just

705
00:23:51,190 --> 00:23:53,330
to give people a sense of--

706
00:23:53,330 --> 00:23:54,250
Mood.

707
00:23:54,245 --> 00:23:55,125
--mood and feeling.

708
00:23:55,120 --> 00:23:57,210
And that's definitely
something that you can do.

709
00:23:57,212 --> 00:23:58,422
And here's another example.

710
00:23:58,420 --> 00:24:00,940
In season four, episode
four, we have a huge moment

711
00:24:00,940 --> 00:24:03,460
where Max, or
Sadie's, in trouble.

712
00:24:03,460 --> 00:24:06,490
And in order to reach her
in this sort of mind, this

713
00:24:06,490 --> 00:24:09,010
[INAUDIBLE] mindscape,
they use music.

714
00:24:09,010 --> 00:24:10,600
Music as the method
with which they

715
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,240
are able to reach into her
mind and call out to her

716
00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:14,360
and reconnect with Max.

717
00:24:14,360 --> 00:24:16,360
And that's how she's able
to escape-- ultimately

718
00:24:16,360 --> 00:24:17,320
escape this mind layer.

719
00:24:17,318 --> 00:24:19,148
That was an idea that
came, like, halfway

720
00:24:19,150 --> 00:24:20,930
through writing the season.

721
00:24:20,930 --> 00:24:23,380
Someone-- it was not us--
pitched this idea of music.

722
00:24:23,380 --> 00:24:26,080
So what we had to do then is we
had to go back to episode one.

723
00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:29,170
And we wanted to plant the
idea that Max was really

724
00:24:29,170 --> 00:24:30,750
into Kate Bush
because it only works

725
00:24:30,748 --> 00:24:32,288
if it's your favorite
song or if it's

726
00:24:32,290 --> 00:24:34,620
a song that has some sort of
personal connection to you.

727
00:24:34,623 --> 00:24:36,043
So we layered that in.

728
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:38,080
And we wrote in this
montage of her walking

729
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:39,670
down the hallway in slow motion.

730
00:24:39,670 --> 00:24:41,950
So we really hit
the Kate Bush note.

731
00:24:47,705 --> 00:24:49,335
One other really
important thing you're

732
00:24:49,330 --> 00:24:53,440
going to be working on as you're
moving from outline to script

733
00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:54,580
is transitions.

734
00:24:54,580 --> 00:24:57,740
And that really is building
in a moment that ties

735
00:24:57,740 --> 00:24:59,960
one scene clearly to the next.

736
00:24:59,960 --> 00:25:03,640
So one scene flows
clearly to the next scene.

737
00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:04,540
Sound--

738
00:25:04,535 --> 00:25:05,415
Sound is important.

739
00:25:05,410 --> 00:25:07,190
Sound is extremely important.

740
00:25:07,190 --> 00:25:08,590
There's a lot of
other techniques

741
00:25:08,593 --> 00:25:09,763
for an effective transition.

742
00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:11,440
Not all scenes--
not all scenes are

743
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:13,470
going to transition
fluidly-- you know, smoothly

744
00:25:13,470 --> 00:25:14,320
to the next scene.

745
00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:17,840
But the more smooth that you can
make one scene go to the next,

746
00:25:17,835 --> 00:25:19,465
the better your
script's going to read,

747
00:25:19,460 --> 00:25:20,860
the better your
script's going to flow,

748
00:25:20,860 --> 00:25:23,480
the more people are just going
to keep turning those pages.

749
00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:25,360
Another transition
technique will use

750
00:25:25,360 --> 00:25:27,430
all the time is the match cut.

751
00:25:27,425 --> 00:25:29,055
And the match cut is
really when you're

752
00:25:29,050 --> 00:25:31,390
cutting from an
image in one scene

753
00:25:31,390 --> 00:25:33,340
to an image in another
that's not the same

754
00:25:33,340 --> 00:25:35,060
but is very similar.

755
00:25:35,057 --> 00:25:36,637
And they can be very
different things.

756
00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:38,810
But they just-- there's
something about those images

757
00:25:38,807 --> 00:25:39,907
that lines up.

758
00:25:39,910 --> 00:25:44,080
One of the most famous match
cuts in cinema history,

759
00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:45,980
of course, is "2001--
a Space Odyssey."

760
00:25:45,980 --> 00:25:49,090
You have, a caveman throw
a bone up into the air.

761
00:25:49,090 --> 00:25:50,610
And then that bone--

762
00:25:50,612 --> 00:25:52,572
Stanley Kubrick, the
director, makes a hard cut

763
00:25:52,570 --> 00:25:54,850
from the bone to a
spaceship that is roughly

764
00:25:54,850 --> 00:25:56,110
in the same shape as the bone.

765
00:25:56,110 --> 00:25:57,190
That's a match cut, okay?

766
00:25:57,190 --> 00:25:59,950
So we do that all the
time or variations of that

767
00:25:59,950 --> 00:26:00,860
all the time.

768
00:26:00,860 --> 00:26:03,820
Here's an example
from the pilot script.

769
00:26:03,820 --> 00:26:08,050
"Mike wipes the saliva off in
his jeans, climbs on his bike,

770
00:26:08,050 --> 00:26:09,580
and pedals off into the night.

771
00:26:09,580 --> 00:26:13,480
Above him a street
light lamp flickers."

772
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:15,820
Then we go-- then we
cut to, "exterior,

773
00:26:15,820 --> 00:26:17,290
Benny's Fish and Fry, night.

774
00:26:17,290 --> 00:26:20,080
A light flickers inside
the Fish and Fry."

775
00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:22,300
Again, it's not--
it's very simple.

776
00:26:22,300 --> 00:26:23,320
It's very clean.

777
00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:25,180
But it's linking these
storylines together.

778
00:26:25,180 --> 00:26:27,340
You're going, okay,
something spooky

779
00:26:27,340 --> 00:26:28,570
is going on to this town.

780
00:26:28,570 --> 00:26:31,150
So even though it feels
like Mike's storyline is

781
00:26:31,150 --> 00:26:34,120
a million miles apart
from Benny's, we're going,

782
00:26:34,120 --> 00:26:37,420
oh, no, no, no, these
worlds haven't collided yet,

783
00:26:37,420 --> 00:26:38,710
but they will.

784
00:26:38,710 --> 00:26:42,310
It's connecting two very
disparate scenes together.

785
00:26:42,310 --> 00:26:43,960
Before you start
writing your script,

786
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:46,630
read a script of a series
or movie in a similar genre

787
00:26:46,630 --> 00:26:48,070
to the show you are developing.

788
00:26:48,070 --> 00:26:50,590
Try to read something that has
been written in the last 20

789
00:26:50,590 --> 00:26:52,930
years to get comfortable
with modern formatting

790
00:26:52,930 --> 00:26:55,500
and screenwriting techniques.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,860


2
00:00:09,020 --> 00:00:10,520
MATT DUFFER
(VOICEOVER): We're going

3
00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:12,860
to attempt to demo for you
in a short period of time

4
00:00:12,860 --> 00:00:16,670
how we blue-sky ideas for a
scene, how we outline a scene,

5
00:00:16,670 --> 00:00:19,040
and then how we take
that outline and turn it

6
00:00:19,040 --> 00:00:20,450
into a script.

7
00:00:20,450 --> 00:00:21,950
So what we're
going to do is we're

8
00:00:21,950 --> 00:00:25,700
going to take that made
up, unofficial Dustin

9
00:00:25,700 --> 00:00:27,330
and Steve spinoff.

10
00:00:27,330 --> 00:00:30,740
And we're gonna write what we
think would be a cool opening

11
00:00:30,740 --> 00:00:32,180
hook for that scene.

12
00:00:32,180 --> 00:00:35,390
And this is gonna be real-time
and messy, because we really

13
00:00:35,390 --> 00:00:37,130
have no idea what
we're gonna write.

14
00:00:37,130 --> 00:00:38,630
We'll see how this
goes, but I think

15
00:00:38,630 --> 00:00:41,960
it'll show you guys sort of
the process of how we actually

16
00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:44,310
write this and also
how messy it is

17
00:00:44,310 --> 00:00:46,960
and how much time
it's gonna take.

18
00:00:46,957 --> 00:00:49,287
So, I guess, yeah, without
further ado, let's get going.

19
00:00:49,290 --> 00:00:50,870
I'm gonna quickly
remind myself

20
00:00:50,870 --> 00:00:52,550
of what the story idea is.

21
00:00:52,550 --> 00:00:53,300
[LAUGHTER]

22
00:00:53,300 --> 00:00:55,730
So "After the events
of season three,

23
00:00:55,730 --> 00:00:58,520
Dustin intercepts a
cryptic message on Cerebro,

24
00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:00,890
a message he believes is
in fact a communication

25
00:01:00,890 --> 00:01:03,140
from his estranged father.

26
00:01:03,140 --> 00:01:05,900
A concerned Dustin decides
to check in on his dad who

27
00:01:05,900 --> 00:01:07,010
lives in Arizona.

28
00:01:07,010 --> 00:01:08,930
He recruits his
good friend Steve--

29
00:01:08,930 --> 00:01:12,530
and Steve's car, of course--
to assist him in his journey.

30
00:01:12,530 --> 00:01:14,900
"However, when Dustin and
Steve arrive in Arizona,

31
00:01:14,900 --> 00:01:16,910
they find that
Dustin's dad is missing

32
00:01:16,910 --> 00:01:19,440
and has been, in fact,
missing for many months.

33
00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:22,370
Turns out that Dustin's
dad, very much like his son,

34
00:01:22,370 --> 00:01:25,370
loves a good adventure and has
set off to find the legendary

35
00:01:25,370 --> 00:01:27,890
Lost Dutchman's Mine,
the rumored home

36
00:01:27,890 --> 00:01:28,940
of a great treasure.

37
00:01:28,940 --> 00:01:32,330
"Steve and Dustin now set off
to find Dustin's dad as well

38
00:01:32,330 --> 00:01:33,330
as the treasure.

39
00:01:33,325 --> 00:01:35,455
However, they aren't the
only ones looking for this

40
00:01:35,450 --> 00:01:37,280
and they soon find
themselves embroiled

41
00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:40,070
in an adventure involving
thieves, treasure hunters,

42
00:01:40,070 --> 00:01:42,170
and something else,
something lurking

43
00:01:42,170 --> 00:01:45,680
in the dark of the mines,
something not quite human."

44
00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:47,160


45
00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:50,210
The first scene of your
script should probably

46
00:01:50,210 --> 00:01:51,120
be an opening hook.

47
00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:51,620
Right?

48
00:01:51,620 --> 00:01:53,130
We want to grab
those readers, so we

49
00:01:53,130 --> 00:01:54,380
need to do something exciting.

50
00:01:54,380 --> 00:01:58,370
So the scene-- you
know, it should not

51
00:01:58,370 --> 00:02:00,860
be Dustin approaching
Steve about his dad.

52
00:02:00,860 --> 00:02:03,970
It could be Dustin receiving the
cryptic message on his Cerebro.

53
00:02:03,967 --> 00:02:04,547
That's not--

54
00:02:04,550 --> 00:02:05,760
That's not super exciting.

55
00:02:05,760 --> 00:02:06,680
That's not exciting.

56
00:02:06,677 --> 00:02:08,867
If you think about-- think
about our pilot script

57
00:02:08,870 --> 00:02:10,670
for "Montauk" or
"Stranger Things,"

58
00:02:10,669 --> 00:02:12,469
we didn't actually
start with our kids

59
00:02:12,470 --> 00:02:15,170
in DandD. What we started with
was something in the lab.

60
00:02:15,170 --> 00:02:16,070
There's was a fire.

61
00:02:16,070 --> 00:02:17,420
There's a dead scientist.

62
00:02:17,420 --> 00:02:18,710
There's alarms blaring.

63
00:02:18,710 --> 00:02:19,880
We asked a lot of questions.

64
00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:21,360
We didn't give a lot of answers.

65
00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:24,290
So I think we should do
something similar now

66
00:02:24,290 --> 00:02:25,800
in a short hook like that--

67
00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:26,300
Yeah.

68
00:02:26,300 --> 00:02:27,680
--given time constraints.

69
00:02:27,677 --> 00:02:29,507
So we're gonna try to
come up with something

70
00:02:29,510 --> 00:02:31,640
very simple and fast
that hopefully gets

71
00:02:31,640 --> 00:02:32,770
you hooked into this story.

72
00:02:32,765 --> 00:02:35,865


73
00:02:37,260 --> 00:02:39,450
Normally we would have
blue-skied this for weeks.

74
00:02:39,450 --> 00:02:41,400
So we're at a
slight disadvantage,

75
00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:42,620
so don't judge us too much.

76
00:02:42,615 --> 00:02:43,115
Yeah.

77
00:02:43,115 --> 00:02:44,715
But it should be
something exciting.

78
00:02:44,712 --> 00:02:45,672
So it should probably--

79
00:02:45,670 --> 00:02:46,170
Yes.

80
00:02:46,170 --> 00:02:47,090
It should probably--

81
00:02:47,087 --> 00:02:48,747
Well, to me, it's
got to involve--

82
00:02:48,750 --> 00:02:49,350
The dad.

83
00:02:49,350 --> 00:02:51,220
Well, it's got
involved the mine.

84
00:02:51,220 --> 00:02:51,720
Right?

85
00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:52,200
The mine, right.

86
00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:53,970
Because what you want to do,
just like in "Stranger Things,"

87
00:02:53,970 --> 00:02:55,720
we're hinting at where
the story's to go.

88
00:02:55,717 --> 00:02:57,297
Just like "Breaking
Bad," any of this,

89
00:02:57,300 --> 00:02:58,970
we want to give the
audience a sense of,

90
00:02:58,967 --> 00:03:02,007
oh, we're gonna go to
the mundane, normal life

91
00:03:02,010 --> 00:03:02,580
in a second.

92
00:03:02,580 --> 00:03:04,250
But we don't want
normal life right now.

93
00:03:04,247 --> 00:03:06,597
We want something to punch
the audience in the face.

94
00:03:06,600 --> 00:03:08,430
We want to hook that reader.

95
00:03:08,433 --> 00:03:10,353
Whatever, it should be
set in Dutchman's Mine.

96
00:03:10,350 --> 00:03:12,000
And unfortunately,
I believe that this

97
00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:14,590
means it can't be
Dustin and Steve even

98
00:03:14,590 --> 00:03:15,840
though I would love to write--

99
00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:17,140
Because they can't
obviously be at the mine.

100
00:03:17,140 --> 00:03:19,650
Now we could do a flash-forward,
and we have Steve and Dustin

101
00:03:19,650 --> 00:03:20,370
in the middle of something.

102
00:03:20,370 --> 00:03:22,450
I don't love-- we don't love
doing that kind of thing.

103
00:03:22,450 --> 00:03:22,950
It's--

104
00:03:22,950 --> 00:03:24,360
It doesn't-- it's not right.

105
00:03:24,363 --> 00:03:25,533
It's not-- it's not right.

106
00:03:25,530 --> 00:03:27,420
So it does-- it definitely
needs to involve--

107
00:03:27,420 --> 00:03:28,260
I think it should
involve the dad.

108
00:03:28,260 --> 00:03:29,140
It should involve--

109
00:03:29,135 --> 00:03:32,675
Because this is about-- this
is about, you know, a missing--

110
00:03:32,670 --> 00:03:33,570
a missing parent.

111
00:03:33,570 --> 00:03:36,900
So we should maybe hint at--
we could do the moment right

112
00:03:36,900 --> 00:03:37,900
before he went missing--

113
00:03:37,900 --> 00:03:38,310
Exactly.

114
00:03:38,310 --> 00:03:40,140
--like almost like the
last time he was seen,

115
00:03:40,140 --> 00:03:41,010
a hint at something that--

116
00:03:41,010 --> 00:03:42,810
Because if you do that,
and then we cut to Dustin,

117
00:03:42,810 --> 00:03:44,990
and then he gets this
message, suddenly, I'm--

118
00:03:44,992 --> 00:03:45,672
I'm interested.

119
00:03:45,670 --> 00:03:46,170
Right?

120
00:03:46,170 --> 00:03:46,670
I'm like--

121
00:03:46,670 --> 00:03:48,720
MATT DUFFER: So Dustin's
dad the moment right

122
00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:49,260
before he goes missing.

123
00:03:49,260 --> 00:03:49,920
ROSS DUFFER: You know
what would be fun?

124
00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:51,720
Like in that "Raiders
of the Lost Ark,"

125
00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:54,270
you know how you're just
seeing glimpses of Indy--

126
00:03:54,270 --> 00:03:56,880
you're not really getting
a full view of him?

127
00:03:56,880 --> 00:03:57,580
We could do--

128
00:03:57,580 --> 00:03:59,310
Well, I actually
think it would be more

129
00:03:59,310 --> 00:04:00,090
like "Last Crusade."

130
00:04:00,090 --> 00:04:02,190
Because again, like Spielberg
redoes the same thing

131
00:04:02,190 --> 00:04:02,940
in "The Last Crusade--"

132
00:04:02,940 --> 00:04:03,210
Oh, that's right.

133
00:04:03,210 --> 00:04:05,850
--except ends up being
the surprise that it's Indy

134
00:04:05,850 --> 00:04:06,450
as a kid.

135
00:04:06,450 --> 00:04:06,790
Yes.

136
00:04:06,790 --> 00:04:08,330
And so this, it
almost would be fun

137
00:04:08,332 --> 00:04:10,052
if we did sort of
a thing like that

138
00:04:10,050 --> 00:04:12,630
where you think it's Dustin
and, in fact, it's Dustin's dad.

139
00:04:12,630 --> 00:04:12,900
Dustin's dad.

140
00:04:12,900 --> 00:04:14,460
Because Dustin's
actually not a kid anymore.

141
00:04:14,460 --> 00:04:14,700
Right?

142
00:04:14,700 --> 00:04:15,200
No.

143
00:04:15,200 --> 00:04:17,580
So his dad is a little
bit quirky like his son.

144
00:04:17,579 --> 00:04:19,799
So it'd be fun if we
started in a scene

145
00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:21,750
where we thought
that it was Dustin--

146
00:04:21,750 --> 00:04:22,320
Yeah.

147
00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:24,400
--exploring some mine
or exploring some space.

148
00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:24,900
Yeah.

149
00:04:24,900 --> 00:04:26,910
And then we reveal that
it's not Dustin, it's his dad.

150
00:04:26,910 --> 00:04:28,470
Because you could have people
even refer to him as Henderson.

151
00:04:28,470 --> 00:04:29,490
He should just be in the mine.

152
00:04:29,490 --> 00:04:29,990
Right?

153
00:04:29,990 --> 00:04:32,190
MATT DUFFER: Dustin's
dad is in the mine.

154
00:04:32,190 --> 00:04:33,030
ROSS DUFFER: Yes.

155
00:04:33,030 --> 00:04:34,620
We're just sketching
out some ideas here.

156
00:04:34,620 --> 00:04:34,950
So we're kind of--

157
00:04:34,950 --> 00:04:36,200
ROSS DUFFER: Glimpses of him--

158
00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:39,120
we think it's Dustin,
because they're very similar.

159
00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:41,640
Shadow, then big reveal.

160
00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:42,990
This isn't Dustin.

161
00:04:42,990 --> 00:04:46,800
This is Dustin's dad.

162
00:04:46,803 --> 00:04:48,723
I guess we need to
decide if he's by himself

163
00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:49,850
or he's with somebody else.

164
00:04:49,845 --> 00:04:53,675
The only-- the thing I'd say why
we might consider pairing him

165
00:04:53,670 --> 00:04:55,020
with someone is so--

166
00:04:55,020 --> 00:04:56,760
maybe it's scarier
if he's by himself.

167
00:04:56,760 --> 00:04:57,630
But he could-- It might be

168
00:04:57,630 --> 00:04:57,690
Scary.

169
00:04:57,690 --> 00:04:58,980
Because think about,
if we're only writing--

170
00:04:58,980 --> 00:05:01,230
if we're keeping this short,
like a page or something,

171
00:05:01,230 --> 00:05:02,370
he could be on the walkie--

172
00:05:02,370 --> 00:05:02,520
Yeah, but--

173
00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:03,260
--someone.

174
00:05:03,263 --> 00:05:03,933
What about that?

175
00:05:03,930 --> 00:05:04,430
Yeah.

176
00:05:04,430 --> 00:05:05,200
Okay, there.

177
00:05:05,198 --> 00:05:07,488
Because I like someone saying,
"Henderson, do you copy?

178
00:05:07,490 --> 00:05:07,890
Henderson."

179
00:05:07,890 --> 00:05:08,370
Oh, that's great.

180
00:05:08,370 --> 00:05:09,070
That's a good start.

181
00:05:09,070 --> 00:05:10,200
That's a great misdirect.

182
00:05:10,195 --> 00:05:10,805
All right.

183
00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:12,690
"Henderson, do you copy?"

184
00:05:12,690 --> 00:05:14,420
He's working with someone--

185
00:05:14,423 --> 00:05:15,093
We don't know.

186
00:05:15,090 --> 00:05:15,360
--who is not--

187
00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:16,470
It's a disembodied voice.

188
00:05:16,470 --> 00:05:16,560
--there.

189
00:05:16,560 --> 00:05:17,400
We don't cut to them.

190
00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:17,610
Right.

191
00:05:17,610 --> 00:05:18,180
We don't cut there.

192
00:05:18,180 --> 00:05:19,590
And this is a
character who can--

193
00:05:19,590 --> 00:05:20,250
Who can play a role later.

194
00:05:20,250 --> 00:05:21,080
--come back later.

195
00:05:21,083 --> 00:05:23,403
Does he find the
treasures or misdirect where

196
00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:25,020
we think he finds the treasure?

197
00:05:25,020 --> 00:05:27,270
I don't know, but something--
something spooky's got

198
00:05:27,270 --> 00:05:27,630
to happen.

199
00:05:27,630 --> 00:05:28,130
Right?

200
00:05:28,130 --> 00:05:30,220
I think we should
hint that he finds it.

201
00:05:30,220 --> 00:05:30,720
Right?

202
00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:31,560
Or something?

203
00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:33,630
I think you have to
maybe-- maybe you think--

204
00:05:33,630 --> 00:05:35,040
I don't want to see
the full treasure yet.

205
00:05:35,040 --> 00:05:37,320
We're then-- we're then
showing our hands too much.

206
00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:38,160
No, no, no, no, no, no.

207
00:05:38,160 --> 00:05:39,160
But I-- I mean it like--

208
00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:40,140
I wonder if he--

209
00:05:40,140 --> 00:05:42,270
maybe he-- he does have
to discover something

210
00:05:42,270 --> 00:05:44,500
like a secret door
or passageway.

211
00:05:44,500 --> 00:05:45,480
ROSS DUFFER: Yes.

212
00:05:45,480 --> 00:05:48,150
MATT DUFFER: He finds a
secret door or passageway,

213
00:05:48,150 --> 00:05:51,120
something like he thinks
he's made a major discovery.

214
00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:55,650
It's something exciting,
whatever exciting is.

215
00:05:55,650 --> 00:05:57,170
And that becomes spooky.

216
00:05:57,170 --> 00:05:57,980
Well no.

217
00:05:57,980 --> 00:05:59,000
There was an obstacle.

218
00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:01,540
He found something, but
there's a new obstacle.

219
00:06:01,535 --> 00:06:03,775
MATT DUFFER: I think
really it is sounds.

220
00:06:03,770 --> 00:06:05,480
This is where sounds
come into play.

221
00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:07,520
You're hearing something.

222
00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:11,810
Maybe you see the glint of some
eyes, some eyes in the dark,

223
00:06:11,810 --> 00:06:15,590
a shadow-- a large shadowy
shape unlike anything.

224
00:06:15,587 --> 00:06:16,667
And also I'm imagining--

225
00:06:16,670 --> 00:06:17,820
I'm jumping ahead a little bit.

226
00:06:17,820 --> 00:06:19,400
But I'm imagining
the end of this hook

227
00:06:19,403 --> 00:06:21,413
as he's dropped
his walkie and you

228
00:06:21,410 --> 00:06:24,050
have the friend, the treasure
hunter friend just going,

229
00:06:24,050 --> 00:06:25,160
Henderson, do you copy?

230
00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:25,760
Henderson?

231
00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:29,090
And we're just pushing in we're
pushing in on that walkie.

232
00:06:29,090 --> 00:06:30,440
And then we cut out to black.

233
00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:31,430
Something like that?

234
00:06:31,430 --> 00:06:31,700
Good.

235
00:06:31,700 --> 00:06:31,790
Yeah.

236
00:06:31,790 --> 00:06:31,880
Right.

237
00:06:31,880 --> 00:06:33,000
Like, he drops his walkie.

238
00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:35,250
I don't know if we want to
even see that he gets away.

239
00:06:35,250 --> 00:06:36,780
We see a blur of
action, a scream.

240
00:06:36,778 --> 00:06:38,568
Like, we can just come
up with some images.

241
00:06:38,570 --> 00:06:40,610
No, and this thing is
fast, that's what I'm saying.

242
00:06:40,610 --> 00:06:41,360
ROSS DUFFER: Yeah.

243
00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:44,710
This thing, whatever
it is, is fast.

244
00:06:44,710 --> 00:06:45,850
Drops walkie.

245
00:06:45,850 --> 00:06:48,180
We don't see what happens
is what I'm saying.

246
00:06:48,175 --> 00:06:49,305
MATT DUFFER: Yeah, exactly.

247
00:06:49,300 --> 00:06:50,530
We don't see what happens.

248
00:06:50,530 --> 00:06:50,830
MATT DUFFER: You
just hear something.

249
00:06:50,830 --> 00:06:52,930
ROSS DUFFER: We
hear drops walkie.

250
00:06:52,930 --> 00:06:54,360
But we don't to imply he's--

251
00:06:54,355 --> 00:06:54,985
well, I guess--

252
00:06:54,980 --> 00:06:55,660
No, we couldn't.

253
00:06:55,660 --> 00:06:57,370
I mean, I think it's
interesting to imply

254
00:06:57,368 --> 00:06:58,428
that he could have died.

255
00:06:58,430 --> 00:06:58,530
He could've-- he
could've have died.

256
00:06:58,530 --> 00:06:59,450
We don't want
to show him dead.

257
00:06:59,450 --> 00:06:59,530
I'm just--

258
00:06:59,530 --> 00:07:00,670
I don't-- you don't
want to hear, like--

259
00:07:00,670 --> 00:07:02,500
We don't want to see,
like, blood splatter that's

260
00:07:02,500 --> 00:07:03,280
the mine wall--

261
00:07:03,280 --> 00:07:03,400
No, that's what I mean.

262
00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:04,120
--something.

263
00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:07,720
But scream echoing through
the mine and then silence.

264
00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:08,470
You know?

265
00:07:08,470 --> 00:07:10,390
All we hear is the walkie.

266
00:07:10,390 --> 00:07:12,670
And then he's got a ton
of batteries in his vest.

267
00:07:12,670 --> 00:07:13,420
ROSS DUFFER: Yeah.

268
00:07:13,420 --> 00:07:15,710
Like, this is Dustin
fully realized--

269
00:07:15,710 --> 00:07:16,210
Yes.

270
00:07:16,210 --> 00:07:17,230
--is kind of what I think.

271
00:07:17,230 --> 00:07:18,810
What's cute about
that is it gives you

272
00:07:18,813 --> 00:07:21,883
a little bit of insight into
how Dustin became Dustin,

273
00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:24,520
that he's kind of-- even though
his dad is not in his life

274
00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,170
anymore, that he's sort of
imitating his dad a little bit.

275
00:07:27,170 --> 00:07:27,590
I think that's sweet.

276
00:07:27,590 --> 00:07:29,320
Not just that he inherited--
so there's something sweet

277
00:07:29,320 --> 00:07:29,820
about that.

278
00:07:29,820 --> 00:07:31,450
Like, he really
looks up to his dad.

279
00:07:31,450 --> 00:07:33,970
Even though obviously they're
estranged and there's some

280
00:07:33,970 --> 00:07:35,920
issue, there's still
something there-- yeah,

281
00:07:35,920 --> 00:07:36,820
that's obviously
connecting them.

282
00:07:36,820 --> 00:07:38,440
Does he have a weapon
or does he have a gun?

283
00:07:38,440 --> 00:07:39,370
You're saying he has a gun?

284
00:07:39,370 --> 00:07:39,820
Yeah.

285
00:07:39,820 --> 00:07:40,120
All right.

286
00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:40,420
[LAUGHS]

287
00:07:40,420 --> 00:07:41,960
I think it's a
little bit exciting.

288
00:07:41,962 --> 00:07:45,402
No, like a-- like a rifle,
like a like a hunting rifle.

289
00:07:45,397 --> 00:07:47,227
But that's just very
unlike Dustin though.

290
00:07:47,230 --> 00:07:48,130
That's why I like it.

291
00:07:48,130 --> 00:07:48,670
Okay.

292
00:07:48,670 --> 00:07:51,820
Because, you know,
it differentiates it.

293
00:07:51,822 --> 00:07:54,032
Something about this-- what
kind of creature is this?

294
00:07:54,030 --> 00:07:54,660
I don't know.

295
00:07:54,655 --> 00:07:55,985
Something lizard-y.

296
00:07:55,980 --> 00:07:56,910
Lizard-y?

297
00:07:56,910 --> 00:07:57,490
Lizard-y.

298
00:07:57,490 --> 00:07:59,240
Oh, my-- that's not
what I was thinking.

299
00:07:59,240 --> 00:08:01,650
Like, you know, scales.

300
00:08:01,650 --> 00:08:03,900
I was thinking more like
a Bigfoot type thing, but--

301
00:08:03,900 --> 00:08:05,900
Well, we don't have to
figure that out though.

302
00:08:05,900 --> 00:08:07,290
Maybe that's
too cliche though.

303
00:08:07,290 --> 00:08:08,020
This is the beauty.

304
00:08:08,020 --> 00:08:09,390
We don't have to figure
it out right now.

305
00:08:09,390 --> 00:08:10,590
And then we cut to black.

306
00:08:10,590 --> 00:08:13,460
And that really is our-- that's
our opening hook right there.

307
00:08:13,455 --> 00:08:14,585
I think that's pretty good.

308
00:08:14,580 --> 00:08:17,880


309
00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:20,670
I'm gonna show you,
what would this look

310
00:08:20,670 --> 00:08:23,490
like in a the
scaffolding outline?

311
00:08:23,490 --> 00:08:25,950
Dustin's dad for the treasure--

312
00:08:25,950 --> 00:08:26,700
ROSS DUFFER: Yeah.

313
00:08:26,700 --> 00:08:29,850
MATT DUFFER: --encounters
a shadowy monster.

314
00:08:29,850 --> 00:08:32,110
He's attacked.

315
00:08:32,110 --> 00:08:34,090
We don't reveal what happens.

316
00:08:34,090 --> 00:08:36,010
That would be the
scaffolding outline.

317
00:08:36,010 --> 00:08:37,840
This is starting
to flesh it out.

318
00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:39,700
And now we'll just take it one--

319
00:08:39,699 --> 00:08:40,659
one more step.

320
00:08:40,659 --> 00:08:41,209
Right, Matt?

321
00:08:41,210 --> 00:08:42,100
Yeah.

322
00:08:42,097 --> 00:08:45,677


323
00:08:45,680 --> 00:08:47,900
So let's talk about
like, what is, like, the--

324
00:08:47,900 --> 00:08:49,440
What is the
opening-- opening shot?

325
00:08:49,442 --> 00:08:53,102
I think it's kind of cool if
we have, you know, over black?

326
00:08:53,100 --> 00:08:53,600
Yeah.

327
00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:54,860
We think it's a black screen.

328
00:08:54,860 --> 00:08:55,570
It's not black.

329
00:08:55,568 --> 00:08:56,358
It's not black.

330
00:08:56,360 --> 00:08:56,690
We're in the mine.

331
00:08:56,690 --> 00:08:58,280
MATT DUFFER: It's-- we're
actually already in the mine.

332
00:08:58,280 --> 00:08:59,030
Yeah.

333
00:08:59,030 --> 00:09:02,390
Mine, pitch black.

334
00:09:02,390 --> 00:09:03,670
Voice over the Black.

335
00:09:03,670 --> 00:09:04,670
"Henderson, do you copy?

336
00:09:04,670 --> 00:09:05,330
Do you copy?"

337
00:09:05,330 --> 00:09:05,690
And then--

338
00:09:05,690 --> 00:09:06,740
ROSS DUFFER: A foot
smashes, maybe.

339
00:09:06,740 --> 00:09:08,490
MATT DUFFER: Like, the
flashlight illuminates.

340
00:09:08,490 --> 00:09:08,990
Mhm.

341
00:09:08,990 --> 00:09:10,790
MATT DUFFER: Like,
it cuts through.

342
00:09:10,790 --> 00:09:12,620
A shadowy figure.

343
00:09:12,620 --> 00:09:15,920
MATT DUFFER: Through the
darkness, revealing the walls.

344
00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:20,240
We'll go into details
there-- dripping, slick.

345
00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:25,280
We're in some sort
of cave or a mine.

346
00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:28,070
Moving towards us, the
voice again, Dustin--

347
00:09:28,070 --> 00:09:29,960
"Henderson, do you copy?"

348
00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:31,650
Maybe it's cutting
out a little bit?

349
00:09:31,650 --> 00:09:32,150
No, no.

350
00:09:32,150 --> 00:09:33,090
He can grab it.

351
00:09:33,090 --> 00:09:40,030
And then close on hand grabs
the walkie, holds it up.

352
00:09:40,030 --> 00:09:42,930
Holds it up, revealing--

353
00:09:42,930 --> 00:09:44,600
We should get
some glimpses here.

354
00:09:44,595 --> 00:09:45,385
MATT DUFFER: Right.

355
00:09:45,387 --> 00:09:50,457
Get glimpses-- curly
hair, a vest filled with--

356
00:09:50,460 --> 00:09:52,410
So I'm gonna say, to
our great surprise--

357
00:09:52,410 --> 00:09:56,220
so it reveals to our great
surprise that this isn't Dustin

358
00:09:56,220 --> 00:09:57,970
at all.

359
00:09:57,970 --> 00:09:58,950
This is-- oh, wait.

360
00:09:58,950 --> 00:10:00,390
We never came up with a name.

361
00:10:00,390 --> 00:10:02,630
Just say Dustin's dad.

362
00:10:02,630 --> 00:10:05,950
MATT DUFFER: This
is Dustin's dad.

363
00:10:05,950 --> 00:10:07,200
And he's, like-- what is he?

364
00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:07,870
He's in his 40s.

365
00:10:07,867 --> 00:10:10,287
MATT DUFFER: We should allow
a little bit of descriptions.

366
00:10:10,283 --> 00:10:12,153
He's exactly what
you would imagine--

367
00:10:12,150 --> 00:10:13,170
ROSS DUFFER: Yeah.

368
00:10:13,170 --> 00:10:15,130
MATT DUFFER:
--Dustin would look--

369
00:10:15,126 --> 00:10:18,666
look like when he grows up.

370
00:10:18,670 --> 00:10:27,470
He's a spitting image of
his son when he grows up.

371
00:10:27,470 --> 00:10:28,790
He wears--

372
00:10:28,790 --> 00:10:29,340
I got--

373
00:10:29,340 --> 00:10:29,840
Oh.

374
00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:31,220
--I'm getting of his stuff in.

375
00:10:31,220 --> 00:10:31,370
Okay.

376
00:10:31,370 --> 00:10:33,770
I want to get glimpses
of him like Indiana Jones.

377
00:10:33,770 --> 00:10:35,000
Right.

378
00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:37,040
[LAUGHS] "Hold
your horses, Petey!"

379
00:10:37,037 --> 00:10:38,117
Whatever this guy's name--

380
00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:39,700
I don't know what
this dude's name is,

381
00:10:39,703 --> 00:10:42,593
but just making this
up as we go along.

382
00:10:42,590 --> 00:10:43,550
He moves down.

383
00:10:43,550 --> 00:10:47,000
He continues to move down
the cave when suddenly he

384
00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:48,410
hears something.

385
00:10:48,410 --> 00:10:51,050
Now we can get our
sound in, something--

386
00:10:51,050 --> 00:10:52,480
a low whistle--

387
00:10:52,478 --> 00:10:53,268
MATT DUFFER: Right.

388
00:10:53,270 --> 00:10:55,990
ROSS DUFFER: --whistling sound.

389
00:10:55,990 --> 00:10:59,770
It sounds like-- he
steps closer to the wall,

390
00:10:59,770 --> 00:11:02,260
to the dead end wall
following that sound.

391
00:11:02,260 --> 00:11:04,120
There's a small
hole or something.

392
00:11:04,120 --> 00:11:06,880
You need them to reach into
something like in that "Temple

393
00:11:06,880 --> 00:11:08,040
of Doom" way.

394
00:11:08,035 --> 00:11:09,165
You know, like a little--

395
00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:12,340
there's a small gap
in the mine wall.

396
00:11:12,340 --> 00:11:14,510
This is where the
wind is coming from.

397
00:11:14,510 --> 00:11:17,200
He takes a deep breath,
then reaches his hand

398
00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:23,080
inside the small gap, grabs hold
of something, turns it, click.

399
00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:25,210
Suddenly, we get a more sounds.

400
00:11:25,210 --> 00:11:27,010
Whoom.

401
00:11:27,010 --> 00:11:28,390
And now I'm going to cap this.

402
00:11:28,390 --> 00:11:29,310
This shit's important.

403
00:11:29,307 --> 00:11:36,727
[LAUGHS] The entire
wall begins to open up.

404
00:11:36,730 --> 00:11:37,840
Now here's the key.

405
00:11:37,840 --> 00:11:39,640
I'm assuming this is
where the treasure is.

406
00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:41,180
We don't want to reveal
the treasure yet.

407
00:11:41,180 --> 00:11:42,010
Yeah, but he could-- he
could communicate an entire--

408
00:11:42,010 --> 00:11:43,320
ROSS DUFFER: We want to
save that for Dustin.

409
00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:43,930
Yeah.

410
00:11:43,932 --> 00:11:44,892
No, his eyes go wide.

411
00:11:44,890 --> 00:11:45,360
Dustin's dad, yeah.

412
00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:46,480
Let his eyes go wide.

413
00:11:46,475 --> 00:11:47,105
He's got-- ah--

414
00:11:47,100 --> 00:11:47,510
Go wide.

415
00:11:47,510 --> 00:11:48,510
We get a nice push in.

416
00:11:48,510 --> 00:11:50,780
And then-- he would get--
he pulls up the walkie.

417
00:11:50,783 --> 00:11:51,703
We need another name--

418
00:11:51,700 --> 00:11:51,840
Petey.

419
00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:52,490
[LAUGHTER]

420
00:11:52,490 --> 00:11:52,990
Petey.

421
00:11:52,990 --> 00:11:53,530
Petey.

422
00:11:53,530 --> 00:11:54,430
Um--

423
00:11:54,426 --> 00:11:56,216
Ah.

424
00:11:56,220 --> 00:11:56,910
Mack?

425
00:11:56,910 --> 00:11:57,660
MATT DUFFER: Mack?

426
00:11:57,660 --> 00:11:58,160
Yeah.

427
00:11:58,160 --> 00:11:59,580
ROSS DUFFER: As
you can see, we're

428
00:11:59,577 --> 00:12:01,557
going into a little
more detail and trying

429
00:12:01,560 --> 00:12:02,380
to get this scene running.

430
00:12:02,380 --> 00:12:04,550
So we're going into probably
more dialogue than we--

431
00:12:04,547 --> 00:12:07,527
than what you normally
would in your final outline.

432
00:12:07,530 --> 00:12:10,170
But this is pretty close to
what your final outline should

433
00:12:10,170 --> 00:12:10,890
look like.

434
00:12:10,890 --> 00:12:13,440
You're not gonna to need
this much dialogue probably.

435
00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:15,480
But Because we're going
straight into script,

436
00:12:15,480 --> 00:12:18,390
we're trying to get a little
more in as quickly as we can.

437
00:12:18,390 --> 00:12:20,080
Right.

438
00:12:20,077 --> 00:12:21,157
So this is a little trick.

439
00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:22,870
So if you have a
character who's talking,

440
00:12:22,868 --> 00:12:24,628
but the dialogue is
not very important,

441
00:12:24,630 --> 00:12:25,950
one thing you can do--

442
00:12:25,950 --> 00:12:31,970
"as Mack continues to try to
get Henderson's attention."

443
00:12:31,970 --> 00:12:34,220
And then I'm gonna
say, "see appendix."

444
00:12:34,220 --> 00:12:35,300
ROSS DUFFER: [LAUGHS]

445
00:12:35,300 --> 00:12:36,890
What that means
is, the dialogue--

446
00:12:36,892 --> 00:12:37,852
We'll write it later.

447
00:12:37,850 --> 00:12:38,930
I'm gonna write it later.

448
00:12:38,930 --> 00:12:39,440
We put it in the back.

449
00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:41,240
And then also, like, if
I put it all down here,

450
00:12:41,240 --> 00:12:42,410
it would just ruin the flow.

451
00:12:42,407 --> 00:12:43,237
It's irrelevant.

452
00:12:43,238 --> 00:12:44,028
It's not important.

453
00:12:44,030 --> 00:12:46,010
It's background noise.

454
00:12:46,010 --> 00:12:49,340
And as you can see here, I'm
sort of working down lower.

455
00:12:49,335 --> 00:12:50,965
This is specifically
a writing partner.

456
00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:52,010
I'm doing stuff later.

457
00:12:52,010 --> 00:12:53,310
Matt's doing stuff earlier.

458
00:12:53,310 --> 00:12:53,810
Right.

459
00:12:53,810 --> 00:12:56,540
Occasionally, we'll screw
each other up or be like, hey,

460
00:12:56,540 --> 00:12:57,860
I'm doing the flashlight beat.

461
00:12:57,860 --> 00:13:00,090
And we work it out.

462
00:13:00,090 --> 00:13:03,290
But I think, you know, for
us, this speeds up the process

463
00:13:03,290 --> 00:13:06,170
if we're-- and also we get
less annoyed at each other

464
00:13:06,170 --> 00:13:08,880
if we're both sort of
working on different areas.

465
00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:11,150
So I'm working on monster
reveal while Matt's doing--

466
00:13:11,150 --> 00:13:13,520
I don't know what he's doing,
presumably something helpful.

467
00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:14,020
Yes.

468
00:13:14,020 --> 00:13:15,390
I don't know.

469
00:13:15,390 --> 00:13:17,020
I think we should
call him Henderson.

470
00:13:17,015 --> 00:13:17,395
Yeah.

471
00:13:17,390 --> 00:13:17,660
I think that's cleaner, yeah.

472
00:13:17,660 --> 00:13:19,280
It's just easier.

473
00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:20,710
This is Mr. Henderson--

474
00:13:20,705 --> 00:13:21,445
ROSS DUFFER: Mhm.

475
00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:22,490
MATT DUFFER: --I'll say.

476
00:13:22,490 --> 00:13:24,320
Again, your final
outline doesn't

477
00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:26,060
have to be quite this detailed.

478
00:13:26,060 --> 00:13:27,830
We're putting in
a lot of dialogue,

479
00:13:27,830 --> 00:13:29,880
and we're doing that
to save a little time.

480
00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:32,390
So we're sort of merging
final outline with script.

481
00:13:32,390 --> 00:13:34,280
You at this stage
may actually just

482
00:13:34,280 --> 00:13:37,940
go ahead and move into Final
Draft, or WriterDuet, or Movie

483
00:13:37,940 --> 00:13:39,620
Magic, or whatever
you want to use.

484
00:13:39,620 --> 00:13:41,680
Matt and I, because
we're collaborating,

485
00:13:41,683 --> 00:13:43,853
we're gonna stick around
in Google Docs for one more

486
00:13:43,850 --> 00:13:47,270
second as we-- as you watch
us just sort of clean this up.

487
00:13:47,270 --> 00:13:49,520
So we've got to add,
like, our scene headings.

488
00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:52,910
We got to add our character
names and capitals.

489
00:13:52,910 --> 00:13:55,070
We've got to do a
little bit of cleanup

490
00:13:55,070 --> 00:13:57,530
to get it to read less
like an outline in now

491
00:13:57,530 --> 00:13:59,010
more like a script.

492
00:13:59,010 --> 00:13:59,510
Okay.

493
00:13:59,510 --> 00:14:00,770
Enter mine.

494
00:14:00,772 --> 00:14:02,482
MATT DUFFER: Why don't
we just say night?

495
00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:03,250
I mean, because--

496
00:14:03,245 --> 00:14:03,625
ROSS DUFFER: Yeah, sure.

497
00:14:03,620 --> 00:14:05,000
MATT DUFFER: Because it doesn't
really matter what time of day

498
00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:05,390
it is.

499
00:14:05,390 --> 00:14:05,720
But--

500
00:14:05,720 --> 00:14:07,580
ROSS DUFFER: And just
say, it's pitch black.

501
00:14:07,580 --> 00:14:11,600
We hear a voiceover the
blackness, over the darkness.

502
00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:12,830
"Henderson, do you copy?

503
00:14:12,830 --> 00:14:14,330
How about we just say voice?

504
00:14:14,330 --> 00:14:14,900
Sure.

505
00:14:14,903 --> 00:14:15,823
Whoosh, a fast light--

506
00:14:15,820 --> 00:14:16,220
Off-screen.

507
00:14:16,220 --> 00:14:18,300
--suddenly cuts through
the darkness revealing--

508
00:14:18,303 --> 00:14:21,743
I'm gonna get rid of our
dashes now, or some of them.

509
00:14:21,740 --> 00:14:24,180
I can say here that
we're in a mine.

510
00:14:24,180 --> 00:14:24,680
Yeah.

511
00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:24,960
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

512
00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:26,090
ROSS DUFFER: I can do that.

513
00:14:26,085 --> 00:14:27,055
Just say unknown.

514
00:14:27,050 --> 00:14:28,440
That's something
else you can do,

515
00:14:28,440 --> 00:14:30,420
which is, don't
describe your scene.

516
00:14:30,417 --> 00:14:32,747
If you don't want your reader
to know where you are yet.

517
00:14:32,750 --> 00:14:35,720
Sometimes we'll underline
stuff to emphasize.

518
00:14:35,720 --> 00:14:37,520
Boom, hits a dead end--

519
00:14:37,520 --> 00:14:39,050
underline.

520
00:14:39,050 --> 00:14:41,430
Again, it's okay to keep
stuff from the audience,

521
00:14:41,430 --> 00:14:43,400
even if your characters
are seen it be care.

522
00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:43,970
You know?

523
00:14:43,970 --> 00:14:46,240
And you can specify that
with camera, or just you

524
00:14:46,235 --> 00:14:47,975
can be as obvious
as just saying,

525
00:14:47,970 --> 00:14:49,970
we're not gonna reveal
this to the audience yet.

526
00:14:49,970 --> 00:14:53,440
It's okay to say stuff like
that to talk to your reader.

527
00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:54,880
Now for this
action, I'm probably

528
00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:57,050
going to actually leave a
lot of these dashes, which

529
00:14:57,047 --> 00:14:57,997
is something we do.

530
00:14:58,000 --> 00:14:59,210
Again, this is our style.

531
00:14:59,205 --> 00:15:00,585
It doesn't have
to be your style.

532
00:15:00,580 --> 00:15:02,650
But just when it's
something quick, fast,

533
00:15:02,650 --> 00:15:05,110
and we're just getting
glimpses, like really fast cuts,

534
00:15:05,110 --> 00:15:06,610
we usually do dashes.

535
00:15:06,610 --> 00:15:09,100
So we see something-- sharp
teeth, blood, fangs, scales.

536
00:15:09,100 --> 00:15:10,180
That's okay.

537
00:15:10,180 --> 00:15:12,430
I think it's okay to actually
leave it almost, like,

538
00:15:12,430 --> 00:15:13,330
in this outline form.

539
00:15:13,330 --> 00:15:14,730
Because to me,
it's communicating

540
00:15:14,728 --> 00:15:16,268
that we're just
audiences just seeing

541
00:15:16,270 --> 00:15:18,610
these quick little glimpses.

542
00:15:18,608 --> 00:15:19,898
This is gonna be controversial.

543
00:15:19,900 --> 00:15:22,330
I'm gonna say we push
in on the fallen walkie.

544
00:15:22,330 --> 00:15:24,340
There are some screenwriter
or screenwriter

545
00:15:24,340 --> 00:15:28,180
books that say don't write
camera moves into your script.

546
00:15:28,180 --> 00:15:30,440
We wholeheartedly disagree.

547
00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:32,860
I don't think you need to,
like, put them in a lot.

548
00:15:32,860 --> 00:15:35,630
But if it's helping tell the
story, which in this case,

549
00:15:35,630 --> 00:15:36,730
it is for me--

550
00:15:36,730 --> 00:15:39,070
I'm explaining that
the end of this beat

551
00:15:39,070 --> 00:15:41,260
is just going to be slowly
moving in and creeping in

552
00:15:41,260 --> 00:15:42,960
on this walkie, it's important.

553
00:15:42,962 --> 00:15:44,922
I think-- I think it
just helps the audience,

554
00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:46,510
helps the reader see it.

555
00:15:46,510 --> 00:15:47,770
You know what I mean?

556
00:15:47,770 --> 00:15:48,860
And that's essential.

557
00:15:48,860 --> 00:15:50,780
I mean, it's not
really stepping on--

558
00:15:50,777 --> 00:15:52,607
even if you're not going
to be directing it,

559
00:15:52,610 --> 00:15:55,390
it's not really stepping on what
the director is gonna be doing.

560
00:15:55,390 --> 00:15:57,270
They can do something
different if they want,

561
00:15:57,265 --> 00:15:59,205
but it's gonna help the
reader visualize this.

562
00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:02,070


563
00:16:03,487 --> 00:16:04,697
Again, this is our process.

564
00:16:04,695 --> 00:16:06,905
You may already be in
Final Draft at this stage.

565
00:16:06,908 --> 00:16:07,948
But I'm gonna to do this.

566
00:16:07,950 --> 00:16:09,000
I'm gonna copy.

567
00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:09,930
I'm gonna paste.

568
00:16:09,930 --> 00:16:10,860
Boom.

569
00:16:10,860 --> 00:16:13,440
Most of what we wrote,
it's translated it

570
00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:15,120
with some mistakes.

571
00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:17,520
It's thinking decrepit
mine is a character,

572
00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:20,470
which decrepit mine is not
a character with dialogue.

573
00:16:20,470 --> 00:16:21,510
It's a scene heading.

574
00:16:21,510 --> 00:16:24,120
And we're not gonna teach you
how to use these programs.

575
00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:27,000
They're pretty straightforward
once you learn them, so just

576
00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:28,440
take a couple of hours and--

577
00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:28,650
MATT DUFFER: Right.

578
00:16:28,650 --> 00:16:29,900
ROSS DUFFER: You're
gonna to learn it.

579
00:16:29,900 --> 00:16:32,190
And what I'm gonna do now is
I'm going to clean this up

580
00:16:32,192 --> 00:16:36,182
so it all at least works
fully as a screenplay.

581
00:16:36,182 --> 00:16:38,142
If there's a really
exciting scene like this,

582
00:16:38,140 --> 00:16:40,060
just capitalize the whole thing.

583
00:16:40,060 --> 00:16:42,400
It just emphasizes--
it implies that there's

584
00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:43,910
gonna be cacophonous music.

585
00:16:43,910 --> 00:16:45,190
And it's a huge moment.

586
00:16:45,190 --> 00:16:45,730
Why not?

587
00:16:45,730 --> 00:16:48,340
We're trying to use these
words, and the language,

588
00:16:48,340 --> 00:16:50,650
and the sounds just to go
this is something that's

589
00:16:50,650 --> 00:16:52,750
both a visual and also it has--

590
00:16:52,750 --> 00:16:54,310
there's sound going
on and whatever.

591
00:16:54,310 --> 00:16:56,360
Because you've got to
remember, this is a script.

592
00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:57,900
This is not a novel.

593
00:16:57,898 --> 00:17:00,188
And so you're trying to
communicate to the audience of,

594
00:17:00,190 --> 00:17:04,450
hey, when this thing is
actually made in produce

595
00:17:04,450 --> 00:17:06,820
and comes alive, this is
what it's gonna feel like.

596
00:17:06,819 --> 00:17:09,539
You're just trying to get
that across as best you can.

597
00:17:09,540 --> 00:17:11,350
This is gonna be a
huge moment where

598
00:17:11,349 --> 00:17:14,089
crazy stuff is going to happen.

599
00:17:14,089 --> 00:17:15,489
Sharp teeth, claws--

600
00:17:18,020 --> 00:17:18,920
Scales.

601
00:17:18,918 --> 00:17:19,838
Weird lizard scales.

602
00:17:19,835 --> 00:17:21,085
Shimmering lizard scales.

603
00:17:21,089 --> 00:17:21,919
I don't why there's a lizard.

604
00:17:21,920 --> 00:17:23,540
Well, because it
makes me think dragon-y.

605
00:17:23,540 --> 00:17:24,350
Like, you know what I mean?

606
00:17:24,349 --> 00:17:25,519
Guarding the treasure.

607
00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:27,020
I thought you didn't
want it to be a dragon.

608
00:17:27,020 --> 00:17:28,480
I know, but it
could be dragon-y.

609
00:17:28,478 --> 00:17:30,478
[LAUGHS] That makes no sense.

610
00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:30,980
Dragon-y.

611
00:17:30,980 --> 00:17:31,940
Sharp teeth.

612
00:17:31,940 --> 00:17:32,880
Okay.

613
00:17:32,882 --> 00:17:35,092
He also didn't like the
title of "Stranger Things."

614
00:17:35,090 --> 00:17:37,700
So he doesn't-- just, you
have to ignore him sometimes.

615
00:17:37,700 --> 00:17:41,060
So shimmering scales,
claws, bloody fangs.

616
00:17:41,060 --> 00:17:42,990
Normally what we would
do at this stage-

617
00:17:42,990 --> 00:17:43,490
Yeah.

618
00:17:43,490 --> 00:17:44,150
--is, yes.

619
00:17:44,152 --> 00:17:45,112
I will read it through.

620
00:17:45,110 --> 00:17:46,640
I would make any final tweaks.

621
00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:50,000
Then what I like to do
is we would print it out.

622
00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:51,720
There's something
about reading it,

623
00:17:51,715 --> 00:17:53,095
we think, on a
printed page where

624
00:17:53,090 --> 00:17:55,620
you can't make any edits or
tweaks that is very different.

625
00:17:55,618 --> 00:17:56,658
We would read it through.

626
00:17:56,660 --> 00:17:59,190
Then we-- we just keep
doing passages of the scene,

627
00:17:59,193 --> 00:18:00,363
making it better and better.

628
00:18:00,360 --> 00:18:03,020
So let's see how bad
it is or if it's okay.

629
00:18:03,020 --> 00:18:05,210
Scene heading--
enter unknown night.

630
00:18:05,210 --> 00:18:06,050
Pitch black.

631
00:18:06,050 --> 00:18:08,690
We hear strange groaning
sounds, creaks, the drip,

632
00:18:08,690 --> 00:18:10,280
drip of water.

633
00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:12,680
And then a voice echoes
over the darkness.

634
00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:16,190
Voice, filtered-- now I've
added filtered in there

635
00:18:16,190 --> 00:18:18,320
because it's coming
through a walkie-talkie.

636
00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:20,000
"Henderson, do you copy?

637
00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:20,950
Do you copy?"

638
00:18:20,953 --> 00:18:21,623
ROSS DUFFER: Uh.

639
00:18:21,620 --> 00:18:24,070
Whoosh-- a flashlight
suddenly cuts through.

640
00:18:24,070 --> 00:18:25,010
I like--

641
00:18:25,010 --> 00:18:26,270
See, we always do reflect--

642
00:18:26,270 --> 00:18:28,790
I think-- try to limit
how often you use suddenly.

643
00:18:28,790 --> 00:18:30,980
Whoosh-- a flashlight
slices through the darkness,

644
00:18:30,980 --> 00:18:32,810
revealing that we're--

645
00:18:32,810 --> 00:18:34,910
a flashlight now slices
through the darkness--

646
00:18:34,910 --> 00:18:35,990
through the dark--

647
00:18:35,990 --> 00:18:39,470
revealing that we're
in a decrepit mine.

648
00:18:39,470 --> 00:18:43,100
The flashlight continues,
sweeps across the mine walls.

649
00:18:43,100 --> 00:18:45,640
Wooden beams crisscross along--

650
00:18:45,640 --> 00:18:46,970
ROSS DUFFER: Muddy, slimy walls.

651
00:18:46,973 --> 00:18:47,183
MATT DUFFER: Muddy,
slimy, walls.

652
00:18:47,180 --> 00:18:47,890
That's correct.

653
00:18:47,888 --> 00:18:52,348
A silhouetted figure clutches to
the flashlight, slowly moving.

654
00:18:52,350 --> 00:18:54,590
There's some mistakes--
slowly moving towards us.

655
00:18:54,590 --> 00:18:56,450
We get a glimpse of this figure.

656
00:18:56,450 --> 00:18:58,700
They're short with curly
hair, a baseball cap,

657
00:18:58,700 --> 00:19:02,330
old sneakers a vest stuffed
with various useful items.

658
00:19:02,330 --> 00:19:05,540
Again, maybe if we went back,
we could be specific about a few

659
00:19:05,540 --> 00:19:06,170
of those items.

660
00:19:06,170 --> 00:19:07,170
But for now, this works.

661
00:19:07,170 --> 00:19:07,730
I--

662
00:19:07,730 --> 00:19:10,100
I might-- I want
to add batteries.

663
00:19:10,100 --> 00:19:12,590
Okay, then Matt's gonna
go the extra mile here.

664
00:19:12,590 --> 00:19:14,210
A heavy backpack
over his shoulder.

665
00:19:14,210 --> 00:19:16,730
There's a hunting rifle
sticking out of the top.

666
00:19:16,730 --> 00:19:19,400
It sure looks like the Dustin
we've come to know and love.

667
00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:20,820
MATT DUFFER: I
think because that,

668
00:19:20,817 --> 00:19:22,637
we're speaking really
to the audience.

669
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:23,210
You know?

670
00:19:23,210 --> 00:19:24,890
I want to italicize that.

671
00:19:24,890 --> 00:19:26,830
We like to do
italics to just give

672
00:19:26,833 --> 00:19:29,003
that extra emphasis on
certain words, certain ideas.

673
00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:30,000
Henderson, who loves--

674
00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:30,620
Do you copy?

675
00:19:30,620 --> 00:19:31,880
MATT DUFFER: We haven't
revealed it's Mack yet,

676
00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:32,990
so we should keep it voice.

677
00:19:32,990 --> 00:19:34,160
ROSS DUFFER: More agitated--

678
00:19:34,157 --> 00:19:36,377
"Henderson, do you copy?"

679
00:19:36,377 --> 00:19:37,707
Why do you have that dash there?

680
00:19:37,710 --> 00:19:39,370
I don't know.

681
00:19:39,370 --> 00:19:41,260
Close on the silhouetted hand.

682
00:19:41,260 --> 00:19:45,010
Reaches down and grabs a
walkie and raises it up.

683
00:19:45,010 --> 00:19:46,600
I'm gonna say, get rid of it.

684
00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:48,530
Again, sometimes you're
gonna overwrite this.

685
00:19:48,525 --> 00:19:49,155
So you should--

686
00:19:49,150 --> 00:19:50,260
I don't think we
need close on, yeah.

687
00:19:50,260 --> 00:19:51,680
Grabs a walkie
and raises it up.

688
00:19:51,677 --> 00:19:54,107
It is here that we reveal--

689
00:19:54,107 --> 00:19:55,027
Reveal that our--

690
00:19:55,030 --> 00:19:56,750
--that our
silhouetted figure's--

691
00:19:56,747 --> 00:19:57,577
ROSS DUFFER: Oh, oh.

692
00:19:57,580 --> 00:20:00,280
Reveal our cigaretted figure's
face for the first time.

693
00:20:00,280 --> 00:20:02,020
To our great surprise,
it isn't Dustin.

694
00:20:02,020 --> 00:20:04,060
This is Mr. Henderson, a.k.a.

695
00:20:04,060 --> 00:20:05,560
Dustin's dad, '40s.

696
00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:07,250
He's a spitting
image of his son.

697
00:20:07,252 --> 00:20:09,462
Imagine what Dustin would
look like when he grows up,

698
00:20:09,460 --> 00:20:10,590
and you'll get the picture.

699
00:20:10,585 --> 00:20:13,245
And again, you can talk to the
audience like that sometimes.

700
00:20:13,240 --> 00:20:15,070
You could do it a
lot, like Shane Black.

701
00:20:15,070 --> 00:20:17,600
Or we do it occasionally.

702
00:20:17,602 --> 00:20:18,682
And then you're Henderson.

703
00:20:18,685 --> 00:20:19,275
Right?

704
00:20:19,270 --> 00:20:20,080
MATT DUFFER: "I copy, yeah.

705
00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:21,310
But I'm a bit busy here."

706
00:20:21,310 --> 00:20:22,060
"Busy with what?

707
00:20:22,060 --> 00:20:23,110
We got to get going."

708
00:20:23,110 --> 00:20:24,430
MATT DUFFER: "I
found a new passage,

709
00:20:24,430 --> 00:20:26,100
and I got a good
feeling about this one."

710
00:20:26,095 --> 00:20:27,635
ROSS DUFFER: "Not
holding my breath."

711
00:20:27,637 --> 00:20:29,527
Now this can get more fun.

712
00:20:29,530 --> 00:20:30,700
That dialogue is whatever.

713
00:20:30,700 --> 00:20:32,290
We don't even
know who Mack is.

714
00:20:32,290 --> 00:20:34,330
Again, you will know
who your characters are.

715
00:20:34,330 --> 00:20:35,590
You've blue-skied it.

716
00:20:35,590 --> 00:20:36,880
I don't know who Mack is.

717
00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:38,790
We're just sort of going
with the flow here.

718
00:20:38,790 --> 00:20:39,290
Um.

719
00:20:39,290 --> 00:20:40,700
So Mack is not very defined.

720
00:20:40,697 --> 00:20:43,027
He would be more defined if
we were doing this for real.

721
00:20:43,030 --> 00:20:46,540
MATT DUFFER: Henderson continues
to move deeper into the mine,

722
00:20:46,540 --> 00:20:48,830
swings left down a corridor,
and hits a dead end.

723
00:20:48,827 --> 00:20:50,407
ROSS DUFFER: I'm
gonna underline that.

724
00:20:50,410 --> 00:20:51,580
MATT DUFFER: Underscore,
underline that.

725
00:20:51,580 --> 00:20:53,080
ROSS DUFFER: Yeah,
just to emphasize

726
00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:54,710
that's an end of a beat sort of.

727
00:20:54,710 --> 00:20:57,160
MATT DUFFER: And we got a
"Shit, shit, shit, shit, shit."

728
00:20:57,160 --> 00:20:59,510
Dustin says shit a lot, so I
like that his dad does too.

729
00:20:59,510 --> 00:21:00,010
This is--

730
00:21:00,010 --> 00:21:00,640
ROSS DUFFER: And then Mac is--

731
00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:01,450
MATT DUFFER: --implying that
he gets it from his dad.

732
00:21:01,450 --> 00:21:02,530
"Shit, shit, shit, shit, shit."

733
00:21:02,530 --> 00:21:03,400
ROSS DUFFER: "Shit, what"

734
00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:04,360
MATT DUFFER: "Dead end."

735
00:21:04,360 --> 00:21:05,440
ROSS DUFFER: "I'm shocked.

736
00:21:05,443 --> 00:21:06,633
Let's please go?"

737
00:21:06,637 --> 00:21:07,717
That's not very good line.

738
00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:09,010
Is it?

739
00:21:09,008 --> 00:21:10,798
I don't think we need
a line for Mack here.

740
00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:11,110
MATT DUFFER: Yeah, yeah.

741
00:21:11,110 --> 00:21:12,110
I don't think so either.

742
00:21:12,110 --> 00:21:13,090
Dead end.

743
00:21:13,090 --> 00:21:14,630
ROSS DUFFER: When
in doubt, delete.

744
00:21:14,628 --> 00:21:17,168
MATT DUFFER: Henderson turns to
leave when he hear something,

745
00:21:17,170 --> 00:21:19,490
a low whistling sound.

746
00:21:19,492 --> 00:21:20,952
I'm gonna say, it
sounds like wind.

747
00:21:20,950 --> 00:21:21,970
It's a lot of sound.

748
00:21:21,970 --> 00:21:24,010
I just say wind.

749
00:21:24,010 --> 00:21:25,910
So again, you're gonna
be overwriting it.

750
00:21:25,913 --> 00:21:27,083
He steps up to the dead end.

751
00:21:27,080 --> 00:21:29,050
There's a small gap in the wall.

752
00:21:29,050 --> 00:21:30,680
This is where the
wind is coming from.

753
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:32,620
He takes a deep breath,
then reaches his hand

754
00:21:32,620 --> 00:21:35,890
inside the small gap and
grabs hold of something.

755
00:21:35,890 --> 00:21:36,640
Turns it.

756
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:37,720
Click.

757
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,520
This is a little too
derivative of "Indiana Jones,"

758
00:21:40,520 --> 00:21:41,320
if I have to say.

759
00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:43,120
Maybe we can come up with
something more specific

760
00:21:43,120 --> 00:21:44,180
when we have more time.

761
00:21:44,180 --> 00:21:45,040
So it turns it.

762
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:45,850
Click.

763
00:21:45,850 --> 00:21:48,580
Then whoom, the wall
begins to open up.

764
00:21:48,580 --> 00:21:50,360
Henderson's eyes go wide.

765
00:21:50,360 --> 00:21:52,280
Whatever he sees shocks him.

766
00:21:52,280 --> 00:21:56,390
He steps forward into
a mysterious chamber.

767
00:21:56,385 --> 00:21:57,765
I'm going to say
continuous here,

768
00:21:57,760 --> 00:21:59,380
because we're not cutting.

769
00:21:59,380 --> 00:22:00,850
So continuous.

770
00:22:00,850 --> 00:22:04,030
His flashlight reflects a
shimmering gold light back

771
00:22:04,030 --> 00:22:05,410
onto his awed face.

772
00:22:05,410 --> 00:22:07,810
We don't see what's
causing the shimmer--

773
00:22:07,810 --> 00:22:10,130
misspelled shimmer--
but whatever it is,

774
00:22:10,130 --> 00:22:12,160
it makes Henderson
tremble with excitement.

775
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:14,920
In fact, he's so excited
he can hardly speak.

776
00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:17,810
"Mack, I-- I think I found it."

777
00:22:17,808 --> 00:22:18,848
ROSS DUFFER: "Found what?

778
00:22:18,850 --> 00:22:20,190
MATT DUFFER: "The jackpot."

779
00:22:20,190 --> 00:22:21,190
ROSS DUFFER: "Holy shit.

780
00:22:21,190 --> 00:22:22,300
You pulling my leg?

781
00:22:22,300 --> 00:22:23,800
You better not be
pulling my leg."

782
00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:26,710
Before Henderson
can respond, shoom.

783
00:22:26,710 --> 00:22:28,090
I think shoom is maybe better.

784
00:22:28,090 --> 00:22:30,460
Shoom, his flashlight cuts out.

785
00:22:30,460 --> 00:22:31,960
It's very dark now.

786
00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:35,470
Again, it's okay to be simple
and just obvious sometimes.

787
00:22:35,470 --> 00:22:36,480
More shits.

788
00:22:36,475 --> 00:22:38,355
But lucky for Henderson,
he has his batteries

789
00:22:38,350 --> 00:22:40,120
on his vest just like his son.

790
00:22:40,120 --> 00:22:42,910
He starts to quickly replace
the batteries in his flashlight

791
00:22:42,910 --> 00:22:46,600
when we hear a strange guttural
sound, something not human,

792
00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:49,330
animalistic, but unlike
any animal we know.

793
00:22:49,330 --> 00:22:52,060
And it's coming from
somewhere in this room.

794
00:22:52,060 --> 00:22:54,490
Henderson spins around,
but the room is dark.

795
00:22:54,490 --> 00:22:56,410
He can't see where
the sound came from.

796
00:22:56,410 --> 00:22:58,070
Again, we're really
breaking this up.

797
00:22:58,070 --> 00:23:00,160
We're doing a lot of
spaces just to get this--

798
00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:02,650
if it's all clumped
as one dialogue,

799
00:23:02,650 --> 00:23:04,660
your reader may just
sort of glaze over it

800
00:23:04,660 --> 00:23:06,100
and flip to the next page.

801
00:23:06,100 --> 00:23:08,300
MATT DUFFER: Very
quietly, very slowly,

802
00:23:08,300 --> 00:23:11,590
he removes the hunting
rifle from off his shoulder.

803
00:23:11,590 --> 00:23:13,960
He aims it in the
direction of the sound.

804
00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:16,870
Then he reaches out with his
thumb and cocks the hammer.

805
00:23:16,870 --> 00:23:17,380
Click.

806
00:23:17,380 --> 00:23:18,910
So we've done the
David Koepp thing

807
00:23:18,907 --> 00:23:19,987
where we've spread it out.

808
00:23:19,990 --> 00:23:21,700
Because you really want
to emphasize that--

809
00:23:21,700 --> 00:23:22,180
[CLICK]

810
00:23:22,180 --> 00:23:24,010
--you can start to see
how quiet it's becoming.

811
00:23:24,010 --> 00:23:24,510
Yeah.

812
00:23:24,510 --> 00:23:26,230
We're just zeroing
in on the sound.

813
00:23:26,230 --> 00:23:27,730
MATT DUFFER: Another
roar, this time

814
00:23:27,730 --> 00:23:29,260
from another part of the room.

815
00:23:29,260 --> 00:23:30,730
We're calling it
room and chamber,

816
00:23:30,730 --> 00:23:33,020
so we'll go through and decide
what we want to call it.

817
00:23:33,022 --> 00:23:33,942
Henderson spins again.

818
00:23:33,940 --> 00:23:34,600
Another roar.

819
00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:36,490
This came from his
left, then his right.

820
00:23:36,490 --> 00:23:38,260
And then whoosh.

821
00:23:38,260 --> 00:23:41,560
And again, breaking that up,
like Koepp did in "Panic Room."

822
00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:44,530
it's just like-- it keeps
people turning that page.

823
00:23:44,530 --> 00:23:45,580
Just keep reading it.

824
00:23:45,580 --> 00:23:46,450
It's a fast read.

825
00:23:46,450 --> 00:23:49,090
And then here's where we went
to an all-caps saying, whoom,

826
00:23:49,090 --> 00:23:50,380
like we're shouting at you.

827
00:23:50,380 --> 00:23:53,140
Whoom, something shadowy in
large lunges at Henderson.

828
00:23:53,140 --> 00:23:55,150
Bang, Henderson's
rifle goes off.

829
00:23:55,150 --> 00:23:56,920
In the light of
the muzzle flashes,

830
00:23:56,920 --> 00:23:58,240
we see a blur of action.

831
00:23:58,240 --> 00:23:59,630
Henderson thrown to the ground.

832
00:23:59,630 --> 00:24:01,540
His walkie scattering
to the rocky ground.

833
00:24:01,540 --> 00:24:02,950
We see glimpses of our monster.

834
00:24:02,950 --> 00:24:05,530
Sharp teeth, shimmering
scales, claws, bloody fangs

835
00:24:05,530 --> 00:24:07,270
reaching for Henderson's neck.

836
00:24:07,270 --> 00:24:09,010
I'm gonna be more
specific there--

837
00:24:09,010 --> 00:24:09,610
neck.

838
00:24:09,610 --> 00:24:13,210
He lets out a long, pained
scream and then silence.

839
00:24:13,210 --> 00:24:16,570
We push in on the fallen walkie
as a panicked Mack continues

840
00:24:16,570 --> 00:24:18,660
to call out for his friend.

841
00:24:18,658 --> 00:24:20,198
ROSS DUFFER:
"Henderson, do you copy?

842
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:21,400
Do you copy?

843
00:24:21,402 --> 00:24:22,362
MATT DUFFER: No answer.

844
00:24:22,360 --> 00:24:23,860
Only ominous silence.

845
00:24:23,860 --> 00:24:24,820
And then right here--

846
00:24:24,815 --> 00:24:26,445
I'm going to be a
little dramatic here.

847
00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:26,940
[LAUGHS]

848
00:24:26,940 --> 00:24:29,470
MATT DUFFER: Right here, we cut
to black and then, you know.

849
00:24:29,472 --> 00:24:30,682
And that's just sort of a--

850
00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:31,710
MATT DUFFER: Titles!

851
00:24:31,705 --> 00:24:32,535
ROSS DUFFER: Titles.

852
00:24:32,538 --> 00:24:34,598
And that's sort of a
three-page opening hook.

853
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:36,290
And again, we would
keep honing it.

854
00:24:36,290 --> 00:24:38,580
We don't really know who
these characters are yet, so--

855
00:24:38,582 --> 00:24:41,212
I think the biggest thing that
needs improvement when reading

856
00:24:41,207 --> 00:24:43,657
it through is just a little
bit more specific about this--

857
00:24:43,660 --> 00:24:45,520
you know, what unlocks
this mysterious chamber.

858
00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:45,580
Yeah.

859
00:24:45,580 --> 00:24:47,410
I think we can be
more interested in there

860
00:24:47,413 --> 00:24:49,303
and I think we can
improve the dialogue

861
00:24:49,300 --> 00:24:50,980
so you a little
bit more understand

862
00:24:50,975 --> 00:24:51,855
who these characters.

863
00:24:51,850 --> 00:24:55,000
We are assuming we're going to
meet this Mack character when

864
00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:56,360
Dustin and Steve go to Arizona.

865
00:24:56,355 --> 00:24:56,865
He needs to be
very interesting.

866
00:24:56,860 --> 00:24:58,690
So he needs to be really
interesting and specific,

867
00:24:58,690 --> 00:24:59,650
and he's not right now.

868
00:24:59,650 --> 00:25:02,620
He's just kind of-- he's just
kind of a wall for Dustin's dad

869
00:25:02,620 --> 00:25:03,820
to bounce off of.

870
00:25:03,818 --> 00:25:06,108
So those are the things that
we would probably work on.

871
00:25:06,110 --> 00:25:08,930
So I think, you know--
we did that very quickly.

872
00:25:08,930 --> 00:25:10,660
But hopefully what
you can see is,

873
00:25:10,660 --> 00:25:13,540
it started out very
broad, very messy,

874
00:25:13,540 --> 00:25:15,310
a lot of spitballing of ideas.

875
00:25:15,310 --> 00:25:19,550
And slowly, it formed into
something much more coherent.

876
00:25:19,550 --> 00:25:21,550
And then we just
kept adding details,

877
00:25:21,550 --> 00:25:22,960
cleaning it up, cleaning it up.

878
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:25,450
And what you're seeing here
at the end of this process,

879
00:25:25,450 --> 00:25:28,900
we've got a hook that
isn't bad, but it's

880
00:25:28,900 --> 00:25:30,290
gonna continue to improve.

881
00:25:30,290 --> 00:25:32,290
So we're gonna talk more
about these characters.

882
00:25:32,290 --> 00:25:33,630
How can we improve that?

883
00:25:33,632 --> 00:25:35,592
How can we come up with
something more original

884
00:25:35,590 --> 00:25:38,980
than just, you know,
him reaching into a hole

885
00:25:38,980 --> 00:25:41,090
and turning something,
which we've seen before.

886
00:25:41,090 --> 00:25:43,000
So we're gonna
continue to go and just

887
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:45,160
try to make this even
better and more original.

888
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:47,830
But what we've got now is
a pretty good first pass

889
00:25:47,830 --> 00:25:48,460
at this scene.

890
00:25:48,460 --> 00:25:51,320


891
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:56,330
Okay, so that was stressful.

892
00:25:56,330 --> 00:25:57,230
So we did that.

893
00:25:57,230 --> 00:25:58,130
[LAUGHS]

894
00:25:58,130 --> 00:26:00,830
And [LAUGHS] we'd like
you to do the same thing.

895
00:26:00,830 --> 00:26:03,710
You don't have to do it within
the sort of time that we had.

896
00:26:03,710 --> 00:26:06,470
What you want to do is you
want to take the opening

897
00:26:06,470 --> 00:26:08,480
scene, your opening hook.

898
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:10,870
And we want you to take it
from the final outline--

899
00:26:10,865 --> 00:26:11,815
The final outline.

900
00:26:11,810 --> 00:26:15,170
--to script stage, very
much just like what we did.

901
00:26:15,170 --> 00:26:16,180
Read it through.

902
00:26:16,175 --> 00:26:18,055
Do another pass, do
another pass until you're

903
00:26:18,050 --> 00:26:18,930
really happy with it.

904
00:26:18,925 --> 00:26:21,445
And remember to focus on
those elements of description,

905
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:23,630
action, dialogue.

906
00:26:23,630 --> 00:26:26,250
And you're just gonna keep
honing it and keep working it

907
00:26:26,250 --> 00:26:27,750
until you feel
really good about it.

908
00:26:27,750 --> 00:26:30,470
And again, the opening hook, you
know, for the "Stranger Things"

909
00:26:30,470 --> 00:26:32,570
pilot script, it was
only about a page.

910
00:26:32,570 --> 00:26:37,130
For the unofficial Dustin and
Steve spinoff we just wrote,

911
00:26:37,130 --> 00:26:38,870
that was about three pages.

912
00:26:38,870 --> 00:26:41,270
Anywhere from really
one to five pages

913
00:26:41,270 --> 00:26:44,160
should do the trick unless you
want to get very elaborate,

914
00:26:44,162 --> 00:26:45,622
and do a "Raiders
of the Lost Ark,"

915
00:26:45,620 --> 00:26:48,560
and have a nice 10-plus
page opening hook.

916
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:49,310
That's fine too.

917
00:26:49,310 --> 00:26:50,090
That's fine too.

918
00:26:50,090 --> 00:26:53,010
Or keep it simple like we did
for the pilot of "Stranger

919
00:26:53,010 --> 00:26:53,510
Things."

920
00:26:53,510 --> 00:26:54,010
It depends.

921
00:26:54,010 --> 00:26:57,930
Whatever your story dictates,
go with your gut there but good

922
00:26:57,930 --> 00:26:58,430
luck.

923
00:26:58,430 --> 00:26:59,680

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,430


2
00:00:05,687 --> 00:00:08,017
MATT DUFFER: So once you get
to the stage in the process

3
00:00:08,020 --> 00:00:10,000
where you have your
script, which is huge--

4
00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:11,500
you've overcome
this massive hurdle.

5
00:00:11,500 --> 00:00:12,860
You've done all this work.

6
00:00:12,860 --> 00:00:15,380
But the question is,
now, who's gonna read it?

7
00:00:15,380 --> 00:00:16,770
How do you get
anyone to read it?

8
00:00:16,770 --> 00:00:19,350
This is probably the question
we get asked the most, which is,

9
00:00:19,353 --> 00:00:19,933
what now?

10
00:00:19,930 --> 00:00:20,840
What do I do now?

11
00:00:20,840 --> 00:00:22,720
And, you know, as we've
kind of talked about,

12
00:00:22,715 --> 00:00:26,715
previously, we had no
connections, no Hollywood

13
00:00:26,710 --> 00:00:27,340
connections.

14
00:00:27,340 --> 00:00:29,390
Our dad was not in the
business, none of that.

15
00:00:29,390 --> 00:00:32,110
So if you have that, great.

16
00:00:32,110 --> 00:00:32,950
Good for you.

17
00:00:32,950 --> 00:00:34,180
You're in the door already.

18
00:00:34,180 --> 00:00:35,560
You have someone who you
can give the script to.

19
00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:37,390
But most of us-- you
know, most of you

20
00:00:37,390 --> 00:00:39,540
probably don't have
Hollywood connections

21
00:00:39,537 --> 00:00:41,617
and it is difficult. So
it's like, what do you do?

22
00:00:41,620 --> 00:00:43,960
You have the script, this
great script that works.

23
00:00:43,960 --> 00:00:44,830
Now, what?

24
00:00:51,390 --> 00:00:51,930
All right.

25
00:00:51,930 --> 00:00:57,300
So you have-- like Matt says,
you have this amazing script.

26
00:00:57,300 --> 00:00:59,400
So the trick is
now to get it read.

27
00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:01,120
So I think a lot
of times people go,

28
00:01:01,120 --> 00:01:04,260
oh, well, I'm gonna just
send this to Netflix

29
00:01:04,260 --> 00:01:07,020
or I'm gonna send to Amazon or
I'm going to send it to HBO.

30
00:01:07,020 --> 00:01:10,540
And, unfortunately,
it's not that simple.

31
00:01:10,540 --> 00:01:14,190
If-- if you do end up somehow
getting your script to Netflix

32
00:01:14,190 --> 00:01:15,820
or Amazon or HBO or Apple--

33
00:01:15,815 --> 00:01:17,945
Meaning, like, just-- if
you just send it to them

34
00:01:17,940 --> 00:01:18,330
in the mail.

35
00:01:18,330 --> 00:01:19,790
If you send it
in the mail, you--

36
00:01:19,788 --> 00:01:22,138
you throw it over the fence,
whatever you do or you find

37
00:01:22,140 --> 00:01:25,860
someone's email, however
you do it, don't do that,

38
00:01:25,860 --> 00:01:27,700
because they're just
gonna throw it out.

39
00:01:27,700 --> 00:01:31,030
So it's really just
a waste of your time.

40
00:01:31,030 --> 00:01:33,070
So what we're gonna
talk about now is,

41
00:01:33,070 --> 00:01:37,260
how do you get it to
Netflix or HBO or Amazon?

42
00:01:37,260 --> 00:01:39,510
And the answer to
that is you're gonna

43
00:01:39,510 --> 00:01:41,520
need an agent or a manager.

44
00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:43,120
Why do you need
an agent or manager?

45
00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:47,530
Basically they're your conduit
into the whole, like, Hollywood

46
00:01:47,530 --> 00:01:48,030
system.

47
00:01:48,030 --> 00:01:48,530
Right?

48
00:01:48,530 --> 00:01:53,040
So they are able to get your
script out to producers.

49
00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:54,480
And producers will
be able to get

50
00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:57,330
your script to
studios and networks,

51
00:01:57,330 --> 00:02:00,000
such as, like, Netflix, right?

52
00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:00,780
For example.

53
00:02:00,780 --> 00:02:02,860
Without an agent or
a manager, no one's

54
00:02:02,858 --> 00:02:03,898
gonna take you seriously.

55
00:02:03,900 --> 00:02:05,340
Unless you're
pretty established,

56
00:02:05,340 --> 00:02:07,450
you can't, you know,
represent yourself.

57
00:02:07,450 --> 00:02:07,950
OK?

58
00:02:07,950 --> 00:02:10,440
You're gonna need to find one
of these agents or managers.

59
00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:12,900
Sometimes people ask, you know,
I'm still a little confused

60
00:02:12,898 --> 00:02:15,328
about it, the difference
between an agent or a manager.

61
00:02:15,330 --> 00:02:18,660
Managers tend to
represent fewer people.

62
00:02:18,660 --> 00:02:20,910
So it's a little
bit more personal.

63
00:02:20,910 --> 00:02:23,430
You can kind of call them
up, you know, on a Saturday

64
00:02:23,430 --> 00:02:24,360
at 3:00 PM.

65
00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:26,070
I mean, I can do that
with my agent now,

66
00:02:26,070 --> 00:02:27,070
which is a little weird.

67
00:02:27,070 --> 00:02:29,400
And agents tend to
represent a lot more people.

68
00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:33,780
But they work at a really large
company, such as CAA, where,

69
00:02:33,780 --> 00:02:35,080
you know-- and they have--

70
00:02:35,075 --> 00:02:38,255
the good-- the advantage of
working with an agent or big--

71
00:02:38,250 --> 00:02:40,350
at a bigger agency
is that they have

72
00:02:40,350 --> 00:02:43,410
a lot of other connections
within that agency, right?

73
00:02:43,410 --> 00:02:45,540
Like big name actors,
big name directors

74
00:02:45,540 --> 00:02:48,120
who they could help-- they
could attach your script to.

75
00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:49,600
And that could help sell it.

76
00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:53,190
So it doesn't really matter
at this-- at this point.

77
00:02:53,190 --> 00:02:54,990
You just need someone
to represent you.

78
00:02:54,990 --> 00:02:58,710
Someone-- the truth is it's
actually a relatively small

79
00:02:58,710 --> 00:02:59,310
town.

80
00:02:59,310 --> 00:03:01,590
Everyone knows
everybody, generally.

81
00:03:01,590 --> 00:03:04,440
So the key is just
gonna be to find someone

82
00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:06,900
that responds to
your script and that

83
00:03:06,897 --> 00:03:08,727
can get it in the hands
of the right people.

84
00:03:08,730 --> 00:03:10,940
And again, all of these
people know the right people.

85
00:03:10,938 --> 00:03:12,688
So you just gotta
get it in their hands

86
00:03:12,690 --> 00:03:14,940
and they gotta like your script,
which seems simple, right?

87
00:03:14,940 --> 00:03:15,480
So OK.

88
00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:20,490
I can't send my script to
Amazon or Netflix or Apple.

89
00:03:20,490 --> 00:03:23,940
So I'm just gonna send it
to some management companies

90
00:03:23,940 --> 00:03:25,800
or agencies.

91
00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:28,080
Unfortunately, it's
also not that simple.

92
00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:32,250
They're also gonna most likely
throw your script in the trash

93
00:03:32,250 --> 00:03:33,540
and not even look at it.

94
00:03:33,540 --> 00:03:36,450
And this sort of becomes a
bit of a chicken and the egg

95
00:03:36,450 --> 00:03:37,260
situation.

96
00:03:37,260 --> 00:03:39,360
There's a bit of a
conundrum here of like--

97
00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:42,910
what you're gonna ask, which
is a completely valid question,

98
00:03:42,910 --> 00:03:46,560
which is, well, if I need
an agent to sell my script,

99
00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:48,780
but my agent-- an agent
won't read my script,

100
00:03:48,780 --> 00:03:50,320
how do I get an agent?

101
00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:54,900
And that is the most complicated
part of this entire process.

102
00:03:54,900 --> 00:03:58,400
And I wish there was a better
system in order for this

103
00:03:58,400 --> 00:03:58,900
to work.

104
00:03:58,900 --> 00:04:01,260
But we're gonna at least tell
you how we managed to do it.

105
00:04:01,260 --> 00:04:02,680
And-- and,
ultimately, you know,

106
00:04:02,677 --> 00:04:05,227
I was kinda saying earlier, it's
very-- you know, it's hard--

107
00:04:05,225 --> 00:04:07,355
it's especially hard if
you don't have connections,

108
00:04:07,350 --> 00:04:09,360
because the truth
is you need-- you--

109
00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:10,690
you need connections, right?

110
00:04:10,692 --> 00:04:12,902
So if you have connections,
if you're coming out here

111
00:04:12,900 --> 00:04:14,790
and people already
have connections,

112
00:04:14,790 --> 00:04:18,120
they have an advantage over
you in terms of-- now, listen,

113
00:04:18,117 --> 00:04:19,947
if their script stinks,
their script stinks.

114
00:04:19,950 --> 00:04:21,090
It's not gonna help them.

115
00:04:21,089 --> 00:04:22,509
But so, hopefully,
your advantage

116
00:04:22,505 --> 00:04:23,885
is you have a
really good script.

117
00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:25,300
That's the best
thing that you can

118
00:04:25,297 --> 00:04:28,437
have going for you is a really
good script, so that when you

119
00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:31,110
do find-- make that connection,
you hand it to them,

120
00:04:31,110 --> 00:04:33,420
the script is gonna
work for them.

121
00:04:33,415 --> 00:04:35,295
What do you do if you
don't have connections?

122
00:04:35,290 --> 00:04:36,540
So we didn't have connections.

123
00:04:36,540 --> 00:04:40,170
We were at-- we-- we
were going to film school

124
00:04:40,170 --> 00:04:42,810
out here at Chapman
University in Orange County.

125
00:04:42,810 --> 00:04:45,810
We were close-ish to LA.

126
00:04:45,810 --> 00:04:47,790
We knew we needed
to make connections.

127
00:04:47,790 --> 00:04:51,090
We needed to meet people
who were making stuff

128
00:04:51,090 --> 00:04:52,420
within the industry.

129
00:04:52,420 --> 00:04:55,620
And so we just, every
summer, and actually

130
00:04:55,620 --> 00:04:57,480
even throughout the
year, we interned.

131
00:04:57,480 --> 00:04:58,230
There's two of us.

132
00:04:58,230 --> 00:05:00,310
Again, this is the advantage
of having two people.

133
00:05:00,313 --> 00:05:01,923
But you can do it
yourself, obviously.

134
00:05:01,920 --> 00:05:03,760
Which is-- we-- we
divided and conquered.

135
00:05:03,758 --> 00:05:05,548
We're like, oh, we
should-- it's two of us.

136
00:05:05,550 --> 00:05:08,180
We should take advantage of the
fact that we're twins and just,

137
00:05:08,175 --> 00:05:09,515
like, spread out all over town.

138
00:05:09,510 --> 00:05:11,940
We did every internship
we could-- could find

139
00:05:11,940 --> 00:05:14,130
and we met as many
people as we could.

140
00:05:14,130 --> 00:05:17,650
We did try to put in-- you know,
do a lot of good work there.

141
00:05:17,650 --> 00:05:20,550
I mean, it's not the most
fun thing in the world,

142
00:05:20,550 --> 00:05:21,630
these internships.

143
00:05:21,630 --> 00:05:26,740
In our case, it was work to
help get coll-- college credit.

144
00:05:26,740 --> 00:05:30,060
And so I guess what
you might question--

145
00:05:30,060 --> 00:05:32,520
you might ask then is, OK,
so I got one of these--

146
00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:34,590
I-- I found an internship.

147
00:05:34,590 --> 00:05:36,730
And so now, what do I do?

148
00:05:36,732 --> 00:05:38,942
I just hand this brilliant
script that I've written--

149
00:05:38,940 --> 00:05:40,690
I hand it to someone
in the company

150
00:05:40,692 --> 00:05:43,152
and they're gonna read it an
they're gonna get me an agent.

151
00:05:43,150 --> 00:05:45,630
It's also not that simple.

152
00:05:45,630 --> 00:05:48,300
What you really need to
do, like Matt's saying is,

153
00:05:48,300 --> 00:05:49,320
you just gotta--

154
00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:50,450
you gotta put in the work.

155
00:05:50,450 --> 00:05:54,230
We-- we made copies of scripts.

156
00:05:54,230 --> 00:05:56,510
We fetched coffees.

157
00:05:56,510 --> 00:05:59,990
I delivered presents to people.

158
00:05:59,990 --> 00:06:01,860
I did Christmas stuff.

159
00:06:01,860 --> 00:06:05,400
I-- it's-- and some of the
time, I was given a fun task.

160
00:06:05,403 --> 00:06:07,073
Like I'd be like,
here, read this script

161
00:06:07,070 --> 00:06:08,510
and let me know what you think.

162
00:06:08,510 --> 00:06:09,500
And you do.

163
00:06:09,500 --> 00:06:13,070
And you slowly start
to earn people's trust.

164
00:06:13,070 --> 00:06:16,670
I was working at a
company called Appian Way.

165
00:06:16,670 --> 00:06:18,530
And my boss there--

166
00:06:18,530 --> 00:06:21,710
one of my bosses there
was Franklin Leonard.

167
00:06:21,710 --> 00:06:24,710
You might know now, if-- if
you're into screenwriting,

168
00:06:24,710 --> 00:06:26,510
he runs something
called the Blacklist.

169
00:06:26,510 --> 00:06:28,730
But back then, it was--
and it's still, part of it

170
00:06:28,730 --> 00:06:31,460
is, today is it just a list
of people's favorite scripts

171
00:06:31,460 --> 00:06:33,680
they read this year
within Hollywood.

172
00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:37,910
So the point is Franklin
was a great boss.

173
00:06:37,910 --> 00:06:39,590
And you know, I
did work with him.

174
00:06:39,590 --> 00:06:40,820
And you start to earn trust.

175
00:06:40,820 --> 00:06:44,510
And I remember, I told him about
this show called "The Wire."

176
00:06:44,510 --> 00:06:46,190
And I got him hooked on it.

177
00:06:46,190 --> 00:06:47,600
And he became obsessed.

178
00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:50,450
And just little things
like that just--

179
00:06:50,450 --> 00:06:52,490
again, just like with
your scripts, baby steps.

180
00:06:52,493 --> 00:06:53,663
You start to earn people's--

181
00:06:53,660 --> 00:06:55,850
You didn't-- you didn't hand
Franklin the script the day you

182
00:06:55,850 --> 00:06:56,630
walked in there.

183
00:06:56,630 --> 00:06:56,900
No.

184
00:06:56,900 --> 00:06:58,160
Like, he'll never look
at you again, probably.

185
00:06:58,160 --> 00:06:59,810
I think this was
probably nine--

186
00:06:59,810 --> 00:07:01,460
at least after 9, 10 months--

187
00:07:01,460 --> 00:07:01,970
Right.

188
00:07:01,970 --> 00:07:03,290
--of working there.

189
00:07:03,290 --> 00:07:05,990
And I go, hey, here's a script.

190
00:07:05,990 --> 00:07:07,580
If you happen to
have time, you know,

191
00:07:07,580 --> 00:07:09,290
I'd love your thoughts on it.

192
00:07:09,290 --> 00:07:11,270
Franklin read the script.

193
00:07:11,270 --> 00:07:13,640
And again, we wrote
this script in college.

194
00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:14,810
It's a pretty messy script.

195
00:07:14,810 --> 00:07:16,530
It has a lot of issues.

196
00:07:16,530 --> 00:07:20,760
It has a pretty strong
first 5 to 10 pages.

197
00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:22,820
Whatever it was that
convinced Franklin,

198
00:07:22,820 --> 00:07:25,340
he thought that there
was a promise in this.

199
00:07:25,340 --> 00:07:27,890
And he sent it to
a couple of agents.

200
00:07:27,890 --> 00:07:29,760
They also thought there
was promise in it.

201
00:07:29,760 --> 00:07:30,840
We took those meetings.

202
00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:33,290
And we had in--

203
00:07:33,290 --> 00:07:35,490
through that, we were
able to get agents.

204
00:07:35,490 --> 00:07:38,870
So the point is, you have
to find your Franklin.

205
00:07:38,870 --> 00:07:40,610
It may not be
through internships.

206
00:07:40,610 --> 00:07:44,270
It may be-- there may be
through some other way.

207
00:07:44,270 --> 00:07:48,740
But the key is you need someone
to hand your script to an agent

208
00:07:48,740 --> 00:07:50,810
and say, hey, this is good.

209
00:07:50,810 --> 00:07:54,350
If you just cold email,
cold call, it's unlikely.

210
00:07:54,350 --> 00:07:56,150
There are other avenues.

211
00:07:56,150 --> 00:07:57,980
Franklin's Blacklist is one.

212
00:07:57,980 --> 00:07:58,960
There's--

213
00:07:58,957 --> 00:07:59,917
There's competitions.

214
00:07:59,915 --> 00:08:00,985
There's competition.

215
00:08:00,980 --> 00:08:02,040
Some of those are valid.

216
00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:03,910
Some of those are just
trying to steal your money.

217
00:08:03,910 --> 00:08:05,090
So you have to be careful.

218
00:08:05,090 --> 00:08:09,440
But generally, there are
ways to get your script out.

219
00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:12,290
The most helpful thing and the
fastest way, in our opinion,

220
00:08:12,290 --> 00:08:14,330
is to come out here
and meet people.

221
00:08:14,330 --> 00:08:17,000
That may not be possible
for you, in which case

222
00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:19,670
it is gonna have to be an online
thing and it's gonna help.

223
00:08:19,670 --> 00:08:22,770
If your script is really good,
hopefully, it'll find its way.

224
00:08:22,770 --> 00:08:26,090
But if there's any way that
you can meet people out here,

225
00:08:26,090 --> 00:08:28,740
that is probably the
fastest and cleanest way.

226
00:08:28,740 --> 00:08:30,810
It was within-- it's
still gonna take time.

227
00:08:30,810 --> 00:08:33,260
It was a couple of years
of interning and working

228
00:08:33,260 --> 00:08:36,230
before we were able
to even get our script

229
00:08:36,230 --> 00:08:39,210
in the hand of someone who
knew an agent, much less meet

230
00:08:39,210 --> 00:08:39,710
an agent.

231
00:08:39,710 --> 00:08:43,230
So it was just-- it is a process
and it is gonna take some time.

232
00:08:43,230 --> 00:08:45,750
So if you can get out
here, that would be great.

233
00:08:45,745 --> 00:08:47,875
And it can be-- it can
be discouraging and just--

234
00:08:47,870 --> 00:08:50,160
just as you're writing a
script, it can be frustrating.

235
00:08:50,162 --> 00:08:52,982
So, like, just to show
the other side of it.

236
00:08:52,977 --> 00:08:54,807
And I think I was just
as good of an intern,

237
00:08:54,810 --> 00:08:56,300
if not a better intern
than my brother.

238
00:08:56,300 --> 00:08:56,630
Right?

239
00:08:56,630 --> 00:08:57,200
OK?

240
00:08:57,200 --> 00:08:59,120
So-- and I put in
about a year and a half

241
00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:00,800
at this company that
shall not be named.

242
00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:01,300
Right?

243
00:09:01,300 --> 00:09:05,510
And I-- and, you know, I think
I did solid-- good, solid work.

244
00:09:05,510 --> 00:09:08,420
And I hand the same exact
script over to them saying, will

245
00:09:08,420 --> 00:09:08,960
you read it?

246
00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:10,100
Of course.

247
00:09:10,100 --> 00:09:11,200
Nothing happened.

248
00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:11,700
OK?

249
00:09:11,700 --> 00:09:13,370
Like, so-- it
didn't go anywhere.

250
00:09:13,370 --> 00:09:14,870
They didn't send it to
an agent or a manager.

251
00:09:14,870 --> 00:09:15,110
Right?

252
00:09:15,110 --> 00:09:15,870
They didn't help.

253
00:09:15,870 --> 00:09:19,790
So this is why don't bank
on one single person or one

254
00:09:19,790 --> 00:09:21,740
single company.

255
00:09:21,740 --> 00:09:22,470
Spread out.

256
00:09:22,470 --> 00:09:24,460
If it's just you, just--
then-- then, you know,

257
00:09:24,455 --> 00:09:26,365
you need to spread
out and go to a bunch

258
00:09:26,368 --> 00:09:27,408
of different internships.

259
00:09:27,410 --> 00:09:29,510
Don't bank on any one
person or any one company.

260
00:09:29,510 --> 00:09:32,330
And-- and just try to meet
as many people as you can.

261
00:09:32,330 --> 00:09:33,390
Or become an assistant.

262
00:09:33,390 --> 00:09:34,010
That's another way.

263
00:09:34,010 --> 00:09:35,140
There are a lot of avenues.

264
00:09:35,135 --> 00:09:36,835
But the most important
one is trying

265
00:09:36,830 --> 00:09:39,210
to meet people that
have connections

266
00:09:39,207 --> 00:09:40,037
within the industry.

267
00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:49,990
So you make connections.

268
00:09:49,990 --> 00:09:51,720
Someone knows an
agent or a manager.

269
00:09:51,722 --> 00:09:52,932
They get your script to them.

270
00:09:52,930 --> 00:09:53,770
They like it.

271
00:09:53,770 --> 00:09:56,060
They go, hey, we want
to represent you.

272
00:09:56,060 --> 00:09:57,730
So then, what happens?

273
00:09:57,730 --> 00:10:00,090
And, you know, at that
point, we're like,

274
00:10:00,085 --> 00:10:01,435
you know, we made it.

275
00:10:01,430 --> 00:10:02,260
We did it.

276
00:10:02,262 --> 00:10:03,222
We did it, mom and dad.

277
00:10:03,220 --> 00:10:04,930
Like we got an
agent in Hollywood.

278
00:10:04,930 --> 00:10:06,910
I mean, we thought
we were pretty cool.

279
00:10:06,910 --> 00:10:08,410
I mean, being
from North Carolina,

280
00:10:08,410 --> 00:10:11,320
all we knew about agents
or managers at the time

281
00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:13,600
was from the HBO
show "Entourage."

282
00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:15,220
That's literally all we knew.

283
00:10:15,220 --> 00:10:16,500
But it's, unfortunately,
not that simple.

284
00:10:16,500 --> 00:10:18,670
So we had this script--
this script called "Origin,"

285
00:10:18,667 --> 00:10:19,477
the-- the--

286
00:10:19,480 --> 00:10:20,260
I'm infected.

287
00:10:20,260 --> 00:10:23,200
--infected, you know, gonna
die in two hours script,

288
00:10:23,200 --> 00:10:26,500
which was kind of, in honesty,
a little bit of a mess, right?

289
00:10:26,500 --> 00:10:30,430
Ross said good 5, 10-- first
5, 10 pages, which is cool.

290
00:10:30,430 --> 00:10:32,590
The rest of it
kinda falls apart.

291
00:10:32,590 --> 00:10:33,830
We weren't outlining.

292
00:10:33,830 --> 00:10:34,330
OK?

293
00:10:34,330 --> 00:10:37,100
So that's why it's
a mess, by the way.

294
00:10:37,102 --> 00:10:38,812
So why-- this is why
you need to outline.

295
00:10:38,810 --> 00:10:39,830
So what happens next?

296
00:10:39,830 --> 00:10:42,130
The agents then send
it out to producers

297
00:10:42,130 --> 00:10:44,800
who they think would be a
good fit for the project.

298
00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:48,070
And then, they'll see which
producers are interested.

299
00:10:48,070 --> 00:10:51,020
Then, we met with those
producers who were interested.

300
00:10:51,023 --> 00:10:52,693
And then, you just
hear them out and you

301
00:10:52,690 --> 00:10:55,180
see which ones seem to get
you and get the project

302
00:10:55,180 --> 00:10:57,670
and seem genuinely
passionate about them.

303
00:10:57,670 --> 00:10:58,480
Pick a producer.

304
00:10:58,480 --> 00:11:00,880
That's a key step is
picking your producer.

305
00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:03,730
And then, that producer,
along with your agent,

306
00:11:03,730 --> 00:11:06,430
will then send it out-- when
they feel the time is right,

307
00:11:06,430 --> 00:11:08,830
they'll send it out to studios.

308
00:11:08,830 --> 00:11:09,700
And that was a film.

309
00:11:09,700 --> 00:11:11,410
So that went out to
all the film studios.

310
00:11:11,408 --> 00:11:12,438
In this case, you know--

311
00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:13,270
Warner Brothers, Paramount--

312
00:11:13,270 --> 00:11:13,900
Yeah.

313
00:11:13,900 --> 00:11:14,650
That's what they--

314
00:11:14,650 --> 00:11:15,340
Universal.

315
00:11:15,340 --> 00:11:16,970
So it went out to
all these companies.

316
00:11:16,968 --> 00:11:18,008
And then, they read it.

317
00:11:18,010 --> 00:11:19,280
And we're like, here we go.

318
00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:21,010
And then, we just-- then,
we're just waiting for the big

319
00:11:21,010 --> 00:11:23,050
paycheck and we're waiting
for someone to buy it.

320
00:11:23,052 --> 00:11:24,712
And then, that did not happen.

321
00:11:24,710 --> 00:11:26,340
Which happens all
the time, by the way.

322
00:11:26,335 --> 00:11:28,815
So scripts will go out wide--
they call it going out wide.

323
00:11:28,810 --> 00:11:30,800
You go out with the script.

324
00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:33,460
And for whatever reason,
no one's gonna option it

325
00:11:33,457 --> 00:11:34,537
and no one's gonna buy it.

326
00:11:34,540 --> 00:11:37,900
I mean, I think it did
actually come sort of close.

327
00:11:37,900 --> 00:11:40,070
It was like almost
there, not quite.

328
00:11:40,070 --> 00:11:44,170
And I really do think if we had
outlined it, that would've sold

329
00:11:44,170 --> 00:11:46,360
and-- and our, you
know, career trajectory

330
00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:48,900
would've been really different.

331
00:11:48,903 --> 00:11:49,573
But it didn't.

332
00:11:49,570 --> 00:11:50,240
But it didn't.

333
00:11:50,237 --> 00:11:52,087
But it didn't end up selling.

334
00:11:52,090 --> 00:11:53,890
But that's OK,
because what the key

335
00:11:53,890 --> 00:11:56,620
was we started knowing nobody.

336
00:11:56,620 --> 00:11:57,760
We came out here.

337
00:11:57,760 --> 00:12:00,910
We-- in turn, we met some
people, like Franklin.

338
00:12:00,910 --> 00:12:03,500
But, again, our-- our knowledge
of people in Hollywood

339
00:12:03,500 --> 00:12:04,670
was pretty small.

340
00:12:04,670 --> 00:12:05,860
We then got our agent.

341
00:12:05,860 --> 00:12:07,360
So we met some agents.

342
00:12:07,360 --> 00:12:09,710
And then, once it
went out, suddenly,

343
00:12:09,712 --> 00:12:11,172
even though the
script didn't sell,

344
00:12:11,170 --> 00:12:12,610
we were taking all
these meetings.

345
00:12:12,610 --> 00:12:14,110
We felt like we
were in "Entourage."

346
00:12:14,110 --> 00:12:16,540
We're meeting these--
some big-time producers.

347
00:12:16,540 --> 00:12:18,940
Were meeting over with studios.

348
00:12:18,940 --> 00:12:20,200
And it felt like, OK.

349
00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:23,720
Suddenly, we're-- the door
has opened and we're into this

350
00:12:23,720 --> 00:12:24,220
world.

351
00:12:24,220 --> 00:12:26,920
We haven't made a penny
yet, but at least we're

352
00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:28,160
starting to make connections.

353
00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:31,810
And, again, once you know people
and you know the right people,

354
00:12:31,810 --> 00:12:34,940
the key is just gonna be to
write a script that works.

355
00:12:34,940 --> 00:12:38,020
And unfortunately,
"Origin," didn't fully work,

356
00:12:38,023 --> 00:12:39,193
which is why it didn't sell.

357
00:12:39,190 --> 00:12:42,310
So I'm-- you know,
it is what it is.

358
00:12:42,310 --> 00:12:44,620
But it got us in the door.

359
00:12:44,620 --> 00:12:45,560
And that's the key.

360
00:12:45,560 --> 00:12:47,560
And I think with
your first script--

361
00:12:47,560 --> 00:12:49,180
listen, I hope it sells.

362
00:12:49,180 --> 00:12:51,860
I hope it goes out and
sells in a bidding war.

363
00:12:51,860 --> 00:12:55,300
But if not, if you can get
it to open that door for you

364
00:12:55,300 --> 00:12:57,940
and get into the world,
that is a huge first step.

365
00:12:57,940 --> 00:13:00,250
And it was a huge
step for us, in terms

366
00:13:00,250 --> 00:13:02,140
of getting to where we are now.

367
00:13:07,780 --> 00:13:09,780
Once you have that
agent, they're gonna send--

368
00:13:09,780 --> 00:13:12,320
the first thing they're gonna
do is they're gonna send it out

369
00:13:12,322 --> 00:13:13,102
to producers.

370
00:13:13,102 --> 00:13:15,062
And they're gonna pick
the producers they think

371
00:13:15,060 --> 00:13:16,890
are a good fit for your
project, who they think might

372
00:13:16,890 --> 00:13:18,360
be interested in your project.

373
00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:21,810
Some of the producers are just
gonna pass on your project.

374
00:13:21,810 --> 00:13:23,530
You're gonna get
rejected lots of times.

375
00:13:23,530 --> 00:13:25,530
This is not something you
should be upset about.

376
00:13:25,530 --> 00:13:27,080
These producers
may just be busy.

377
00:13:27,080 --> 00:13:29,580
They may not have even read it,
they're just not interested,

378
00:13:29,580 --> 00:13:30,270
whatever.

379
00:13:30,270 --> 00:13:31,860
What you want to be
interested in is--

380
00:13:31,860 --> 00:13:35,760
are the producers who liked your
project, who want to meet you,

381
00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:38,280
who want to produce
unit movie or your--

382
00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:40,080
or your television show, right?

383
00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:44,820
So I think then what you
do is you go and you meet--

384
00:13:44,820 --> 00:13:48,150
or nowadays, maybe you
Zoom, with all the producers

385
00:13:48,150 --> 00:13:49,440
who liked your project.

386
00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:51,060
And then, you hear them out.

387
00:13:51,060 --> 00:13:52,560
And they're gonna
kind of actually--

388
00:13:52,560 --> 00:13:54,090
this is kind of a cool
stage, in where they're sort

389
00:13:54,090 --> 00:13:55,530
of pitching themselves to you.

390
00:13:55,532 --> 00:13:57,992
It's not-- it's, like, kind of
a little bit of a low stress

391
00:13:57,990 --> 00:13:59,010
thing for you.

392
00:13:59,010 --> 00:14:01,560
You already know that they're
interested in your project.

393
00:14:01,560 --> 00:14:03,780
And they're gonna talk
about their visions

394
00:14:03,780 --> 00:14:06,320
for, not just your project,
but for where it could end up.

395
00:14:06,315 --> 00:14:08,195
And they're gonna try
to get you all excited.

396
00:14:08,190 --> 00:14:09,840
So how do you pick
a good producer?

397
00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:12,220
I think this is one of those
things where you really just

398
00:14:12,215 --> 00:14:14,745
have to trust your gut
and you have to go with--

399
00:14:14,740 --> 00:14:17,190
I wouldn't necessarily
go with what seems

400
00:14:17,190 --> 00:14:18,720
on paper like the right idea.

401
00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:20,220
I think, you know,
Ross and I had

402
00:14:20,220 --> 00:14:21,580
made that mistake in the past.

403
00:14:21,580 --> 00:14:23,550
I think the most
important thing to do

404
00:14:23,550 --> 00:14:26,610
is just who seems to
understand your material, who

405
00:14:26,610 --> 00:14:28,560
seems to understand
you, who seems actually,

406
00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:30,300
genuinely the most
passionate about it.

407
00:14:30,300 --> 00:14:32,720
Like, you want someone who's,
like, really, really excited

408
00:14:32,717 --> 00:14:33,867
about it and who gets it.

409
00:14:33,870 --> 00:14:36,300
I mean, we met with a
lot-- you know, this is--

410
00:14:36,300 --> 00:14:38,550
talking about
"Stranger Things" now.

411
00:14:38,550 --> 00:14:41,430
But when we first
sent that script out

412
00:14:41,430 --> 00:14:45,120
and we had a meeting with
a handful of producers,

413
00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:47,940
there were some who clearly--
you know, right away, we're

414
00:14:47,940 --> 00:14:49,860
like, well, this
is not a good fit.

415
00:14:49,860 --> 00:14:52,830
Because they were going, listen,
I really like this script.

416
00:14:52,830 --> 00:14:53,640
It's amazing.

417
00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:55,770
You know, I love it so much.

418
00:14:55,770 --> 00:14:57,150
Can we remove the kids?

419
00:14:57,150 --> 00:14:58,710
Like, let's just
make it-- because

420
00:14:58,710 --> 00:15:01,560
and, again, the producer's
goal is to sell the material.

421
00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:04,860
They see kids and it's not
a kids show, immediately,

422
00:15:04,860 --> 00:15:06,790
that's a red flag for them.

423
00:15:06,790 --> 00:15:09,270
They haven't seen a script
like that sell, I don't know,

424
00:15:09,270 --> 00:15:10,930
for a really long time.

425
00:15:10,930 --> 00:15:13,640
So they're like, this is gonna
be very difficult to sell.

426
00:15:13,638 --> 00:15:15,178
We knew immediately,
anyone's telling

427
00:15:15,180 --> 00:15:17,860
us to remove the kids from the
show is wrong for the project.

428
00:15:17,863 --> 00:15:19,283
We actually even
had the opposite.

429
00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:20,820
We had people go, let's
just make it a kid show,

430
00:15:20,820 --> 00:15:22,200
remove the adult characters.

431
00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:23,700
We're like, well,
that's also wrong.

432
00:15:23,700 --> 00:15:23,960
Right?

433
00:15:23,955 --> 00:15:25,085
That's-- that's not right.

434
00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:27,250
That means you don't get--
they don't get what we're

435
00:15:27,247 --> 00:15:28,717
trying to do for the show.

436
00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:30,660
But eventually, you'll
meet the producer who,

437
00:15:30,660 --> 00:15:33,340
they say all the right things,
they know the same references,

438
00:15:33,340 --> 00:15:34,830
they love the same
movies you do,

439
00:15:34,830 --> 00:15:36,820
they know exactly
what you want to do.

440
00:15:36,820 --> 00:15:37,320
Right?

441
00:15:37,320 --> 00:15:38,310
Oh, there's another example.

442
00:15:38,310 --> 00:15:38,550
Right?

443
00:15:38,550 --> 00:15:40,020
We had a producer we were with.

444
00:15:40,020 --> 00:15:42,210
And they said, when
you're pitching this,

445
00:15:42,208 --> 00:15:44,248
I love the script-- they
didn't want us to change

446
00:15:44,250 --> 00:15:45,270
the kids or any of that.

447
00:15:45,270 --> 00:15:46,770
But they said, when
you're going out

448
00:15:46,770 --> 00:15:49,650
and you're pitching this to
these television studios,

449
00:15:49,650 --> 00:15:52,230
they don't understand
movies or no movies.

450
00:15:52,230 --> 00:15:54,910
So you can't reference movies
when you're pitching your show.

451
00:15:54,908 --> 00:15:55,948
And I was like, I don't--

452
00:15:55,950 --> 00:15:57,330
I literally-- I
was like, I don't

453
00:15:57,325 --> 00:15:59,315
know how to pitch
"Stranger Things"

454
00:15:59,310 --> 00:16:01,440
and not be able
to reference "ET."

455
00:16:01,440 --> 00:16:05,520
And I was like, do-- do
television studio executives--

456
00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:06,690
they haven't seen "ET?"

457
00:16:06,690 --> 00:16:08,440
Like it just didn't
make any sense to me.

458
00:16:08,440 --> 00:16:09,230
So that was--

459
00:16:09,225 --> 00:16:10,055
A red flag.

460
00:16:10,050 --> 00:16:10,830
--a red flag.

461
00:16:10,830 --> 00:16:13,050
And we ended up walking
away from that producer.

462
00:16:13,050 --> 00:16:15,630
So at the end of the day,
you know, trust your gut.

463
00:16:15,630 --> 00:16:18,030
Go with who gets you and
who gets your material.

464
00:16:18,025 --> 00:16:20,405
That's how you know-- and
who's gonna support your vision

465
00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:22,570
and support you specifically.

466
00:16:22,567 --> 00:16:24,147
And that's how you
make your decision.

467
00:16:30,963 --> 00:16:32,383
So you've settled
on a producer.

468
00:16:32,380 --> 00:16:35,350
So what's gonna happen now
is the producer's gonna go,

469
00:16:35,350 --> 00:16:37,150
well, I think the
best course of selling

470
00:16:37,150 --> 00:16:42,130
it is to go to these
companies or these studios.

471
00:16:42,130 --> 00:16:43,870
Now, we're starting
to get closer

472
00:16:43,870 --> 00:16:46,630
to that original idea, which is
like, how do I get to Netflix

473
00:16:46,630 --> 00:16:47,680
or Amazon or whatever?

474
00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:49,940
Well, now, that's
where we're headed.

475
00:16:49,940 --> 00:16:53,620
So they might say, I think
this is a great fit for Netflix

476
00:16:53,620 --> 00:16:54,910
and Amazon or whoever.

477
00:16:54,910 --> 00:16:58,060
And so-- but the trick
is, with those companies,

478
00:16:58,060 --> 00:17:00,490
you're not gonna
just send your script

479
00:17:00,490 --> 00:17:02,620
and they're gonna just
buy it and that's it.

480
00:17:02,620 --> 00:17:05,320
What you're gonna need to
do when you're devel-- doing

481
00:17:05,319 --> 00:17:07,569
the TV shows, you're gonna
need to develop a pitch,

482
00:17:07,569 --> 00:17:11,529
so you can give them a
sense of not just the pilot,

483
00:17:11,530 --> 00:17:15,100
but you're trying to give them a
sense of what the entire season

484
00:17:15,099 --> 00:17:16,269
of that show is like.

485
00:17:16,270 --> 00:17:19,810
So a pitch is an
elaboration, essentially, on--

486
00:17:19,810 --> 00:17:20,830
on the pilot.

487
00:17:20,829 --> 00:17:23,199
So what these studio
executives are gonna get,

488
00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:24,790
they're gonna have
read your script.

489
00:17:24,790 --> 00:17:26,650
So if they like your
script and you're

490
00:17:26,650 --> 00:17:29,570
invited to go meet with them,
that's a really good sign.

491
00:17:29,570 --> 00:17:32,080
That means they liked
your script, most likely.

492
00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:33,370
Not always the case, actually.

493
00:17:33,370 --> 00:17:36,400
But usually-- usually, it means
that they liked your script.

494
00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:40,210
And at that point,
basically, you want to--

495
00:17:40,210 --> 00:17:41,990
and how long is
it pitch usually?

496
00:17:41,992 --> 00:17:42,702
I mean, I guess--

497
00:17:42,700 --> 00:17:45,110
Ours was, like,
15 minutes maybe.

498
00:17:45,105 --> 00:17:45,975
15, 20 minutes.

499
00:17:45,970 --> 00:17:46,120
Right?

500
00:17:46,120 --> 00:17:47,290
You don't wanna be too long.

501
00:17:47,287 --> 00:17:48,907
You don't wanna feel
like, you know--

502
00:17:48,910 --> 00:17:50,580
you don't wanna be
long-winded, looking

503
00:17:50,577 --> 00:17:52,657
at their clock-- you know,
looking at their watch,

504
00:17:52,660 --> 00:17:52,930
whatever.

505
00:17:52,930 --> 00:17:55,000
That's a bad sign, if they're
looking at their watches.

506
00:17:55,000 --> 00:17:56,560
So you wanna be
brief, to the point,

507
00:17:56,560 --> 00:17:59,500
and all you're doing with
the pitch is telling them,

508
00:17:59,500 --> 00:18:01,840
essentially, how
awesome your show is

509
00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:04,730
and how cool it's gonna be
and what's cool about it.

510
00:18:04,727 --> 00:18:07,057
And you're gonna tell them
all the things that weren't--

511
00:18:07,060 --> 00:18:09,330
aren't maybe evident
in-- in the pilot.

512
00:18:09,330 --> 00:18:09,830
Yes.

513
00:18:09,830 --> 00:18:12,290
And I think, probably, the
best way to explain, you know,

514
00:18:12,288 --> 00:18:15,518
exactly what a pitch is to
show you what the pitch was

515
00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:17,710
for-- for "Montauk"
or "Stranger Things."

516
00:18:17,710 --> 00:18:20,110
I, mean we wrote out the
whole thing and memorized it.

517
00:18:20,110 --> 00:18:21,860
You definitely don't
wanna go into a pitch

518
00:18:21,860 --> 00:18:24,280
and read off a sheet
of paper, like that.

519
00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:26,230
I mean, that's one way
to not sell a show.

520
00:18:26,230 --> 00:18:28,960
I think this is an area
where a lot of writers

521
00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:31,920
get really nervous,
because we're not--

522
00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:33,340
we're not actors, right?

523
00:18:33,340 --> 00:18:34,840
It's not-- and it's
kind of annoying

524
00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:36,250
that, actually, you
even have to do this,

525
00:18:36,250 --> 00:18:37,990
you have to go,
like, sell yourself.

526
00:18:37,990 --> 00:18:41,260
Because writers tend to,
like, hide from other people.

527
00:18:41,260 --> 00:18:43,590
I'm not-- and, you know--
you don't-- you're not--

528
00:18:43,585 --> 00:18:45,675
you're not good at boasting.

529
00:18:45,670 --> 00:18:48,250
But that's why the
best thing to do

530
00:18:48,250 --> 00:18:50,690
is do what you do
best, which is write.

531
00:18:50,690 --> 00:18:52,090
Write your pitch down.

532
00:18:52,087 --> 00:18:53,167
You're not winging this.

533
00:18:53,170 --> 00:18:53,920
You don't wing it.

534
00:18:53,920 --> 00:18:54,160
Right?

535
00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:56,110
You probably don't have
that-- if you're like us,

536
00:18:56,110 --> 00:18:57,550
you don't have that
skill set, right?

537
00:18:57,550 --> 00:18:59,200
To just sort of be
improvising it on the day,

538
00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:00,740
you're gonna get
nervous or whatever.

539
00:19:00,742 --> 00:19:03,432
The best thing to do,
write out your pitch,

540
00:19:03,430 --> 00:19:06,950
memorize it, and just-- and
just spit it out on the day

541
00:19:06,952 --> 00:19:09,162
and try to make it feel like
you're coming up with it

542
00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:10,600
on the spot, but you won't be.

543
00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:19,690
What happens is-- so
you'll go into a room.

544
00:19:19,690 --> 00:19:22,210
And, you know, you'll
pitch your heart out.

545
00:19:22,210 --> 00:19:25,190
And then, they go "Thank you."

546
00:19:25,190 --> 00:19:26,170
And you leave.

547
00:19:26,170 --> 00:19:28,570
And then, you just wait for
a phone call from your agent.

548
00:19:28,568 --> 00:19:30,108
They're not gonna
follow up with you,

549
00:19:30,110 --> 00:19:31,280
they're gonna follow
up with your agent.

550
00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:32,820
So if it's bad news,
you don't have--

551
00:19:32,822 --> 00:19:35,122
you hear-- you're kind
of hearing it secondhand.

552
00:19:35,125 --> 00:19:36,945
If it's good news, you're
hearing it second hand.

553
00:19:36,940 --> 00:19:38,290
And, yeah, good news,
you're hearing-- right.

554
00:19:38,290 --> 00:19:38,530
Whatever.

555
00:19:38,530 --> 00:19:40,520
You're ne-- you're never
gonna hear directly from them.

556
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:42,060
That's what the
agent or your manager

557
00:19:42,062 --> 00:19:44,802
is for, to communicate directly
with the studio or the network.

558
00:19:44,800 --> 00:19:46,200
So you just wait.

559
00:19:46,202 --> 00:19:48,162
Sometimes you gotta wait--
some day-- sometimes

560
00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:49,570
you'll hear that day.

561
00:19:49,570 --> 00:19:52,060
Sometimes you'll-- you'll hear
stories about people being--

562
00:19:52,060 --> 00:19:53,840
you know, they're
buying it in the room.

563
00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:54,160
I don't know.

564
00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:55,090
That never happened to me.

565
00:19:55,090 --> 00:19:56,860
I guess that does
happen to some people.

566
00:19:56,860 --> 00:19:58,600
Or it'll be the
next day, sometimes

567
00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:00,850
it'll be three days, whatever.

568
00:20:00,850 --> 00:20:02,240
But I wouldn't panic.

569
00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:04,930
We had no idea when
we were walking out

570
00:20:04,930 --> 00:20:06,190
that they would buy it or not.

571
00:20:06,190 --> 00:20:08,860
We-- they just-- it was
just total poker face.

572
00:20:08,860 --> 00:20:12,200
We had no sense of how
much they liked it or not.

573
00:20:12,195 --> 00:20:14,325
And we were all-- we were
just-- we were terrified.

574
00:20:14,320 --> 00:20:16,890
So you really are just waiting
for your agent to call you.

575
00:20:16,887 --> 00:20:18,967
And then, hopefully your
agent is nicer than ours,

576
00:20:18,970 --> 00:20:21,720
because he called us
and said, bad news.

577
00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:22,670
They didn't like it.

578
00:20:22,668 --> 00:20:23,958
And then, he said, I'm kidding.

579
00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:24,860
They're buying this story.

580
00:20:24,860 --> 00:20:25,870
And that was really mean.

581
00:20:25,870 --> 00:20:26,950
It gave us a heart attack.

582
00:20:26,953 --> 00:20:28,473
Yeah.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,430
[DRAMATIC MUSIC PLAYING]

2
00:00:11,050 --> 00:00:12,550
MATT DUFFER: The
best way to explain

3
00:00:12,550 --> 00:00:15,110
how we pitch is just to show
you the "Stranger Things" pitch.

4
00:00:15,113 --> 00:00:17,033
You're gonna be talking
about a lot of stuff

5
00:00:17,030 --> 00:00:19,900
and a lot of stuff that was
in your blue sky document that

6
00:00:19,900 --> 00:00:22,150
maybe just didn't make
it into the pilot.

7
00:00:22,150 --> 00:00:24,970
For instance, in your pilot
script of "Stranger Things,"

8
00:00:24,970 --> 00:00:27,190
we talk about how
Hopper's lost a daughter.

9
00:00:27,190 --> 00:00:29,260
We don't really
talk about how that'

10
00:00:29,263 --> 00:00:30,433
where he's going from there.

11
00:00:30,430 --> 00:00:32,030
That A to B, we
don't talk about.

12
00:00:32,032 --> 00:00:33,492
We don't know from
the pilot script

13
00:00:33,490 --> 00:00:36,640
that Mike and Eleven are gonna
have this innocent relationship

14
00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:38,680
and sort of have a first love.

15
00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:40,960
We don't get into that or
that Jonathan and Nancy are

16
00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:42,110
gonna end up teaming up.

17
00:00:42,112 --> 00:00:43,572
So what you're able
to do is you're

18
00:00:43,570 --> 00:00:45,670
able to elaborate
a little bit more.

19
00:00:45,670 --> 00:00:48,280
Now, don't get all
too carried away.

20
00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:49,990
This is 15 to 20
minutes, so you're

21
00:00:49,990 --> 00:00:51,470
gonna have to be
very particular.

22
00:00:51,470 --> 00:00:53,170
You're gonna have
to pick your best

23
00:00:53,170 --> 00:00:54,760
ideas and your simple ideas.

24
00:00:54,760 --> 00:00:57,280
You could definitely
lose people really quick.

25
00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,130
If you start going too deep
into mythology or whatever,

26
00:01:00,130 --> 00:01:01,670
you're gonna lose people.

27
00:01:01,670 --> 00:01:03,550
But you should
touch on mythology.

28
00:01:03,550 --> 00:01:05,680
We touch on what this
other dimension is.

29
00:01:05,680 --> 00:01:07,540
We talk about inspirations.

30
00:01:07,540 --> 00:01:10,810
We talk a little bit about
music, even, and tone.

31
00:01:10,810 --> 00:01:13,840
You're just sort of hitting
these big bullet points of what

32
00:01:13,840 --> 00:01:15,970
the show is both gonna
feel like and your

33
00:01:15,970 --> 00:01:19,190
giving a sense of what
the story arcs could be.

34
00:01:19,192 --> 00:01:21,402
And then even at the end,
you're talking a little bit

35
00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:26,600
about what could be beyond this,
if it happens to be successful.

36
00:01:26,600 --> 00:01:28,570
This is not a document
that we've really

37
00:01:28,570 --> 00:01:29,710
shared with anyone.

38
00:01:29,710 --> 00:01:30,490
We didn't even share
it with Netflix.

39
00:01:30,490 --> 00:01:32,110
MATT DUFFER: You know, we
broke it down for ourselves,

40
00:01:32,110 --> 00:01:33,360
starting with an introduction.

41
00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:35,980
We talked about, did you
see our look book trailer?

42
00:01:35,982 --> 00:01:37,692
It's probably clear
to you that now we're

43
00:01:37,690 --> 00:01:39,100
gonna get into a
look book later.

44
00:01:39,100 --> 00:01:40,660
We were movie nerds
growing up, so we

45
00:01:40,660 --> 00:01:42,920
started to make it a
little personal immediately

46
00:01:42,917 --> 00:01:45,247
and talk about why we're
passionate about this material.

47
00:01:45,250 --> 00:01:47,380
We talked about going
to movies with our dad,

48
00:01:47,380 --> 00:01:49,570
and how we loved
this growing up,

49
00:01:49,570 --> 00:01:52,110
and how we then fell in love
with TV with "The Sopranos."

50
00:01:52,113 --> 00:01:54,533
And we talk about a little
bit why we think it's unique,

51
00:01:54,530 --> 00:01:55,660
and why there isn't
a show like that,

52
00:01:55,660 --> 00:01:57,730
and why we would like
to see a show like this.

53
00:01:57,730 --> 00:01:59,590
And then, if you look
at this, actually, we

54
00:01:59,590 --> 00:02:01,750
talk about a lot of
things we had you kind

55
00:02:01,750 --> 00:02:03,250
of blue sky or thinking about.

56
00:02:03,250 --> 00:02:04,390
I mean, we talk about--

57
00:02:04,390 --> 00:02:04,600
ROSS DUFFER: Inspiration.

58
00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:07,120
MATT DUFFER: --inspiration,
so the kind of movies

59
00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:08,230
that inspired us.

60
00:02:08,229 --> 00:02:10,689
ROSS DUFFER: And you can
see here, it says, "ordinary

61
00:02:10,690 --> 00:02:11,810
meets the extraordinary."

62
00:02:11,810 --> 00:02:14,260
It's bolded, that's how
important we thought it was.

63
00:02:14,260 --> 00:02:15,760
We did not bold
this for this class.

64
00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:17,710
This was bolded for
the Netflix pitch.

65
00:02:17,710 --> 00:02:19,420
But again, we make
it personal again.

66
00:02:19,420 --> 00:02:22,270
Because then, we say right after
that, "When we were growing up,

67
00:02:22,270 --> 00:02:24,910
we were just regular kids
living in the suburbs of North

68
00:02:24,910 --> 00:02:26,730
Carolina, playing
Dungeons and Dragons

69
00:02:26,730 --> 00:02:27,730
with our nerdy friends."

70
00:02:27,730 --> 00:02:32,350
And we're saying this is why
this show is meaningful to us.

71
00:02:32,352 --> 00:02:34,062
We're making it personal
for them, again.

72
00:02:34,060 --> 00:02:36,220
So I think that is important.

73
00:02:36,220 --> 00:02:38,160
Then we get into setting.

74
00:02:38,158 --> 00:02:39,698
ROSS DUFFER: Setting,
for us, was not

75
00:02:39,700 --> 00:02:41,800
the most important
aspect of this storyline.

76
00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:44,350
And we summarize
it very quickly,

77
00:02:44,350 --> 00:02:47,980
talking about how Montauk is
this close-knit seaside town.

78
00:02:47,980 --> 00:02:49,680
And we talk about Amity in Jaws.

79
00:02:49,683 --> 00:02:51,103
We don't spend a
lot of time here.

80
00:02:51,100 --> 00:02:51,600
No.

81
00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:53,040
And then we get into mythology.

82
00:02:53,037 --> 00:02:54,367
So, it's funny I'm reading this.

83
00:02:54,370 --> 00:02:55,790
Some of this is
not even accurate.

84
00:02:55,787 --> 00:02:58,747
But we basically get
into the Montauk project

85
00:02:58,750 --> 00:03:00,540
and why we're into
the Montauk project.

86
00:03:00,542 --> 00:03:01,752
And why we love conspiracy.

87
00:03:01,750 --> 00:03:02,650
MATT DUFFER: And why
we love conspiracy.

88
00:03:02,650 --> 00:03:04,180
Again, we're making it personal.

89
00:03:04,180 --> 00:03:06,940
ROSS DUFFER: We have
these, again, bolded lines.

90
00:03:06,940 --> 00:03:09,760
And again, this isn't
for MasterClass.

91
00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:12,080
This was stuff we had
bolded, just as a--

92
00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:13,760
I think, even though
we memorized it,

93
00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:16,120
we wanted to be like, you've
got to hit this moment,

94
00:03:16,122 --> 00:03:17,832
you've got to emphasize
this because it's

95
00:03:17,830 --> 00:03:20,560
so important, which
is, a doorway or tears

96
00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:22,240
open to another dimension.

97
00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:23,950
We talk about these entities.

98
00:03:23,950 --> 00:03:27,650
We realized multiple
entities was more entities

99
00:03:27,645 --> 00:03:28,275
than we needed.

100
00:03:28,270 --> 00:03:30,580
And it became one, which
was the Demogorgon.

101
00:03:30,580 --> 00:03:33,490
And we end this with saying,
"This supernatural kidnapping

102
00:03:33,490 --> 00:03:34,880
sets our story into motion."

103
00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:36,730
And I think one
reason that's bolded

104
00:03:36,730 --> 00:03:38,380
and we thought was
so important was

105
00:03:38,380 --> 00:03:40,750
this is going back way,
way, way back to early

106
00:03:40,750 --> 00:03:42,760
in the lesson when
we said, big idea.

107
00:03:42,760 --> 00:03:44,650
And our big idea
coming out of prisoners

108
00:03:44,650 --> 00:03:47,830
was, what if we do a show about
a supernatural kidnapping?

109
00:03:47,830 --> 00:03:50,320
So we wanted to make
sure that they understood

110
00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:51,880
that at the core of
this, we're gonna

111
00:03:51,880 --> 00:03:53,890
have a lot of crazy
ideas, other dimensions,

112
00:03:53,890 --> 00:03:55,070
and multiple entities--

113
00:03:55,067 --> 00:03:56,277
Girls with side-eye powers.

114
00:03:56,275 --> 00:03:56,955
Some psychic powers.

115
00:03:56,955 --> 00:03:57,455
Yeah.

116
00:03:57,455 --> 00:04:00,435
Well, listen, if you're
getting-- just think about it,

117
00:04:00,430 --> 00:04:02,470
at the end of the day,
supernatural kidnapping.

118
00:04:02,470 --> 00:04:04,990
And then we move into
talking about the structure.

119
00:04:04,985 --> 00:04:07,365
And these are really the arcs
that we were talking about.

120
00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:07,960
The story arcs.

121
00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:09,790
The story arcs that
we were talking about.

122
00:04:09,793 --> 00:04:13,003
We were calling them generations
slash structure here.

123
00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:14,810
We're talking about
the drive, of course,

124
00:04:14,810 --> 00:04:16,100
which is what happened to Will.

125
00:04:16,102 --> 00:04:17,112
How do we get will back?

126
00:04:17,110 --> 00:04:19,520
Again, very easy for
them to understand.

127
00:04:19,519 --> 00:04:22,149
And then we talk about, there's
gonna be three main storylines.

128
00:04:22,144 --> 00:04:23,814
And we're going to
break them into three

129
00:04:23,811 --> 00:04:26,441
different generations, the
kids, the teens, the adults.

130
00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:27,880
And then, we also
bolded, "We like

131
00:04:27,880 --> 00:04:29,560
to think of each of
these generations

132
00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:31,990
as existing in a
different '80s universe."

133
00:04:31,990 --> 00:04:34,400
Well, and I think it also
gives them a shortcut, right,

134
00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:34,900
too?

135
00:04:34,900 --> 00:04:35,400
Yeah.

136
00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:38,140
Because saying, the adults
are in a Spielberg movie.

137
00:04:38,140 --> 00:04:39,610
The teens are an
'80s horror film,

138
00:04:39,613 --> 00:04:41,533
like "Halloween" or
"Nightmare On Elm Street."

139
00:04:41,530 --> 00:04:44,050
And then the kids are
in a Stephen King novel,

140
00:04:44,050 --> 00:04:45,490
like "Stand By Me" or "It."

141
00:04:45,490 --> 00:04:48,580
And I think, again,
these aren't--

142
00:04:48,580 --> 00:04:50,800
these are references
that we were

143
00:04:50,800 --> 00:04:53,800
assuming that they would be able
to understand and relate to.

144
00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:56,720
And then we step through each
of those generations for them.

145
00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:59,200
So we're like, okay, now we're
gonna talk about the adults.

146
00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:00,250
Yeah, we actually
say this, look.

147
00:05:00,250 --> 00:05:01,960
"Now we will walk
through the storylines.

148
00:05:01,958 --> 00:05:03,278
First, we have our adults."

149
00:05:03,280 --> 00:05:04,000
It's very simple.

150
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Again, very simple, clean,
simple introductions to this.

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You don't want them to get lost.

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If you start going into too much
detail, they're gonna just--

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they're gonna zone
out, and they're

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gonna start thinking about their
next meeting or whatever it is.

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Just keep it focused and clean.

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And then,
basically, what we do

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is we talk about all the
major adult characters.

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When we go through
each character,

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we go through Hopper,
and what we're doing

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is we're talking a little
about who Hopper is.

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We're talking about
the story arc, which

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is something in your blue sky
that you've come up with that A

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to B. And we're talking
about his story arc, A to B.

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And then we're doing
the same with Joyce.

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So we're just hitting
those huge, big points.

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So hopefully they understand
who this character is,

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where they go in the story,
and where they end up.

168
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But I think that, again,
you're staying really broad.

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If you look at this
outline we've got,

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it's a short paragraph for
each of these characters.

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And then we sort of
summarize, at the end,

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you know, this is
another bolded thing.

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We say, "What really unites
the adult storylines,

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emotionally and thematically,
is that both Hopper

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and Joyce her parents
who feel like they

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have failed their children.

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Specifically, they feel they
have failed them because

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of mistakes in their past.

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But over the course
of the show, they

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find a way to
forgive themselves,

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to accept their mistakes, and
to move on with their lives.

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So it's starting to
talk about what is gonna

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unite Joyce and Hopper here.

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We're just doing the same
structure that we did with

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the adults with the
teams, which is we say,

186
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"They've got adulthood
looming, and it's terrifying,

187
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which is represented by this
'monster' that is stalking

188
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them.

189
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And that's, again,
just telling Netflix,

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hey, this isn't just kids
running away from monsters.

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There's a little
more depth to it.

192
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So that can be a helpful thing.

193
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And then we go to the kids.

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And it was an obvious choice by
us to end with the kids last.

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We knew that was our stro--
like, really strong, probably

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our most interesting storyline.

197
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So we wanted to
end on a high note.

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That's why we structured
it in the way that we did

199
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or I'm imagining that it is.

200
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We talk about Mike, he's still
got that birthmark on hi face--

201
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That's right.

202
00:06:54,190 --> 00:06:55,600
--which leads to insecurity.

203
00:06:55,600 --> 00:06:59,050
And then we describe this
storyline of him and Eleven.

204
00:06:59,050 --> 00:07:02,200
And we say, "We now have
this E.T. fish-out-of

205
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water storyline.

206
00:07:03,340 --> 00:07:05,980
And with that, almost,
they get it, right?

207
00:07:05,980 --> 00:07:09,700
They get how it's gonna
work with Mike and Eleven.

208
00:07:09,700 --> 00:07:12,340
And we kind of step through
some of the cool sequences

209
00:07:12,340 --> 00:07:13,790
that the kids might have--

210
00:07:13,785 --> 00:07:15,165
these fun sequences
they're gonna

211
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have with this psychic girl
who's suddenly living with them

212
00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:19,580
and how she's gonna learn how
to live in the real world.

213
00:07:19,584 --> 00:07:19,854
And we talk about all that.

214
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And we say little ideas like,
"she levitates their Dungeons

215
00:07:23,230 --> 00:07:24,610
and Dragon figures."

216
00:07:24,610 --> 00:07:26,800
Now, in the show,
she does, I think,

217
00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:28,360
the Millennium Falcon toy.

218
00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:29,410
Which is a better idea.

219
00:07:29,410 --> 00:07:31,510
But again, it's giving
them a taste of, hey,

220
00:07:31,510 --> 00:07:32,810
this journey's gonna be fun.

221
00:07:32,810 --> 00:07:34,850
This is one of the things
that could happen along

222
00:07:34,852 --> 00:07:35,442
this journey.

223
00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:38,130
Once we went through each
generation and all the major

224
00:07:38,130 --> 00:07:40,630
characters, we then went into--
we started talking about how

225
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they're gonna combine.

226
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We labeled this Finale.

227
00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:46,720
We said, there's gonna be a big
set piece, where the government

228
00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:48,100
agents come to Mike's house.

229
00:07:48,100 --> 00:07:48,820
Yeah.

230
00:07:48,820 --> 00:07:50,230
This is actually pretty
accurate, still, for the show.

231
00:07:50,230 --> 00:07:51,080
Yeah, it is, yeah.

232
00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:52,090
They come to the Mike's house.

233
00:07:52,090 --> 00:07:54,190
That leads to the bike
chasing, whatever we say.

234
00:07:54,190 --> 00:07:56,800
So that moment, we
knew that was gonna

235
00:07:56,800 --> 00:07:58,420
be an exciting
moment in the show

236
00:07:58,420 --> 00:08:01,840
and that whatever happened
there was gonna lead all three

237
00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:04,780
of these storylines to collide.

238
00:08:04,780 --> 00:08:07,290
We're not specific about
how they collide here.

239
00:08:07,293 --> 00:08:07,963
ROSS DUFFER: No.

240
00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:09,650
We just said there's gonna
be a huge event of the house.

241
00:08:09,650 --> 00:08:12,150
And then we just wrote, "This
is when our three generational

242
00:08:12,150 --> 00:08:14,410
storylines merge,
adults, teens, and kids."

243
00:08:14,410 --> 00:08:17,140
And then we talk about a little
bit what we were telling you

244
00:08:17,140 --> 00:08:18,930
not too long ago, which
is, "They each have

245
00:08:18,932 --> 00:08:20,712
a key piece of
knowledge, the adults

246
00:08:20,710 --> 00:08:22,270
have learned where
Will is hiding,

247
00:08:22,270 --> 00:08:24,890
the kids have learned about
this portal beneath Camp Hero,

248
00:08:24,888 --> 00:08:27,428
and the teens have learned how
to defeat the Entities," which

249
00:08:27,430 --> 00:08:28,720
will become the Demogorgon.

250
00:08:28,720 --> 00:08:30,820
"They now have what
they need to free Will."

251
00:08:30,820 --> 00:08:33,670
And then we talk a little
bit about the climax.

252
00:08:33,669 --> 00:08:34,679
We talk about--

253
00:08:34,678 --> 00:08:36,218
But again it's
like five sentences.

254
00:08:36,220 --> 00:08:38,760
--how they're going to-- yeah,
that they're going to rescue

255
00:08:38,762 --> 00:08:42,672
Will and how Eleven is gonna
use her powers to help close

256
00:08:42,669 --> 00:08:44,889
the rift and end the horror.

257
00:08:44,890 --> 00:08:48,070
So that was us running through
the entire series for them.

258
00:08:48,070 --> 00:08:50,200
Again, it's a really
zoomed-out view of it.

259
00:08:50,200 --> 00:08:52,450
ROSS DUFFER: And then, we
get into franchise, briefly.

260
00:08:52,450 --> 00:08:54,830
MATT DUFFER: And I think,
initially, this franchise thing

261
00:08:54,832 --> 00:08:56,292
didn't exist in
the original pitch.

262
00:08:56,290 --> 00:08:57,980
But it was something we
kept getting asked about,

263
00:08:57,980 --> 00:08:59,560
so we were like, we
better write down

264
00:08:59,560 --> 00:09:01,150
some good answers for this.

265
00:09:01,150 --> 00:09:04,120
And a lot of this we
already went over,

266
00:09:04,120 --> 00:09:07,360
in terms of, we started
to talk about, listen, we

267
00:09:07,358 --> 00:09:08,648
want this story to be complete.

268
00:09:08,650 --> 00:09:10,030
We want them to rescue Will.

269
00:09:10,030 --> 00:09:12,450
We don't want them to rescue
Will and then lose Will again

270
00:09:12,447 --> 00:09:14,217
and season 2 is about
rescuing will again,

271
00:09:14,218 --> 00:09:15,758
because we knew that
would be boring.

272
00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:18,790
So we knew it would
revolve around--

273
00:09:18,790 --> 00:09:22,330
revolve around what happens
with Will when he's returned.

274
00:09:22,330 --> 00:09:24,700
"How has his time in this
other dimension affected him."

275
00:09:24,695 --> 00:09:25,575
That's what we wrote.

276
00:09:25,570 --> 00:09:27,920
He's going to be
psychologically damaged.

277
00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:30,800
He's gonna be haunted by
very intense nightmares.

278
00:09:30,803 --> 00:09:32,723
How do you come back
from something like that.

279
00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:34,680
And ultimately, that is
what season 2 is about.

280
00:09:34,678 --> 00:09:36,428
It's like, how
does Will come back

281
00:09:36,430 --> 00:09:37,780
from the events of season 1?

282
00:09:37,780 --> 00:09:40,930
We've got 15, 20 minutes,
and so we've got to be,

283
00:09:40,930 --> 00:09:43,600
every word counts here.

284
00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:46,630
And you've got to be
very careful with not

285
00:09:46,630 --> 00:09:48,220
falling into too much detail.

286
00:09:48,220 --> 00:09:51,140
[DRAMATIC MUSIC PLAYING]

287
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So in addition to the
pitch and in addition

288
00:09:56,290 --> 00:09:58,000
to that verbal
pitch that we did,

289
00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:00,940
we sent a look book prior
to our meetings for them.

290
00:10:00,940 --> 00:10:03,650
And, basically, a look
book, this is optional.

291
00:10:03,645 --> 00:10:05,775
This is something you
definitely do not have to do.

292
00:10:05,770 --> 00:10:07,000
You have to do
the pitch, but you

293
00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:08,290
don't have to do the look book.

294
00:10:08,292 --> 00:10:09,942
But what we like
about the look book

295
00:10:09,940 --> 00:10:13,150
is it goes back to
the idea of tone

296
00:10:13,150 --> 00:10:15,820
that we talked about
way earlier, in terms

297
00:10:15,820 --> 00:10:20,080
of giving them a sense of, what
is this show gonna feel like?

298
00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:20,930
Or look like.

299
00:10:20,930 --> 00:10:21,430
Yeah.

300
00:10:21,430 --> 00:10:23,500
What is the texture
of the show, right?

301
00:10:23,500 --> 00:10:25,210
So you're doing
things with images

302
00:10:25,210 --> 00:10:28,040
that you just can't completely
do with the written word.

303
00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:30,380
So we found this
actually pretty helpful.

304
00:10:30,380 --> 00:10:33,550
And I think the studios and
networks all responded really

305
00:10:33,550 --> 00:10:35,110
positively to this look book.

306
00:10:35,110 --> 00:10:36,380
And it was pretty simple.

307
00:10:36,380 --> 00:10:39,130
We did it ourselves
on Photoshop.

308
00:10:39,130 --> 00:10:41,150
We're not particularly
skilled at Photoshop,

309
00:10:41,150 --> 00:10:42,850
so we kept it pretty simple.

310
00:10:42,850 --> 00:10:45,760
If you don't know Photoshop,
or Illustrator, or any

311
00:10:45,758 --> 00:10:47,798
of those things, maybe
you have a friend who does

312
00:10:47,800 --> 00:10:49,130
or someone who can help you out.

313
00:10:49,133 --> 00:10:51,823
Again, it doesn't have
to be super fancy.

314
00:10:51,820 --> 00:10:55,570
But, basically, we wanted
to adopt the look--

315
00:10:55,570 --> 00:10:57,040
if you check out--
we'll show you

316
00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:58,810
some of the pages
from this look book.

317
00:10:58,810 --> 00:11:02,710
We were trying to evoke the
feeling of a classic Stephen

318
00:11:02,710 --> 00:11:03,670
King paperback.

319
00:11:03,670 --> 00:11:05,200
You'll notice that
the font is not

320
00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:08,530
totally dissimilar from the font
ultimately used for the show,

321
00:11:08,530 --> 00:11:09,400
"Stranger Things."

322
00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:11,770
But again, this is something
very simple that Matt

323
00:11:11,770 --> 00:11:14,600
and I were able to
do on Photoshop.

324
00:11:14,595 --> 00:11:16,455
So we included
an introduction,

325
00:11:16,450 --> 00:11:17,960
very much like we
did in the pitch.

326
00:11:17,960 --> 00:11:18,460
We did.

327
00:11:18,460 --> 00:11:20,750
But the most important
thing, aside from that, again,

328
00:11:20,752 --> 00:11:21,652
are the pictures.

329
00:11:21,650 --> 00:11:24,340
So this is something that we
were unable to do on the pitch.

330
00:11:24,340 --> 00:11:27,310
But we show images from the
films which inspired it,

331
00:11:27,310 --> 00:11:30,640
so some images from "E.T."

332
00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:33,370
We show some images from
"Hellraiser" and "Nightmare

333
00:11:33,370 --> 00:11:34,180
on Elm Street."

334
00:11:34,180 --> 00:11:39,230
And, you know, we show Camp
Hero, what the base looks like.

335
00:11:39,227 --> 00:11:41,557
So remember, again, when we're
talking about the script,

336
00:11:41,560 --> 00:11:43,450
you're very spare
in your description.

337
00:11:43,450 --> 00:11:45,430
So it's good to use a
look book, we think.

338
00:11:45,430 --> 00:11:47,290
It allows a bit of
a shortcut to allow

339
00:11:47,290 --> 00:11:49,930
them to start to
visualize, what is

340
00:11:49,930 --> 00:11:51,400
this show that I'm gonna buy?

341
00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:52,630
What is it gonna look like?

342
00:11:52,630 --> 00:11:54,670
And we do get into some
of the character stuff.

343
00:11:54,672 --> 00:11:56,582
But a lot of this
is, we're trying

344
00:11:56,580 --> 00:11:59,080
to get a little bit more, like
Matt's saying, the feel of it

345
00:11:59,080 --> 00:11:59,580
across.

346
00:11:59,580 --> 00:12:01,350
We do talk about the conspiracy.

347
00:12:01,345 --> 00:12:03,225
And some of the stuff
we go over in the pitch

348
00:12:03,220 --> 00:12:04,780
and the basic story beats.

349
00:12:04,780 --> 00:12:07,060
But then we go into
the tone and style.

350
00:12:07,060 --> 00:12:09,730
We go into how we're gonna
deal with the horror,

351
00:12:09,730 --> 00:12:12,250
that a lot of it's
gonna be off screen.

352
00:12:12,250 --> 00:12:14,560
And the monster's
gonna be obscured,

353
00:12:14,560 --> 00:12:17,020
and you're not going to
see things super clearly.

354
00:12:17,020 --> 00:12:19,090
And just, sort of,
wanted to approach it

355
00:12:19,090 --> 00:12:23,050
like those old classic films
that we grew up loving.

356
00:12:23,050 --> 00:12:24,850
And so, we are able
to talk about that,

357
00:12:24,850 --> 00:12:26,140
which is something
we didn't have time

358
00:12:26,140 --> 00:12:27,190
to get into with the pitch.

359
00:12:27,190 --> 00:12:29,170
We talk a little bit,
even, about the music,

360
00:12:29,170 --> 00:12:31,420
that it's gonna have-- we
envision it as having like

361
00:12:31,420 --> 00:12:34,060
a synth score, as opposed
to like an orchestral score.

362
00:12:34,060 --> 00:12:36,200
We want it to sound like
a John Carpenter film.

363
00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:38,590
So again, a lot of
this is kind of--

364
00:12:38,590 --> 00:12:41,570
and that was not something-- we
didn't get into the soundtrack

365
00:12:41,573 --> 00:12:42,493
when we were pitching.

366
00:12:42,490 --> 00:12:45,050
And that was all about story,
and character, and structure.

367
00:12:45,050 --> 00:12:47,550
And if you are interested in
looking more at, it I believe

368
00:12:47,550 --> 00:12:48,640
you can just--

369
00:12:48,640 --> 00:12:49,920
it is online.

370
00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:50,920
Someone put it online.

371
00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:52,550
Someone put it
online at some point.

372
00:12:52,550 --> 00:12:55,660
So you can just Google
"Stranger Things" look book.

373
00:12:55,660 --> 00:12:57,580
And it will come up for you.

374
00:12:57,580 --> 00:13:00,570
[DRAMATIC MUSIC PLAYING]

375
00:13:03,560 --> 00:13:05,180
We had the pitch,
the verbal pitch.

376
00:13:05,180 --> 00:13:06,650
We had the look book,
which we sent them.

377
00:13:06,650 --> 00:13:08,190
We did one other
thing, which is sort

378
00:13:08,192 --> 00:13:10,822
of an above and beyond thing,
which is not necessary.

379
00:13:10,820 --> 00:13:12,440
Our producer
suggested that we--

380
00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:13,070
Is that what it was?

381
00:13:13,070 --> 00:13:13,560
Yeah, that's what it was.

382
00:13:13,560 --> 00:13:16,020
Yeah, our producer suggested
we do it, which we would do,

383
00:13:16,018 --> 00:13:19,758
like, a sizzle reel or a
fake trailer for the show.

384
00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:23,620
Basically, all this is, is
you take a bunch of clips.

385
00:13:23,615 --> 00:13:26,245
This is, again, something that's
so simple that Ross and I were

386
00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:29,570
able to do it on Final Cut.

387
00:13:29,570 --> 00:13:33,640
We took a bunch of clips
from movies that were ins--

388
00:13:33,635 --> 00:13:35,555
a lot of the movies
that inspired the show--

389
00:13:35,550 --> 00:13:36,050
Yeah.

390
00:13:36,050 --> 00:13:37,280
--old movies.

391
00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:38,100
We had "E.T."

392
00:13:38,095 --> 00:13:39,475
We had "Nightmare
on Elm Street."

393
00:13:39,470 --> 00:13:42,200
We also had new movies.

394
00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:44,420
We had-- what else
did we have in there?

395
00:13:44,420 --> 00:13:45,170
We had "Super 8"

396
00:13:45,170 --> 00:13:46,700
We had like 30-some movies.

397
00:13:46,700 --> 00:13:48,590
Yeah, "Super 8" was
in there a lot, right?

398
00:13:48,590 --> 00:13:49,340
"Halloween."

399
00:13:49,340 --> 00:13:50,060
"Halloween."

400
00:13:50,060 --> 00:13:51,500
Just a lot of our references.

401
00:13:51,500 --> 00:13:52,460
And we put it together.

402
00:13:52,458 --> 00:13:54,588
"Altered States" was in there.

403
00:13:54,590 --> 00:13:56,210
And we added this--

404
00:13:56,210 --> 00:13:58,820
what's cool about it
and it just further

405
00:13:58,820 --> 00:14:01,000
helps tell them or show them--

406
00:14:00,995 --> 00:14:01,615
The tone.

407
00:14:01,610 --> 00:14:04,490
--the tone, how you
envision the show.

408
00:14:04,487 --> 00:14:06,317
What do you imagine
it's going to look like?

409
00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:08,070
What do you imagine
it's gonna sound like?

410
00:14:08,070 --> 00:14:09,280
And it was cool, even for us.

411
00:14:09,278 --> 00:14:10,988
I don't know how much
it helped, in terms

412
00:14:10,987 --> 00:14:12,137
of the selling of the show.

413
00:14:12,140 --> 00:14:14,900
But it was fun to put together
and actually helped educate us,

414
00:14:14,900 --> 00:14:18,080
in terms of what this
show was gonna look like.

415
00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:20,600
Was it gonna work, our
idea of synth music?

416
00:14:20,600 --> 00:14:24,410
So we put, like, John Carpenter
synth music over images

417
00:14:24,410 --> 00:14:28,190
from ET, which has kind of a
really uplifting John Williams

418
00:14:28,190 --> 00:14:29,750
score and it was,
like, really cool.

419
00:14:29,750 --> 00:14:31,710
And we were like, okay,
I think, actually, this

420
00:14:31,708 --> 00:14:32,588
is going to work.

421
00:14:32,585 --> 00:14:34,465
It's definitely not
something you have to do.

422
00:14:34,460 --> 00:14:36,440
Hard to know how much it
moves the needle, in terms

423
00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:37,400
of selling the project.

424
00:14:37,398 --> 00:14:39,948
But I do think, ultimately,
something specific to us

425
00:14:39,950 --> 00:14:41,870
is that we had wanted
to direct this one.

426
00:14:41,870 --> 00:14:42,140
So--

427
00:14:42,140 --> 00:14:42,640
Right.

428
00:14:42,640 --> 00:14:46,340
--I think it helped sell
us that we had a clear vision

429
00:14:46,340 --> 00:14:49,250
for what this should look,
and sound, and feel like.

430
00:14:49,250 --> 00:14:51,870
And so, I think it
helped in that regard.

431
00:14:51,870 --> 00:14:55,100
So it can be a helpful thing,
certainly not necessary.

432
00:14:55,100 --> 00:14:58,090
[DRAMATIC MUSIC PLAYING]

433
00:15:01,090 --> 00:15:02,530
We had our producers.

434
00:15:02,530 --> 00:15:06,830
We had our verbal pitch
that we had memorized.

435
00:15:06,826 --> 00:15:09,516
We had our look book,
we had our sizzle reel.

436
00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:13,240
So now was the time to
really go out and pitch this

437
00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:14,620
to various companies.

438
00:15:14,620 --> 00:15:19,060
Which both our agents and
our producing partners

439
00:15:19,060 --> 00:15:20,740
came up with a list
of, hey, I think

440
00:15:20,740 --> 00:15:22,900
these are the companies
that potentially would

441
00:15:22,900 --> 00:15:24,590
be interested in this project.

442
00:15:24,590 --> 00:15:28,060
So then you start a sort
of grueling-- the grueling

443
00:15:28,060 --> 00:15:32,440
experience of actually going and
doing these pitches in person.

444
00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:35,650
So why it's exhausting
is you're doing

445
00:15:35,650 --> 00:15:37,450
this 15 or 20-minute
pitch, but you're

446
00:15:37,450 --> 00:15:38,780
doing it over and over again.

447
00:15:38,780 --> 00:15:39,280
Yeah.

448
00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:40,630
I believe-- how
many did we do?

449
00:15:40,630 --> 00:15:42,340
I think, in that first
week, was it fif--

450
00:15:42,338 --> 00:15:45,078
I mean, you say I exaggerate,
but I feel like it was 12--

451
00:15:45,080 --> 00:15:45,580
Yeah

452
00:15:45,580 --> 00:15:47,080
--in that first week.

453
00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:49,660
Yeah, I would say it was
probably 12 in that first week.

454
00:15:49,660 --> 00:15:51,920
And what can be--

455
00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:55,060
it can be exciting, but
it can be discouraging.

456
00:15:55,060 --> 00:15:57,190
I mean, you're gonna hear
stories again about, hey,

457
00:15:57,185 --> 00:15:58,855
someone just bought
[SNAPS FINGERS] this

458
00:15:58,852 --> 00:15:59,592
in the room.

459
00:15:59,590 --> 00:16:00,970
Again, that didn't happen to us.

460
00:16:00,970 --> 00:16:04,870
And I would say a chunk of the
places, at least half of them,

461
00:16:04,870 --> 00:16:07,180
were probably hearing
the pitch just out

462
00:16:07,180 --> 00:16:10,870
of to be nice to the
agents because they

463
00:16:10,870 --> 00:16:12,110
had a relationship with them.

464
00:16:12,110 --> 00:16:12,940
So like, okay, yeah.

465
00:16:12,943 --> 00:16:15,503
I'll take 40 minutes out of
my day to hear this pitch.

466
00:16:15,500 --> 00:16:18,550
But they weren't really
interested in the project.

467
00:16:18,550 --> 00:16:20,830
So that can also become--

468
00:16:20,830 --> 00:16:23,380
be a painful process, because
you're trying to be excited.

469
00:16:23,380 --> 00:16:25,540
And if you're not
getting anything back,

470
00:16:25,540 --> 00:16:28,870
if they're just zoned out,
then that 15 or 20 minutes is

471
00:16:28,870 --> 00:16:30,640
gonna feel like two hours.

472
00:16:30,637 --> 00:16:31,717
And so, you just do that--

473
00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:32,220
Right.

474
00:16:32,220 --> 00:16:34,360
--over and over
and over again.

475
00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:35,750
And it can be disheartening.

476
00:16:35,747 --> 00:16:37,327
Some people you'll
pitch to, they'll

477
00:16:37,330 --> 00:16:39,290
seem completely
disengaged, uninterested.

478
00:16:39,285 --> 00:16:40,665
And you're not
surprised when you

479
00:16:40,660 --> 00:16:43,060
get the phone call, ultimately,
that they passed on it.

480
00:16:43,060 --> 00:16:44,200
That's frustrating.

481
00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:46,030
It's more discouraging
and frustrating

482
00:16:46,030 --> 00:16:49,010
when you have that person or
people in the room who really

483
00:16:49,005 --> 00:16:50,385
seem to connect
to it, who really

484
00:16:50,380 --> 00:16:52,860
do seem to understand it,
who seem to love the project,

485
00:16:52,862 --> 00:16:54,822
and you come out of that
room kind of bouncing.

486
00:16:54,820 --> 00:16:56,440
You're like, wow, I
think that really worked.

487
00:16:56,440 --> 00:16:56,780
That really went well.

488
00:16:56,780 --> 00:16:58,960
I think they're going to buy--
that went really, really well.

489
00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:01,120
And you get the phone
call that they brought it

490
00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:02,830
to their boss, who was like--

491
00:17:02,830 --> 00:17:06,250
for whatever reason, kids, I
don't know, kids and monsters?

492
00:17:06,250 --> 00:17:07,510
No thanks, that's not for us.

493
00:17:07,510 --> 00:17:08,960
And they end up passing on it.

494
00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:11,260
So within that
first week, it was--

495
00:17:11,260 --> 00:17:13,060
so you're pitching
your heart out,

496
00:17:13,060 --> 00:17:14,980
and you're traveling
all over town.

497
00:17:14,980 --> 00:17:16,780
And I think we had 12
pitches in that week,

498
00:17:16,780 --> 00:17:20,350
and it was 12 rejections,
ultimately, in that first week.

499
00:17:20,349 --> 00:17:21,999
And then, on that
Friday, I remember

500
00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:27,780
we got a call from our
agent, who said that--

501
00:17:27,775 --> 00:17:31,515
don't get too discouraged that
it was a special project that

502
00:17:31,510 --> 00:17:33,100
was gonna find a special home.

503
00:17:33,100 --> 00:17:35,410
And it was just not the
phone call you want to get.

504
00:17:35,410 --> 00:17:38,110
Because you're like,
what's wrong with my child?

505
00:17:38,110 --> 00:17:40,750
Like, what's wrong with this?

506
00:17:40,750 --> 00:17:42,500
The idea that he
was calling it, um--

507
00:17:42,500 --> 00:17:43,000
Special.

508
00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:43,720
--special.

509
00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:45,510
Kind of like, it was
like, okay, well, this

510
00:17:45,512 --> 00:17:47,452
is gonna be harder than
we thought to sell it.

511
00:17:47,450 --> 00:17:47,950
Butt--

512
00:17:47,950 --> 00:17:50,470
Because we did feel very
strongly about the script.

513
00:17:50,470 --> 00:17:52,000
And we felt strongly
about the pitch

514
00:17:52,002 --> 00:17:53,212
and the additional materials.

515
00:17:53,210 --> 00:17:55,480
And the producers had
responded so positively.

516
00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:56,620
And we were just--

517
00:17:56,620 --> 00:18:00,560
it just felt like, for a second
there, it wasn't gonna happen.

518
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:03,520
So I think what
happens, inevitably--

519
00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:06,580
and this is something
that's important to know--

520
00:18:06,580 --> 00:18:09,070
is that you do get
rejected a lot,

521
00:18:09,070 --> 00:18:11,110
you get the door
shut on you a lot.

522
00:18:11,110 --> 00:18:13,720
And it can be really
wearing on you.

523
00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:15,210
It can wear you down.

524
00:18:15,207 --> 00:18:16,917
I mean, I know a lot
of people have left,

525
00:18:16,915 --> 00:18:18,705
you know, they stopped
even pursuing it

526
00:18:18,700 --> 00:18:20,780
because it got worn down
so much by the rejection.

527
00:18:20,783 --> 00:18:22,863
And at certain points,
it can seem impossible.

528
00:18:22,860 --> 00:18:23,360
It can.

529
00:18:23,360 --> 00:18:26,170
I think the best
thing to do when you're

530
00:18:26,170 --> 00:18:29,410
feeling like you can't go
take another step is you just

531
00:18:29,410 --> 00:18:31,660
got to get back up, and you
have to go back out there,

532
00:18:31,660 --> 00:18:33,940
and you have to pitch it,
like, with the confidence

533
00:18:33,935 --> 00:18:35,565
that this is really
cool and you really

534
00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:37,100
do believe in it,
which was the case.

535
00:18:37,102 --> 00:18:39,872
I mean, I think we kind of
got over it over the weekend.

536
00:18:39,875 --> 00:18:42,255
I mean, we were starting to
get, actually, pretty nervous

537
00:18:42,250 --> 00:18:43,150
about it selling.

538
00:18:43,150 --> 00:18:45,160
The challenge
with all of this is

539
00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:50,570
that there's an element of
luck and timing involved.

540
00:18:50,570 --> 00:18:52,060
So for the instance--

541
00:18:52,060 --> 00:18:53,100
Yeah.

542
00:18:53,100 --> 00:18:56,620
--on "Stranger Things," the
instance was we weren't even

543
00:18:56,620 --> 00:19:00,010
pitching to Netflix that wasn't
even part of the plan Netflix

544
00:19:00,010 --> 00:19:04,600
was making shows for Dave
Fincher and Jenji Kohan.

545
00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:06,970
She wasn't gonna make
a Duffer Brothers show.

546
00:19:06,970 --> 00:19:08,770
That wasn't even
on anyone's radar.

547
00:19:08,770 --> 00:19:10,510
They were so selective.

548
00:19:10,510 --> 00:19:13,750
So we didn't even set
a meeting with Netflix.

549
00:19:13,750 --> 00:19:16,360
Someone new had just
started to work there,

550
00:19:16,360 --> 00:19:19,690
had a meeting with one of
our agents on our team.

551
00:19:19,690 --> 00:19:22,960
And they said, hey,
we're looking for a show.

552
00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:26,440
It should be youth-oriented, but
we want it to be supernatural.

553
00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:28,490
I don't remember the
other key words he used,

554
00:19:28,492 --> 00:19:30,702
but our agent was like, wait
a minute, wait a minute,

555
00:19:30,700 --> 00:19:33,610
wait a minute, I have the
script for you, oh my God.

556
00:19:33,610 --> 00:19:35,350
And he slipped him
"Stranger Things."

557
00:19:35,350 --> 00:19:38,200
This executive happened
to really like the script.

558
00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:40,660
And that got us our meeting.

559
00:19:40,660 --> 00:19:42,910
But this is also where
you need a good agent.

560
00:19:42,910 --> 00:19:45,400
Because then our agents are
kind of going, you know,

561
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,540
if you really are interested
in this, it's really hot.

562
00:19:48,535 --> 00:19:50,415
Like, a lot of people
are interested in this,

563
00:19:50,410 --> 00:19:51,430
you better act pretty fast.

564
00:19:51,430 --> 00:19:52,650
Like, nobody was
interested in this script.

565
00:19:52,650 --> 00:19:53,260
No.

566
00:19:53,260 --> 00:19:54,890
That is the other
element of this,

567
00:19:54,890 --> 00:19:57,740
which is you just need that
first little bite of someone

568
00:19:57,742 --> 00:19:58,452
being interested.

569
00:19:58,450 --> 00:19:58,950
Right.

570
00:19:58,950 --> 00:19:59,920
But they leverage that.

571
00:19:59,918 --> 00:20:01,208
You need something to leverage.

572
00:20:01,210 --> 00:20:03,430
And then, suddenly,
there's excitement builds.

573
00:20:03,430 --> 00:20:06,040
And then people go, oh, there's
this hot script in town.

574
00:20:06,040 --> 00:20:08,680
And that led to, ultimately,
our meeting with Netflix

575
00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:10,050
and them buying the project.

576
00:20:10,045 --> 00:20:10,545
So--

577
00:20:10,545 --> 00:20:12,965
No, but suddenly, people are
taking us to steak dinners.

578
00:20:12,962 --> 00:20:16,722
And, like, this from nobody
was interested in this at all--

579
00:20:16,725 --> 00:20:17,355
That's right.

580
00:20:17,350 --> 00:20:21,280
--to one person
expresses interest.

581
00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:23,440
Suddenly, there's panic,
everybody wants it.

582
00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:25,830
And we're getting, like,
they're buying us $100 steaks.

583
00:20:25,833 --> 00:20:26,503
It's ridiculous.

584
00:20:26,500 --> 00:20:26,960
But there's an alternate--

585
00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:28,040
But that's how it works.

586
00:20:28,043 --> 00:20:32,713
--but there's an alternate
universe where that meeting

587
00:20:32,710 --> 00:20:34,760
with that new Netflix
exec doesn't happen.

588
00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:35,260
Right.

589
00:20:35,260 --> 00:20:36,970
It doesn't get in his hands.

590
00:20:36,970 --> 00:20:39,830
The interest doesn't
build like that.

591
00:20:39,830 --> 00:20:43,480
So the point of this story
is to not get discouraged.

592
00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:45,850
Because there was definitely
a version of this story

593
00:20:45,850 --> 00:20:48,520
where the script
doesn't sell, or maybe

594
00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:52,190
we get a small little
option fee and we develop

595
00:20:52,190 --> 00:20:53,440
it a little more at a company.

596
00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:55,010
And it just never gets made.

597
00:20:55,010 --> 00:20:57,800
So that's the scary
thing about it.

598
00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:01,980
And so, there's always gonna
be that element of luck

599
00:21:01,980 --> 00:21:04,190
and timing, that it's just
always gonna be there.

600
00:21:04,190 --> 00:21:05,690
There's nothing you
can do about it.

601
00:21:05,690 --> 00:21:08,110
So there's gonna be a little
bit of crossing your fingers.

602
00:21:08,107 --> 00:21:11,077
And all you can do is write
the best script possible,

603
00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:13,990
get the best pitch,
and go above and beyond

604
00:21:13,990 --> 00:21:16,600
with your additional
materials, whether that's

605
00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:18,610
a look book, or
sizzle reel, or both,

606
00:21:18,610 --> 00:21:20,740
or whatever it is that
you think you can do,

607
00:21:20,740 --> 00:21:23,270
whatever ideas you have,
to get people excited.

608
00:21:23,270 --> 00:21:25,480
That's really all you
can do, that's All

609
00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:26,560
that's in your control.

610
00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:29,370
The rest of it is up to fate.

611
00:21:29,368 --> 00:21:32,178
[DRAMATIC MUSIC PLAYING]

612
00:21:34,990 --> 00:21:38,530
Initially, Ross and I
did not want to write,

613
00:21:38,530 --> 00:21:40,030
or didn't see
ourselves as writers,

614
00:21:40,030 --> 00:21:41,610
I guess is a better
way of putting it.

615
00:21:41,613 --> 00:21:43,843
We really wanted to
direct, that was our goal.

616
00:21:43,845 --> 00:21:45,975
So it was very important
to us that this was a show

617
00:21:45,970 --> 00:21:48,640
that we would be able to
direct, that we at least wanted

618
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:49,810
to direct the pilot.

619
00:21:49,810 --> 00:21:52,360
But ideally, we wanted to
direct the majority, if not

620
00:21:52,360 --> 00:21:53,440
the whole show.

621
00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:57,130
And so, that's one reason we
did the look book, one reason we

622
00:21:57,130 --> 00:21:59,350
did the sizzle reel,
the fake trailer,

623
00:21:59,350 --> 00:22:01,780
to show that we had a vision
and understanding of this

624
00:22:01,780 --> 00:22:05,320
beyond the written form.

625
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:07,750
But it was hard,
because at that point,

626
00:22:07,750 --> 00:22:10,210
we had made that one movie at
Warner Bros., "Hidden," which

627
00:22:10,208 --> 00:22:11,668
we talked a little
bit about, which

628
00:22:11,667 --> 00:22:13,537
was a bomb, which was
a dud, which was never

629
00:22:13,540 --> 00:22:14,440
released, right?

630
00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:15,940
Which people always
seem to have,

631
00:22:15,940 --> 00:22:18,250
like, sort of
lukewarm responses to.

632
00:22:18,250 --> 00:22:22,600
I remember there was a
company that really wanted

633
00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:25,270
to make "Montauk" or "Stranger
Things," that loved it,

634
00:22:25,270 --> 00:22:26,680
like, they got it completely.

635
00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:26,980
The phone call did come.

636
00:22:26,980 --> 00:22:28,160
This feels like the one, yeah.

637
00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:29,650
Yeah, it was like,
this is the one.

638
00:22:29,650 --> 00:22:30,970
This is where we're
supposed to be.

639
00:22:30,970 --> 00:22:32,230
They're gonna make this show.

640
00:22:32,230 --> 00:22:33,340
Like, it really
did feel like that.

641
00:22:33,340 --> 00:22:35,050
I mean, this was a
studio that had money,

642
00:22:35,048 --> 00:22:36,158
that could make the show.

643
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,920
And they said, yeah, we don't
want the guys directing.

644
00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:40,090
So that was really hard.

645
00:22:40,090 --> 00:22:41,890
I mean, first of all,
it hurt my feelings

646
00:22:41,893 --> 00:22:43,813
that they didn't like
the film and they didn't

647
00:22:43,810 --> 00:22:45,020
think we were good directors.

648
00:22:45,018 --> 00:22:47,748
But secondly, we were in a tough
spot, because at that point,

649
00:22:47,750 --> 00:22:51,550
nobody was interested
in the show.

650
00:22:51,550 --> 00:22:53,610
And I don't know, it
was a tough decision,

651
00:22:53,608 --> 00:22:55,148
but we told our
agents, listen, we're

652
00:22:55,150 --> 00:22:57,980
not interested in doing this
if we're not directing it.

653
00:22:57,980 --> 00:23:00,040
We believed in it
enough that we felt

654
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:01,330
we would find another home.

655
00:23:01,330 --> 00:23:02,360
We're like, if these
people responded

656
00:23:02,360 --> 00:23:03,970
to it or this studio
responded to it--

657
00:23:03,970 --> 00:23:04,300
Someone else--

658
00:23:04,300 --> 00:23:06,310
--another studio is gonna
come and respond to it.

659
00:23:06,310 --> 00:23:08,540
But it was at risk, it was
a bit of a roll of the dice.

660
00:23:08,540 --> 00:23:10,000
But it was like,
for us, it was not

661
00:23:09,998 --> 00:23:12,678
worth making if we weren't
allowed to direct it.

662
00:23:12,682 --> 00:23:14,142
It's like the whole
reason we wrote

663
00:23:14,140 --> 00:23:16,310
this was so we'd have
leverage to be able to direct.

664
00:23:16,307 --> 00:23:18,407
So at that point, we
didn't have a lot of money.

665
00:23:18,410 --> 00:23:20,500
We had worked on
that one TV show.

666
00:23:20,500 --> 00:23:23,260
We were running out of money
from that television show.

667
00:23:23,260 --> 00:23:24,960
Because we kind of
hoarded that money

668
00:23:24,955 --> 00:23:28,035
and used that to buy ourselves
enough time to write this--

669
00:23:28,032 --> 00:23:28,612
On the bank.

670
00:23:28,615 --> 00:23:29,115
--show.

671
00:23:29,115 --> 00:23:30,465
So with the bank, you know--

672
00:23:30,465 --> 00:23:31,845
so we were basically
gonna end up

673
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:33,760
having to work for another
TV show or something,

674
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:34,590
if this didn't sell.

675
00:23:34,593 --> 00:23:37,513
So it was a hard decision,
but it was honestly

676
00:23:37,515 --> 00:23:39,145
one of the best
decisions we ever made,

677
00:23:39,140 --> 00:23:40,850
which was to walk away
from that company.

678
00:23:40,848 --> 00:23:43,028
And the only lesson
in that is, I

679
00:23:43,030 --> 00:23:48,100
think, you know, stick to
your guns, trust your gut.

680
00:23:48,100 --> 00:23:50,560
If you really want to direct,
or you want to be involved,

681
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:52,660
you want to be the show runner,
I think you should say that.

682
00:23:52,660 --> 00:23:53,630
I think you should
stick to that.

683
00:23:53,630 --> 00:23:54,760
I think a lot of
people, especially

684
00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:56,340
if you're inexperienced,
they're gonna

685
00:23:56,343 --> 00:23:58,453
be trying to push you
out of that position

686
00:23:58,450 --> 00:24:02,780
because it's just an easier
sell to their bosses, basically.

687
00:24:02,780 --> 00:24:06,890
But if you see yourself in
that role, you got to say it.

688
00:24:06,890 --> 00:24:09,640
You got to say that that's
the requirement if you

689
00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:10,450
want this script.

690
00:24:10,450 --> 00:24:12,550
If your script's strong
enough, hopefully--

691
00:24:12,550 --> 00:24:14,350
if that company doesn't
allow you to do it,

692
00:24:14,350 --> 00:24:16,180
hopefully you'll find
a company that does.

693
00:24:16,180 --> 00:24:18,280
Netflix did, Netflix
believed in us.

694
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:20,440
There are two things
that also lessons

695
00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:23,230
from that, which we found, at
least in our experience, which

696
00:24:23,230 --> 00:24:25,390
is confidence.

697
00:24:25,390 --> 00:24:27,880
Even if you don't have it,
which we certainly-- we

698
00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:30,430
didn't know how to make a
show, we just said we did.

699
00:24:30,430 --> 00:24:31,410
Right.

700
00:24:31,405 --> 00:24:33,585
There is something to
be said about faking it

701
00:24:33,580 --> 00:24:36,790
until you make it, which is
just, project confidence,

702
00:24:36,790 --> 00:24:37,830
if don't hedge your bets.

703
00:24:37,832 --> 00:24:39,162
Do you guys know how to do this?

704
00:24:39,165 --> 00:24:40,815
Don't say, well, I
mean, hopefully, we

705
00:24:40,810 --> 00:24:41,560
can figure it out.

706
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:44,110
No, no, no, just
say, absolutely, this

707
00:24:44,105 --> 00:24:45,735
is what-- we have a
vision, this is how

708
00:24:45,730 --> 00:24:47,840
we want to impart that vision.

709
00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:49,900
And if you just fake
confidence, you're

710
00:24:49,900 --> 00:24:51,400
gonna make people
feel a lot better.

711
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:53,780
And you're more likely
to get what you want.

712
00:24:53,780 --> 00:24:56,050
And also, there's
a power in saying

713
00:24:56,050 --> 00:25:00,530
no, if someone says, hey,
we'll buy this project for you,

714
00:25:00,530 --> 00:25:02,230
but these are the requirements.

715
00:25:02,230 --> 00:25:05,240
If you say no, it actually
gives you more leverage

716
00:25:05,235 --> 00:25:05,865
than you think.

717
00:25:05,860 --> 00:25:08,200
Because then what happens
is they go, wait a minute,

718
00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:10,840
this is someone who
has a clear vision

719
00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:13,050
and they're sticking
to their guns.

720
00:25:13,053 --> 00:25:14,473
And I think that
that is something

721
00:25:14,470 --> 00:25:16,060
that, at least in
our experience,

722
00:25:16,060 --> 00:25:18,340
has actually proved
pretty beneficial.

723
00:25:18,340 --> 00:25:20,380
So you shouldn't
be afraid to say

724
00:25:20,380 --> 00:25:22,580
no in certain circumstances.

725
00:25:22,580 --> 00:25:25,390
What is gonna
be your ally here

726
00:25:25,390 --> 00:25:29,890
is just doing everything we've
kind of stepped you through,

727
00:25:29,890 --> 00:25:32,650
which is doing the work,
planning, writing things down,

728
00:25:32,648 --> 00:25:33,938
like you notice with the pitch.

729
00:25:33,940 --> 00:25:36,940
Even that, every aspect
of that was written down.

730
00:25:36,940 --> 00:25:38,120
We weren't winging it.

731
00:25:38,120 --> 00:25:39,070
We weren't having to--

732
00:25:39,070 --> 00:25:41,320
that will give you the
confidence when you go in these

733
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:43,090
meetings to sound like you know
what the hell you're talking

734
00:25:43,090 --> 00:25:44,590
about, even if you don't.

735
00:25:44,590 --> 00:25:45,310
Just--

736
00:25:45,310 --> 00:25:46,390
We were so nervous--

737
00:25:46,388 --> 00:25:46,928
So nervous.

738
00:25:46,930 --> 00:25:48,310
--going into the
Netflix meeting.

739
00:25:48,305 --> 00:25:49,545
We were terrified.

740
00:25:49,540 --> 00:25:53,470
But if we got in there,
uh, shaking and mumbling,

741
00:25:53,470 --> 00:25:56,140
that probably wouldn't
have gotten us the project.

742
00:25:56,140 --> 00:26:00,160
But because Matt and I had
rehearsed that pitch so

743
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:02,680
many times, that
once we got going,

744
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:04,990
once we started it and said,
hey, so you've probably

745
00:26:04,990 --> 00:26:07,200
seen our look book, and we
started those first couple

746
00:26:07,198 --> 00:26:08,978
sentences, it fell into place.

747
00:26:08,980 --> 00:26:10,510
We had done this so many times.

748
00:26:10,510 --> 00:26:14,110
And we just pretended like we're
just pitching to each other.

749
00:26:14,110 --> 00:26:16,330
That confidence
just-- even though we

750
00:26:16,330 --> 00:26:19,660
weren't confident at all,
Netflix saw it as confidence.

751
00:26:19,657 --> 00:26:21,487
And that's all that
mattered in that moment.

752
00:26:21,490 --> 00:26:24,070
So, again, it's
just, put in the work--

753
00:26:24,070 --> 00:26:24,820
Put in the time.

754
00:26:24,820 --> 00:26:29,200
--put in the time, plan it
all out, don't wing anything,

755
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,800
and you know, you'll be fine.

756
00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:34,620


757
00:26:37,735 --> 00:26:39,615
So now, you know, you've
started your script,

758
00:26:39,610 --> 00:26:41,030
you're feeling
confident about it.

759
00:26:41,027 --> 00:26:44,497
I think it might be worth
taking the time to develop

760
00:26:44,500 --> 00:26:46,510
some of this pitching material.

761
00:26:46,510 --> 00:26:49,170
It's good to put together
a look book, if you can.

762
00:26:49,165 --> 00:26:53,805
If you know how to edit
on Final Cut, or iMovie,

763
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:56,620
or any of those
programs, then it's fun

764
00:26:56,620 --> 00:26:58,090
to start to put
together, hey, this

765
00:26:58,090 --> 00:27:00,430
is, maybe, what my
world could look like.

766
00:27:00,430 --> 00:27:02,380
Start to develop
those materials you

767
00:27:02,380 --> 00:27:04,350
would need to develop
your own pitch.

768
00:27:04,348 --> 00:27:05,888
And, you know,
write out the pitch.

769
00:27:05,890 --> 00:27:10,270
I mean, again, look, this pitch
is one, two, three, four, five,

770
00:27:10,270 --> 00:27:12,800
six, it's only seven--
it's 6 and 1/2 pages.

771
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:13,300
Yeah.

772
00:27:13,300 --> 00:27:14,360
So it's not that long.

773
00:27:14,360 --> 00:27:16,440
It's not that much longer
than the page you wrote.

774
00:27:16,443 --> 00:27:19,753
It's just basically organizing
all the ideas you have.

775
00:27:19,748 --> 00:27:21,788
You're not gonna have to
be generating new ideas.

776
00:27:21,790 --> 00:27:23,620
You're gonna have plenty
of ideas at this point,

777
00:27:23,620 --> 00:27:25,180
writing them down,
organizing them

778
00:27:25,180 --> 00:27:27,580
in the way that sounds
as cool as possible.

779
00:27:27,578 --> 00:27:29,618
And then, suddenly, you're
gonna to have a pitch.

780
00:27:29,620 --> 00:27:31,300
The minute you hire
a producer, you're

781
00:27:31,300 --> 00:27:32,840
gonna be like, hey,
listen, I already

782
00:27:32,842 --> 00:27:34,502
have a pitch ready to go.

783
00:27:34,497 --> 00:27:35,827
I have this beautiful look book.

784
00:27:35,830 --> 00:27:37,240
Here we go.

785
00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:38,170
And that's fast.

786
00:27:38,170 --> 00:27:40,920
And then they can send
that out to the town.

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,300


2
00:00:06,130 --> 00:00:08,860
All right, so you've
sold your script.

3
00:00:08,860 --> 00:00:10,680
If so, that's amazing.

4
00:00:10,682 --> 00:00:12,142
Now, with "Stranger
Things" we were

5
00:00:12,140 --> 00:00:14,620
in a somewhat unique
situation in that Netflix

6
00:00:14,620 --> 00:00:16,780
had greenlit the series.

7
00:00:16,780 --> 00:00:20,380
So we went straight into
writing the rest of the series.

8
00:00:20,380 --> 00:00:24,250
A lot of times what's going to
happen is a studio or a network

9
00:00:24,253 --> 00:00:25,423
is going to buy your script.

10
00:00:25,420 --> 00:00:26,920
And then they're going to
continue to develop it.

11
00:00:26,920 --> 00:00:29,320
You're going to work with an
executive there to continue

12
00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:31,900
to hone the script and
hopefully get into a place

13
00:00:31,900 --> 00:00:35,410
that they feel comfortable
with greenlighting that pilot.

14
00:00:35,410 --> 00:00:37,190
So it sort of depends.

15
00:00:37,190 --> 00:00:39,100
The situation is
gonna depend on it.

16
00:00:39,100 --> 00:00:40,890
But the goal, of
course, always is

17
00:00:40,890 --> 00:00:42,640
whether it's greenlit
right away or later,

18
00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:43,900
as you want to get greenlit.

19
00:00:43,900 --> 00:00:47,320
You want them to obviously
produce your story

20
00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:48,640
and produce your show.

21
00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:51,630
And when that happens,
something really exciting

22
00:00:51,630 --> 00:00:54,130
happens, which is you're going
to get a writers' room, which

23
00:00:54,130 --> 00:00:56,550
is something prior to
"Stranger Things" we had never

24
00:00:56,550 --> 00:00:57,550
been in a writers' room.

25
00:00:57,550 --> 00:01:00,610
We didn't really know how
a writers room worked.

26
00:01:00,610 --> 00:01:03,310
What's great about a writers'
room is that doing a TV show

27
00:01:03,310 --> 00:01:04,180
can be overwhelming.

28
00:01:04,180 --> 00:01:06,280
That's a lot of
hours and characters

29
00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:08,050
and storylines that
you're tracking.

30
00:01:08,050 --> 00:01:09,790
And sometimes when
you're just working

31
00:01:09,790 --> 00:01:12,520
by yourself, or in our
case, a writing partner,

32
00:01:12,520 --> 00:01:13,930
you can get lost in the woods.

33
00:01:13,930 --> 00:01:15,100
And you get stuck.

34
00:01:15,100 --> 00:01:17,740
And what's amazing about
having other people

35
00:01:17,742 --> 00:01:19,452
in the room and other
voices is that they

36
00:01:19,450 --> 00:01:20,830
can help you get unstuck.

37
00:01:20,830 --> 00:01:22,630
And they can give you
ideas that you never

38
00:01:22,630 --> 00:01:24,890
would have thought of
in the first place.

39
00:01:24,890 --> 00:01:27,520
And so they can help
you further blue sky

40
00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,310
and further develop your idea
and help you with your outlines

41
00:01:30,310 --> 00:01:33,160
as you go and continue to
develop the other episodes

42
00:01:33,155 --> 00:01:34,405
of your show beyond the pilot.

43
00:01:40,557 --> 00:01:41,887
So stepping back for a second.

44
00:01:41,890 --> 00:01:43,440
So what is a writers'
room exactly?

45
00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:46,020
So a writers' room is
basically something--

46
00:01:46,020 --> 00:01:50,180
if you have a television show,
it's a room of writers, right?

47
00:01:50,180 --> 00:01:51,780
And they're going
to be chosen by you.

48
00:01:51,780 --> 00:01:53,280
If you're show-running,
you're going

49
00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:55,110
to be able to select
who the writers are.

50
00:01:55,110 --> 00:01:56,650
It's not like Netflix
is going to say

51
00:01:56,652 --> 00:01:59,372
you have to hire X, Y, Z,
this person, this person,

52
00:01:59,368 --> 00:02:01,408
this person, and suddenly
give you these writers.

53
00:02:01,410 --> 00:02:04,160
You're going to read
a lot of scripts.

54
00:02:04,158 --> 00:02:04,948
A lot of scripts.

55
00:02:04,950 --> 00:02:05,910
A lot of scripts.

56
00:02:05,910 --> 00:02:07,720
A lot of scripts that
aren't going to be so good.

57
00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:09,330
But every once in a while,
you're going to read a script

58
00:02:09,330 --> 00:02:09,830
you like.

59
00:02:09,830 --> 00:02:11,840
You are going to then
meet with that writer,

60
00:02:11,843 --> 00:02:13,263
and you're just
gonna feel it out.

61
00:02:13,260 --> 00:02:15,750
It's like a-- kind of like a
little first date or whatever.

62
00:02:15,750 --> 00:02:18,450
You're going to see
if you get along.

63
00:02:18,450 --> 00:02:21,790
Does this person seem to
like the same stuff you like?

64
00:02:21,790 --> 00:02:23,730
Do you share similar
sensibilities?

65
00:02:23,730 --> 00:02:26,340
Do they bring something unique,
something different than you

66
00:02:26,340 --> 00:02:26,910
to the room?

67
00:02:26,910 --> 00:02:28,760
Because you don't want to
just hire a bunch of yous,

68
00:02:28,760 --> 00:02:30,450
a bunch of people
who think like you.

69
00:02:30,447 --> 00:02:31,527
You already have yourself.

70
00:02:31,530 --> 00:02:33,320
Or in this case, there's
already two of us.

71
00:02:33,322 --> 00:02:34,782
So we wanted to
bring on people who

72
00:02:34,780 --> 00:02:36,950
had maybe a different
perspective, a different point

73
00:02:36,947 --> 00:02:37,977
of view on everything.

74
00:02:37,980 --> 00:02:41,520
And in terms of how many
writers you want to hire,

75
00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:42,690
it just depends.

76
00:02:42,690 --> 00:02:44,700
Ross and I over the
years have decided

77
00:02:44,700 --> 00:02:48,030
we work better if there are
fewer writers in the room,

78
00:02:48,030 --> 00:02:49,560
fewer voices in the room.

79
00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:51,510
That if it's a
smaller room, that's

80
00:02:51,510 --> 00:02:52,570
just how we like to work.

81
00:02:52,570 --> 00:02:55,980
So right now, it's me, Ross,
and four other writers.

82
00:02:55,980 --> 00:02:57,360
So six writers total.

83
00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:58,350
I think it was five--

84
00:02:58,350 --> 00:02:59,690
it was five on season one.

85
00:02:59,687 --> 00:03:01,767
And maybe it was even a
little less on season two.

86
00:03:01,770 --> 00:03:05,310
So every year we're sort of
learning and experimenting

87
00:03:05,310 --> 00:03:07,320
with how many writers we want.

88
00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:10,080
But like Matt said,
hopefully everyone

89
00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:13,500
there has a unique
perspective but also

90
00:03:13,500 --> 00:03:15,950
a unique skill set that
is helpful in terms

91
00:03:15,950 --> 00:03:16,950
of developing your show.

92
00:03:16,950 --> 00:03:18,010
We call it superpower.

93
00:03:18,010 --> 00:03:22,510
We like-- we want every writer
to have a specific superpower.

94
00:03:22,510 --> 00:03:24,980
And we don't want any of
those superpowers to overlap.

95
00:03:24,980 --> 00:03:26,730
Like, if you're talking
about superheroes,

96
00:03:26,730 --> 00:03:28,980
you don't want every superhero
to be shooting fireballs,

97
00:03:28,980 --> 00:03:29,340
right?

98
00:03:29,340 --> 00:03:29,830
So it's like--

99
00:03:29,830 --> 00:03:31,290
Or being invisible,
or whatever it is.

100
00:03:31,290 --> 00:03:31,410
Right.

101
00:03:31,410 --> 00:03:34,150
It's like everybody has to have
their own unique little skill.

102
00:03:34,150 --> 00:03:37,830
So we have one-- we
have a writer who is--

103
00:03:37,832 --> 00:03:38,792
what would you call it?

104
00:03:38,790 --> 00:03:40,410
They're an idea generator.

105
00:03:40,410 --> 00:03:43,200
They just machine gun out
ideas, just a ton of ideas.

106
00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:44,080
Terrible ideas.

107
00:03:44,083 --> 00:03:45,753
Like, terrible,
terrible, terrible idea.

108
00:03:45,750 --> 00:03:46,490
Terrible idea.

109
00:03:46,487 --> 00:03:47,067
Terrible idea.

110
00:03:47,070 --> 00:03:47,790
And then, bam.

111
00:03:47,790 --> 00:03:49,180
Brilliant idea.

112
00:03:49,180 --> 00:03:51,190
So you need-- even
the bad ideas are

113
00:03:51,192 --> 00:03:53,402
good when they're thrown
out because they might shake

114
00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:56,320
something loose for you, or
my brother, or another writer,

115
00:03:56,320 --> 00:03:56,820
right?

116
00:03:56,820 --> 00:03:57,760
So it's good.

117
00:03:57,762 --> 00:03:59,222
We like to have
this machine gunner

118
00:03:59,220 --> 00:04:01,980
in the room, a guy or girl who
can generate a lot of ideas.

119
00:04:01,980 --> 00:04:08,100
Then we have what I would
like to call the goalkeeper.

120
00:04:08,100 --> 00:04:09,960
And this is an essential
role because this

121
00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:12,390
is someone who blocks
all those bad ideas that

122
00:04:12,390 --> 00:04:14,360
are getting machine gunned out.

123
00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:15,410
They're polite about it.

124
00:04:15,412 --> 00:04:17,582
But they basically are like,
I don't like that idea.

125
00:04:17,579 --> 00:04:18,389
I don't like that idea.

126
00:04:18,390 --> 00:04:19,350
I don't like that idea.

127
00:04:19,348 --> 00:04:21,748
I mean, I don't like
it because of X, Y, Z.

128
00:04:21,750 --> 00:04:23,490
So they're protecting the show.

129
00:04:23,490 --> 00:04:25,240
They're looking more
at the big picture.

130
00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:27,540
Because the machine
gunner isn't necessarily

131
00:04:27,540 --> 00:04:30,760
going to realize that this
idea that they generated,

132
00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:33,330
which is really cool
or could be fun, well,

133
00:04:33,330 --> 00:04:35,070
yeah, maybe on its own it is.

134
00:04:35,070 --> 00:04:37,350
But the goalie,
or the goalkeeper

135
00:04:37,350 --> 00:04:39,810
is going to go, well,
in the story that we're

136
00:04:39,810 --> 00:04:41,940
trying to tell, it's
really just a detour.

137
00:04:41,940 --> 00:04:45,300
And it's getting us away from
where we want this story to go.

138
00:04:45,300 --> 00:04:47,490
So you need someone
who's going to be

139
00:04:47,490 --> 00:04:50,280
critical because sometimes
in a writers' room everyone

140
00:04:50,280 --> 00:04:52,860
can just be very enthusiastic
and go, I love your idea,

141
00:04:52,860 --> 00:04:54,330
I love your idea,
I love your idea.

142
00:04:54,330 --> 00:04:56,660
But you need someone, hopefully
who's not mean about it,

143
00:04:56,663 --> 00:04:59,703
but who can go,
well, I don't think

144
00:04:59,700 --> 00:05:02,920
that's going to work
for X, Y and Z reasons.

145
00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:04,710
So again, you're just
looking for people

146
00:05:04,710 --> 00:05:07,590
with different perspectives
and with different skills

147
00:05:07,590 --> 00:05:08,760
as writers.

148
00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:10,530
And all that's going
to do is just make

149
00:05:10,530 --> 00:05:13,080
writing a lot easier for you.

150
00:05:13,080 --> 00:05:16,140
Because so many times Matt
and I will get stuck in a loop

151
00:05:16,140 --> 00:05:19,620
or we'll be writing, we'll
be off in our own office

152
00:05:19,620 --> 00:05:22,680
writing a scene, or a script,
or working on the outline,

153
00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:23,760
and we'll just get stuck.

154
00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:25,380
And we don't know
what the answer is.

155
00:05:25,380 --> 00:05:27,590
And then we're gonna go--
we'll go back into the room

156
00:05:27,588 --> 00:05:29,918
and go, hey, everyone,
we're stuck on this.

157
00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:30,900
Can you help us?

158
00:05:30,900 --> 00:05:33,150
And people are going to
start spit-balling ideas.

159
00:05:33,150 --> 00:05:35,310
The goalie is going to
say what isn't working.

160
00:05:35,313 --> 00:05:37,233
And then someone's going
to say some idea that

161
00:05:37,230 --> 00:05:40,140
is way outside of the box of
what Matt and I were thinking,

162
00:05:40,140 --> 00:05:41,380
and suddenly, it's boom.

163
00:05:41,382 --> 00:05:42,842
It's going to jar
everything loose.

164
00:05:42,840 --> 00:05:44,510
And we're going to
go, oh wait a minute.

165
00:05:44,507 --> 00:05:46,587
I see an avenue now
to solving this.

166
00:05:46,590 --> 00:05:49,140
So the writers' room can
be a really helpful tool.

167
00:05:49,140 --> 00:05:52,530
And it's also a reminder that
as you're breaking this pilot

168
00:05:52,530 --> 00:05:56,290
script, you do not need to
have everything figured out.

169
00:05:56,293 --> 00:05:58,713
We didn't even know we were
gonna go into the upside down,

170
00:05:58,710 --> 00:06:01,590
much less what it was
going to look like.

171
00:06:01,590 --> 00:06:03,900
Joyce was going to talk
to Will through magnets.

172
00:06:03,900 --> 00:06:07,230
That became Christmas lights
as a result of someone's idea

173
00:06:07,230 --> 00:06:09,280
in the writers' room.

174
00:06:09,280 --> 00:06:11,930
Someone suggested we should
do a mall in season three.

175
00:06:11,930 --> 00:06:14,980
That came from another writer.

176
00:06:14,980 --> 00:06:17,500
Again, all of these unique
perspectives and voices

177
00:06:17,500 --> 00:06:19,420
are going to be
really helpful as you

178
00:06:19,420 --> 00:06:22,210
start to develop a
potentially eight hour or even

179
00:06:22,210 --> 00:06:23,200
longer story.

180
00:06:23,203 --> 00:06:25,123
And I think something
you're going to weigh,

181
00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:26,230
and the studio is
going to want you

182
00:06:26,230 --> 00:06:28,180
to weigh when you're
hiring these writers is

183
00:06:28,180 --> 00:06:30,850
they're going to want some
level of experience in the room.

184
00:06:30,850 --> 00:06:32,080
They're going to want
you to have someone

185
00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:33,620
in the room who has
done this before,

186
00:06:33,622 --> 00:06:36,072
who's been in 10
writers' rooms, OK?

187
00:06:36,070 --> 00:06:38,650
Ross and I weigh experience a
little less than most people.

188
00:06:38,650 --> 00:06:40,630
I think we found
a lot of people,

189
00:06:40,630 --> 00:06:43,150
a lot of our best talent,
a lot of our best writers,

190
00:06:43,150 --> 00:06:45,280
a lot of the best people,
frankly, on the show

191
00:06:45,280 --> 00:06:48,590
didn't have a lot of
experience coming into it.

192
00:06:48,590 --> 00:06:50,680
So it doesn't matter
so much, but it

193
00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:53,580
is helpful to have at least
one person in that room who

194
00:06:53,578 --> 00:06:55,868
has done it before, who knows
how these rooms function,

195
00:06:55,870 --> 00:06:56,900
who knows how they work.

196
00:06:56,900 --> 00:06:59,020
I don't think you want
everyone to be super green.

197
00:06:59,020 --> 00:07:01,420
But at the same time, I think
the number one important thing

198
00:07:01,420 --> 00:07:03,520
is that they're passionate,
they're good writers.

199
00:07:03,520 --> 00:07:05,080
I mean, you can tell by reading
their scripts if they're

200
00:07:05,080 --> 00:07:06,250
good writers or bad writers.

201
00:07:06,247 --> 00:07:08,107
The good writers,
and they share some--

202
00:07:08,110 --> 00:07:10,420
you know, they share similar
sensibilities with you

203
00:07:10,420 --> 00:07:12,070
and they're bringing a new
perspective for the room.

204
00:07:12,070 --> 00:07:14,490
All of those things are more
important, and in my opinion,

205
00:07:14,487 --> 00:07:16,007
trump experience every time.

206
00:07:16,010 --> 00:07:16,510
Yeah.

207
00:07:16,510 --> 00:07:18,640
You're going to be in a
room with these people

208
00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:20,590
for many, many hours.

209
00:07:20,590 --> 00:07:21,740
Many days.

210
00:07:21,740 --> 00:07:23,740
Months, generally, in our case.

211
00:07:23,740 --> 00:07:27,260
Up to eight months in a
small room with these people.

212
00:07:27,260 --> 00:07:29,110
And so you need to
make sure everyone's

213
00:07:29,110 --> 00:07:32,980
going to get along, that this
person has a positive attitude.

214
00:07:32,980 --> 00:07:36,200
So even if it's someone who is
going to be critical of ideas,

215
00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:38,740
they're saying in a way
that is useful to the group

216
00:07:38,740 --> 00:07:41,130
and that is still
filled with positivity

217
00:07:41,133 --> 00:07:43,303
because you want everyone
in that room to get along.

218
00:07:43,300 --> 00:07:46,810
Because if it's an
environment that is--

219
00:07:46,810 --> 00:07:48,580
like any office,
if it's environment

220
00:07:48,580 --> 00:07:50,870
that feels unhealthy
or that people just

221
00:07:50,868 --> 00:07:52,658
aren't getting along,
you're just not going

222
00:07:52,660 --> 00:07:53,740
to be very productive.

223
00:07:53,740 --> 00:07:56,840
It needs to be an open
creative environment

224
00:07:56,835 --> 00:07:59,335
because it needs to be a place
where everyone's comfortable.

225
00:07:59,335 --> 00:07:59,715
Feels safe.

226
00:07:59,710 --> 00:08:01,930
And feel safe to throw out
any idea because everyone's

227
00:08:01,930 --> 00:08:02,920
going to throw out bad ideas.

228
00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:04,670
Ross and I throw out
so many awful ideas--

229
00:08:04,670 --> 00:08:05,590
So many bad ideas.

230
00:08:05,587 --> 00:08:06,167
--every day.

231
00:08:06,170 --> 00:08:07,720
And so do all of
our other writers.

232
00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:08,930
So you have to be not scared.

233
00:08:08,928 --> 00:08:11,008
You have to create an
environment where you're not

234
00:08:11,012 --> 00:08:12,282
scared to throw out bad ideas.

235
00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:14,330
And that works the best
if everybody gets along

236
00:08:14,332 --> 00:08:16,042
and no one's super
judgmental of anybody.

237
00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:18,280
You have to be able
to say, for instance, I

238
00:08:18,280 --> 00:08:21,370
think there should be a
lizard creature in the mine.

239
00:08:21,370 --> 00:08:23,620
And you have to be able
to feel free to say that.

240
00:08:23,620 --> 00:08:26,320
And then someone should feel
free to say, I don't know.

241
00:08:26,320 --> 00:08:27,740
Why is it a lizard creature?

242
00:08:27,738 --> 00:08:28,778
You know what I'm saying?

243
00:08:28,780 --> 00:08:29,910
I know what you're saying.

244
00:08:29,910 --> 00:08:30,410
OK.

245
00:08:30,410 --> 00:08:32,760
But right.

246
00:08:32,757 --> 00:08:34,297
Yeah, I still think
it's pretty cool.

247
00:08:34,299 --> 00:08:34,839
All right.

248
00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:36,530
The lizard creature.

249
00:08:36,532 --> 00:08:37,992
We'll see what the
internet thinks.

250
00:08:37,990 --> 00:08:38,490
[LAUGHS]

251
00:08:38,490 --> 00:08:41,870


252
00:08:44,602 --> 00:08:46,312
And so once we
finished with season one

253
00:08:46,310 --> 00:08:49,450
of "Stranger Things," obviously
it became a situation of, OK,

254
00:08:49,448 --> 00:08:50,238
what is season two?

255
00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:52,250
We'd already talked
about how we had

256
00:08:52,250 --> 00:08:55,460
a basic idea for that, which
is involving Will's possession.

257
00:08:55,460 --> 00:08:58,970
But one thing we've done to keep
it interesting moving forward--

258
00:08:58,967 --> 00:09:00,797
and I think it's true
of season two and true

259
00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:03,500
of season three
and four is that we

260
00:09:03,500 --> 00:09:05,990
think about each season
as a sequel, which

261
00:09:05,990 --> 00:09:09,470
is we're always
interested in exploring

262
00:09:09,470 --> 00:09:12,650
different tones, different
moods, different storylines.

263
00:09:12,650 --> 00:09:14,400
We want it to feel
very different.

264
00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:16,310
So we've always liked
the idea of people--

265
00:09:16,310 --> 00:09:18,410
not arguing over whether
they liked or dislike

266
00:09:18,410 --> 00:09:19,160
"Stranger Things."

267
00:09:19,160 --> 00:09:20,870
But we like the idea
of people arguing

268
00:09:20,870 --> 00:09:23,540
over which season is their
favorite, which is their least

269
00:09:23,540 --> 00:09:26,030
favorite, very much how
we argued about what's

270
00:09:26,030 --> 00:09:27,300
the best "Indiana Jones."

271
00:09:27,300 --> 00:09:29,030
So that was what
we kind of wanted

272
00:09:29,030 --> 00:09:30,380
to do with "Stranger Things."

273
00:09:30,380 --> 00:09:33,170
So every season is something
very, very different,

274
00:09:33,170 --> 00:09:34,070
but it excites us.

275
00:09:34,070 --> 00:09:35,690
So season two is
a darker season.

276
00:09:35,690 --> 00:09:38,960
It's kind of an
exorcist possession

277
00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:40,780
set in and around Halloween.

278
00:09:40,783 --> 00:09:42,203
Season three, we
knew it was going

279
00:09:42,200 --> 00:09:43,410
to be released in the summer.

280
00:09:43,408 --> 00:09:45,708
So we wanted to do basically
our summer blockbuster.

281
00:09:45,710 --> 00:09:46,690
We wanted it to be fun.

282
00:09:46,690 --> 00:09:47,690
We wanted bright colors.

283
00:09:47,690 --> 00:09:49,440
We wanted a giant
monster in them all.

284
00:09:49,443 --> 00:09:50,363
We wanted all of that.

285
00:09:50,360 --> 00:09:53,540
So tonally, it's very, very
different than season two.

286
00:09:53,540 --> 00:09:56,060
Then season four, we didn't
want to do that again.

287
00:09:56,060 --> 00:09:58,070
We didn't want to do a
big blockbuster season.

288
00:09:58,070 --> 00:10:00,350
Even though it is coming
out in the summer still.

289
00:10:00,350 --> 00:10:03,140
So we wanted to go a
little bit darker again.

290
00:10:03,140 --> 00:10:04,580
We wanted to do--

291
00:10:04,580 --> 00:10:05,970
Well, our kids are all--

292
00:10:05,970 --> 00:10:07,340
our kids aren't kids anymore.

293
00:10:07,340 --> 00:10:07,790
They're teens.

294
00:10:07,790 --> 00:10:08,660
They're full-on teenagers.

295
00:10:08,660 --> 00:10:09,620
They're in high school.

296
00:10:09,618 --> 00:10:12,108
And so that inevitably
changes the tone.

297
00:10:12,110 --> 00:10:14,030
And we wanted to
play with that tone

298
00:10:14,030 --> 00:10:15,970
and go back to some
of the horror films

299
00:10:15,970 --> 00:10:17,720
that we grew up loving
so much, whether it

300
00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:22,760
was "Nightmare on Elm Street"
or "Hellraiser" or these--

301
00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:23,600
Or "IT."

302
00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:24,110
It's funny.

303
00:10:24,110 --> 00:10:24,590
Actually, if you look--

304
00:10:24,590 --> 00:10:25,370
Steven King's "IT."

305
00:10:25,370 --> 00:10:25,430
Right.

306
00:10:25,430 --> 00:10:26,990
I think it's
these touchstones.

307
00:10:26,990 --> 00:10:29,270
And some of them we did
talk about when we first

308
00:10:29,270 --> 00:10:30,440
came up with the season.

309
00:10:30,440 --> 00:10:33,830
And we played with them a little
bit with Jonathan and Nancy

310
00:10:33,830 --> 00:10:35,350
and Steve in season one.

311
00:10:35,350 --> 00:10:37,100
But we really wanted
to get back into that

312
00:10:37,100 --> 00:10:39,860
and do a true
really scary horror

313
00:10:39,860 --> 00:10:44,720
film with our characters who
used to be middle school aged

314
00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:46,580
kids and now they're older.

315
00:10:46,580 --> 00:10:49,680
So we thought we could go
darker and scarier with them.

316
00:10:49,680 --> 00:10:52,280
So that was sort of
where we started off

317
00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:53,330
when we did season four.

318
00:10:53,330 --> 00:10:54,910
So again, like Matt's
saying, the hope

319
00:10:54,913 --> 00:10:57,273
was every season
feels different.

320
00:10:57,270 --> 00:10:59,210
And yes, some of
that is just to keep

321
00:10:59,210 --> 00:11:02,930
things fresh for the audience,
but also to keep us excited,

322
00:11:02,930 --> 00:11:05,370
keep our writers exciting,
keep actors excited,

323
00:11:05,370 --> 00:11:07,770
which is that-- and all
of our other collaborators

324
00:11:07,772 --> 00:11:09,232
who are producing
the show with us.

325
00:11:09,230 --> 00:11:11,180
Which is every
season we're not just

326
00:11:11,180 --> 00:11:13,640
trying to repeat ourselves,
we're trying to do new things.

327
00:11:13,640 --> 00:11:15,890
Inevitably, you
know, you're going

328
00:11:15,890 --> 00:11:17,560
to learn new things
every season.

329
00:11:17,563 --> 00:11:18,983
You're going to
make new mistakes.

330
00:11:18,980 --> 00:11:20,860
But you're also going
to make new discoveries

331
00:11:20,855 --> 00:11:23,225
and go, oh, wow, that
was really exciting.

332
00:11:23,220 --> 00:11:25,820
We should lean into that
even more the next season.

333
00:11:25,820 --> 00:11:27,650
And I think that's
exciting to us.

334
00:11:27,650 --> 00:11:29,820
And to not be afraid
to try new things

335
00:11:29,817 --> 00:11:31,397
and do different
things because that's

336
00:11:31,400 --> 00:11:36,110
what keeps our edge up and
keeps us excited to go back

337
00:11:36,110 --> 00:11:37,700
to this world year after year.

338
00:11:44,010 --> 00:11:46,110
You know, once you've
actually produced a show,

339
00:11:46,110 --> 00:11:47,730
it's going to go
out into the world.

340
00:11:47,730 --> 00:11:49,310
And people are
going to watch it.

341
00:11:49,310 --> 00:11:50,470
A lot of people are
going to watch it,

342
00:11:50,470 --> 00:11:51,810
and they're going
to have opinions.

343
00:11:51,810 --> 00:11:53,400
And sometimes those
opinions are going

344
00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:55,650
to make you feel really happy
and good about yourself.

345
00:11:55,650 --> 00:11:57,480
And sometimes they're
going to make you feel

346
00:11:57,483 --> 00:11:58,713
a little down about yourself.

347
00:11:58,712 --> 00:12:00,422
So what we try to do
every season is just

348
00:12:00,420 --> 00:12:03,400
try to block out all the noise
and go back to that feeling

349
00:12:03,402 --> 00:12:05,612
we had when we were first
starting "Stranger Things,"

350
00:12:05,610 --> 00:12:08,040
and just coming up
with that big idea.

351
00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:11,280
That was just Matt
and I in our apartment

352
00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:12,560
just spit-balling ideas.

353
00:12:12,560 --> 00:12:14,310
So we try to block it
all out and get back

354
00:12:14,310 --> 00:12:16,680
to that, looking for that
thing that excites us,

355
00:12:16,680 --> 00:12:19,240
that makes us really want
to sit down and write again.

356
00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:21,490
That feeling that we told
you that you're looking for,

357
00:12:21,490 --> 00:12:23,520
which is that spark
and that excitement.

358
00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:26,070
We do that every
year and just try

359
00:12:26,070 --> 00:12:27,520
to find that excitement again.

360
00:12:27,520 --> 00:12:31,470
And once we find it, and we go,
oh, I can't wait to write that.

361
00:12:31,470 --> 00:12:33,450
That's when we know we
have the kernel of what

362
00:12:33,450 --> 00:12:35,880
it's gonna become a new
season of "Stranger Things."

363
00:12:35,880 --> 00:12:37,530
I think the lesson in that--
and I think we've touched

364
00:12:37,530 --> 00:12:38,110
on this a lot.

365
00:12:38,113 --> 00:12:42,573
But I think you're your own
best compass in terms of what

366
00:12:42,570 --> 00:12:44,430
you like and what excites you.

367
00:12:44,430 --> 00:12:46,560
In the same way
that we suggested

368
00:12:46,560 --> 00:12:48,210
you don't listen to
studio executives,

369
00:12:48,210 --> 00:12:49,750
I don't think you
should be listening

370
00:12:49,752 --> 00:12:52,242
to Twitter, or social
media, or your friends.

371
00:12:52,240 --> 00:12:53,910
I think you should
be really, as much

372
00:12:53,910 --> 00:12:56,070
as possible, listen to
yourself and your own gut

373
00:12:56,070 --> 00:12:57,070
and what excites you.

374
00:12:57,070 --> 00:12:59,450
I think that's going to result
in the best work possible.

375
00:12:59,445 --> 00:13:01,025
And you can take all that in.

376
00:13:01,020 --> 00:13:02,550
And we get notes.

377
00:13:02,550 --> 00:13:06,150
And again, we hear from fans,
what they like and don't like.

378
00:13:06,150 --> 00:13:07,890
And some of it might
resonate with you.

379
00:13:07,890 --> 00:13:09,470
And you're going to
go, you know what?

380
00:13:09,473 --> 00:13:10,363
I think that's right.

381
00:13:10,363 --> 00:13:12,033
And you're going to
feel it in your gut.

382
00:13:12,030 --> 00:13:13,320
But there's other
stuff that people

383
00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:14,160
are going to
criticize that you're

384
00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:16,680
gonna go, well, I understand
they didn't like that,

385
00:13:16,682 --> 00:13:17,642
but I really like that.

386
00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:19,760
And I feel that's an
essential part of the story,

387
00:13:19,762 --> 00:13:20,972
so I'm gonna stick to my gut.

388
00:13:20,970 --> 00:13:22,080
And I'm gonna stick to my guns.

389
00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:22,830
And I'm gonna--

390
00:13:22,830 --> 00:13:25,320
I'm gonna continue
down that path.

391
00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:26,520
And that's fine too.

392
00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:30,810
Again, you're gonna have critics
as you start producing stuff.

393
00:13:30,810 --> 00:13:33,970
But, ultimately, you still need
to be your harshest critic.

394
00:13:33,965 --> 00:13:36,095
You know when I was flipping
through those outlines

395
00:13:36,090 --> 00:13:38,580
and just showing how we just
kept doing it over, and over,

396
00:13:38,580 --> 00:13:39,540
and over again?

397
00:13:39,540 --> 00:13:40,860
We still have to do that.

398
00:13:40,860 --> 00:13:44,040
Even though we found success
with this first season,

399
00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:45,960
we still are really
hard on ourselves

400
00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:47,880
because I think you
have to be in order

401
00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:49,170
to make something good.

402
00:13:49,170 --> 00:13:51,780
You've got to just keep
pushing yourself to get better,

403
00:13:51,780 --> 00:13:53,490
and to get better,
and to keep learning

404
00:13:53,490 --> 00:13:56,500
and keep growing as an artist.

1
00:00:00,978 --> 00:00:03,428


2
00:00:09,790 --> 00:00:11,450
So we'll talk a
little bit about 4

3
00:00:11,447 --> 00:00:13,027
and some of the
interesting challenges

4
00:00:13,030 --> 00:00:15,310
in making season 4, of
which there were many.

5
00:00:15,310 --> 00:00:17,120
One of the biggest
challenges, of course,

6
00:00:17,120 --> 00:00:19,120
we were producing
this and COVID hit.

7
00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:22,600
So we shut down for
about six months.

8
00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:24,260
That resulted in
some challenges.

9
00:00:24,260 --> 00:00:26,600
For example, we had one
actor, Dacre Montgomery,

10
00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:28,740
who was in Australia,
all the way in Australia.

11
00:00:28,742 --> 00:00:30,202
And we had written
a scene for him.

12
00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:32,470
He was going to come back
in episode 4 of the show

13
00:00:32,470 --> 00:00:34,270
in the episode, "Dear Billy."

14
00:00:34,270 --> 00:00:35,860
But we could not
for the life of us

15
00:00:35,860 --> 00:00:38,590
get him out of Australia
into the United States.

16
00:00:38,590 --> 00:00:39,370
It was impossible.

17
00:00:39,370 --> 00:00:41,780
And the time finally came,
we kept punting the scene

18
00:00:41,783 --> 00:00:42,703
and punting the scene.

19
00:00:42,700 --> 00:00:44,560
Surely, surely it's
going to be easier

20
00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:46,060
to get out of Australia.

21
00:00:46,060 --> 00:00:47,410
It never happened.

22
00:00:47,410 --> 00:00:49,540
Never panned out so
we never got Dacre.

23
00:00:49,540 --> 00:00:51,130
We never got Dacre
out of Australia,

24
00:00:51,130 --> 00:00:54,850
but we still have a scene
between Max and Billy, Sadie

25
00:00:54,850 --> 00:00:58,030
and Dacre that takes
place in a cemetery.

26
00:00:58,030 --> 00:01:01,750
So what we ended up doing is
our director was actually--

27
00:01:01,750 --> 00:01:03,460
Shawn Levy was
directing that episode--

28
00:01:03,460 --> 00:01:08,290
he shot Sadie's side of the
conversation at the graveyard.

29
00:01:08,290 --> 00:01:10,930
He had a stand-in for Billy,
so any over-the-shoulder

30
00:01:10,930 --> 00:01:12,920
shot you see is going
to be with a stand-in.

31
00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:17,290
And then he shot an empty
frame without Dacre in it.

32
00:01:17,290 --> 00:01:20,650
So Sadie is acting
against nothing.

33
00:01:20,650 --> 00:01:23,990
I mean, she's acting against
a stand-in for Dacre.

34
00:01:23,990 --> 00:01:26,210
I think they recorded
Dacre's voice.

35
00:01:26,205 --> 00:01:28,585
So they were playing Dacre's
voice, but he was not there.

36
00:01:28,580 --> 00:01:31,990
And then we shot-- months,
months, months later, we shot--

37
00:01:31,992 --> 00:01:32,952
In another continent.

38
00:01:32,950 --> 00:01:35,530
In another continent, we
shot Dacre against blue screen

39
00:01:35,530 --> 00:01:36,490
in Australia.

40
00:01:36,490 --> 00:01:39,330
And then we comped him in,
and the scene works great.

41
00:01:39,330 --> 00:01:40,330
You would never know it.

42
00:01:40,330 --> 00:01:41,270
No more hiding.

43
00:01:41,268 --> 00:01:42,308
Billy, that's not true.

44
00:01:42,310 --> 00:01:43,720
I swear-- I swear,
it's not true.

45
00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:46,140
That is why you
feel such guilt.

46
00:01:46,135 --> 00:01:46,695
No.

47
00:01:46,690 --> 00:01:48,890
Why you hide
from your friends.

48
00:01:48,890 --> 00:01:49,390
No.

49
00:01:49,390 --> 00:01:50,930
Why you hide from the world.

50
00:01:50,930 --> 00:01:51,460
No.

51
00:01:51,460 --> 00:01:57,280
And why late at night you have
sometimes wished to follow me.

52
00:01:57,280 --> 00:01:59,990
COVID caused a lot of delays.

53
00:01:59,990 --> 00:02:01,660
But one thing that
it did afford us,

54
00:02:01,660 --> 00:02:04,090
which we've never had on any
season of "Stranger Things"

55
00:02:04,090 --> 00:02:07,120
is we had time to go back.

56
00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:09,430
Usually we're sprinting
with these scripts.

57
00:02:09,430 --> 00:02:10,300
We're writing them.

58
00:02:10,300 --> 00:02:13,540
We hand them over to production,
and it gets shot right away.

59
00:02:13,535 --> 00:02:15,165
So this is the first
time ever, we just

60
00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:18,040
had a bunch of scripts
that weren't being shot,

61
00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:19,640
that were just sitting there.

62
00:02:19,640 --> 00:02:23,030
And so Matt and I used the
time to go back and go,

63
00:02:23,030 --> 00:02:27,310
hey, we can plant an
idea here that we're

64
00:02:27,310 --> 00:02:28,690
going to pay off later.

65
00:02:28,690 --> 00:02:29,560
We can--

66
00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:31,120
Improve all these scenes.

67
00:02:31,115 --> 00:02:32,745
And the character
arcs, for instance,

68
00:02:32,740 --> 00:02:34,210
that we were talking
about, right?

69
00:02:34,208 --> 00:02:36,748
About how a character-- you want
some of your main characters

70
00:02:36,750 --> 00:02:41,470
to go from A to B.
Well, sometimes that

71
00:02:41,470 --> 00:02:43,990
gets lost a little
bit in the struggle

72
00:02:43,990 --> 00:02:48,910
of juggling all these storylines
and just in plot mechanics.

73
00:02:48,910 --> 00:02:52,720
But we had the time now to
go back and go, okay, wait,

74
00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:55,360
this moment here
is an opportunity

75
00:02:55,360 --> 00:02:57,820
to further develop this
character in his arc.

76
00:02:57,820 --> 00:03:00,010
So it was a really
fun process for us

77
00:03:00,010 --> 00:03:02,590
actually to be able to go
back and look at these scripts

78
00:03:02,590 --> 00:03:04,550
and evaluate, can
they get better.

79
00:03:04,550 --> 00:03:06,970
And, again, you've got to
be your harshest critic.

80
00:03:06,970 --> 00:03:08,590
Everything can
always get better.

81
00:03:08,590 --> 00:03:10,900
There is going to always
be a pencils down moment.

82
00:03:10,900 --> 00:03:12,460
But for once in
our lives, we are

83
00:03:12,460 --> 00:03:14,540
able to go, hey,
let's take a breath.

84
00:03:14,540 --> 00:03:15,250
Let's look back.

85
00:03:15,250 --> 00:03:17,350
And can we improve
these scripts?

86
00:03:17,350 --> 00:03:18,850
So it's actually
interesting if we

87
00:03:18,850 --> 00:03:22,360
start thinking about, what did
we do when we had that time off

88
00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:23,320
from COVID.

89
00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:25,680
What would have been different
had COVID not happened?

90
00:03:25,677 --> 00:03:27,757
How different would "Stranger
Things 4" have been?

91
00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:29,390
I think it would have
been not as good.

92
00:03:29,385 --> 00:03:31,635
I mean, there were lots of
things that were different.

93
00:03:31,635 --> 00:03:33,105
Like, for instance,
in episode 2,

94
00:03:33,100 --> 00:03:37,240
when Eleven hits Angela
with a roller skate.

95
00:03:37,240 --> 00:03:39,350
That used to be set
at a putt-putt course.

96
00:03:39,350 --> 00:03:39,850
Angela.

97
00:03:43,030 --> 00:03:45,540
So we were obsessed with this
having to be at a putt-putt

98
00:03:45,540 --> 00:03:46,040
course.

99
00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:49,310
We could never find a
good putt-putt course

100
00:03:49,312 --> 00:03:50,022
that looked good.

101
00:03:50,020 --> 00:03:51,490
We realized all
putt-putt courses--

102
00:03:51,490 --> 00:03:52,610
I don't know how I
didn't know this--

103
00:03:52,610 --> 00:03:54,740
but they're all right
next to giant freeways.

104
00:03:54,740 --> 00:03:56,450
It was going to be a
nightmare for sound.

105
00:03:56,448 --> 00:03:58,148
Anyway, we took the
time and rewrote it

106
00:03:58,150 --> 00:04:01,330
for taking place
in a roller rink.

107
00:04:01,330 --> 00:04:03,610
And I can't imagine
that scene now not

108
00:04:03,610 --> 00:04:05,050
taking place inside
a roller rink,

109
00:04:05,050 --> 00:04:07,090
and I can't imagine
Eleven not smacking

110
00:04:07,090 --> 00:04:10,060
Angela with a roller skate.

111
00:04:10,060 --> 00:04:12,070
You can see bloody
roller skates over there

112
00:04:12,070 --> 00:04:14,050
behind us in honor
of that moment.

113
00:04:14,050 --> 00:04:14,860
Yes.

114
00:04:14,860 --> 00:04:15,760
What else changed?

115
00:04:15,760 --> 00:04:16,550
This is an example.

116
00:04:16,552 --> 00:04:19,002
We didn't know until we
were writing the finale when

117
00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:21,820
Eddie is on top of his trailer
rocking out with his guitar.

118
00:04:21,820 --> 00:04:25,810
We didn't know that his guitar
was going to play any purpose

119
00:04:25,810 --> 00:04:27,230
or serve any role in the story.

120
00:04:27,230 --> 00:04:29,470
So we did not set up
that he had a guitar.

121
00:04:29,470 --> 00:04:32,080
But at this point, we
had written the finale.

122
00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:34,910
We knew we needed to set up
that Eddie was a guitarist.

123
00:04:34,910 --> 00:04:38,150
So we went back, and we
started to layer that idea in.

124
00:04:38,153 --> 00:04:40,573
There's a scene in episode 1
when he's talking to Chrissy,

125
00:04:40,570 --> 00:04:42,280
and he mentions how
he plays guitar.

126
00:04:42,280 --> 00:04:43,690
You played guitar, right?

127
00:04:43,690 --> 00:04:46,640
Uh-huh, still do, still do.

128
00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:48,410
You should come see us.

129
00:04:48,410 --> 00:04:50,340
We play at The
Hideout on Tuesdays.

130
00:04:50,335 --> 00:04:51,535
It's pretty cool.

131
00:04:51,530 --> 00:04:56,230
We-- we actually get a
crowd of about five drunks.

132
00:04:56,230 --> 00:04:56,840
[LAUGHS]

133
00:04:57,340 --> 00:04:58,780
That was all
part of a rewrite.

134
00:04:58,780 --> 00:05:01,590
In fact, that whole scene
was just a whatever scene

135
00:05:01,593 --> 00:05:02,513
that got a ton better.

136
00:05:02,510 --> 00:05:04,300
It's one of my favorite
scenes in the show.

137
00:05:04,302 --> 00:05:06,412
It was just a mediocre
scene initially

138
00:05:06,413 --> 00:05:08,083
between Eddie and
Chrissy, where we just

139
00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:08,980
got through the mechanics.

140
00:05:08,980 --> 00:05:10,230
She's buying drugs from Eddie.

141
00:05:10,230 --> 00:05:10,900
That was it.

142
00:05:10,900 --> 00:05:13,450
All the sweet character moments
came out in the rewrite, all

143
00:05:13,450 --> 00:05:15,730
because basically we had
to set up this guitar.

144
00:05:15,730 --> 00:05:17,470
We have him-- when
he's taking Chrissy

145
00:05:17,470 --> 00:05:19,360
into his trailer at the
end of that episode,

146
00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:24,070
we have him kiss his guitar
and give it a little strum.

147
00:05:24,070 --> 00:05:27,400
And he calls it her, so we
established that this guitar

148
00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:30,860
means something to him.

149
00:05:30,860 --> 00:05:31,860
[KISSES FINGERS]

150
00:05:31,860 --> 00:05:32,860
[STRUMS GUITAR]

151
00:05:32,860 --> 00:05:33,940
You're beautiful.

152
00:05:33,940 --> 00:05:36,400
This is the kind of
luxury we had in terms

153
00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:38,570
of when we had time, we
were able to go back--

154
00:05:38,570 --> 00:05:39,070
Yes.

155
00:05:39,070 --> 00:05:40,200
And refine these scripts.

156
00:05:40,195 --> 00:05:42,795
Sometimes you can do
this stuff with reshoots.

157
00:05:42,790 --> 00:05:44,680
But oftentimes there's
no time for reshoots.

158
00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:46,840
And the reason is,
could you just reveal

159
00:05:46,840 --> 00:05:48,310
that Eddie has a guitar later.

160
00:05:48,310 --> 00:05:51,260
Yes, but it's nice
to set something up.

161
00:05:51,255 --> 00:05:53,385
And this is something we
didn't cover in the class,

162
00:05:53,380 --> 00:05:55,120
where you're going to see-- if
you do read the screenwriting

163
00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:57,660
book, it's going to be all over
our screenwriting book, which

164
00:05:57,662 --> 00:06:01,032
is a plant and a payoff,
which is you plant something

165
00:06:01,030 --> 00:06:04,150
very early on in a script,
and you don't pay it off

166
00:06:04,150 --> 00:06:05,680
until much later.

167
00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:08,200
Sometimes we do know
what we want to pay off,

168
00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:10,210
so we do plant it early on.

169
00:06:10,210 --> 00:06:11,830
But sometimes we're
not quite sure

170
00:06:11,830 --> 00:06:13,370
where the story is
going to go, or it

171
00:06:13,372 --> 00:06:15,372
changes as we're developing it.

172
00:06:15,370 --> 00:06:18,580
And in that case, it is nice to
be able to go back and put it

173
00:06:18,580 --> 00:06:20,080
in the script and
plant something,

174
00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:22,780
like as simple as a
guitar, that then pays off

175
00:06:22,780 --> 00:06:25,090
hours and hours and hours later.

176
00:06:25,090 --> 00:06:27,220
And the last thing I
would say just about what

177
00:06:27,220 --> 00:06:30,520
that delay gave us is the
voice of Eddie in Joe Quinn,

178
00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:33,610
we didn't know as well as the
other actors because we never

179
00:06:33,610 --> 00:06:34,750
worked with Joe before.

180
00:06:34,750 --> 00:06:37,660
But by the time we
had been shooting

181
00:06:37,660 --> 00:06:40,220
a couple of weeks with Joe
when we had to shut down,

182
00:06:40,220 --> 00:06:41,800
and so we started
to hear his voice,

183
00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:44,090
and we started to get a better
handle on the character.

184
00:06:44,092 --> 00:06:46,182
And this is something
that we found as important

185
00:06:46,180 --> 00:06:47,200
during production.

186
00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,800
We talked about it a little
bit with Maya Hawke in Robin

187
00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:54,070
and with Finn Wolfhard as
Mike, which is the actors that

188
00:06:54,070 --> 00:06:56,710
are cast are going to
change a little bit maybe

189
00:06:56,710 --> 00:06:58,390
how you write these
characters and what

190
00:06:58,390 --> 00:06:59,470
their voices sound like.

191
00:06:59,470 --> 00:07:02,120
So it gave us time
to go back and go,

192
00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:04,510
how can we get Eddie
better so it's not just

193
00:07:04,510 --> 00:07:05,710
setting up the guitar.

194
00:07:05,710 --> 00:07:09,040
It's also going, okay, how
can we improve his voice.

195
00:07:09,040 --> 00:07:11,810
It's sort of like in that
Dustin-Steve spin-off

196
00:07:11,805 --> 00:07:13,935
that we were writing, where
it's like I don't quite

197
00:07:13,930 --> 00:07:15,070
know who Mack is.

198
00:07:15,070 --> 00:07:17,590
Yes, we would figure
out a little bit more

199
00:07:17,590 --> 00:07:20,260
if we blue-skyed and worked
on his character backstory.

200
00:07:20,260 --> 00:07:23,560
But maybe we cast an actor
who's just totally different

201
00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:25,030
than we ever imagined him.

202
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Great, now you have
the ability to go back

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and work on that voice more and
make him even more interesting.

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And hopefully what started out
as a pretty basic character

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or in the case of that
spin-off thing that we wrote,

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he didn't really have
a character at all.

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He wasn't doing anything.

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He was just bouncing off of--

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He was a brick wall.

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He's a brick wall.

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Well, suddenly, we can imbue
him with a lot more personality,

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and suddenly he's going
to jump off the page

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and jump off the screen
in a much better way.

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You don't remember me?

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I'm sorry.

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00:07:53,590 --> 00:07:56,920
Middle school talent show,
you were doing this cheer thing.

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00:07:56,920 --> 00:07:59,890
You know, the--
the thing you do.

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It was pretty cool actually.

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00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:04,800
And I-- I was with my dad.

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Corroded Coffin.

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Corroded Coffin.

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Oh, my god.

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Yes, no--

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00:08:07,390 --> 00:08:07,890
You do remember, right?

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00:08:07,890 --> 00:08:09,660
Oh, of course, with a name
like that, how could I forget?

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I don't know.

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You're a freak.

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So at this point,
we've reached

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sort of the end of this class,
and we hope you enjoyed it.

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And thanks for sitting
here and listening to us

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talk and talk and talk about
screenwriting for this long,

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if you've made it this far.

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I think it's just worth
us kind of covering really

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quickly some of the big
points in this lesson,

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since it was kind
of long, or for us

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what are the key moments
or key takeaways,

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the things we hope
really stay with you.

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Number one is big idea.

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It's really important that
you have the right idea.

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Don't jump in till you
feel that idea is right.

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Be passionate about it
and again simple, clean,

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take from your life.

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You don't need to
write some sprawling

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epic for your first script.

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You haven't written
anything before.

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It's okay to be simple.

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It is much more
complicated, and I

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think hopefully you've seen that
over the course of us talking,

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which is even telling
a simple story,

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there are a lot of elements to
it and it can be complicated.

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So it's okay to write
something simple.

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00:09:14,910 --> 00:09:18,230
It's okay to give yourself
a very simple story

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for your first script.

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Right.

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And then the other
thing is, at that point,

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blue-skying, this is
a part of the process

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that we think is
really important,

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which is that free-form
brainstorming.

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Stream of consciousness.

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00:09:29,370 --> 00:09:31,520
Stream of-- take
a lot of time.

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Develop your idea.

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Develop your idea.

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Have fun with that stage.

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00:09:34,332 --> 00:09:35,832
And then once you
do that and you're

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starting to move in the more
formal stages of outlining

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and writing, I think we would
just encourage you again

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to stay out really wide.

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Stay zoomed way far
out and then slowly,

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00:09:47,090 --> 00:09:50,580
baby steps, right, like slowly
zoom in closer, closer, closer,

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closer.

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00:09:51,080 --> 00:09:52,880
It's going to come more--
it's going to come more and more

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into focus.

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00:09:53,640 --> 00:09:56,080
And I think it can
be so overwhelming.

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00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:56,580
Yeah.

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00:09:56,580 --> 00:09:58,540
And I think this is
the most important thing.

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00:09:58,538 --> 00:10:01,668
You're going to watch a show or
a movie that you love, right?

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00:10:01,670 --> 00:10:04,190
And it's going to
feel impossible.

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00:10:04,190 --> 00:10:07,220
How in the world did
they do all this?

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00:10:07,220 --> 00:10:10,760
How did they start with just a
blank page and it became this?

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00:10:10,760 --> 00:10:13,340
Well, it got there very slowly.

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It's a messy process.

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00:10:14,300 --> 00:10:15,180
It's a messy process.

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00:10:15,175 --> 00:10:18,985
As you saw, it started out--
our brainstorming for "Stranger

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00:10:18,980 --> 00:10:22,460
Things" started off with
Sam Rockwell in a shack.

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00:10:22,460 --> 00:10:25,430
You know, it started
out with nerd friend.

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00:10:25,430 --> 00:10:26,990
It started out almost--

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00:10:26,990 --> 00:10:30,110
so basic and simple
and messy and a lot

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00:10:30,110 --> 00:10:35,240
of misspelling and bad grammar,
and it just slowly became

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00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:38,690
the show that maybe you've
seen and that you recognize.

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00:10:38,690 --> 00:10:41,370
But it was a long, long
process to get there.

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00:10:41,370 --> 00:10:42,570
And it can be overwhelming.

293
00:10:42,572 --> 00:10:44,032
But again, like
Matt's saying, baby

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00:10:44,030 --> 00:10:47,390
steps, if you take it one
little step at a time, suddenly

295
00:10:47,390 --> 00:10:49,760
that blank page, which we know--

296
00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:52,190
we know firsthand how
scary that can be,

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00:10:52,190 --> 00:10:54,350
suddenly it's less
scary because you don't

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00:10:54,350 --> 00:10:55,880
have to solve it all at once.

299
00:10:55,880 --> 00:10:57,420
Just take it one step at a time.

300
00:10:57,420 --> 00:11:00,490
And I promise you, it is a
lot more doable than it seems.

301
00:11:00,493 --> 00:11:02,663
So that kind of brings
us to the end of the class.

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00:11:02,660 --> 00:11:04,190
We hope you got
something out of it.

303
00:11:04,190 --> 00:11:07,120
We're excited hopefully to
one day meet you in Hollywood.

304
00:11:07,118 --> 00:11:08,658
And that's my new
dream, that someone

305
00:11:08,660 --> 00:11:10,940
says they saw this class,
and it helped them.

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00:11:10,940 --> 00:11:13,550
And now they're a
very successful writer

307
00:11:13,550 --> 00:11:15,140
or writer-director in Hollywood.

308
00:11:15,140 --> 00:11:18,030
So that's my new dream so
please make that come true.

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00:11:18,033 --> 00:11:18,953
We're rooting for you.

310
00:11:18,950 --> 00:11:22,220
Take that spark of an idea
and turn it into gold.

311
00:11:22,220 --> 00:11:23,780
And remember just have fun.

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00:11:23,780 --> 00:11:24,620
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00:11:24,616 --> 00:11:26,156
[INAUDIBLE]

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00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:27,670
This should be a fun process.

315
00:11:27,670 --> 00:11:29,770
And you want to enjoy
it as you're going

316
00:11:29,770 --> 00:11:32,560
through it so try to have fun.

317
00:11:32,560 --> 00:11:33,520
Find that passion.

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00:11:33,520 --> 00:11:38,320
Find that spark
and best of luck.

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00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:40,470
[STATIC]